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[Darkstorne]

Here's the problem- Because you are already using a system that gives individuals their own loot table, why not use it on the bosses where people want to be rewarded the most? (Not instantly the best gear)

In fact I'm willing to bet that instead of having a loot reward at the end of the Strike, if they had set those loot to drop from bosses you would have a much more satisfying experience downing them.

But the issue again is that the loot from a random mob, a boss, or strike rewards, are all under the same RNG.

So it's an issue with your own perception. You ARE getting loot from Strikes, guaranteed at least one or two items at the end, plus all the chances of engrams dropping from enemies throughout the run. It works out as a much more player-friendly way of rewarding loot (so it's instanced to players rather than a need/greed system where you're more likely to get nothing at all) yet you're upset because it doesn't conform to standard (worse) MMO practices.

 

[p3tran]

Someone please tell me this isn't actually the case...

lololol
now, if I wanted to improve the game -until it is formally improved- I'd just make sure that that cave of love in old russia, would start to give some vanguard marks too

 

[Chaos2Frozen]

So it's an issue with your own perception. You ARE getting loot from Strikes, guaranteed at least one or two items at the end, plus all the chances of engrams dropping from enemies throughout the run. It works out as a much more player-friendly way of rewarding loot (so it's instanced to players rather than a need/greed system where you're more likely to get nothing at all) yet you're upset because it doesn't conform to standard (worse) MMO practices.

Boss dropping loot is a worse MMO practice?

You are already using a system that gives individuals their own loot table so that whole not getting any loot for yourself is not an issue, why not use it on the bosses where people want to be rewarded the most? (Not instantly the best gear)

And again, the issue is that the loot from a random mob, a boss, or strike rewards, are all under the same RNG. This wouldn't be a problem if the loot were of better quality for an activity that requires more effort....Then there's that whole other problem about how strikes are essentially the same design yadayada but forget it.

 

[Winter John]

The mighty ElPresador has been playing Destiny

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H9vF63BM7V8&list=UUwNvdtSQfkljyW_FT-BNZWA

 

[jellies_two]

So it's an issue with your own perception. You ARE getting loot from Strikes, guaranteed at least one or two items at the end, plus all the chances of engrams dropping from enemies throughout the run. It works out as a much more player-friendly way of rewarding loot (so it's instanced to players rather than a need/greed system where you're more likely to get nothing at all) yet you're upset because it doesn't conform to standard (worse) MMO practices.

the problem is strikes are fucking boring after doing them twice each. Thats 5 or 6 hours and you're sleepwalking. no wonder people choose the cave because you can do something else fun on a tablet, while waiting for drops.

 

[Son of Sam]

Sigh

 

[Darkstorne]

Boss dropping loot is a worse MMO practice?

You are already using a system that gives individuals their own loot table so that whole not getting any loot for yourself is not an issue, why not use it on the bosses where people want to be rewarded the most? (Not instantly the best gear)

And again, the issue is that the loot from a random mob, a boss, or strike rewards, are all under the same RNG. This wouldn't be a problem if the loot were of better quality for an activity that requires more effort....Then there's that whole other problem about how strikes are essentially the same design yadayada but forget it.

No, they're not lol

Strikes give guaranteed blue loot, guaranteed marks for legendaries of your choosing, and guaranteed rep which typically leads to legendary engrams at each level. On top of that guaranteed loot for running a Strike, you also have the chance at engrams drooping for each enemy - that's the only part under RNG.

Grinding for loot (such as treasure cave) only gives you the regular RNG chance at engrams from kills, subject to RNG luck again upon decryption. No guaranteed loot after a 20-30 minute run. No vanguard marks. No rep.

You started out saying Strikes give you no more loot than you get for grinding. Now you're changing your argument to "Well, okay, it gives loot, but not at the exact moment I want it given to me." Honestly, sounds like you're just arguing for the sake of arguing.

the problem is strikes are fucking boring after doing them twice each. Thats 5 or 6 hours and you're sleepwalking. no wonder people choose the cave because you can do something else fun on a tablet, while waiting for drops.

If you think Strikes are boring, and you think grinding for loot as an alternative is boring, you probably just shouldn't be playing this game.

 

[Chaos2Frozen]

You started out saying Strikes give you no more loot than you get for grinding. Now you're changing your argument to "Well, okay, it gives loot, but not at the exact moment I want it given to me." Honestly, sounds like you're just arguing for the sake of arguing.

Actually I was arguing for both points albeit clumsily.

But yes, since you want to take it as a grind game, every little bit does counts including having bosses drop (good) loot.

If you think Strikes are boring, and you think grinding for loot as an alternative is boring, you probably just shouldn't be playing this game.

What an amazing game!

 

[MMaRsu]

If you think Strikes are boring, and you think grinding for loot as an alternative is boring, you probably just shouldn't be playing this game.

The strikes ARE boring after running through them three or four times lol.

 

[Psoelberg]

News from the official Bungie website:
"there should always be something new to experience every time you play Destiny."

It's like they are trying so hard to pretend no negative review have happened.

Have they even commeted on it yet?

 

[Marcel]

News from the official Bungie website:
"there should always be something new to experience every time you play Destiny."

It's like they are trying so hard to pretend no negative review have happened.

Have they even commeted on it yet?

There should be something new but I had to go through a shitty grind to get to it, Bungie.

And yes, one of the developers commented on it:

(LOL)

 

[Kolgar]

I'll ask here because no one replied in the OT thread.

So, guys. I really enjoyed the game up to Level 20 when I finished the story missions. But I'm not into grinding and I'm trying to decide whether to trade the game in.

I bought it on X1 because a buddy of mine has it, but he's never on so I solo'd the main game. The lack of matchmaking for strikes kind of puts me in a spot and I'm having trouble understanding just what there is for me to do in the game that doesn't involve farming and failure.

Any suggestions? If it's likely Bungie will fix some issues and make the game more accessible to a solo player like me, I'll keep it around. I certainly enjoyed the gunplay and art.

Thanks.

 

[Karl Hawk]

I decided on passing on Destiny after the initial fan reactions and I watched the Angry Joe review just. The AJ criticisms seem to be a great encapsulation of all the frustrations I've read about Destiny thus far -- while the production values like graphics, art direction and music, as well as the core mechanics of the game like controls and shooting are sound, the narrative is very weak and the systems/loot/level design is similarly weak as well.

I'm just surprised that a game that has such production values can get basic MMO systems like loot and level design this poorly. Then again, when someone like Luke Smith can become a design lead on Destiny for Bungie, I'm really not.

Late reply, but whatever.

The fact that Luke Smith is Destiny's design lead is a problem.... why?

 

[BokehKing]

It's a motherfucking shame that people waited to review our game until we told them they could review our game.

They should have waited longer.

Stupid assholes.

I think you're too emotionally invested in this man, take a deep breath, and relax, it's just a game

 

[PrivateWHudson]

The mighty ElPresador has been playing Destiny

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H9vF63BM7V8&list=UUwNvdtSQfkljyW_FT-BNZWA

Guess we now know why they didn't add public chat.

 

[Marcel]

I'll ask here because no one replied in the OT thread.

Level 20 -> 26 is the big Raid level grind. You're either grinding for marks and rep on the Vanguard Playlist/Crucible, doing bounties, or shooting at trash mobs at the treasure cave for potential rare/legendary drops. To upgrade Light level gear you have to grind out planet materials or ascendant shards. Once you're raid-ready, seems like it's a repeat raid grind to 28 to be Nightfall Strike ready. Rinse and repeat 'til 30 I guess.

If that doesn't sound fun to you, sell or shelve the game. I wouldn't blame you.

 

[Glass Shark]

The Kotaku review is great. This line sums up my feelings on the game so far:

At times, I've felt as though I'm playing Destiny "wrong" by farming exploits and choosing boring missions over enjoyable ones. But if I'm playing incorrectly, why has the game been designed to reward that style of play?

I can't decide if I think this is a good game or not, and yet I can't stop playing.

 

[Jito]

The mighty ElPresador has been playing Destiny

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H9vF63BM7V8&list=UUwNvdtSQfkljyW_FT-BNZWA

Please don't be serious, this guy can't be serious? Its like darksidephil level of stupid.

 

[eot]

because this, I guess?



Ya lost me.

That was a remarkably incoherent paragraph.

 

[Sullichin]

It's almost sickening when people support random drops and "everyone wins!" mentality. So the guy that does the best on the team should have the same amount of chance to get a drop as the guy that does the worst on the team? It's completely random and an absolute joke, it makes players not want to try. What's the point of trying, you can do horrible and still get the same amount of loot as the guy that's actually giving effort.

Yeah, just sickening.

You are already rewarded by being on the winning team in Crucible by getting over twice the rep you would if you had lost. It's been said before but reps/marks are the way to grind out new equipment, and you do that faster the better you play. You should "want to try" because winning is a faster way of ranking up in Crucible and you can buy guaranteed legendaries with your rank. But I also try because I think PVP (specifically control) is the best part of the game. That's enough for me.

 

[op_ivy]

The Kotaku review is great. This line sums up my feelings on the game so far:



I can't decide if I think this is a good game or not, and yet I can't stop playing.

yeah, IMO its an excellent AND highly lacking/disappointing game. its rare to see such a polarization among a single person's view of a game. an oxymoron. on the one hand, i have a blast with it and absolutely cant wait to get back into playing it, in which case i'd score it a 9 or 10. but on the other hand there are some major misteps, such as lack of compelling/coherent story, poor loot reward design, lack of communication in most modes, connection issues in pvp (major major major issues for me), etc, which should score it significantly lower (6?).

 

[Sinfamy]

Why is King' Watch blocked off?
I can see enemies on my radar...

 

[PrivateWHudson]

Why is King' Watch blocked off?
I can see enemies on my radar...

a) To open as an Event in the near future.
b) To unlock as DLC

No clear picture as to which at the moment.

 

[Impala26]

There's literally no point. The game is terribly balanced, there's no reason to try and get better, it's a roll of the dice.

Bungie is basically saying "Who cares if you are great, average, or horrible, everybody wins!"

I don't care for that mentality, and it's not the Bungie I know.

It's really head-scratching considering Halo 2's mulitiplayer ranking system is considered by many as one of, if not THE best ranking systems for console shooters to date. The more you look at it though, it's like Bungie has been backpedaling/reversing on that system with each major relase they put out.

Halo 2: Difficult, but normalized (Bell) ranking curve of 0-50 ("Average" Player = 25)

Halo 3: Easier and weighted ranking curve of 0-50 ("Average" Player ~ 35)

Halo Reach: No ranking curve save "The Arena" Playlist, but rewards EXP for playing more games/time with slightly more for better team/player performance.

Destiny: No ranking curve whatsoever or ranked playlist. EXP is for Crucible rep/bounties only. Weapon/gear/item drops are COMPLETELY random.

It's like each entry literally incentivizes actually getting BETTER playing PvP less and less...

 

[Impala26]

Double Post Derp.

 

[gai_shain]

The best stuff should most definitely be behind pure RNG. Otherwise inflation hits very fast.

because lots of people can have the best gear? There is no trading or selling in destiny is there?

 

[Anton Sugar]

I know that feel.

Seriously, is there an explanation for this system? If it's an end-mission/game roll, why is there even the possibility that you can get nothing?

Frustrating as hell. Did the Daily Strike with friends yesterday and NONE of us got ANYTHING. What the fuck?

 

[BigDug13]

Seriously, is there an explanation for this system? If it's an end-mission/game roll, why is there even the possibility that you can get nothing?

Frustrating as hell. Did the Daily Strike with friends yesterday and NONE of us got ANYTHING. What the fuck?

That's some bullshit. Nobody should get "nothing" as their reward for completing a time consuming Strike. Nothing will discourage gamers more than providing a possibility of zero reward for time investment. Even if they got lower level stuff or items that aren't an upgrade, at least that's SOMEthing. It should never be zero reward. That's fucked.

 

[Doc_Drop]

Still no Edge review? Must be waiting to include in next issue to get them sales

 

[Fisty]

Seriously, is there an explanation for this system? If it's an end-mission/game roll, why is there even the possibility that you can get nothing?

Frustrating as hell. Did the Daily Strike with friends yesterday and NONE of us got ANYTHING. What the fuck?

You didnt get anything because its a WEEKLY strike, not daily. Youve probably already done the strike (the icon will be colored and rewards wont be listed if youve done it) so therefore no reward.

 

[Papercuts]

That tweet gets weirder and weirder by the day. The game needs actual, real new playable spaces. Fucking hell, even a new mission would be fine at this point, everything is literally the same old stuff but with some modifier that doesn't really change a whole lot.

 

[Stormus]

The only thing that Destiny exceeds in is the PvP/Graphics. In every other category this game falls short. I totally bought into the hype

 

[-tetsuo-]

If you think Strikes are boring, and you think grinding for loot as an alternative is boring, you probably just shouldn't be playing this game.

How can a strike not be boring after doing it 5 times?

 

[Chaos2Frozen]

How can a strike not be boring after doing it 5 times?

There are ways to avoid that (or at least delay it) if your boss mechanics are fun and exciting- I don't think I'll ever get bored of fighting Titan in FFXIV and I don't even need loot as a motivation. But because the boss battles here are so uninspiring, the dullness can set in quite fast.

 

[Caja 117]

Wow

Yeah, I actually preffer those radom rewards in team matches. they tried already rewarding the best player in Reach with Arena Ranks, and those playlists were a mess because no one was playing to win, rather for their own gain, there wasnt any teamwork at all.

For example in a control match everyone would be shooting to have the most kills instead of capturing the control point.

 

[Papercuts]

There are ways to avoid that (or at least delay it) if your boss mechanics are fun and exciting- I don't think I'll ever get bored of fighting Titan in FFXIV and I don't even need loot as a motivation. But because the boss battles here are so uninspiring, the dullness can set in quite fast.

Yeah. In theory, grinding the same 6 strikes could have lasted for awhile, but those strikes themselves have a ton of mechanical issues. Wayyy too much health, uninteresting boss design, etc. On top of that, Strikes are currently the worst thing you could spend your destiny time, regarding payouts.

 

[nynt9]

There are ways to avoid that (or at least delay it) if your boss mechanics are fun and exciting- I don't think I'll ever get bored of fighting Titan in FFXIV and I don't even need loot as a motivation. But because the boss battles here are so uninspiring, the dullness can set in quite fast.

Or even if the boss battles are boring, at least make them rewarding (in terms of loot) so that there's incentive to do them.

 

[Anton Sugar]

That's some bullshit. Nobody should get "nothing" as their reward for completing a time consuming Strike. Nothing will discourage gamers more than providing a possibility of zero reward for time investment. Even if they got lower level stuff or items that aren't an upgrade, at least that's SOMEthing. It should never be zero reward. That's fucked.

Exactly. Even getting some materials would be better than nothing. I'm not asking for exotic equipment, just SOMETHING for my time and effort, for doing what is "recommended" as higher level progression.

You didnt get anything because its a WEEKLY strike, not daily. Youve probably already done the strike (the icon will be colored and rewards wont be listed if youve done it) so therefore no reward.

Nope, that's my mistake--we did the Daily Story (I thought it was called "Strike"). We tried the Weekly Strike but couldn't get it done.

So why didn't we get anything for completing the Daily Story yesterday?

 

[Officerrob]

The only thing that Destiny exceeds in is the PvP/Graphics. In every other category this game falls short. I totally bought into the hype

Music/Sound Design is fantastic

 

[Fisty]

Nope, that's my mistake--we did the Daily Story (I thought it was called "Strike"). We tried the Weekly Strike but couldn't get it done.

So why didn't we get anything for completing the Daily Story yesterday?

Well you got vanguard marks and xp, unless you hit the weekly cap for marks. Thats about all youre gonna get, the daily stories are pretty easy once you get past 20, you should be able to solo it so naturally you arent going to get a shard or something for that

 

[Poodlestrike]

Well you got vanguard marks and xp, unless you hit the weekly cap for marks. Thats about all youre gonna get, the daily stories are pretty easy once you get past 20, you should be able to solo it so naturally you arent going to get a shard or something for that

Actually, you do get Ascended Mats for the Dailies if you turn up the difficulty.

 

[Fisty]

Music/Sound Design is fantastic

And the UI is one of the best/cleanest out there, really great work

 

[BeforeU]

And the UI is one of the best/cleanest out there, really great work

Not really. It gets annoying after a while

 

[GuitarAtomik]

Honestly, I'm ok with the random doling of items in PvP (perhaps because I'm not that great at it lol). THAT SAID, it probably shouldn't be quite that random. I think it should be something like this:

Top Score: Guaranteed 2 items / Higher chance of getting exotics and legendaries
2nd: Guaranteed 1 item / Higher chance of getting legendaries
3rd: Guaranteed 1 item / Higher chance of getting blues

Everything else stays the same. Having a lower score could still net you two legendaries (yeah right) but you could just as easily get nothing. This would reward the top scorers with guaranteed items, while not as skilled players still feel like they have a chance at something awesome. Obviously this would need some adjustment for 3v3 though. Maybe only reward top score.

 

[Impala26]

Honestly, I'm ok with the random doling of items in PvP (perhaps because I'm not that great at it lol). THAT SAID, it probably shouldn't be quite that random. I think it should be something like this:

Top Score: Guaranteed 2 items / Higher chance of getting exotics and legendaries
2nd: Guaranteed 1 item / Higher chance of getting exotics
3rd: Guaranteed 1 item / Higher chance of getting blues

Everything else stays the same. Having a lower score could still net you two legendaries (yeah right) but you could just as easily get nothing. This would reward the top scorers with guaranteed items, while not as skilled players still feel like they have a chance at something awesome. Obviously this would need some adjustment for 3v3 though. Maybe only reward top score.

Can Bungie hire you already?

Also, shouldn't 2nd spot be "higher chance of LEGENDARIES"? Also, would you think any sort of weighting should be considered for being on the WINNING team?

 

[ironcreed]

I know that feel.

Exactly. The game becomes pointless and offers no incentive to keep playing.

 

[Fisty]

Actually, you do get Ascended Mats for the Dailies if you turn up the difficulty.

Well yea but I doubt hes turning up the diff on daily stories if he cant finish a weekly strike. The best you could hope for is a lucky random drop from mobs in that case. He should be trying to get strange coins and raising vanguard/crucible reps and marks at this point, it seems

 

[Exploratory]

Can Bungie hire you already?

Also, shouldn't 2nd spot be "higher chance of LEGENDARIES"? Also, would you think any sort of weighting should be considered for being on the WINNING team?

Its not even about Bungie hiring him it's about them lacking even the most basic common sense throughout the game.

Ugh now I'm off to play more Destiny for hours on end.

 

[GuitarAtomik]

Can Bungie hire you already?

Also, shouldn't 2nd spot be "higher chance of LEGENDARIES"? Also, would you think any sort of weighting should be considered for being on the WINNING team?

Yeah, that's what I meant (fixing)! Always get those confused. My understanding is that the winning team already does have a higher chance of getting items. I could be wrong. Weighting the RNG for TYPE of item might be a good idea but maybe not necessary. The winning team already gets more Crucible marks and you don't see what the other team got as far as rewards (or do you?) so you're not going to feel the sting if the losing team gets better gear. But at the same time, maybe a little bit of extra weight should be added.

 

[abadguy]

I'm probably feeling crazy, but if there's anything going on regarding moneyhats with Destiny, I imagine it to be Microsoft spending money to spread negative public awareness for this release.

Holy shit! Wat?