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[Wiseblade]

I hope Intelligent Systems are adding something to replace this. Even though I had zero interest in the minigame, I'm not going to be excited about cut features and receiving a game that is objectively less.

 

[Ushojax]

Then what are you saying if you don't give a shit what they think? They, Nintendo, put it in the game in the first place. And they, Nintendo, allow for it to be played for the Japanese audience.

So they thought it was a good idea which is why it is in the Japanese version of the game.

And they, Nintendo, later decided it was a bad idea to put it in the localised version. That's perfectly normal. Content is altered or removed all the time when games are localised. I'm glad they eventually made a decision to remove that mini game because I thought it was a bad addition to the franchise from day one.

 

[SliceSabre]

And they, Nintendo, later decided it was a bad idea to put it in the localised version. That's perfectly normal. Content is altered or removed all the time when games are localised. I'm glad they eventually made a decision to remove that mini game.

We don't actually have any proof that was the case. All we know is that it isn't in the NA version of the game.

 

[Ushojax]

We don't actually have any proof that was the case. All we know is that it isn't in the NA version of the game.

The proof is that it isn't in the game. For whatever reason, they decided not to include that content. We will never know the precise reasons but I'm just glad it's gone. Fire Emblem did not need to get more like LovePlus, Awakening was enough.

 

[PtM]

Are you really going to defend the -gameplay- of SRW?!

I just like puns.

 

[Alucrid]

We don't actually have any proof that was the case. All we know is that it isn't in the NA version of the game.

What other reason would there be? Based on their track record it seems pretty obvious

 

[Scientist Supreme!]

What other reason would there be? Based on their track record it seems pretty obvious

Someone brought up that it might be to cut cost. Since it had a lot of Voice acting in the mode.

 

[Elaugaufein]

But we do know, because Nintendo, in localizing the game, looked at the information they have regarding sales, customer feedback, and whatever else they might use to make these kind of decisions, and clearly, they determined it *does* affect localization and that it's better to leave it out.

You can disagree with them, but acting like this decision was made arbitrarily one day by someone rather than informed by the data available to them, just doesn't make sense.

Companies are nowhere near omniscient about this stuff though. Square Enix was completely wrong about how well Bravely Default would sell in the west. Nintendo was wrong about Xenoblade. Even much smaller companies with much better grasps of their target audience release games that under/over perform sometimes for reasons that are complete mysteries (I don't think anyone could tell you why Trails in the Sky sold terribly on the PSP but did fine on Steam).

ETA - And on hardware there was Microsoft's Xbox One whatever the hell it was stragegy, before it was even released. I'm sure they had data that showed their initial plan was brilliant but it it didn't work that way in practice..

 

[Firemind]

Not completely? I guess then I should say "nobody would have cared nearly as much".

Soleil blew up over all the gaming news websites. She (and now this facerubbing thing) are the majority of news that has been reported about this game, even if both are really, really trivial elements of the whole.

It's... more than a little depressing.

i mean diehard fe fans import the games all the time, including those who can read japanese, to datamine stuff way ahead of the western release. why do you think there are fan translations of unlocalized games? it's true it wouldn't have gotten the media attention without awakening though. seeing the sales numbers of fates in japan though, i have little hope these controversies will leave a lasting impression.

 

[Fencedude]

Are you really going to defend the -gameplay- of SRW?!

It's...fine? Like, not transcendent or anything but perfectly acceptable

 

[Letep]

Continue petting your Pokemon, team.

 

[duckroll]

It's...fine? Like, not transcendent or anything but perfectly acceptable

It's fine if you're playing the games for everything else it has to offer. The gameplay itself as a srpg is serviceable but there are tons of srpgs with way better gameplay to spend your time on if you mainly care about gameplay. So not all srpgs sell on gameplay alone. That's my point!

 

[Fencedude]

It's fine if you're playing the games for everything else it has to offer. The gameplay itself as a srpg is serviceable but there are tons of srpgs with way better gameplay to spend your time on if you mainly care about gameplay. So not all srpgs sell on gameplay alone. That's my point!

tbh there are few SRPG that work with long range combat like SRW does, which gives it a distinctly different feel than most others.

 

[Brannon]

Instead of removing it, they should edit it in a way that makes it universally more 'acceptable', if that's the word, like giving gifts. Sorta like that Xenosaga edit where Albedo hovers his hand over Momo's head to magically extract information instead of jamming his hand all up in her android guts, as it were (On phone, so can't link the video of the comparison, buy you'll understand once you see it).

WAY better than not getting it at all (Zangeki no Reginliev :sob...

 

[Koeta]

A few weeks from now we will have the Bravely Second version of this thread, just an early reminder >.>

 

[sensui-tomo]

A few weeks from now we will have the Bravely Second version of this thread, just an early reminder >.>

It already happened, but we'll see what else was changed in the european release when it comes out next month. At least content wasnt cut there, just altered, which is better/fine.

 

[Draxal]

I don't play Fire Emblem anymore, I don't buy new Fire Emblem games, so honestly this doesn't really affect me directly in any way. But if it were a series I actually cared about, at this point I think I would be at least a little concerned. Direct censorship is always bad, even if it is done for the "right" reasons. I don't think it really matters who is doing the censorship either, although that can cause more or less distress depending on the process. When Spielberg alters ET for the re-release, it is stupid. When Lucas decides to change the context of scenes when re-releasing Star Wars, it is stupid. When studios decide to censor movies to release them at lower ratings in cinemas, it is annoying. When studios decide to censor movies for foreign sensitivities to reach a larger audience, it is annoying.

In many cases, an argument can always be made for why changes are made. But that doesn't change the fact that it is annoying that works cannot stand on their own for what they are. That's not to say that every piece of work some amazing work of art worthy of eternal preservation, but rather that I think each piece of work should be allowed to stand for itself to be judged by the audience.

I don't want to play a SRPG with casual homophobic stuff, or creepy face rubbing minigames where you get "closer" to your party members. But I think I still wouldn't want to play such a SRPG even if such content is removed from a single version of the game. If Nintendo of America truly feels that such content is offensive and should not be in their games, and if they truly feel that the content in FE Fates could be classified as such, then they should have been to reject the game for localization. Of course we know this is not the case. This is a business and marketing decision meant to distance the brand outside of Japan from Idea Factory games. I think we can all accept that, because business is business, but I'm not sure if championing or celebrating that decision is in the best interest of consumers.

If the next Fire Emblem game in Japan doubles down on this sort of thing, is the English fanbase going to essentially turn into one that encourages and demands for continued censorship in every game just so they can pretend to feel better about a series that they would otherwise feel weird about liking in the original form? That would be so weird to me.

They've been doing this from day one. Lyn had to be aged up 3 years in the initial release of Fire Emblem (7)-Rekka no Ken, and weirdly enough they gave the western release a jiggle animation of Lyn's Sol Katti as well.

As for Soleil, they didn't intend that situation to be as obviously a fucked up as it was, it was a dumb joke that plays off her dad and just screwed up in the end. It was a throwaway scenario out of 2,000 or so scenarios in this game, it was not integral to the plot's story at all.

If anything, the complete difficulty changes with FE9/10 annoy me more than any change in this localization.

 

[theSlacker]

This line of thinking never makes sense to me. Companies do this all the time. Are you perpetually angry becuase of that?

I am pretty much. It gets tiring though so I try not to even read news about it or participate in these threads. I mean I don't even care about the petting minigame as it is something I probably wouldn't have even done in the game anyway. It's more that I hate the idea of a localization team deciding what is appropriate for me and my entire region. I'd rather not have to defend "bust sliders" or "human petting minigames", but I know that all that stuff is optional and that someone out there would have liked to have utilized it. I also know how it feels to have something changed in a localization that effects the story of a game and my enjoyment (stuff like all the changes in the Xenosaga games) for the sake of making it acceptable to a region.

( ._.)

 

[Koeta]

It already happened, but we'll see what else was changed in the european release when it comes out next month. At least content wasnt cut there, just altered, which is better/fine.

We will see soon enough if anything was or wasn't cut, while I don't care for the changes you are right that at least it wasn't fully just cut out, all they did as far as we know was change an Indian Job to a Cowboy Job so they wouldn't offend anyone......lol

 

[Elaugaufein]

A few weeks from now we will have the Bravely Second version of this thread, just an early reminder >.>

Demo in two weeks, so we'll probably get an idea if there were any other class changes , and a better idea of how they actually did deal with the Tomahawk/Gunner thing then.

 

[Nanashrew]

A few weeks from now we will have the Bravely Second version of this thread, just an early reminder >.>

Is that the native american class, thing? I still feel that is a completely understandable change to avoid cultural insensitivity.

 

[PtM]

I am pretty much. It gets tiring though so I try not to even read news about it or participate in these threads. I mean I don't even care about the petting minigame as it is something I probably wouldn't have even done in the game anyway. It's more that I hate the idea of a localization team deciding what is appropriate for me and my entire region. I'd rather not have to defend "bust sliders" or "human petting minigames", but I know that all that stuff is optional and that someone out there would have liked to have utilized it. I also know how it feels to have something changed in a localization that effects the story of a game and my enjoyment (stuff like all the changes in the Xenosaga games) for the sake of making it acceptable to a region.

( ._.)

They probably didn't think much about you with this.

 

[dan2026]

This line of thinking never makes sense to me. Companies do this all the time. Are you perpetually angry becuase of that?

Pretty much. Why is this 'ok' for Japan but not ok for the rest of the world.
If Nintendo were so against this content, why did they allow it in their game in the first place?

 

[Meia]

And they, Nintendo, later decided it was a bad idea to put it in the localised version. That's perfectly normal. Content is altered or removed all the time when games are localised. I'm glad they eventually made a decision to remove that mini game because I thought it was a bad addition to the franchise from day one.

Companies in general are not in the business of hacking away content from one market to another, so can we stop pretending that this is a normal, every day occurrence?


https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCP1GrSKB5lTUaQILsRGsf8Q/videos


From what others have said, this content is included in the "petting mini-game" and will also wind up on the cutting room floor. This is not a small amount of voice work(even some minor characterization) that one audience will get, that everyone else won't. I just flat out don't understand why this is perfectly ok with a lot of people on this forum.

 

[PtM]

Pretty much. Why is this 'ok' for Japan but not ok for the rest of the world.
If Nintendo were so against this content, why did they allow it in their game in the first place?

Because dating sims are an established market in Japan.

Companies in general are not in the business of hacking away content from one market to another, so we can stop pretending that this is a normal, every day occurrence.


https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCP1GrSKB5lTUaQILsRGsf8Q/videos


From what others have said, this content is included in the "petting mini-game" and will also wind up on the cutting room floor. This is not a small amount of voice work(even some minor characterization) that one audience will get, that everyone else won't. I just flat out don't understand why this is perfectly ok with a lot of people on this forum.

Because some people care about what they get, not just about getting anything.

 

[redcrayon]

It was just to make a point, it wasn't meant to be a fair comparison. But since you brought up that aspect of strategy games, I should probably point out that in Japan, the Super Robot Wars series is pretty damn popular, more so than FE (maybe about equal now though), and it is exclusively due to the licensed franchises, characters, and story. The gameplay is shit, but the maps are just as long if not longer than FE maps, and there are a gazillion maps in the game. So there, different audiences, different strokes.

Fair enough

 

[Koeta]

Pretty much. Why is this 'ok' for Japan but not ok for the rest of the world.
If Nintendo were so against this content, why did they allow it in their game in the first place?

Because they think leaving this content in will cause some sort of shitstorm, but the reality of it is, taking it out causes much more of a shitstorm these days now that people know what the source game was, back before we had internet in every home most people didn't have a clue what was being done.

but at the end of the day it will fade, and just be another item in the list of silly things Nintendo does still, like making consoles Region locked.

 

[Meia]

Because some people care about what they get, not just about getting anything.

And for those happy/indifferent about this being done, I do hope that they're the same when something that they think seems neat is cut from an upcoming game for "reasons."


Defending cutting content is something that will come back to bite the person in the end. Why support the practice at all and roll the dice? It just doesn't make sense.

 

[PtM]

And for those happy/indifferent about this being done, I do hope that they're the same when something that they think seems neat is cut from an upcoming game for "reasons."


Defending cutting content is something that will come back to the person in the end. Why support the practice at all?

Because sometimes less is more.

 

[Ushojax]

Companies in general are not in the business of hacking away content from one market to another, so can we stop pretending that this is a normal, every day occurrence?

That's not true at all. Tetra's Trackers was removed for the Western version of Four Swords Adventures. South Park Stick of Truth had content removed in Europe. London Life (a huge amount of content) was only translated for the American version of Layton 4. Yakuza 3 was heavily cut for its European version. Pokemon Platinum had the slot machines removed in Europe. Games are routinely altered for the German market.

These kinds of decisions are made frequently with many different types of games for many different reasons. Sometimes it's because of ratings issues, sometimes the financial costs of localisation, sometimes because a Western subsidiary will take a different view on the appropriateness of content compared to it's Japanese counterpart.

 

[Vincent Grayson]

And for those happy/indifferent about this being done, I do hope that they're the same when something that they think seems neat is cut from an upcoming game for "reasons."


Defending cutting content is something that will come back to the person in the end. Why support the practice at all and roll the dice? It just doesn't make sense.

Because for many of us, nuance is a totally reasonable thing. It's not (IMO) a black and white issue.

Sometimes, content will be cut where I'll happily agree. This is one of those cases. Sometimes, I'm sure content will be cut where I don't agree. It hasn't come up (at least with games I have an interest in), but I refuse to buy into this idea that it's "better" to just say "Nothing should ever be cut".

 

[Draxal]

Malig Knight is the stupidest possible class name change of all time (myrmidon is up there), and this is my biggest problem with the localization so far.

 

[Palculator]

That's not true at all. Tetra's Trackers was removed for the Western version of Four Swords Adventures. South Park Stick of Truth had content removed in Europe. London Life (a huge amount of content) was only translated for the American version of Layton 4. Yakuza 3 was heavily cut for its European version. Pokemon Platinum had the slot machines removed in Europe. Games are routinely altered for the German market.

And these changes were shit.

 

[duckroll]

Companies in general are not in the business of hacking away content from one market to another, so can we stop pretending that this is a normal, every day occurrence?

LOL. Yes it is. Maybe you just don't notice it.

 

[theSlacker]

They probably didn't think much about you with this.

I don't see how that is relevant to anything I said. Would you mind expanding on your statement?

 

[Ushojax]

And these changes were shit.

Most of them were, I agree. But I don't think the change to Fire Emblem is a bad one, that content never belonged in this series, the waifu aspect can only be taken so far before it gets stupid.

 

[WrenchNinja]

Malig Knight is the stupidest possible class name change of all time (myrmidon is up there), and this is my biggest problem with the localization so far.

It sounds like malignant. That what they're going for?

 

[LouisaFerre]

Because sometimes less is more.

Unless you have to do it I genuinely don't see how cutting out the feature makes the game better. It's genuinely weird to me that some people are so disgusted by this that the rest of the game is actually contaminated or something because it's an option.

 

[Senhua]

My suggestion for anyone who like to play the game without censorship : 'start learning Japanese language and import the game '.
It's clear that western culture is different from Japan so if you guys prefer you game 'pure' do that.

Localized version of games always getting some adjustment with local culture.

 

[Palculator]

My suggestion for anyone who like to play the game without censorship : 'start learning Japanese language and import the game '.
It's clear than western culture is different from Japan so if you guys prefer you game 'pure' do that.

Localized version of games always getting some adjustment to local culture.

So I'm not part of western culture (whatever the fuck that actually means, we're talking about dozens of nations here) now?

 

[kuroneko0509]

It sounds like malignant. That what they're going for?

most likely

 

[Senhua]

So I'm not part of western culture (whatever the fuck that actually means, we're talking about dozens of nations here) now?

It’s due to cultural differences. The West has it’s own thinking about how to depict women in games media which is different from Japan […] Speaking personally, if it is a representation acceptable to the general people in Japan, I wouldn’t be concerned about it in Japan. It’s a difficult problem.

.

 

[Palculator]

.

But this feature wasn't about women.

 

[Rabid Dwarf 76]

Why not buy a Japanese 3DS, and the game, and learn Japanese? If you're that outraged about not playing "complete games" then play them in their original language so you don't have to suffer through a translation that could change anything.

I am learning Japanese. I live and work in Japan. The problem is my level of Japanese is low. I won't be able to read fire emblem level Japanese for awhile. Learning takes a LOT of time. I've only had one year of proper schooling and the rest has been free classes I attend at local community centers when I have time. I work 9 hours a day with an hour commute to work. I sad because as of right now my choice is between playing the censored English version so I can understand the story or play the complete version in a language I'm not proficient in. So yeah, fuck me right?

 

[BGBW]

Western culture is such a stupid term. To imply the whole Western world is of one mind.

Tell a Scot he has the same culture as an Englishman and he'll deck you harder than a double decker bus.

 

[MrHoot]

Again with the "western culture" thing.

Again, how can western culture can cope perfectly fine with romance in Bioware games, violence in FPS and mortal kombat but yeah, patting someone on the head is where we draw the line to "ewwww gross/creepy". Granted MKX or bioware are "adult" games (largely played by also teen audiences mind you) but I don't think a patting on the head is gonna push the boundaries of sexual deviancy on our young minds

 

[Palculator]

Western culture is such a stupid term. To imply the whole Western world is of one mind.

Tell a Scot he has the same culture as an Englishman and he'll deck you harder than a double decker bus.

This. And not all of us are from the nation the puritans went to.

 

[EvilKatarn]

how can western culture can cope perfectly fine with romance in Bioware games

They don't look like anime. That is literally it.

Spoiler

Interspecies rubber dolls awkwardly rubbing up against each other is so much more mature.

 

[nukedeggs]

If only learning Japanese well enough to be able to play a text heavy game is something that can be done easily. But I guess if I want to play 'full' versions of a lot of games, I'll have to do it.

Sucks that they're removing face-petting entirely. I wanted to play it because it seemed funny and harmless.

 

[Elaugaufein]

most likely

Malig Knight doesn't sound anything like Malignant to me ? Is there a US accent where you basically drop the second 'n' sound in Malignant because that's the only way I can see to make that work.