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[Movalpolos]

Gears of War 4 MP.

 

[lukeskymac]

I hate this reasoning.

Life happens. I get phone calls. My wife needs my attention. A package arrives at the door. Folks need to use the bathroom. The kids are acting up. Etc.

Any game that demands that you schedule your whole life around it for an hour or two with no lenience whatsoever isn't exactly game design I'm fond of. We get older, and our schedules fill up. I'm not the jobless teenager I was back the glory days of save points and Xenogears's slow-scrolling text.

As much as I do like games like Dark Souls and Bloodborne, I'd be lying if I said their inability to let me even pause the game to handle life issues has rubbed me the wrong way more times than I care to share.

Yes, life happens. But wanting to change a fundamental piece of game design because you might lose some souls (and that'll happen only if you're already on your way to reclaiming them after a death) if something URGENT happens IRL is just... no.

 

[Garlador]

Souls games don't have pause buttons for a couple of reasons. The most obvious one is that the online multiplayer and single player is supposed to be seamless, and that's how the game is meant to be played.

Calling BS on this.

I played every game offline. There's no reason you shouldn't be able to pause playing offline.

You can get invaded randomly or summon people to help. But what if you just wanna play online? Well, it would sort of ruin the tension if you could just pause the game midstream during a boss battle and change your entire loadout and select every item you need without having to worry about taking damage.

Hence why there's an "offline" mode to accommodate people who don't enjoy the multiplayer aspect.

You can still summon people and get invaded by preset NPCs offline. Even FromSoftware knows not everyone enjoys the online stuff, nor is everyone even always able to enjoy it (Xbox Live costs money, after all, and some people's ISP just suck).

There is absolutely no legitimate reason offline players could not pause the game.

Yes, life happens. But wanting to change a fundamental piece of game design because you might lose some souls (and that'll happen only if you're already on your way to reclaiming them after a death) if something URGENT happens IRL is just... no.

That doesn't make it any better game design.

It's not a "fundamental piece of game design". Having the ability to pause the game to take care of business is just respecting the player's life outside of the game world.

COUNTLESS hard games offer this. Ninja Gaiden Black doesn't suddenly become awful if I pause during a boss fight. Viewtiful Joe's challenge doesn't suddenly vanish if I pause to get a glass of water. Resident Evil's survival mechanics don't vanish if I go to the menu screen.

Dark Souls isn't some special little snowflake. There's punishing a player for playing badly and making mistakes, and then there's punishing a player because they have a life outside the game. Dark Souls - as great as it is - can and does punish players in-game for having to attend to real life issues. I'm testament to this fact many times over.

 

[AlucardGV]

I would never have made it through Bloodborne if I didn't use a guide. For example, to get a particular rune you need to use a certain gesture in front of a particular enemy for a certain amount of time. You don't even get the gesture in the same area. You find it earlier in the game and use it near the end. I guess it's a cool secret but the amount of stuff hidden in the game is ridiculous and I can only imagine it would be a huge waste of time trying to figure everything out on my own.

the essential bloodborne is pretty straightforward and even gherman tells you where to go after every boss
all the fluffy hidden stuff is not really required to go through the game

 

[E92 M3]

People want long JRPGs. When I think of not respecting time, I think of something like the original Destiny with tons of required farming.

 

[MikeE21286]

I'm playing DQ7 right now. I would agree with that. First thing that came to mind.

The other is Final Fantasy XIII

 

[MohitParty]

I felt this way in Everybody's Gone to the Rapture. The walking speed was ridiculously slow. But I guess at least the game was short.

 

[Zafir]

Hmm, MGSV. So many random missions which you're forced to do that have very little reason to exist outside of padding the game. I got bored very quickly, and inevitably didn't finish it despite actually rather liking the game play.

I suppose in general open world games which force you to do side shit to proceed through the main story piss me off. Often the side content don't have much effort put into it, and when I'm then forced to do it, it just rubs me the wrong way. Just Cause 2 was pretty bad for it, and so I didn't get very far at all despite also liking the game play.

 

[Wyndstryker]

Almost every MMORPG out there if not every MMORPG out there

 

[Unknown One]

First thing that came to my mind was MGSV. That game had contempt for my free time.

 

[prgrs]

I felt this way in Everybody's Gone to the Rapture. The walking speed was ridiculously slow. But I guess at least the game was short.

The game has a run button, it just never tells you about it. The devs admitted they messed up on that one.

 

[Tommi84]

First offender:
Everyone Gone to the Rapture - no running is complete utterly stupid. Yeah, yeah, I know you can 'run' using whatever the button is. It doesn't make much difference though.

Second offender:
No Man's Sky PS4 - requirement to keep the butoon pressed on a given option and the need to move the cursor freely instead of jumping from one option to another. This literally infuriated me while playing. Using mouse while playing a PC version (and mods) would be better idea, but my rig is not capable of playing games.

 

[Maddocks]

Battlefield 1 MP. I like it, but I sure as hell don't like the reward system. I want to feel like I'm gaining ground and going and doing something. Bf1 just feels like a grind to a gun that's op then use that gun for a small dog tag the end.

Battlefield 4 reward system was way way better and always had me chasing the next thing to keep me engaged.

 

[packy34]

I've completed MGSV 3 times, so I don't really understand personally why it keeps popping up here. It's a long game, sure, but the gameplay loop is fun. There aren't any missions that require *too* much time or effort to complete so I don't get the argument.

I've heard that FFXV has a boss (or bosses?) that take multiple hours to defeat. To me that's a legitimate example of not respecting time.

 

[sonicmj1]

The only monster hunter game I ever played, Monster Hunter 3 ultimate, feels like a solid 70-100 hours game stretched to be hundreds of hours long with ridiculous grinding and time wasting game mechanis.

- Grinding: Because you can't just make a cool armour from defeating a boss. No, you have to kill it like 15 times because you need 6 of the items it has a 30% chance of droping if you destroy its horn.

- Resources for the sake of resources: Cool now you have 6 of the item but wait, you also need minerals and insects and fish and other random shit (different stuff, mind you, for every part of the armour). So now you have to go mine for minerals and catch bugs in a way that adds literally NOTHING to the game other than some more game time.

- You have money? Can't use that, we need resources:
So here is a crazy idea: You take jobs to hunt down monsters, you complete those jobs and get rewarded with items and money. You use that money to upgrade your base of operations.
But no, the game doesn't want your money. It wants "resources" you get by going out into the wild to kill random monsters. So get ready to go kill mosters outside of missions (monsters you have no interest to kill) so you can get "resoucres" which you need to upgrade the village.

- Crafting yet more stuff:
So some monsters are weak to different types of traps and gadgets. That's a pretty cool idea, it makes what you bring into battle sometimes more important than the level and power of you gear.
Oh but geat ready to craft the shit you need because no one is selling it. Have fun farming more minerals and insects.

- Potions and stuff? More crafting!
Why replenish your potions after a battle if we can have you farming and combining them. It takes a few minutes after every battle, so if we battle hundreds of times we can add a few hours of "content" to the game!!!.
Oh also the whole farm/cultivating thing also "needs resources". Beause we really need you to waste some more time getting them

A real shame. Because the core gamplay is awesome

I only really went deep on Monster Hunter 4, and I didn't mind a lot of the prepwork that you have to do. Grabbing materials, crafting stuff together, cooking before you start each mission, all come together to make you feel like you're getting ready to do something big. Most early monsters drop stuff quickly enough that by the time you've learned their patterns, you have whatever you need.

It doesn't get really annoying until you get to the endgame and you start dealing with sub-20% drop rates on materials. I don't have time for that.

 

[mhayes86]

Bravely Default has A LOT of recycled content which made me never finish it.

I agree, and it's a reason my wife stopped playing, but I always have to mention that most of the content in the last third of the game can be skipped. It's still a pretty terrible design choice and you'd miss some great items and amusing dialogue, but skipping everything that you can will save you like 30 hours.

With that said, getting older and time being precious, I've come to realize that a lot of RPGs do not respect the player's time.

 

[Audioboxer]

GT5 patches.

No idea but I'm going to guess GT6 is just as bad.

PD gonna PD.

 

[Garlador]

I've completed MGSV 3 times, so I don't really understand personally why it keeps popping up here. It's a long game, sure, but the gameplay loop is fun. There aren't any missions that require *too* much time or effort to complete so I don't get the argument.

I've heard that FFXV has a boss (or bosses?) that take multiple hours to defeat. To me that's a legitimate example of not respecting time.

Final Fantasy has become notorious for that.

I was playing FFX HD and was intending to Platinum it. After all, I never fought the Dark Aeons before and that was new content, let alone the new superboss.

... After finish the main campaign - highly overleveled for it as well - I set about getting all the ultimate weapons and maxing out the sphere grids and... hours upon hours upon hours upon hours upon hours of grinding Sphere Points and doing utterly monotonous tasks... and I'm STILL NOWHERE NEAR READY for the Dark Aeons or the optional bosses.

It drove me insane because this wasn't fun content. This wasn't an enjoyable side-quest or a fun mini-game to do on the side. This was DOZENS of hours of grinding the same repetitive things over and over and over again and, after all of it, I realized I was still about a dozen hours away from being strong enough to take them on.

That's insane, and it sunk my opinion of the game as a whole tremendously. A great story with great pacing and it all goes out the window. There's nothing between "strong enough to beat the game" and "strong enough to fight the uber-bosses" but a dozen hours of snooze-inducing button mashing and ridiculous grinding coupled with insufferable mini-games (dodge the lightning 200 times in a row!).

Absolutely no respect for my time. I gave up on it, despite sinking so many hours into my characters post-story.

 

[Iva Demilcol]

Fuck people with IBS, right?

I swear you Souls fans are so touchy. And I like the games.

I don't like most of the souls fanbase either, but let's be realistic though: a Pause button doesn't exist because FS doesn't want to give you a quick way to calm down a little, even if the game is offline, not because 'fuck people with IBS'. The pause button has saved me while playing games like NG black, to me pausing a game is another resource for the player and FS understands that and deliberately took it out from their Souls games. There's a reason they did 5 games without it, they clearly understand what they are taking away from you.

You have two options to confront the absence of a in-game pause option: either you accept it and try to find a way to substitute it with something else (quit to the main menu) like me, or keep complaining that they took a commodity away from you; there's not much to do about it now that the series are over. And bet that if they make a DS4 and you can play the game offline you won't be able to pause it either.

 

[TechnicPuppet]

The start of Assassins Creed games which reached peak absurdity with 3 with what felt like a 9 hour boring as hell tutorial/intro. Lots of RPGs suffer from this F3 and 4 for example, NV does it right.

Also games that make it hard to make your way around, poor maps, difficulty following quests. I completed Mass Effect today and moved to Mass Effect 2, some nice improvements in that regard.

 

[AwShucks]

Final Fantasy XI.

As somebody who decided to finally play through this, you're spot on. No guidance at all. Without a guide I would not have even bothered.

Even with a guide there is so much running around and useless side quests and cutscenes that take forever.

That said, I've really enjoyed the stories.

 

[SprachBrooks]

Damn OP, why did you even bother with the game 10 hours in lol. Shit sounds so cumbersome.

I found DA:I a total waste of time. MGS V sounds especially egregious with its gameplay elements.

 

[ferr]

Bravely Default has A LOT of recycled content which made me never finish it.

This right here.. great game made awful.

 

[patchday]

Response to OP:

(average moba)
League of Legends - 45+ min long matches
dota 2 main game mode - 45+ min long matches
Paragon (and even more shatty- you have to grind those random card packs for equipment)

Card games that dont reward you for losing matches. only reward victories. But at least in their defense those games would be trivial to bot lol

 

[Solid SOAP]

First 5+ hours of Twilight Princess... not saying the game as a whole doesn't respect your time, but cmon. That ridiculously long intro, having to do all the bug quests... it's legit horse shit. Once you aren't restricted to wolf form in the Twilight sections the game becomes legit and one of the best 3D Zeldas, but damn that trek towards it... it sucks!

 

[MohitParty]

The game has a run button, it just never tells you about it. The devs admitted they messed up on that one.

Oh I know about the run button but it pretty much goes from a crawl to a slightly faster crawl. Also I don't think the run button works indoors.

 

[DarknessTear]

Kingdom Hearts 2 (tutorial)
Persona 4's terrible introduction that I never got past.

 

[the_sun_king]

Kingdom Hearts 2 (tutorial)
Persona 4's terrible introduction that I never got past.

*punts you*

 

[DarknessTear]

*punts you*

P3 got my attention more.

 

[Ishida]

I've heard that FFXV has a boss (or bosses?) that take multiple hours to defeat. To me that's a legitimate example of not respecting time.

Optional bosses. They are not necessary to beat the game. So it's up to you to decide if you have enough time to waste.

MGSV is a real answer here.

 

[v1perz53]

Any game where you can't pause.

Imagine you are in a tough boss battle for example in Dark Souls 3. Now you have to go to the bathroom otherwise you will literally shit your pants. But you can't pause!

I worry about your ability to live as an adult if during the course of a ~5-10 minute boss battle you go from "not feeling like you need to go to the bathroom" to "shitting your pants if you don't go RIGHT then". There are other concerns like someone with a baby waking up or someone at the door, but as has been said 100x already, you can just save/quit mid boss instead of pausing and it will start you right back there with the boss at full HP. All you lose is the 2-3 minutes you had been fighting that boss. Is it worse than a pause menu? Yes definitely, but is it very nearly the same? Also yes. Offline mode should have pause though.

Anyway, my answer is any game that makes you play through 3 or more times for the platinum trophy, or that you can't unlock the hardest difficulty until you beat the game once. I will almost never play the exact same game twice back to back, why restrict how I can play unless I do.

 

[OHjaysimpsan]

Every Metroid game I've ever played (Metroid, Metroid II, Super, Zero Mission, Prime, and Fusion) felt extraordinarily disrespectful to my time. Getting lost for hours on end walking in circles to see hours thrown in the garbage is something I never want any game to do.

Also felt some 3D Zelda (Wind Waker, especially) games fill into this and other assorted games that feel too long for its content like Ryse, Evil Within, etc.

whaaaaaat??????? This is the first time i hear this about metroid prime. You were playing it wrong.

 

[Cipher Peon]

whaaaaaat??????? This is the first time i hear this about metroid prime. You were playing it wrong.

As a strong believer of user centric design, I don't believe anyone can play anything wrong. So disagreed.

But even if I were playing it wrong, the fact that the game did not push me to play it correctly on top of the fact I wasn't enjoying it regardless is absolutely what I'd feel was a failing on that game's part,

 

[Garlador]

I don't like most of the souls fanbase either, but let's be realistic though: a Pause button doesn't exist because FS doesn't want to give you a quick way to calm down a little, even if the game is offline, not because 'fuck people with IBS'. The pause button has saved me while playing games like NG black, to me pausing a game is another resource for the player and FS understands that and deliberately took it out from their Souls games. There's a reason they did 5 games without it, they clearly understand what they are taking away from you.

Perhaps, but I still disagree with it.

Ninja Gaiden didn't become "easier" if I could pause to use the restroom.

Actually, quite the opposite. Every time I ever paused a game to do something, and then came back, it was even harder to continue because I had interrupted my groove and had to struggle to get back mentally and physically to the state I was in the midst of the interruption.

Dark Souls, I refuse to believe, would "suffer" for a pause menu during offline play. I can see absolutely no detriments to having the option.

But, by all means, let's having inconveniences like grass and healing grinding in Demons's Souls and Bloodborne, as if THAT doesn't grind the game's pacing down to a screeching halt at times for certain players.

Sorry, but I'm going to call it as I see it. I think it's a BAD DESIGN in an otherwise great set of games.

And I refuse to believe FromSoftware isn't talented enough as a developer to develop a game around the ability to pause a game either. They're not incompetent. I'll repeat; I have never played a single, solitary, legendary "hard" game where the pause option ruined the challenge or difficulty. I've never played an "immersive" game where having to pause the game ruined the immersion for me. I have never played a single, solitary game where pausing the game hurt the game for me in any way, and I've played a metric ton of hardcore games for the past thirty years.

You have two options to confront the absence of a in-game pause option: either you accept it and try to find a way to substitute it with something else (quit to the main menu) like me, or keep complaining that they took a commodity away from you; there's not much to do about it now that the series are over. And bet that if they make a DS4 and you can play the game offline you won't be able to pause it either.

"Stop whining about something that's a legit problem for you".

Damn, Dark Souls fans are some of the best and yet most insufferable...

I better not even mention "easy mode" lest the pitchforks and torches come out.

This is old-hat to me. This reminds me of old school survival horror defenders who whined about people who struggled with tank controls, ink ribbons, and fixed camera angles. While many of them could make a legit point, so many of them were insufferably stubborn that nothing BUT those choices could make a game true survival horror and they screamed and raged whenever a fan asked for smoother controls, or checkpoints, or anything at all that made the games more accessible to anything but the most elite and time-liberated players.

Shock and awe, great horror games with great controls, check-points, and better cameras did indeed come out. We got games like Resident Evil 4 and Silent Hill 2 and Dead Space and Condemned and Outlast and others that used some or all of those elements. Same thing with Fire Emblem fans and the OPTION to remove perma-death in the newer games. It's embarrassing.

I just refuse to believe that Dark Souls lives or dies by its inability to pause the game, as if that's the sacred cow that Dark Souls fans cling to and to rob them of this optional ability would somehow throw the whole balance of the series out the door and flush all its goodwill and skillful game design down the toilet, especially if it was only available offline.

Really, I heard the jokes over the years before playing the games, that Dark Souls fans were averse to almost any criticism of the series, that they were "perfect" and any attempt to change them, alter them, or make them more accessible was seen as blasphemy, and I sort of chuckled at the "exaggeration"...

... But having beaten all the games, and loved them, and talked to countless fans and... I don't think it's an exaggeration any more. I've bumped into far, far, FAR too many Dark Souls fans that bristle at the merest hint of life improvement features like offline pausing or giving less skilled or more time-constrained players an easier mode.

God forbid a player other than yourself has a feature that enhances their experience with the game.

 

[Cyanity]

XENOBLADE CHRONICLES 25 HOURS TO GET YOUR FLYING SKELL X.

I'm still salty

Perhaps, but I still disagree with it.

Ninja Gaiden didn't become "easier" if I could pause to use the restroom.

Actually, quite the opposite. Every time I ever paused a game to do something, and then came back, it was even harder to continue because I had interrupted my groove and had to struggle to get back mentally and physically to the state I was in the midst of the interruption.

Dark Souls, I refuse to believe, would "suffer" for a pause menu during offline play. I can see absolutely no detriments to having the option.

But, by all means, let's having inconveniences like grass and healing grinding in Demons's Souls and Bloodborne, as if THAT doesn't grind the game's pacing down to a screeching halt at times for certain players.

Sorry, but I'm going to call it as I see it. I think it's a BAD DESIGN in an otherwise great set of games.

And I refuse to believe FromSoftware isn't talented enough as a developer to develop a game around the ability to pause a game either. They're not incompetent. I'll repeat; I have never played a single, solitary, legendary "hard" game where the pause option ruined the challenge or difficulty. I've never played an "immersive" game where having to pause the game ruined the immersion for me. I have never played a single, solitary game where pausing the game hurt the game for me in any way, and I've played a metric ton of hardcore games for the past thirty years.


"Stop whining about something that's a legit problem for you".

Damn, Dark Souls fans are some of the best and yet most insufferable...

I better not even mention "easy mode" lest the pitchforks and torches come out.

This is old-hat to me. This reminds me of old school survival horror defenders who whined about people who struggled with tank controls, ink ribbons, and fixed camera angles. While many of them could make a legit point, so many of them were insufferably stubborn that nothing BUT those choices could make a game true survival horror and they screamed and raged whenever a fan asked for smoother controls, or checkpoints, or anything at all that made the games more accessible to anything but the most elite and time-liberated players.

Shock and awe, great horror games with great controls, check-points, and better cameras did indeed come out. We got games like Resident Evil 4 and Silent Hill 2 and Dead Space and Condemned and Outlast and others that used some or all of those elements. Same thing with Fire Emblem fans and the OPTION to remove perma-death in the newer games. It's embarrassing.

I just refuse to believe that Dark Souls lives or dies by its inability to pause the game, as if that's the sacred cow that Dark Souls fans cling to and to rob them of this optional ability would somehow throw the whole balance of the series out the door and flush all its goodwill and skillful game design down the toilet, especially if it was only available offline.

Really, I heard the jokes over the years before playing the games, that Dark Souls fans were averse to almost any criticism of the series, that they were "perfect" and any attempt to change them, alter them, or make them more accessible was seen as blasphemy, and I sort of chuckled at the "exaggeration"...

... But having beaten all the games, and loved them, and talked to countless fans and... I don't think it's an exaggeration any more. I've bumped into far, far, FAR too many Dark Souls fans that bristle at the merest hint of life improvement features like offline pausing or giving less skilled or more time-constrained players an easier mode.

God forbid a player other than yourself has a feature that enhances their experience with the game.

You're overreacting tbh. Just find a corner and stand behind it. No big deal.

 

[TreasureHunterG]

Metal Gear Solid: Peace Walker

Really, the grinding in that game was unnecessary and boring. I only managed to finish it because I'm huge fan of the series, otherwise I would have thrown out this garbage. Really, what the fuck was that Zadornov crap?

 

[Acerac]

Animal Crossing is terrible for this.

I strongly disagree with the Dark Souls responses. It just makes sense to me that a series that was meant to be played online wouldn't have a pause button.

Just find a corner and stand behind it. No big deal.

Also this.

 

[BeatnikGunsoo]

Final Fantasy XI.

This hell most pre 2007 MMOs

 

[muetimueti]

The Witness. If you've seen some of the secrets you'll know exactly why.

 

[Azuran]

Final Fantasy XI.

You mean you didn't like doing the same quest 135th times to get a weapon that got outclassed after only 2 weeks?

FFXI is the only true answer in this thread. Some of you that never played it will never know and understand some of the inane crap players had to go through in that game. And don't even get me started on Mystic Weapons when they first came out. That crap was on another level altogether.

Kingdom Hearts 2 (tutorial)
Persona 4's terrible introduction that I never got past.

FIGHT ME

 

[AudioEppa]

As much I love the game, burnout paradise was like this, there was a lot of times where I had to stop playing but friends needed me for something and I had to brb, but that might be different because it's online and that's expected to not stop.

It's so sad to see mgs5 a lot, one of my favorite series reduced to "but but it has great gameplay" unfortunately I saw it coming a mile away and happy I avoided it at all cost.

Most of the other games people list I never would play.

 

[Snacks the sober sea lion]

I know that Dark Souls not having a pause can be a problem in boss fights, and Dark Souls III has that shit where if you're playing in online mode and lose connection, it instantly kicks you back to the main menu. But Dark Souls is also constantly saving your game. As long as you weren't in the middle of a fight, you'll pick up exactly where you left off if you have to quit. No need to finish the level, reach a checkpoint, or find a save point. I'd say the game respects the player's time just fine.

 

[Garlador]

You're overreacting tbh. Just find a corner and stand behind it. No big deal.

I'm not overreacting.

Not when this is the 1000th time I've heard someone get defensive at any criticism of the pure and flawless Dark Souls.

And I wish I was exaggerating that number. If anything, I feel like I'm understating it.

I've read through enough stubborn defenses of Dark Souls problematic design elements and refusal to accommodate skill or time-deficient players to fill a whole new forum full of it.

And, despite all of them, I've never read a single one that made sense to me. It's possibly the one thing I shockingly agree with Jim Sterling on the most.

Most annoyingly so because, again, I've seen the Dark Souls defense force before in other games for other genres and other insane and bad design decisions that we've moved away from over the last several decades.

I will NEVER understand someone who complains about an optional feature that enhances someone else's game experience while never affecting your own.

I know that Dark Souls not having a pause can be a problem in boss fights, and Dark Souls III has that shit where if you're playing in online mode and lose connection, it instantly kicks you back to the main menu. But Dark Souls is also constantly saving your game. As long as you weren't in the middle of a fight, you'll pick up exactly where you left off if you have to quit. No need to finish the level, reach a checkpoint, or find a save point. I'd say the game respects the player's time just fine.

For the most part... but there are a lot of people - myself included - who spend a great deal of the game time in those boss fights.

I probably spent 10% of my time in Dark Souls 1 just fighting Smough and Ornstein over and over and over again.

 

[CielTynave]

Persona Q, battles take fucking forever even with the battle speed at max.

 

[HK-47]

If you are a completionist, you already have no respect for your time, so it seems dumb to blame the games for it.

 

[Garlador]

If you are a completionist, you already have no respect for your time, so it seems dumb to blame the games for it.

Some games make that more reasonable than others, though. Not all games have the same barometer to get to 100%.

I could 100% everything in Tomb Raider, yet in that same timeframe get only 2% done in Dragon Age: Inquisition, for instance.

Some games are just more sensibly paced and some games make completing everything FUN rather than a slog and grind. A lot of games don't understand that balance.

I've 100% completed plenty of games where the whole experience was a joy and I loved every second and it could be done in a reasonable amount of time.

... And then there's the games where that's far from the case.

 

[Haunted]

Shufflepuck Cantina Deluxe

A nice homage to one of the classic games of the past, well animated and modelled, clearly produced with a lot of love and respect for the original. Updated and newly created opponents that make for engaging matches..once, twice, even several times.

But then you realise that you're not only supposed to beat them a couple times, but repeat the same thing and beat each opponent 50, 60, 75+ times without any sort of variation in order to finish them off and complete the game.


Used to be a mobile game in the past so maybe you could pay your way to the finish line, I don't know. But as it is on Steam, it's maybe one of the crassest examples of padding/stretching out game content I've ever seen.

 

[HK-47]

Some games make that more reasonable than others, though. Not all games have the same barometer to get to 100%.

I could 100% everything in Tomb Raider, yet in that same timeframe get only 2% done in Dragon Age: Inquisition, for instance.

Some games are just more sensibly paced and some games make completing everything FUN rather than a slog and grind. A lot of games don't understand that balance.

I've 100% completed plenty of games where the whole experience was a joy and I loved every second and it could be done in a reasonable amount of time.

... And then there's the games where that's far from the case.

As bullshit as DAI is with its meaningless tedium, comparing it to a compact action game doesnt really say anything. Compare it to other big WRPGs.

 

[jimboton]

I find the base concept of an exploration game that forces you to get lost for hours on end is inherently disrespectful of my time. There are ways to do it well, of course (I'm very much in love with how Silent Hill and Etrian Odyssey handles it), but I've always loathed how Metroid does it.

I'd much rather be railroaded and make lots of quantifiable progress than be lost and waste my valuable time that I could be doing literally anything else.

So don't play a game about exploration if you think exploring is a waste of your time. There are plenty of games around that offer 'quantifiable progress' a plenty for following an objective marker. Sounds like that would be more your thing.

 

[nded]

I love the game, but Okami.