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[Ripclawe]

Having to cut back on my workout length due to time constraints and came up with this simple bench routine as I try to do only compound exercises to hit more muscles in less time. But I keep thinking I am screwing up the weight distribution. My max is 310.

Warmup
2x8 = 135 lbs

Working
1x8 = 225
1x8 = 255
1x8 = 280
1x8 = 235

"cooldown"
1x8= 135

 

[Luscious LeftFoot]

Having to cut back on my workout length due to time constraints and came up with this simple bench routine as I try to do only compound exercises to hit more muscles in less time. But I keep thinking I am screwing up the weight distribution. My max is 310.

Warmup
2x8 = 135 lbs

Working
1x8 = 225
1x8 = 255
1x8 = 280
1x8 = 235

"cooldown"
1x8= 135

A lot of fitness guys seem to recommend using percentages of maximum rep for workouts. Increase 10%-15% per set.

Using that model you're warming up and cooling down with approx. 45% of max and work out sets are:
72%
82%
90%

You can adjust a bit, but it seems to be inline with what they suggest.

 

[Jason's Ultimatum]

I'm confused. I'm 6'1 and have long arms.

Because people have different body sizes, limb lengths and strong points, the ideal grip width and arm position can vary greatly from one individual to the next. In his book, The Complete Guide to Powerlifting, Fred Hatfield identifies several critical anatomical factors that you must adjust your benching style for:


Long arms - elbows out, wider grip,
Short arms - elbows in, closer grip.
Weak pecs - elbows in, narrower grip
Strong pecs - wider grip, elbows out

Weak front delts - elbows out, wide grip
Strong front delts - narrower grip, elbows close to torso

Weak triceps - elbows out, wider grip
Strong triceps - elbows in, closer grip

I have long arms, strong pecs (but not strong bench) , my front delts I don't know, and I have strong triceps.

So what form do I use, lol. It seems to go both ways. Do I bench wide grip and elbows out or close grip and elbows in?

EDIT-FUCK BB bench. When I move in September, I'll find a new gym that has DBs that go past 100 pounds. BB bench has always been awkward for me. Never did like it.

 

[Deleted member 12837]

I broke my right pinky finger last night playing basketball, and I'm right-handed. I have to have a splint on it for 3-4 weeks, but the doctor said that if I was careful and creative, I could still weight-lift.

I'm thinking rows, chinups and deadlifts (most pulling exercises) are out because they require the most grip. Bench press and dips shouldn't be too bad, squats and OH press scare me a bit but I'll at least try them out.

Any recommendations on exercises that I can do despite this splint for the next month to minimize muscle loss? Unfortunately, machines seem like the easiest solution because they often avoid needing to grip or squeeze anything.

 

[MjFrancis]

I've got this pull-up thing down. 2x10 chins in the morning, 1x13 pull-up max endurance set and 11x5 close-grip chins done between every pressing set today. So, that's 88 pull-ups so far this week... and it's only Monday. I'm confident that my endurance set could have been better, and that I'll get closer to 200 pullups a week faster than planned.

 

[MWS Natural]

Read these:

Push-Ups, Face Pulls, and Shrugs

Achieving Structural Balance

Wanna Grow? Gotta Row

Thanks man, there is some really good info in those links. I only do compound exercises really but I will add a few of the muscle specific ones that were suggested.

the thing with that area is, a TON of muscles connect all at your shoulder, so it could really be any number of muscles. as im sure you know, best bet is to listen to your body and stretch it, and stop whatever you're doing if you get more pain.

Will do.

 

[deadbeef]

I broke my right pinky finger last night playing basketball, and I'm right-handed. I have to have a splint on it for 3-4 weeks, but the doctor said that if I was careful and creative, I could still weight-lift.

I'm thinking rows, chinups and deadlifts (most pulling exercises) are out because they require the most grip. Bench press and dips shouldn't be too bad, squats and OH press scare me a bit but I'll at least try them out.

Any recommendations on exercises that I can do despite this splint for the next month to minimize muscle loss? Unfortunately, machines seem like the easiest solution because they often avoid needing to grip or squeeze anything.

You should be able to squat with no problem. Don't be scared, there are lots of resources online to help you learn the technique, and with video cameras everywhere nowadays you can get really smart guys to give you feedback by posting a video online.

 

[Masta_Killah]

I think elbows in work more secondary muscles than elbows out for bench. IIRC, elbows out do a better job at isolating the chest. If your chest is strong but your bench is lagging, it could mean your supporting muscles like your tris are lagging. If your iffy on benching, check out some youtube vids of ss and elitefts for some pointers.

 

[parrotbeak]

I use thumbless grip when I squat so I'd assume that will be fine. Actually I wouldn't worry about any of them except bench and press -- would be worried that my hand might cramp from a different distribution of tension while the bar was over me. The others, even pulls, you'll probably go down in weight but if it doesn't work, just let go.

Any recommendations on exercises that I can do despite this splint for the next month to minimize muscle loss? Unfortunately, machines seem like the easiest solution because they often avoid needing to grip or squeeze anything.

Ya, I did the machine thing last year cuz of my back and it's a huge difference. For something as minor as a pinky, I would stick to barbell and just reduce the weights before going to machines. You'll stay stronger overall.

 

[Deleted member 12837]

You should be able to squat with no problem. Don't be scared, there are lots of resources online to help you learn the technique, and with video cameras everywhere nowadays you can get really smart guys to give you feedback by posting a video online.

I guess I should've clarified, I'm not scared at all about squats in general, I've been doing Stronglifts 5x5 for 6 months now. I'm just nervous about doing squats without being able to grip the bar entirely.

I use thumbless grip when I squat so I'd assume that will be fine. Actually I wouldn't worry about any of them except bench and press -- would be worried that my hand might cramp from a different distribution of tension while the bar was over me. The others, even pulls, you'll probably go down in weight but if it doesn't work, just let go.


Ya, I did the machine thing last year cuz of my back and it's a huge difference. For something as minor as a pinky, I would stick to barbell and just reduce the weights before going to machines. You'll stay stronger overall.

I thought I'd miss my pinky the least of any finger, and that it would be easy to just ignore, but you'd be surprised how awkward things are when you have to keep your pinky straight and out away from the rest of your fingers...

I'll give the compound lifts a try I guess, and adjust weight and go from there. Thanks for the advice. If anyone does happen to know good replacements for my particular scenario though, don't hesitate to recommend away.

 

[parrotbeak]

I guess I should've clarified, I'm not scared at all about squats in general, I've been doing Stronglifts 5x5 for 6 months now. I'm just nervous about doing squats without being able to grip the bar entirely.

You could always do cross arm front squats. Ya, I was trying to feel how it would be to grip with my pinky straight, and the tension is definitely different -- I feel more tension in the wrist.

 

[deadbeef]

I guess I should've clarified, I'm not scared at all about squats in general, I've been doing Stronglifts 5x5 for 6 months now. I'm just nervous about doing squats without being able to grip the bar entirely.

You should be able to just grip the bar with your first 3 fingers, I would think. You're not really holding the bar, as much as you are just holding it in place on your traps.

 

[parrotbeak]

You should be able to just grip the bar with your first 3 fingers, I would think. You're not really holding the bar, as much as you are just holding it in place on your traps.

This is true, although try holding your pinky outstretched like it's in a splint. Gripping feels really weird and harder. But I think you could also not grip the bar at all and just press down on it with your palm, couldn't you?

 

[deadbeef]

On this Smolov routine, I seem to be developing rough patchy spots on my back where the bar sits when I'm squatting - haha. Calluses on my traps, nice. Also, I apparently bled through my t-shirt today where the squat belt was pinching me.

 

[parrotbeak]

Haha, that is crazy. What week are you in now?

It momentarily crossed my mind to only do squats and cardio with my limited gym time this month, but then I remembered that my lower back probably wouldn't be able to handle that. Still thinking on what I'm going to do.

 

[deadbeef]

Today was the first day of week 3 of the Base Mesocycle, (70% 1RM + 15kg) x9x4. Just 3 more days until I get a small break, and then test! Getting excited, but looking at Fri/Sat of this week is scary. (80%+15kg)x5x7 on Friday and then (85%+15kg)x3x10 on Saturday.

 

[MrToughPants]

It momentarily crossed my mind to only do squats and cardio with my limited gym time this month, but then I remembered that my lower back probably wouldn't be able to handle that. Still thinking on what I'm going to do.

^Front squat!

I'm front squatting three times a week since I have an SI joint problem and can't back squat. I follow front squats with walking DB lunges to keep the glutes/hams going. Also doing 200/alt reps of 100-130lbs DB rows twice a week since deadlifts are also out of the question.

DB lunges>rows>shrugs I was holding onto 100s+ for an hour Saturday and could barely hold onto 40-45s for lateral raises...I might order some straps.

Back/Pelvis feels fine after two weeks of this so i'll keep this going for a while or until I move back up to 215lbs.

 

[parrotbeak]

^Front squat!

Haha, oh shit, that's a great idea! Funny, I had just suggested it for the broken pinky. Ya, I think I will try see how many sets/reps I can fit in. Thanks!

I was going to deadlift, since I only do 1x5 anyway and that won't take long at all. Probably only once a week though, depending on how my back feels.

 

[rando14]

Hey guys,

Does anyone here deadlift without shoes? I like to squat without shoes and I normally deadlift in flat shoes but I was curious if anyone deadlifts without them. Thanks.

 

[Brolic Gaoler]

Got 325 up today (bench).


Feels good man.

 

[MjFrancis]

I will deadlift or squat barefoot when I can - not as often as I used to unfortunately. Since I go to a commercial gym, Chuck Taylor's or Feiyue's have been my shoes of choice. Both have thin flat soles. The Feiyue's are 1/3 the price of the Chuck's though, making them my default choice.

 

[Munin]

Is it possible that some people are just physically more weak than others by nature? I dunno, I have been going to the gym regularly for about 4 months now, and I have made some progress, but that still means that I can only bench about 60lbs (4x8-10 reps), overhead (free standing) 70lbs, barbell curl 50....a few pages back somebody casually mentioned that for deadlift 90lbs would be a "light" starter weight and for me that is already pretty taxing.

I dunno. I started out as 130lbs (I am 5'9''), and already up to 150 now, but I feel like I only now reached what is supposed to be the normal "starting" level. Frustrating :/ I don't feel like I made a lot of progress. I guess I should just keep going, but...yeah. I feel really weak.

 

[FallingEdge]

How much are you eating? What is your diet like? There are a lot more factors that go into getting stronger than just going to the gym. What is your lifestyle like?

 

[Munin]

How much are you eating? What is your diet like? There are a lot more factors that go into getting stronger than just going to the gym. What is your lifestyle like?

I drink on average 1 to 2 liters of milk a day, the rest is most often chicken, rice, vegetables, with some added eggs, peanut butter and stuff like that. I mean like I wrote I GAINED quite a few pounds already, and I went up on the weights as well, but that just really means I went from insanely weak to "beginner just about to start" I guess.

 

[MWS Natural]

Push-Ups, Face Pulls, and Shrugs

Started doing my pushups last night and had to laugh how much bigger you look with a pump vs without.

Without pump = fat slob
With pump = power lifter

Yeah it's that drastic of a difference lol.

Got 325 up today (bench).
Feels good man.

Good shit man! How much do you weigh? I'm really trying to push for 350 within the next few weeks.

 

[MWS Natural]

Is it possible that some people are just physically more weak than others by nature?

Of course, it's called genetics. But anyone and everyone can get strong if they work at it.

 

[parrotbeak]

I dunno. I started out as 130lbs (I am 5'9''), and already up to 150 now, but I feel like I only now reached what is supposed to be the normal "starting" level. Frustrating :/ I don't feel like I made a lot of progress. I guess I should just keep going, but...yeah. I feel really weak.

How old are you?

 

[Munin]

22.

 

[mattoz85]

Age: 25
Height: 5'10''
Weight: 250
Goal: 220 by year's end
Current Training Schedule: 0-3x/week at the gym. 25 minutes of cardio followed by 9 sets of various core exercises along with other upper/lower body exercises. Nothing too strenuous, but it still makes me feel like crap the next day. I'm doing about 1/3 of what I was doing a year and a half ago.
Current Training Equipment Available: normal gym equipment

Comments: I've been dealing with severe chronic back pain for almost a year. In that time I've gained 30 lbs, after losing 60 lbs in the previous 18 months. My pain severely limits what I can do, not just for exercise but in general. My diet's crap because eating is the only thing I can do that isn't physically painful. It's a whole cycle of depression, eating, hating what I look like, working out for a week, feeling physically horrible, depression, etc.

I'm not sure if what I'm doing at the gym is right for me or not. My pain management doctor told me to build up my core muscles and lose weight. I talked to a trainer at the gym who showed me some exercises, but they ended up making me really sore. I would wake up 3 or 4 days a week feeling like absolute crap, ie- not leaving the house, not moving from the couch or bed. I haven't been to the gym in 2 weeks and I feel better physically, but I know I need to lose weight.

So aside from motivation, I just need a good workout that won't hurt and won't make me feel like crap the next day.

 

[parrotbeak]

22.

Hmm. Based on mirror and feel, do you think the 20 lbs you gained was mostly muscle? Are you doing 8-10 reps of everything? 4x8-10 is kind of a lot for maximizing strength gains. Have you considered one of the Starting Strength or Stronglifts programs?

 

[FallingEdge]

snip

I have no idea as far as what exercises you can do but if you have trainer and doctor who have set you up on the plan, I say just follow it. Yes, you will be sore but as you do it more and more, the soreness will go away. We have all experienced it and as we have become more experienced, it happens less and less. Myself, I love that feeling and try to push myself every time in the gym (time permitting of course).

And I'm sure you know this already but it won't matter how much you exercise if you don't get your diet in check. Start simple, remove the sweets and sugars. Eat more whole foods and veggies.

Hope that helps.

 

[parrotbeak]

Comments: I've been dealing with severe chronic back pain for almost a year. In that time I've gained 30 lbs, after losing 60 lbs in the previous 18 months. My pain severely limits what I can do, not just for exercise but in general. My diet's crap because eating is the only thing I can do that isn't physically painful. It's a whole cycle of depression, eating, hating what I look like, working out for a week, feeling physically horrible, depression, etc.

Where on your back? Have you gotten an mri and found any specific causes for the pain?

Also what exactly did your trainer have you do?

 

[mattoz85]

Where on your back? Have you gotten an mri and found any specific causes for the pain?

Also what exactly did your trainer have you do?

I have two herniated discs, but after physical therapy and a series of injections (epidural, facet joint, and something else I forget the name of) I've had absolutely zero pain relief. I've been to 6 doctors, and none of them can completely explain the pain. My pain management doctor referred me to a rheumatologist to see if I have any genetic diseases, and I'm seeing him on Monday.

The trainer showed me some stuff on a stability ball (which I do at home, because the ones at the gym are dirty), inverted sit-ups on some contraption (which I really like), an oblique exercise where you alternate a weight in your hands and tilt sideways, and some other stuff using my body weight as resistance. When I'm at the gym, I feel fine. I don't get sore at all, and I'm just a little bit tired. But I'll wake up the next day feeling like total crap.

Then there are the days that are just wasted when I'm in a haze of painkillers and muscle relaxants, but that's for another thread.

I have no idea as far as what exercises you can do but if you have trainer and doctor who have set you up on the plan, I say just follow it. Yes, you will be sore but as you do it more and more, the soreness will go away. We have all experienced it and as we have become more experienced, it happens less and less. Myself, I love that feeling and try to push myself every time in the gym (time permitting of course).

And I'm sure you know this already but it won't matter how much you exercise if you don't get your diet in check. Start simple, remove the sweets and sugars. Eat more whole foods and veggies.

Hope that helps.

It wasn't the soreness that got to me. In 2009/early 2010, I lost 60 lbs. by spending 6 hours per week in the gym. I know what it used to feel like when I worked out. The way I feel now after going to the gym is totally different. I'm completely drained and listless the day after. And I'm only doing a third or a half of what I used to - 20 minutes of cardio instead of 60, 70 lbs on the chest press instead of 140, etc. It's frustrating.

I know my diet has to change, but it's not so easy. I used to cook a lot, but now it's nearly impossible for me to stand in front of the stove long enough to cook anything decent. I eat frozen food for nearly every meal, and I eat snacks because I have nothing better to do. I don't go out anymore except for work and the occasional card night.

I just need the motivation to start, and there's nothing in my life right now that's doing it.

 

[parrotbeak]

The reason why your friend feels better after squats is because as knee flexion increases (such as going down when squatting), the VMO (teardrop muscle on quads) increases it's firing rate. The VMO is what pulls the patella medially and why a lot of therapists speak about it and knee stabilization. So when your friend does squats, the resistance as he drops down and comes out of the hole acts as a force to re-align his kneecap. He likely has a tight IT band or similar which is pulling his knee to the side on his off days. Some foam rolling or massage on his IT band would probably be huge.

I don't know if it's in my head because I looked at this VMO muscle and then did squats and ran stairs, but I feel like mine is tight and yanking too much on my patella. Feels uncomfortable when I walk. Definitely need to stretch more tonight but I just stretched and it didn't seem to do much.

I have two herniated discs, but after physical therapy and a series of injections (epidural, facet joint, and something else I forget the name of) I've had absolutely zero pain relief. I've been to 6 doctors, and none of them can completely explain the pain. My pain management doctor referred me to a rheumatologist to see if I have any genetic diseases, and I'm seeing him on Monday.

The trainer showed me some stuff on a stability ball (which I do at home, because the ones at the gym are dirty), inverted sit-ups on some contraption (which I really like), an oblique exercise where you alternate a weight in your hands and tilt sideways, and some other stuff using my body weight as resistance. When I'm at the gym, I feel fine. I don't get sore at all, and I'm just a little bit tired. But I'll wake up the next day feeling like total crap.

The surgeon who did my microdiscetomy told me that no one can explain why some herniations are extremely painful and some aren't. Mine was clearly pressing on the sciatic nerve -- you could see a lot of disc material all over it and the nerve had swollen up to like 3x the normal size compared to the other side. So surgery was an obvious choice. But it really depends on the abilities of your surgeon and the particulars of the injury. I lucked out.

Sounds like you have a lot of other issues going on. I couldn't function without pain killers prior to my surgery and I know how they mess up your head. I'd hate to have to deal with strengthening my core while dealing with back pain and opiates.

Sorry I don't think I can give you specific advice, not knowing exactly the extent of the ruptures or how to go about strengthening your back without potentially making the ruptures worse. I would warn against just doing whatever your trainer says also though, because every back injury is a little different and you probably can't do everything a person with a healthy back can do.

When you say you feel like crap the next day, is it back pain, tightening, energy level, emotional? All of the above?

Are you getting radiating pain to other parts of your body and do these get worse after gym or during any particular exercises?

Inverted situps are on a bench that declines with your feet in pads to hold you up? What degree are you at? Just curious because I've read mixed things about inversion and I personally won't do it -- I feel like I stretch my back enough laying flat on the floor without that pressure of my body weight pulling on my verts. I do declining situps but not completely upside down.

 

[Deleted member 12837]

You should be able to just grip the bar with your first 3 fingers, I would think. You're not really holding the bar, as much as you are just holding it in place on your traps.

You could always do cross arm front squats. Ya, I was trying to feel how it would be to grip with my pinky straight, and the tension is definitely different -- I feel more tension in the wrist.

I'm gonna give squats and OH press a try tomorrow (dips and bench will be on friday) and will report back. I still can't think of a replacement back exercise though to fill in for deadlifts, chin-ups and rows...

 

[deadbeef]

I'm gonna give squats and OH press a try tomorrow (dips and bench will be on friday) and will report back. I still can't think of a replacement back exercise though to fill in for deadlifts, chin-ups and rows...

Good Mornings in place of deadlifts.

 

[parrotbeak]

Then there are the days that are just wasted when I'm in a haze of painkillers and muscle relaxants, but that's for another thread.

Eh, it could be a whole thread by itself, but this is the fitness thread, which includes anything that affects your body and workout. I know this is easy to say, but it helped me to have other people say it: take the pain as much as you can and only use the pills when absolutely needed. I'm sure you know by now that there are degrees of intense pain. There were times I literally couldn't see -- my vision went dark and I saw flashes of color and thought I was passing out. There's the too much pain to think clearly at all. There's the too much pain to concentrate on a task. There's the "this sucks, but I can still get shit done." And then there's that false sense of peace when you're so messed up on pills and the pain is still there but you don't care anymore. Shoot for the "this sucks but you can get shit done" with occasional lapses into not being able to concentrate on a task. You can be like that at home when you don't need to be doing anything anyway. It helped to go do my stretches and then watch tv or listen to music.

Also, at this point I don't know what muscle relaxers are going to help with. You want strong spine, strong supporting muscles. Relaxers are ok for muscle strains when everything tightens up and pinches your nerves. Doctors always dish out relaxers for any kind of pain whether it makes sense or not. I never took mine. I just used heat pads, stretching and then ice.

Before you can get your body strong, your mind has to be strong. It can't be strong if it's in a narcotic fog. Some opiate use will be needed, but make it the bare minimum.

I found it helpful to keep a log of when I took a pill, because it messes with your memory. Once I started the log I realized I was completely blanking on when the last time I took one. When you're on them all the time, you'll start to feel pains when your body wants more of the drug, not necessarily when you actually need them for real pain. I discovered that in my withdrawal period after surgery.

 

[mattoz85]

I hope this isn't all horribly off topic, and if it is, I apologize.

When you say you feel like crap the next day, is it back pain, tightening, energy level, emotional? All of the above?

Well, it's the usual soreness, in combination with feeling completely physically drained. Like I've been hit by a metaphorical truck or something. And that brings my emotional level down, and I'm just a depressed hermit for the day.

Are you getting radiating pain to other parts of your body and do these get worse after gym or during any particular exercises?

I've been very fortunate in this regard. My pain is localized to my mid/upper back and radiates to my neck when I sit for too long. I don't know if I could deal with leg or arm pain in addition to all this. Nothing hurts at the gym, which is why this is frustrating. I don't know what exactly isn't working because I feel fine – just a little bit tired from being so out of shape.

Inverted situps are on a bench that declines with your feet in pads to hold you up? What degree are you at? Just curious because I've read mixed things about inversion and I personally won't do it -- I feel like I stretch my back enough laying flat on the floor without that pressure of my body weight pulling on my verts. I do declining situps but not completely upside down.

I'm not sure how to describe it. It's this stationary piece of equipment that uses pads on the calves (rear) and at the pelvis (front). I don't know if inverted situp is the right word for it. I do it more for strengthening than stretching. The trainer says it strengthens the lower back. I do it along with ab and oblique exercises for a full core workout.

Before you can get your body strong, your mind has to be strong. It can't be strong if it's in a narcotic fog. Some opiate use will be needed, but make it the bare minimum.

I found it helpful to keep a log of when I took a pill, because it messes with your memory. Once I started the log I realized I was completely blanking on when the last time I took one. When you're on them all the time, you'll start to feel pains when your body wants more of the drug, not necessarily when you actually need them for real pain. I discovered that in my withdrawal period after surgery.

I'm paranoid about becoming addicted, so I feel like I've been careful in this regard. I take Vicodin and I can tolerate it very well. I only feel like I'm in a fog when I take a muscle relaxant with it, and I try to do that sparingly. I'm 100% aware of when I take a pill and how often. I take one with breakfast every morning, then I'll usually take a second in the late afternoon. If I'm working or doing something else, I'll sometimes take a third. But ~5 days a week, it's 2 pills. I've also had periods where I've stopped taking it altogether and tried to deal with the pain by itself. The withdrawal symptoms weren't very bothersome for me, but I think I just tolerate the drug really well.

Thanks for your insights. I really appreciate it. I posted in your back pain thread a few weeks (months?) ago, but lost track of it. It makes me feel better to know that other people have had to deal with this kind of stuff.

 

[Munin]

Hmm. Based on mirror and feel, do you think the 20 lbs you gained was mostly muscle? Are you doing 8-10 reps of everything? 4x8-10 is kind of a lot for maximizing strength gains. Have you considered one of the Starting Strength or Stronglifts programs?

I definitely have some muscle on me now, so there is definitely something, I just wonder if I really am getting the most out of my time and effort. Would you recommend less reps and higher weight then? I am doing 8-10 since I have been taught that is the best rep range for muscle gain, and since my main goal was always to bulk up, I stuck to that.

 

[parrotbeak]

Well, it's the usual soreness, in combination with feeling completely physically drained. Like I've been hit by a metaphorical truck or something. And that brings my emotional level down, and I'm just a depressed hermit for the day.

I feel you man, sorry I don't know what you can do. Went through that depression myself when the most activity I could do was stretching and crunches. Especially if you are used to being able to go to the gym and get your emotions right by getting your blood flowing, and then you can't do it anymore. I didn't have a solution other than surgery to get out of that state. Hopefully the other specialist you're seeing can help you fix the problem.

What about using the elliptical without the handles? That helped me get started at the gym again. Builds up your core muscles by forcing you to hold everything tight and in balance while at the same time giving you a good cardio workout to lose weight.

The only thing I can think is just take it slower, maybe do less per session but every day?

I definitely have some muscle on me now, so there is definitely something, I just wonder if I really am getting the most out of my time and effort. Would you recommend less reps and higher weight then? I am doing 8-10 since I have been taught that is the best rep range for muscle gain, and since my main goal was always to bulk up, I stuck to that.

That might be the range for gaining muscle size but not strength. Check out the OP, particularly #2. Then check out Starting Strength, the book and the wiki. A lot of people swear by that program for building strength in beginners. The book is a wealth of knowledge that you will never stop using for as long as you work out.

 

[Munin]

Right but, I find the approach taught most beginners pretty confusing then. Most beginners want to gain muscle, no? So is the idea to gain strength first and then switch to a focus on muscle building? If so, how long should I focus on strength instead?

 

[parrotbeak]

Size will come with strength. You need to be strong first.

 

[Munin]

OK..so I will go down to 5x5 for main compound lifts and see where that gets me.

 

[parrotbeak]

I'd really suggest reading SS or at least check out the wiki and the other links in the OP and decide for yourself. Don't take my word for it.

 

[TheRagnCajun]

So I'm doing squats the other day, 3 sets of 5 @ 225lbs, and I overhear this girl bragging to her WO buddy about squatting 220lbs for a 1RM. She insisted it was a full ATG squat too. I'm thinking, there's no way. She's got muscle, but not in excess that would lead you to believe she's on steroids. She can't weigh more than 135lbs.

My wife is 100lbs and squats 70 for 2 sets of 7, which is more than I've seen any other woman do at my gym.

So today I look online and accoring to this chart that would put the bragging girl in the 'Elite power lifter' catagory. Now she is short, probably no more than 5' tall. I suppose her physiology could give her a mechanical advantage. But comeon. I see her there all the time, so maybe I'll call her on it next time. I'm figuring she just wanted to be overheard with me and my wife hogging the squat rack at the time.

 

[MjFrancis]

I'm ambivalent towards braggarts such as these. Ultimately I would ignore them and keep at my own training, though. One of the advantages the deadlift has over the squat is this intangible of bragging. Without being backed by a powerlifting green light or being seen with your own eyes, you have no idea how low someone squatted when they boast of their numbers. Some people are happy with a 1/4 or 1/2 squat, and to paraphrase Rippetoe, some people are content with a slight unbending of the knees. Yes, I've actually seen that. The deadlift is much more cut and dry: either you lifted X amount of weight or you didn't. I don't care how sloppy or what stance, but if you locked out, you locked out. End of story.

 

[Poindexter]

I can't stand braggarts. When I meet someone who says they lift I like to talk about routine, diet, etc. But most people only want to talk about numbers and most of them are BS'ing. I've met a guy who asked me "How much weight did you say that was? Yeah yeah, I do that sometimes. Not all the time though. And not just once." Oooookay. Insecure people. smh. If a guy is stronger than me, I'd rather find out how he got that way and dissect his routine and diet than throw out bullshit number.

What kind of rests does everyone take here? I used to be really lax on rest periods for compound lifts (3-5 minutes). I would do it at home and between sets I'd watch a couple of minutes of tv or something. well eventually as my routine got bigger, my workouts got way too long so I adopted a two minute rest for compounds and 60-90 second rest for isolation lifts. And man, that is exhausting. It brought my numbers down quite a bit and really humbled me. But DOMS has been setting in every workout since I've started so it feels good. And it's more exhilarating while also taking less time. Just curious about everyone else's policy.

 

[FallingEdge]

Feel free to use the crossfit Basic Strength Standards [PDF] as a guide for your press progression goals. For the press I chose to use my own bodyweight as a benchmark. As I get bulkier this goal will get slightly loftier, but that's fine. I've also heard of the 500/400/300 pound 1RM as a standard for some people's deadlift/squat/bench press instead of the crossfit chart I use. That's not to mention any elite standard I've heard thrown around, aka the cats at Westside.

Make a goal that you will be satisfied with. Break it if you can.

Thanks for the link. I was looking for that. According to the chart, I'm pretty much at the intermediate level. Gotta continue to push and grind!

What kind of rests does everyone take here?

For me, I do 3 minutes for compound lifts. 1-2 minutes for isolation.

 

[MjFrancis]

My rest periods have changed from my once 60-90 second habit (I haven't done that for about a year now). Most assistance lifts are 1-2 minutes, sometimes a little less. My compound lifts will be 2-3 minutes, but deadlifts and squats can sometimes take up to five minutes when I'm getting to my last couple sets of the day. Supersets or inserting chins between presses might change some of these numbers, but not much.

I agree with you about the numbers game for the most part. I'm adverse to injury (most are), and keep my distance from my 1RM numbers - I prefer 3-5 rep maxes. And as people have noticed, I mostly keep them to myself. I enjoy the informative small talk of fitness and weights, always in a pursuit to match my own goals, which I've written down and kept with a 5/3/1 template to reach them in time. I have enough of them that I usually work on some while maintaining others.

I wish I was making this up, but speaking of braggarts, one cat I know claimed he could squat "like, fifteen hundred pounds." If you're going to make something up, why not come up with something realistic? Like, not record-breaking? Next time it was 1,000, and the time after, 800. Eventually he'll own up to his 200 pound squats, but it doesn't make much difference to me.

 

[Poindexter]

Thanks for the info, guys. After a while I guess I'll up it to a 3 minute rest and give myself another 30 seconds of leeway on isolation. It's also nice to know I'm not the only one who takes a bit longer when lifting heavy compound. I felt kinda lazy when I'd wait 5 minutes at 90% of 1RM on bench and squat.

I agree with you about the numbers game for the most part. I'm adverse to injury (most are), and keep my distance from my 1RM numbers - I prefer 3-5 rep maxes. And as people have noticed, I mostly keep them to myself. I enjoy the informative small talk of fitness and weights, always in a pursuit to match my own goals, which I've written down and kept with a 5/3/1 template to reach them in time. I have enough of them that I usually work on some while maintaining others.

I wish I was making this up, but speaking of braggarts, one cat I know claimed he could squat "like, fifteen hundred pounds." If you're going to make something up, why not come up with something realistic? Like, not record-breaking? Next time it was 1,000, and the time after, 800. Eventually he'll own up to his 200 pound squats, but it doesn't make much difference to me.

:lol

I've never maxed out on several lifts (only maxed out on bench honestly) so when people are throwing out (probably bullshit) 1RM figures I get to hear shit. I've mostly stopped talking weights with most people unless I can tell they also have the body to backup their numbers. These guys that I know just started lifting and not a week after they started they were claiming the could squat 400 lbs. When I asked how many reps "Not many! Just like 5 or 6 a set before we get tired." I'm convinced they're using a smith machine, barely bending the knees or just plain lying. Possibly confusing leg press with squat. It's just obnoxious. They also do no upper body exercises because they're concentrating on legs.