Totally this. Don't want to alienate the main user base
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Digital Foundry - Playstation 5 Pro specs analysis, also new information
- Thread starter Gaiff
- Start date
Could be early dev-kit specs.
Tom Henderson did say Testkits will be identical to the final product.
This sounds to me like the Devkits could possibly be using older hardware, which the current leaks might be based on.
The testkits are basically commertial units with some debug tools, and final devkits need to have the same hardware configuration with additional memory and possibly slightly better CPU or GPU. Unlike initial development kits, which may not have the same hardware as commercial units.
Mr.Phoenix
Member
Thanks for this...
This is why I say that the only thing that may not be set in stone right now, are the clocks.
What people don't know/seem to forget, is that there is a difference between a dev kit and a test kit. A test kit is a perfect product match in every way with the final hardware. With the only difference is that its running Dev. Firmware. The devkits, however, are more powerful than the final hardware and always have significantly more performance headroom than the final hardware. One can even say the dev kits "emulate" the specifications of the final hardware.
Eg. Dev kit CPU and GPU can be running at 4.4GHz and 2.7Ghz respectively, and Sony will set a test kit profile of say a 3.8Ghz CPU and a 2.2Ghz GPU. Then after Sony has truly finalized the design of the hardware, and in turn has done all its thermal testing, could now update that test kit profile to something like 4Ghz CPU and 2.4Ghz CPU if during their testing they realize they have enough thermal and power headroom to bump things up a bit.
Not saying this is going to happen, but it can happen. Sony has only ever done this once before for I believe the PSP, Xbox did it for the XB1.
Bojji
Member
It has more CUs and higher clock 2498 MHz.
We are looking at:
33.5 vs. 61.39 TFLOPS
Richard is expressing his opinion, I also think that Pro won't beat 2x larger GPU in anything. I can be wrong obviously (same goes to Richard) because RT hardware is the biggest mystery of PS5 Pro.
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Loxus
Member
It puzzles me that you think putting Zen3 or 4 would make it become the PS6.
PS6 is most likely going to have 16 core and it may not even be something like Zen6. By then AMD maybe moving on to a new entire architecture.
The features we're getting with this new GPU, AI and ML are more making the PS5 a PS6 than upgrading the CPU.
It's not the same as going from Jaguar to Zen2. Which is massive, up to 300%.
Zen CPU architecture barely gain 15-19% in performance between Zen 2, 3, & 4.
And barely anything changed in the architecture compared to upgrading from Jaguar.
But the PS5 Pro getting a 45%+ boost in rasterization, up to 4× RT and AI/ML with 300 8-bit TOPs (more that the 7900XTX) isn't considered PS6?
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Mr.Phoenix
Member
dont know how else to explain this...It puzzles me that you think putting Zen3 or 4 would make it become the PS6.
PS6 is most likely going to have 16 core and it may not even be something like Zen6. By then AMD maybe moving on to a new entire architecture.
The features we're getting with this new GPU, AI and ML are more making the PS5 a PS6 than upgrading the CPU.
It's not the same as going from Jaguar to Zen2. Which is massive, up to 300%.
Zen CPU architecture barely gain 15-19% in performance between Zen 2, 3, & 4.
And barely anything changed in the architecture compared to upgrading from Jaguar.
But the PS5 Pro getting a 45%+ boost in GPU performance and AI/ML with 300 8-bit TOPs (more that the 7900XTX) isn't considered PS6?
The PS5 only gets a GPU upgrade, and while getting a RAM upgrade in that its faster, but its still the same total amount (its more but you get the idea). Is what makes it still a PS5. That they left the CPU untouched, simply comes down to the fact that for what they intended to do with the PS5pro, they didn't see it as necessary. They improved the things they felt they needed to improve to make the PS5pro what they wanted it to be.
I am not going to go into the whole CPU discussion again, as I have addressed this very thing numerous times and even gave clear examples to support my theory of how Sony, would be looking at the CPU and it being a bottleneck very differently from how you may look at it.
And we just don't know it, but something as simple as changing the PS5 CPU from a 2x4 cluster layout to 1x8 cluster may cause complications Sony just doesn't want. It could also be that AMD simply does not have variants of that CPU layout for the node the PS5pro is using, or the R&D required to get that CPU to also talk with the GPU they are getting is more.
Point is, there are a lot of obvious reasons as to why Sony would choose to not make what to you... may seem like a simple no-brainer upgrade.
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MisterXDTV
Member
Absolutely not
Again, you are just considering the theoretical specs but not the TRUE purpose of this machine...
Take PS5 games and make them run/look better....
That's NOT a PS6, not even close....
Loxus
Member
So how does moving to Zen3 with a mere 15% improvement, same core count, same clocks, no new features be considered PS6?
But moving on RDNA3.5/4 with dual-issue, 45% improvement, more CUs, up to 4× RT, and 300 8-bit TOPs not considered PS6?
You realize how much more uplift you're getting from the GPU compared to the CPU, but the GPU isn't considered a massive leap?
Even Kepler, who you guys believe in, since he is who leaked the PS5 Pro still uses Zen2.
Doesn't consider upgrading the CPU = PS6. And actually said it'll make a lot more sense to use Zen5/RDNA4.
Mr.Phoenix
Member
Sigh...
Ok. On the GPU, then the CPU and then lastly, the BOM.
- GPU
Sony knows, that for the MAJORITY of the games made FOR the PS5. A GPU upgrade is all that is needed to get a 1440p + PSSR + 60fps mode that will look on par to or even better than the native 30fps fidelity mode on the base PS5. THIS is the whole point of the PS5pro. And Sony knows, from the gluttony of resources they have and data, that this probably gets 90%+ of all PS5 games, past present, and future to that performance threshold. Its what the XS vs XSX should have been. It takes into account the simple fact, that if any developer can get a game running at 1800p - 2160P@30fps on the base console, this gets them to 1296p-1440p + PSSR>4K, on the PS5pro, and at 60fps.
- CPU
I believe its safe to assume, and we can both agree, that sony has infinitely more access to data analytics on their own platform and its usage? Ok. Sony, looking at and profiling every game currently running on their PS5, would have likely come to the conclusion, that seeing every game that exists on the platform use under 50% CPU utilization, doesn't equate to what qualifies as a CPU bottleneck for them, but rather, an optimization/developer bottleneck. And there is more than enough evidence to support this theory.
Also, sony had no doubt convened with any number of their development studios and technical teams, and those people would have advised sony on the things or areas that they felt needed improvement most.
A mistake that even now, while you make your argument, that you and everyone else that talks about this CPU thing is making, is that you are advocating for sony to take the exact same brute force approach to addressing CPU issues that is used in the PC space. Most game engines (especially from third parties) are lopsidedly single-threaded affairs at best, or generally underutilize all those threads that a modern CPU has at worst. This is why a CPU clock boost is usually always better than a generational upgrade.
Think of it this way, if Sony took a Zen4 CPU, and clocked it at the same clocks of a base PS5... it would still suffer from the same issues, and ultimately represent only an at best 10-15% performance gain. While maybe taking up more space on the die and require more engineering to make it work. So... why not just upclock the existing CPU by 10-15%?
Thats an optimization problem, NOT a hardware problem, and Sony is not going to put that kinda effort into fixing a problem that their data and devs tells them they do not have. For a console that is only made to give the base PS5 games an "ultra mode".
- Lastly, say the PS5 base model, has a BOM of $350. Sony's primary objective, whether you like it or not, is to make a PS5pro, with a BOM of around $450. That would inform every single design choice they make, down to how many screws go into the damn thing.
edit:
The whole this is not a PS6 argument isn't speaking to what doing this or that could do, but rather, to what they are trying to improve or do. Again, they want to use PSSR to get the MAJORITY (never all) of the games that run on the current PS%, past, present, and future... to 60fps. Not 120fps, not 144fps...etc. So how about this, if you had the base PS5, and you were a designer, and that was your target, and I told you you had only a $100 worth of wiggle room to achieve that.... what would you do?
And min you, you have to find a way to significantly improve the GPU (as this yields the most benefit across all your software), to improve the CPU, and to improve RAM capacity and bandwidth. With $100.
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Loxus
Member
Don't tell me this, tell this to Kelper.
He's the one that suggest using Zen5 makes sense, which means BC isn't a problem and also said cost of that SOC is comparable to PS5/XBSX.
Dude knows more about Zen5 then me, so I believe he should know what he's talking about.
Mr.Phoenix
Member
Are you serious right now?
All Kepler is, is a leaker. He does not work for Sony. He is not designing the platform.
I would rather cast my lot with the designer of the Platform, Cerny. As I am sure he is not only more informed than Kepler of the underpinnings of their own platform, but knows what the F they are doing.
It doesn't matter if you even bring the designer of Zen5 from AMD.... That is a Sony choice. And their decisions are informed from and by their own analysis, and their own devs and engineers. WTF am I reading here... you are literally saying we should take the word and mythical knowhow of a leaker called Kelper over Cerny?
And is your idea of actually making an argument to disregard everything or point that has been made to just say... "hey look this guy said this."
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ChiefDada
Gold Member
*Sigh* Not Tflops again...
How many TFLOPS are you equating for 2-4x RT improvement that goes beyond RDNA 3 and for PSSR?
Loxus
Member
You do realize the PS5 Pro using Zen2 comes from him and only him right???
So far Mark Cerny said nothing about the PS5 Pro.
Bojji
Member
What are we even discussing here?
PS5 was over 5x faster than PS5 in GPU
~4/5x faster in CPU
2x RAM
This generational jump was super weak compared to previous ones but it's not comparable to just ~50% GPU power uplift...
Even with Zen 3 or 4 Pro would just be a better PS5 playing games in higher framerate and with better IQ.
Like it or not but TF are good measure of power of GPUs in the same family. 7900XTX also has massive amount of memory bandwidth to back it up, it's not just pure TF power. Obviously this is only relevant to raster.
RT can't be calculated because there is no PC GPU to compare, they cleary use some parts that will appear (or not) in RDNA3.5 or RDNA4 GPUs. Thing is, I don't think "small" RDNA3.5/4 GPU will beat massive RDNA3 chip, you can believe whatever you want.
PSSR is just upscaling and has very similar cost to FSR2, I don't know what it have to do with anything? Games will still have to render internally in 900p/1080p/1440p/ etc.
PS5 was over 5x faster than PS5 in GPU
~4/5x faster in CPU
2x RAM
This generational jump was super weak compared to previous ones but it's not comparable to just ~50% GPU power uplift...
Even with Zen 3 or 4 Pro would just be a better PS5 playing games in higher framerate and with better IQ.
Like it or not but TF are good measure of power of GPUs in the same family. 7900XTX also has massive amount of memory bandwidth to back it up, it's not just pure TF power. Obviously this is only relevant to raster.
RT can't be calculated because there is no PC GPU to compare, they cleary use some parts that will appear (or not) in RDNA3.5 or RDNA4 GPUs. Thing is, I don't think "small" RDNA3.5/4 GPU will beat massive RDNA3 chip, you can believe whatever you want.
PSSR is just upscaling and has very similar cost to FSR2, I don't know what it have to do with anything? Games will still have to render internally in 900p/1080p/1440p/ etc.
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Mr.Phoenix
Member
And that doesn't matter. Again, all he is, is a leaker. His leaking pedigree is not being questioned here. Where I draw the line however, is when you want me to take his design opinions over the design choices that Sony may have made.
Would it be great if Sony actually used Zen 4? Absofuckinglutely. But as I have said, even if they do that, and keep clocks roughly the same... then it wouldn't be the silver bullet you all seem to hope it would be.
If however, sony does what I think they would do, and leave the CPU mostly untouched like they did with the PS4pro, just like Kelper also leaked... I would understand why they did so.
And that's is what this conversation, or hell this thread is about. Not to wishlist what kinda hardware we hope is in the thing, but to understand what or why they did what they have decided to do.
Let me just save you the trouble, that is not what is being discussed lol.
Agreed.
Also agreed.
Now this is the part I don't understand. Or not "dont understand", but more like I am conflicted with.
Who is making this PS5pro RDNA3.5/4 GPU is equivalent or better to 2x RDNA3 equivalent TF GPU?
I don't even believe that is a sensible or realistic argument to make. Cause if we are talking about raw raster performance, well thats obviously false. Are we talking about relative performance, and even then, by the very nature of its description "relative", thats is also false because if you were to just take the relative approximation of the card its compared to's performance, well things can get complicated too.
The way I choose to look at the PS5pro GPU, is that aims to give you 1440p@60fps performance on par with a $500 GPU. Using PSSR to take that tro 4K. But the second you start going above 60fps... you will start to see that gap widen in favor of the $500GPU.
Eg. The PS5pro, could have you running a game at 60fps that looks on par with a 4070s using PSSR to get 4K. However, that 4070 would be able to run that same game, at PS5pro + PSSR settings at over 75-80fps. But thats not our/sony's business because its locked to 60fps anyway.
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Loxus
Member
It's easy to understand why the PS4 Pro still used Jaguar, Zen is an entirely different architecture from Jaguar.
But if you're using the PS4 Pro as an idea as what to expect from the PS5 Pro. Then we wouldn't be getting RDNA3/4 since Mark Cerny said the GPU in the PS4 Pro is identical to the PS4 for the purpose of BC.
The nitty-gritty details of the PS4 Pro, according to system architect Mark Cerny / More power, at what cost?
STANDARD PS4 GAMES WILL PLAY JUST THE SAME UNLESS DEVS PATCH THEM
For the more than 700 or so existing PS4 games, Cerny said the goal was to ensure those titles played smoothly no matter what. That’s why the Pro incorporates an identical GPU. Because the new console has "the old GPU next to a mirror version of itself," Sony can support existing games with a simple trick: "We just turn off the second GPU," he said. Developers can patch these titles to boost graphics and performance in very subtle ways. But unless you have a 4K television, the difference will not be substantial.So all in all, it seems like the PS4 Pro has the same CPU/GPU, but the GPU has elements/features of Polaris.
So were does this leave the PS5 Pro if it takes the same design goal of the PS4 Pro?
This guy nailed it imo.
This is easier to believe if we look at RDNA2 as being RDNA1 refresh with RT.
RDNA2 is still within the GFX range as RDNA1 of 1000.
RDNA1 = GFX101X
RDNA1.1 = GFX101X
RDNA2 = GFX103X
PS5 without RT = GFX1000/1001
PS5 with RT = GFX1013/1014
XBSS/X = GFX1020
While RDNA3 and 4 are in different ranges of 1100 and 1200.
RDNA3 = GFX11XX
RDNA3.5 GFX115X
RDNA4 = GFX12XX
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MisterXDTV
Member
What?
Henderson leak (the guy who has real documents at his hand)
EXCLUSIVE - More PlayStation 5 Pro Specs Detailed
Following this week's leaks on the PlayStation 5 Pro GPU specs and performance targets, Insider Gaming has learned more PS5 Pro specs.
insider-gaming.com
English is not my native language, but I believe IDENTICAL has a very specific meaning: IT'S 100% the SAME
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ChiefDada
Gold Member
What type of power? Ray Tracing? Because remember, that's what we're discussing here.
It's not "just upscaling". There is a very good chance PS5 Pro games with 1440p internal resolution often look better than the image quality 7900XTX can produce at 1440p with FSR reconstruction or even native 4k with subpar FSR TAA. You're a PC gamer, why are you suddenly forgetting the benefits of DLSS? It's all about results, not paper specs.
Loxus
Member
Mark Cerny calls the GPU in the PS4 Pro identical to the PS4's GPU. Is it still GCN2, or is it GCN4?What?
Henderson leak (the guy who has real documents at his hand)
EXCLUSIVE - More PlayStation 5 Pro Specs Detailed
Following this week's leaks on the PlayStation 5 Pro GPU specs and performance targets, Insider Gaming has learned more PS5 Pro specs.
English is not my native language, but I believe IDENTICAL has a very specific meaning: IT'S 100% the SAME
The nitty-gritty details of the PS4 Pro, according to system architect Mark Cerny / More power, at what cost?
STANDARD PS4 GAMES WILL PLAY JUST THE SAME UNLESS DEVS PATCH THEM
For the more than 700 or so existing PS4 games, Cerny said the goal was to ensure those titles played smoothly no matter what. That’s why the Pro incorporates an identical GPU. Because the new console has "the old GPU next to a mirror version of itself," Sony can support existing games with a simple trick: "We just turn off the second GPU," he said. Developers can patch these titles to boost graphics and performance in very subtle ways. But unless you have a 4K television, the difference will not be substantial.
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MisterXDTV
Member
Loxus
Member
Are you saying Mark Cerny is wrong in saying the PS4 Pro incorporates an identical GPU to the PS4?Whatever, It's like talking to a deaf person at this point...
I'm done
Even Mark Cerny's own words you don't believe? WTF
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Bojji
Member
Some people believe that PS5 Pro will beat 7900xtx in RT, I have my doubts and Richard from DF thinks like that too. And this won't be answered until first games arrive because we don't fucking know what AMD did to improve RT performance in Pro.
Raster power (as I said at the end of the sentence), TF are relevant only in raster because RT is much more complicated (you can see lower TF Nvidia cards beating high TF AMD cards).
Image quality between 1440p FSR2 and 1440p PSSR will obviously be different but amount of power needed to process that will be the same, we were talking in "power" units here.
PC hardware testers are often comparing AMD and Nvidia GPUs using for example FSR2 and DLSS2 performance modes, amount of power needed for that is very similar and tests are fair in this regard but obviously image quality of DLSS is on another level.
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Gaiff
SBI’s Resident Gaslighter
I mean, that's not impossible. The 7900 XT's RT performance is only on par with the 3080 which will be 4 years old by the time the Pro hits the scene. The caveat, however, is that it's only in a heavy RT workload such as path tracing where the Pro's GPU would have an enormous advantage. For one, I doubt we actually see any path-traced game on the Pro and for two, most games are hybrid workloads where the raster performance is as important if not more than the RT performance.
So in real-life scenarios, I'm not expecting the 7900 XTX to ever get outdone by the Pro unless Sony decides to run games using path tracing, which while not impossible, is highly unlikely.
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Bojji
Member
Across multiple games 7900XTX is close to 3090ti in RT (on average), that 3080 level is in Cyberpunk (hybrid RT). Obviously with PT performance plummets...
What Richard also mentioned is that Sony talks (in the leak) about adding more RT effects to game using RT already or adding RT to games that don't have it. Nothing about PT so performance in hybrid RT will be the most important thing and raster performance is equally as important in these kind of workloads. 7900XTX is too far ahead in most metrics...
Maybe CDPR will try PT mode on Pro, this could give us what this machine can do with workloads like that (and maybe compare it to RDNA3 GPUs!).
If Sony approached developers with "here's this new mid-gen console that will be purchased by ~10% of userbase - plz be excited and add PT to your games because F U that's why" - well if there was ever a developer revolt chance - that would be a great trigger.
I mean as it was - PS4Pro adoption of hw exclusive features was incredibly spotty - CBR is probably in less than 30% of games, and other Pro exclusive features are even rarer. Hell I don't know if even a handful of VR titles shipped with the Pro exclusive GPU enhancements - which yes - was a shame - but also predictable outcome.
So yea - they need to offer easy to use, minimum effort enhancements as the 'main' driver - sure you'll get a few crazies out there that *will* try adding PT or more - but there's no way they can ask for that outright without straight pissing people off. These consoles are mostly just an annoyance/distraction to devs as it is without asking them to jump complicated hoops.
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chilichote
Member
Is that so difficult to understand?
The PS5 Pro is designed to play PS5 games with better performance while creating as little effort as possible for the developers.
The PS5 Pro is designed to play PS5 games with better performance while creating as little effort as possible for the developers.
Mr.Phoenix
Member
Finally some recognition from DF
Alex can’t handle the truth
Finally. About time they pointed this out.
Panajev2001a
GAF's Pleasant Genius
If Ken K were to wake me up in the middle of the night like that… hey I may try to get a PS5 dev license, more scared about Mark and
though, that might be scary… but scarily motivating ?Good points there, they know the market and the audience of mid-generation console upgrades, PS4 Pro helped with real hard evidence too.
playsaves3
Member
The cpu stuff is just insane if it was true even if I believed they would refuse to upgrade to zen 4/5 no way they only do a 10% clock increase no way it’s less than the ps4 pros 33%Could be early dev-kit specs.
Tom Henderson did say Testkits will be identical to the final product.
This sounds to me like the Devkits could possibly be using older hardware, which the current leaks might be based on.
Physiognomonics
Member
It's only (poor) John, in a direct. Don't you worry about them doing whole new narratives about that fact in 5 upcoming hit pieces.
MisterXDTV
Member
Actually Navi 4x GPUs should be monolithic according to the leaks, so no MCDs at all:
Mr.Phoenix
Member
Let this be a lesson for why people should not guarantee anything in the future based on the past.
Thanks for the correct though, that should mean the PS5pro APU would probably be under 300mm2. Maybe even under 280mm2, because it would lack the infinity cache that Navi4x comes with.
HeisenbergFX4
Gold Member
More info come very soon
ChiefDada
Gold Member
Richard: "[PS5 Pro] is just a bigger GPU."
Sure, Richard. Continue to ignore PSSR as if your entire team hasn't been fawning over what DLSS has allowed for and achieved for NVIDIA GPUs
MisterXDTV
Member
Physiognomonics
Member
They will ignore PSSR and RDNA4 RT as long as they technically can. They are in full panic mode and are here to prepare the grounds for next-xbox that will obviously have a better CPU. This is why Richard is focusing on PS5 Pro CPU, the weak link. He has a well thought plan.Richard: "[PS5 Pro] is just a bigger GPU."
Sure, Richard. Continue to ignore PSSR as if your entire team hasn't been fawning over what DLSS has allowed for and achieved for NVIDIA GPUs
There are going to be many more of those articles. First to demolish as much as they can PS5 Pro (focusing on Zen 2 CPU), then to prepare for the inevitable next Xbox announcement from MS. Or from DF at this point as it's the same thing. They shamelessly did it for Scorpio, they'll do it again for this next xbox with an exclusive access of some kind. They'll come up with a nice spin to hide the fact that at this point they are a mouthpiece of MS, not journalists.
EDIT: The "next xbox is coming" propaganda machine is already well oiled and running. This is the last question they "picked" in the last DF direct:
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Insane Metal
Member
YES PLEASE
MisterXDTV
Member
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PaintTinJr
Member
I'm not sure if it has been mentioned much, but I could see the BVH8 hardware capability on the Pro being very relevant to how it compares to the NVIDIA RTX hardware. This quote from a Nvidia moderator in 2019 about RTX might not be true anymore, but is still quite interesting in the thread and validates Sony and AMD's approach of not building complex accelerators when the mod is advocating for having to do the BVH8 outside the accelerator, and only getting the RTX traversal benefit from the accelerator.
forums.developer.nvidia.com
The research paper linked above, that I've read the first few pages of, seems to suggest extra memory advantages on the GPU side of things can be had just compressing leaf nodes in BVH4 and BVH8 - without an real processing cost beyond uncompressed because traversal performance cost remains unchanged- and this memory gain is above and beyond the added memory saving and processing saving of BVH8 over standard BVH (as described in the primer link below), sort of like Broadband where you increase the MTU size and waste less by using bigger packets. So IMO it will be interesting to see the RT gains from the Pro's BVH8 hardware.
jacco.ompf2.com
/edit
The uncompressed memory footprint of BVH8 is bigger than BVH4, so the BVH8 might imply that the CUs in the Pro also have double the L1 cache because as I understand it, to get the benefit of BVH8 over BVH4 you need to have all the leaf nodes in the same cache line to get the major traversal processing benefit - as discussed in the BVH primer for lowering the storage of a BVH node -which in turn would benefit all aspects of the CU processing, whether compute or raster or AI or RT.
BVH questions
Hi! I have two questions regarding the BVH acceleration structures: How can I determine how many objects are stored per leaf in the BVH? Is this a dynamic value and can it be retrieved from the BVH structures? In one of the example programs on github, I found the use of the undocumented Bvh8...
forums.developer.nvidia.com
Nvidia Mod said:
The research paper linked above, that I've read the first few pages of, seems to suggest extra memory advantages on the GPU side of things can be had just compressing leaf nodes in BVH4 and BVH8 - without an real processing cost beyond uncompressed because traversal performance cost remains unchanged- and this memory gain is above and beyond the added memory saving and processing saving of BVH8 over standard BVH (as described in the primer link below), sort of like Broadband where you increase the MTU size and waste less by using bigger packets. So IMO it will be interesting to see the RT gains from the Pro's BVH8 hardware.
How to build a BVH – Part 1: Basics – Jacco’s Blog
jacco.ompf2.com
/edit
The uncompressed memory footprint of BVH8 is bigger than BVH4, so the BVH8 might imply that the CUs in the Pro also have double the L1 cache because as I understand it, to get the benefit of BVH8 over BVH4 you need to have all the leaf nodes in the same cache line to get the major traversal processing benefit - as discussed in the BVH primer for lowering the storage of a BVH node -which in turn would benefit all aspects of the CU processing, whether compute or raster or AI or RT.
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PaintTinJr
Member
The thing that is probably worrying them is that the name spectral suggests at an absolute minimum the technique is grading the image by complexity, working much smarter, rather than harder, and exclusive to Sony and AMD. I mean even if simply looking at the histogram value counts and then spending disproportionately more reconstruction ML on areas of the histogram with tiny peaks where the signal to noise ratio is likely worst and needs boosted.Richard: "[PS5 Pro] is just a bigger GPU."
Sure, Richard. Continue to ignore PSSR as if your entire team hasn't been fawning over what DLSS has allowed for and achieved for NVIDIA GPUs
It's wild that they are gonna have to go from " Is a pro console needed?" To this is why new hardware is a great thing!" in such a short time period lol
Imtjnotu
Member
Physiognomonics
Member
I doubt they understand half or even a quarter of what you are explaining here. They are simply freaked out by Playstation daring to do its own DLSS technique, using AI upscaling when DF have being praising both AI upscaling and DLSS for years and specifically doing it extensively by Dictator who probably sold a few Nvidia GPUs doing so. So in a sense all the hype they have created on AI upscaling for years is going to directly benefit Playstation with their PS5 Pro! It's so ironic and tragic for them.
This is why they are currently trying to completely change their tune. The next best thing will be thanks to a new CPU this time, they'll swear. Bringing "Just a GPU" is not enough now.
But they are completely wrong again about technologies. This is the first time consoles are limited mainly by their GPUs, not CPUs. It has never happened before so what console really need for the next models are better GPUs and graphic techniques (Like AI upscaling, dedicated RT HW and such) not better CPUs. They are so obvious with their motives and are not afraid of spouting nonsense because Richard is right now desesperate. Only John is the voice of reason and reminds them that consoles need better GPUs, not CPUs, but this is Richard the boss and always has being, not John.
67 TFLOPsDROP THE INFO OR
HeisenbergFX4
Gold Member
DROP THE INFO OR
OverHeat
« generous god »
Stay classy…DROP THE INFO OR
Anchovie123
Member
Sonys goal for PS6 should be to achieve full PT at 1440p60 with reconstruction to 4K. I think 2026 is too early for this and 2028 seems about right. Assuming PS6 will be RDNA 6 & Zen 6.
We dont want another repeat of this gen where the consoles came out underbaked and can kinda do RT but not really. If PS6 were to release in 2026 then then same thing will happen where it can kinda do PT but not really. The thing is when these systems come out you're essentially trapped with that feature set till next gen releases (6-8 years).
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