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[Bornstellar]

I mean phenomenal. You can look up the definition for that.

I love the traversal, the gunplay mechanics, the super abilities, the wealthy of options and different play-styles of the various classes. It's not perfect, and could use some tweaks here and there (gun balancing), but other than that I can't name a better MP that I've played in years.

Well, for starters, any of Bungie's Halo games (probably even Reach). Traversal is sluggish and ill suited to the fast kill times, gunplay is completely imbalanced, supers are broken and cheap with no counters, and matches are stacked towards those with better gear.

 

[David___]

What does what he said there prove?

Deej's exact words, "We've revealed everything you're going to explore in the first version of the game."

He later goes on to say that for release single explorable areas will be available on Earth, Moon, Mars, and Venus and possibly Jupiter as a "surprise" since he didn't mention it and you see it on the select-able map.

I dunno. This whole thing just sounds like the deals made with Sony extend to even using Sony's own PR tactics. Don't tell gamers anything, reveal news (particularly bad news) at the last minute, and tie up everyone's money in a preorder they're hopefully too lazy or too late to cancel by the time they are able to read a review.

Oh look, its teiresias back to his usual ramblings.

 

[rdrr gnr]

I mean phenomenal. You can look up the definition for that.

I love the traversal, the gunplay mechanics, the super abilities, the wealthy of options and different play-styles of the various classes. It's not perfect, and could use some tweaks here and there (gun balancing), but other than that I can't name a better MP that I've played in years.

A lot of the elements I loved from Halo are present here, and the gunplay in general is a joy.

This doesn't answer the question, though. You're just listing things. Most people would say the supers need work, along with vehicles, along with some of guns, along with the spawns on Venus and Mars. What are your arguments against those balance concerns?

 

[fluffydelusions]

Games fun. I'm looking forward to sept.

 

[RoboPlato]

I don't know dude. Letting everyone play the demo was pretty cool.

What isn't cool is someone from Bungie coming here and saying "lol, thats not the game. That thing was for toddlers in the kiddie pool with water wings. You won't see the real game until sept 9." Really don't like that kind of guerrilla marketing.

Would you really expect a beta to be fully representative of the size and scope of the game?

 

[Confused Cheeseburger]

I never played a beta that represented 25% or so of the game. Usually a beta is a very, very small portion of the actual game. I am hoping that what we got in the beta is just a very small slice of the pie, but if it is roughly even close to 25% then that is extremely disappointing. I am not too interested in the PVP stuff, I always prefer PVE and teaming up with others to do PVE stuff, so for me, that is why I hope that the beta is not roughly 25% of the PVE content.

But, if Old Russia is the only environment on earth, it is truly a waste. It is Earth, our home after all, you would think that there would be at least 2-3 major environments to explore on earth?

BUT IT'S NOT 25%.

Spoiler

this thread is starting to feel a little hopeless

 

[BokehKing]

matches are stacked towards those with better gear.

Only iron banner
If you don't have good gear you probably shouldn't go in there

 

[Lactose_Intolerant]

BUT IT'S NOT 25%.

Spoiler

this thread is starting to feel a little hopeless

this is a forum, not a job. Go play a game.

 

[jadedm17]

Disappointment is disappointment. Most of the comments expressing it in this topic weren't unreasonable, and they shouldn't be labeled as anything negative because of it. That is all i'm saying.

Not at all, GAF as a whole does a great job of rising above it all; This thread has some valid concerns.
The low shots and whining that get through are funny nonetheless.

 

[QaaQer]

If you preordered something that you can't or won't cancel with what you feel to be insufficient knowledge then that's on you.

Or govts with anti consumer digital legislation. I can return/cancel any unused product/preorder except for digital goods. Dafuq?

 

[Confused Cheeseburger]

this is a forum, not a job. Go play a game.

I actually just turned on luigi's mansion 2, a fine game if there ever was.

 

[Bornstellar]

Would you really expect a beta to be fully representative of the size and scope of the game?

In terms of being able to extrapolate from what content we have access to (IE zone size, gameplay loop, etc.)? Yes?

Only iron banner
If you don't have good gear you probably shouldn't go in there

Not just Iron Banner - whatever they do to equalize the weapons and armor didn't help when I played my first crucible matches without unlocking any gear - after getting better gear that I was top of my team in both reg. and iron banner.

 

[QaaQer]

Would you really expect a beta to be fully representative of the size and scope of the game?

yes. Why wouldn't it be given it is like 2 weeks away from going gold?

 

[Gouty]

1. Some folks have spent 20 hours or more in the beta and not all of that was PvP.

So? Some people are still playing Dunk Hunt. What some people do has nothing to do with the amount of content found in a game.

2. If you mean unique content that you never repeat, I wonder how realistic that expectation is...

Then enlighten me. What is realistic? Why wouldn't 30 hours of Non PVP content be? I'd like a detailed explanation of the realities.

3. How can you be so sure that this game, from this extremely minor potentially misconstrued throw away comment, won't have what you're looking for? Because you saw levels 1 to 8? Because you played one Strike?

Sure of what? Did you read my post? Clearly I'm not sure of anything, I'm asking questions and expressing my concern.

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

Well, for starters, any of Bungie's previous game. Traversal is sluggish and ill suited to the fast kill times, gunplay is completely imbalanced, supers are broken and cheap with no counters, and matches are stacked towards those with better gear.

Traversal is sluggish? Wat. Indefinite sprint and multi-jumps are sluggish? The traversal is one of the best aspects of the MP and is better than Halo's by far, I can't even imagine how good it's going to be once I upgrade to the triple jump for the hunter. Gunplay is largely balanced, shotgun/sniper are CLASSIC Halo balancing. The only thing I'd nerf is the auto rifle to make it less effective long-range, and add more recoil. It shouldn't be better at distance than the Scout Rifle. They also need buffs to the Pulse Rifle and Hand Cannon to make them more relevant. But other than that the balancing was, by and large, good. Headshots make a huge difference in this game and it's not CoD at all.

Supers are just part of the game, they're nothing more than another temporary "power weapon" that add some fun to the game and change the pace up a bit. They're no more cheap than someone shooting a rocket into a crowded zone, and you actually do require some skill in order to effectively use a super in many scenarios. They're really not some hugely imbalanced game changer, rather they provide for some fun combat variety.

This doesn't answer the question, though. You're just listing things. Most people would say the supers need work, along with vehicles, along with some of guns, along with the spawns on Venus and Mars. What are your arguments against those balance concerns?

I don't think they're necessarily invalid concerns, but at the same time I also don't think they hugely detract from the current experience. And luckily they're minor enough to be ironed out prior to release.

 

[Icyflamez96]

Deej's exact words, "We've revealed everything you're going to explore in the first version of the game."

He later goes on to say that for release single explorable areas will be available on Earth, Moon, Mars, and Venus and possibly Jupiter as a "surprise" since he didn't mention it and you see it on the select-able map.

The reason that the whole thing is confusing is because right after mentioning that destinations were planets, he started naming planets. Then he was asked "can we go out of the solar system?" And he said "not so far, we revealed everything that you will be able to explore in the game." So it's unclear if he was talking strictly destinations, or locations.

Where does he say the bolded?

 

[RoboPlato]

yes. Why wouldn't it be given it is like 2 weeks away from going gold?

It was less than a full zone and gear, low level cap, and gear was limited to common and uncommon pieces.

 

[Tiops]

You know, if you are worried about how much content the game will have and if it'll be worth your money, you can just not preorder it and wait for opinions. It's not hard.

I am a little bit worried about the content too, but what I've played in the Beta is enough to justify my money, so I'll get day 1.

 

[Regret Upon Approval]

Since we're throwing out concerns here as well, I'll add in.

FOV feels too narrow. Subsequently it feels awkward and it is easy to lose track of things or be blindsided.
Exploring is the most appealing thing to me, but needs some work. Like being able to join up and communicate with randoms while on patrol. And less dead ends with nothing but glimmer chests. I hope for mysteries to find and secrets to unravel.
Will there be weapons that play differently? I've already read several times there'll be more in the full game and we haven't gotten past uncommons. But looking at the stock of legendaries on vendors it seems more like higher stats and wittier blurbs. Not functioning differently.

Those were my main concerns with the beta. Addressing them will make me quite pleased to purchase.

 

[Icyflamez96]

Not at all, GAF as a whole does a great job of rising above it all; This thread has some valid concerns.
The low shots and whining that get through are funny nonetheless.

So you're disagreeing with me that most of the concerns were reasonable? Or that they shouldn't be labeled as "whiners" when they're just expressing their concerns? What do you mean by "low shots?" I'm all types of confused by your post

Spoiler

not saying it's your fault just try to re word it please

 

[Icyflamez96]

You know, if you are worried about how much content the game will have and if it'll be worth your money, you can just not preorder it and wait for opinions. It's not hard.

I am a little bit worried about the content too, but what I've played in the Beta is enough to justify my money, so I'll get day 1.

And that's exactly what a lot of people said they were doing.

 

[Bornstellar]

Traversal is sluggish? Wat. Indefinite sprint and multi-jumps are sluggish? The traversal is one of the best aspects of the MP and is better than Halo's by far, I can't even imagine how good it's going to be once I upgrade to the triple jump for the hunter. Gunplay is largely balanced, shotgun/sniper are CLASSIC Halo balancing. The only thing I'd nerf is the auto rifle to make it less effective long-range, and add more recoil. It shouldn't be better at distance than the Scout Rifle. They also need buffs to the Pulse Rifle and Hand Cannon to make them more relevant. But other than that the balancing was, by and large, good. Headshots make a huge difference in this game and it's not CoD at all.

Supers are just part of the game, they're nothing more than another temporary "power weapon" that add some fun to the game and change the pace up a bit. They're no more cheap than someone shooting a rocket into a crowded zone, and you actually do require some skill in order to effectively use a super in many scenarios. They're really not some hugely imbalanced game changer, rather they provide for some fun combat variety.



I don't think they're necessarily invalid concerns, but at the same time I also don't think they hugely detract from the current experience. And luckily they're minor enough to be ironed out prior to release.

Yes, traversal is sluggish in terms of floatiness (similar to Halo), it's also easy to get caught on the environment. However, the TTK is much faster so it has a much more adverse effect here than there.

Supers are unlike power weapons because they don't spawn on the map and you don't have to jockey for control of them. There's also no clear indication that your opponent has a super ready.

Couple more things I didn't mention - the FOV is ridiculously small, the network perf. is terrible, and player visibility / readability is also awful.

It was less than a full zone and gear, low level cap, and gear was limited to common and uncommon pieces.

While there were locked areas, they were indoors and likely to be campaign mission locations. In terms of the "overworld", I'm pretty sure I saw it all.

 

[OverHeat]

Yes, traversal is sluggish in terms of floatiness (similar to Halo), it's also easy to get caught on the environment. However, the TTK is much faster so it has a much more adverse effect here than there.

Supers are unlike power weapons because they don't spawn on the map and you don't have to jockey for control of them. There's also no clear indication that your opponent has a super ready.

Couple more things I didn't mention - the FOV is ridiculously small, the network perf. is terrible, and player visibility / readability is also awful.

flashing yellow level on their name....

 

[Interficium]

maybe they should have focused on PvE then.

also those maps are awful, if they were built from the ground up someone should be fired. then again Bungie has never given a shit about MP considering the only Halo with good maps was made by mistake.

Pure class. Deeper down the rabbit hole we go!

 

[Sword Of Doom]

Then SHARE something. All I'm hearing is that it's not enough. We don't even know that with any certainty.

Obviously we're basing all this on what we've played. I'm mainly disappointed with two things. The campaign kind of feels like the Titanfall campaign where it's the same as what you basically do during other parts of the game except someone is talking in your ear and there's cutscenes, which are beautiful. The other thing that bothers me is the one area per world which this thread is about. I feel like a part of my disappointment comes from overexposure to the game before it's even launched. If you told me all this info about the game after the alpha I wouldn't care. But after spending so much time with the game (around 20hours) I can't help but feel disappointed.

 

[QaaQer]

It was less than a full zone and gear, low level cap, and gear was limited to common and uncommon pieces.

and it gave us an excellent opportunity to understand the story (or lack thereof), the gameplay, the scope of the areas, mission structures, loot systems, etc etc.

In fact, I have no doubt that by doing a full beta, they have hurt sales.

There must be good reasons for companies like EA with Titanfall and Activision with Destiny to do these betas because they sure as shit don't increase sales.

 

[Bornstellar]

flashing yellow level on their name....

Not very clear.

 

[rdrr gnr]

and it gave us an excellent opportunity to understand the story (or lack thereof), the gameplay, the scope of the areas, mission structures, loot systems, etc etc.

In fact, I have no doubt that by doing a full beta, they have hurt sales.

There must be good reasons for companies like EA with Titanfall and Activision with Destiny to do these betas because they sure as shit don't increase sales.

Absolutely not. I do think demos have issues, but in this is helped Bungie more than it hurt.

 

[RoboPlato]

and it gave us an excellent opportunity to understand the story (or lack thereof), the gameplay, the scope of the areas, mission structures, loot systems, etc etc.

In fact, I have no doubt that by doing a full beta, they have hurt sales.

There must be good reasons for companies like EA with Titanfall and Activision with Destiny to do these betas because they sure as shit don't increase sales.

I'm pretty sure this beta increased sales a lot. I've never seen opinion turn around on a game as fast as this once people played it. Many were confused about what it even was and thought it looked boring until they got their hands on it.

 

[MrDaravon]

Isn't it my right to decide the value proposition as a consumer? Having played the beta, my decision on when or at what price I purchase the game is dependent on how much unique and engaging content there is in the PVE (since the PVP is definitely not my thing).

Sure, but even if they put numbers out there we don't have accurate context for most of it. Let's just say as an example Urk comes on and says there are 40 story missions across 5 planets, each with one zone. We got to play through most of Earth and the first 5 (?) missions there. Who's to say that the last 3 planets don't have way longer story missions, or that the single area maps on those planets are way bigger? We don't know what any of the other Strikes look like, they could all be way longer (or shorter). The point is no one outside of Bungie has any answers to these questions. So how can ANYONE make an accurate value proposition based on any sort of information like that they put out right now? People are making assumptions regarding game time extrapolating out how long the starting planet/zone took us, which is potentially totally ridiculous. If people are concerned to the level of detail where they need every type of unique activity broken down, exact mission number counts and how long they and the base game take, you're going to need to wait for reviews regardless. Practically no game does that pre-launch outside of general claims of "40+ hours of content" and "10 multiplayer maps!", and in those cases usually the general public hasn't played the game outside of maybe a typical demo so there's no context for any of that. This is only happening here because people are extrapolating assumptions based off a beta we got to play early, which isn't usually the case.

There are totally valid concerns and criticisms here (like them saying you can go anywhere you can see which is clearly not the case, one area per planet, etc), and I personally am extraordinarily unhappy about being limited to 3 people in your team outside of PvP/Raid and some other things as well. It's totally fine to feel disappointed about a lot of things (I know one person who outright actually did cancel their pre-order because of the low fireteam beta count saying why can Halo and Borderlands do 4-player but this game can't). But people are flipping the fuck out about an unconfirmed mission count tally that by itself doesn't even really mean anything since they're clearly focused on making this a game you will be playing for a long time, aka ensuring it has replayability. And now some people are assuming that it's limited because it's all been locked away to a cascade of nickel and dime paid DLC from launch until the end of time. It's totally crazy to me how a developer that has been beloved and community focused for so incredibly long is just immediately fucking turned on like this before the game is even out. This is the kind of shit we used to make fun of reddit and 4chan for.

 

[jond76]

and it gave us an excellent opportunity to understand the story (or lack thereof), the gameplay, the scope of the areas, mission structures, loot systems, etc etc.

In fact, I have no doubt that by doing a full beta, they have hurt sales.

There must be good reasons for companies like EA with Titanfall and Activision with Destiny to do these betas because they sure as shit don't increase sales.

Maybe they actually need to... test stuff.

 

[QaaQer]

Absolutely not. I do think demos have issues, but in this is helped Bungie more than it hurt.

naw, that's why there are almost no aaa retail games with demos. It's been shown they hurt sales.

 

[fluffydelusions]

maybe they should have focused on PvE then.

also those maps are awful, if they were built from the ground up someone should be fired. then again Bungie has never given a shit about MP considering the only Halo with good maps was made by mistake.

 

[Sword Of Doom]

I dunno. This whole thing just sounds like the deals made with Sony extend to even using Sony's own PR tactics. Don't tell gamers anything, reveal news (particularly bad news) at the last minute, and tie up everyone's money in a preorder they're hopefully too lazy or too late to cancel by the time they are able to read a review.

Seriously what did Sony ever do to you? You seem genuinely hurt by them

 

[Crimson_Gold]

I don't even know what's real anymore. This thread has gone off the rails

 

[tuna_love]

Do you mean phenomenal potential or do you just not know what you are talking about? What about the game is phenomenal? Is "phenomenal" like how KZ: SF was phenomenal? Because there's another word for that.

Lol

 

[Pattycakes]

I don't even know what's real anymore. This thread has gone off the rails

This thread is my comedy for the night. Just sit back and watch the popcorn.

 

[David___]

Seriously what did Sony ever do to you? You seem genuinely hurt by them

Yoshida obviously laughed as Boyes, Hirai and House killed his cat.

 

[rdrr gnr]

naw, that's why there are almost no aaa retail games with demos. It's been shown they hurt sales.

I've seen that argument. It has a ton of issues. Even if that trend were true, we have two 400-page threads dedicated to that game thanks to the beta. My guess would be this game is going to do around 10M -- thanks, in part, to that beta.

 

[Lucent]

This thread is my comedy for the night. Just sit back and watch the popcorn.

Thought you were supposed to eat popcorn. =l

 

[Commanche Raisin Toast]

basically the way i felt after reading that there are a handful of planets (counting the Moon here too just for the sake of argument) with one area each is "oh man, i was really looking forward to exploring other areas of Earth to see what's happened to it since the fall".

i also am a bit worried that i just played 1/4 of the content of the game in the beta. with not much new to look forward to in the main game itself. there was only one or two strikes on Russia in the beta, right? and didn't they confirm that Russia is the biggest area?

Urk said they are making this game for every kind of player. i pretty much play 95% SP and the remaining 5% is co-op and it's very situational. i'm starting to feel like there will be less in the game for ME (and players like me) because it's been 'taken away' to give to the co-op and competitive crowd. they deserve to get content too, and i understand that, but i really did get through all of the SP stuff in the beta within a few sittings. i'm not going to be spiteful and cancel my preorder and declare it on here to upset Urk, but i just felt it would be a good thing to at least throw my concerns into the ring as well.

 

[QaaQer]

I don't even know what's real anymore. This thread has gone off the rails

hehehehe. Giant-ass releases with big marketing budgets include something for social marketing. Actually, it doesn't even have to be a big release anymore, its not that expensive to seed forums. So yeah, your's is a good attitude to have.

Spoiler

at least gaf tries to weed their garden, most do not

 

[Draper]

Bungie is probably sweating behind their desks knowing that the jig is up!

 

[Crimson_Gold]

Thought you were supposed to eat popcorn. =l

Depends, could be decorative popcorn or even worse, candy corn in disguise

 

[David___]

Thought you were supposed to eat popcorn. =l

Not enough content. Better to watch it burn to a crisp.

 

[Icyflamez96]

Yoshida obviously laughed as Boyes, Hirai and House killed his cat.

I don't know if you missed my comment because I didn't directly quote you, but

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=122955784&postcount=2972

 

[Lucent]

Depends, could be decorative popcorn or even worse, candy corn in disguise

Candy corn is good. Just not in large quantities.

 

[Sword Of Doom]

hehehehe. Giant-ass releases with big marketing budgets include something for social marketing. Actually, it doesn't even have to be a big release anymore, its not that expensive to seed forums. So yeah, your's is a good attitude to have.

Spoiler

at least gaf tries to weed their garden, most do not

The weeks leading up to the console launches were golden

 

[gatti-man]

yes. Why wouldn't it be given it is like 2 weeks away from going gold?

Because that's not how betas work? Because bungie is using it to test their network not for you to play the entirety of the game for free for 10 days? Because common sense?

You do understand what Betas are right? They aren't demos or trials.

 

[QaaQer]

I've seen that argument. It has a ton of issues. Even if that trend were true, we have two 400-page threads dedicated to that game thanks to the beta. My guess would be this game is going to do around 10M -- thanks, in part, to that beta.

I'm guessing 6 million before they start doing price reductions. Although that depends entirely on people understanding this isn't a game with a single player campaign. If people think it is, then yeah Borderlands numbers, 10 million probably.