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Here Comes the Next Xbox {Many Xbox 720 Details - Paul Thurrott article} [Updated]
- Thread starter Tomcat
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Sarcasm?
TheNatural
My Member!
LOL. Microsoft doesn't give shit free, they shaft you more over time. Chances are, I would bet there will be no 'Silver.' Wouldn't surprise me if they stuffed achievements and other things behind the gated wall of Live.
thats the thing, and i think i recall hearing rumors stating this, that gold would be the new silver (free) and allow access to online gaming and some other things with a new tier ("diamond"?) that gave additional benefits/services. kind of like psn.
If Sony continues to offer online multiplayer for free, Microsoft has to make that aspect free as well. With the year head start on the PS3, Microsoft could implement whatever they wanted and people would pay because it was the only console offering that level of service available to those who didn't want a PC. Going into a new generation, since they will both launch near each other, both companies have to at least match a few things (like free online multiplayer) as not give the other company an easy bullet point for marketing.
Except Netflix can take away a piece of content, and then I'm done. It doesn't matter if I was in the middle of watching a TV series, if it's gone I can't get it again. Plus doesn't work that way. It's better.
Fine with calling it a rental service, but it's still the best rental service I've ever heard of. Even if it cost as much as Netflix.
That would be...interesting. I think Microsoft doesn't give enough credit about being forward-thinking; if they see that they could lose marketshare because of Sony, they might do something drastic like this. Now THIS would be an interesting twist.
I really wonder what they could do do make the Diamond or whatever tier so special? Would it just be free games and discounts? Interesting...
That really isn't the same thing at all. And even so, would it be acceptable? Explain to me how and why times have changed. Nintendo builds a system to make a profit from the very start. Sony doesn't, and neither has MS. If the Vita taught people anything, it's that using off the shelf hardware can translate into a more affordable system for the consumer. It looks like Microsoft is taking that money saved and keeping it for themselves unless there's some ridiculously expensive hardware in it that we don't know about. Anyone who thinks the BOM based on the current specs (including Kinect 2) is over $400 - $500 is kidding themselves.
The cost to build these systems will come down dramatically in the next couple of years. Selling at anything over $399 would be a huge mistake, even when it means taking a small loss from the beginning.
Actually MS gives services and software free all the time. For example their low tier development tools are free. They got in trouble with the justice department for giving IE for free while there competitors was charging for browsers...
I think he's talking about stuff for consumers. And it's funny you should mention IE, since even THAT is behind the Live pay wall. lol
On the Xbox...not on Windows. Unless you count the Windows OS as a "pay wall."
ThisWreckage
Banned
I don't understand why people would pay Microsoft on top of their Internet service provider to simply play online. Playstation Plus is a much more attractive service. Besides, the games are not the only feature of the service. The discounts that they give you pretty much pays for the service itself.
Ehhh.. Having mixed feelings about the price tag. I buy every console at launch, yes paid $600 for PS3, but after the launches of the previous generation - faulty systems, shitty launch window games, and long game droughts, I just don't think I have the stomach to spend more than $400 for a game console anymore.
I figured. Just saying... We're talking about the Xbox here, not Windows.
I really hope they have a Kinect-les sku for 400$, but all signs are pointing to hell no. With that said, I think the PS4 is going to be 500$ as well, so it's really going to be an expensive holiday either way I go, most likely.
ThisWreckage
Banned
That's not going to happen. If the original Kinect was a meager success then they would have offered Durango models with or without Kinect 2.0. But the original Kinect was a moneymaker for them and they'll hitch their cart to that horse from the very start.
AdventureRacing
Member
For that price they would have to have an amazing launch line-up for me to jump in.
That's why I said "all signs point to hell no."
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Just thinking, Microsoft is really, really, really gong to have to do something big. Sony already has 4 big exclusives coming out at launch, or launch window; Killzone: SF, Knack, DriveClub, and infamous: SS. The last one is likely the only that doesn't come out on launch day.
The reason Kinect sold, the reason that people bought the Xbox 360 as a entertainment box, etc., was likely due in part to how cheap the 360 became. The games for the Kinect weren't great, but they were broad enough to appeal to the mass audience, and the thing caught on fast.
This thing is going to be 500$, maybe 400$ at the very, very least. The Innovator and Early adopters are usually gaming enthusiasts. A small segment of them are pure tech enthusiasts. How the hell is Microsoft going to go head-to-head with Sony if they don't bring something for those early adopters and get the console to snowball into the mass market when things cool down and the consoles aren't "new" anymore? They have to be planning something. There's no chance in hell they'd walk in like lambs to slaughter this holiday.
So what the hell do they have planned that's going to get people to buy it? Is it a new IP? Do the still think a new Halo, Gears, or Forza could do it? Do they think those families that bought a Kinect are going to dump 500 bones for new tech? I just can't believe Microsoft would go into this without something big planned.
specialguy
Banned
Actually Xbox and 360 are both pretty much awesomely engineered technically as to the power in the box (putting aside RROD)
360 keeps up with PS3 despite coming out a year earlier, for example.
Also for the RAM, the latest rumor is that there is 3GB reserved, but "only" 2GB of that used at launch. The other 1GB they supposedly can use for more OS stuff or release to games later, it's simply being left up in the air, but at launch it will just be a holdback. I would suspect it'll end up being released to games.
So a real used reserve of 2GB vs the rumor (and I stress rumor in PS4's case) of 1GB for the competition (Wii U, PS4) doesn't seem too absurd. Not that I actually agree with it, unless they are doing some amazing things.
As for why reserve fixed amounts, I dont know, I guess so it can be counted on to be there when games run? EG, the 32MB in 360, despite 360 having unified memory.
You cant call up the full dash while running a 360 game, only the guide menu, why? Because it only has 32MB...
i will say 32mb is pretty pathetic in this day and age, even 1gb will be such a welcome improvement. our consoles are so damn old!
ThisWreckage
Banned
Well, Gerstmann said that third party exclusives are making a comeback. Microsoft has been really close with EA, Epic, and Bethesda in the past. You can expect an exclusive from one of those three or maybe even two of those three. I would not rule out either Microsoft or Sony receiving a GTAV exclusive port either. And then you have the Final Fantasy rumors. And then of course you have Microsoft moneyhatting exclusive content much like Sony's deal with Bungie's new game.
This is going to sound cynical (but this is true), but Halo would be enough to get a lot of people to buy the next Xbox. Microsoft knows this too.
specialguy
Banned
We have no idea when these games are actually coming out. Some could easily slip a year or more (Knack strikes me that way for sure). Shadowfall will surely make launch imo.
Killzone and Infamous only sell "ok". They're not exactly monsters. The other two, Joe Blow has never heard of.
ThisWreckage
Banned
It makes zero sense to release your big guns on launch day because third party titles will carry your launch for you. That's one reason why Santa Monica, Naughty Dog, and Polyphony were not at the PS4 unveiling.
Fair enough, but Joe Blow isn't the norm for console launches. I mean it's not people as insanely addicted to talking, following, and reading about industry stuff, but these are people who likely play more than one or two games a year. These are people who move the software that isn't CoD, Halo, or Gran Turismo.
500$ is HUGE for anybody, let alone people who are buying a thing with a completely unknown future and sparse library of games.
IrishNinja
Member
$500, non-archaic always-online....ehhhhh
BC? im trying to find something to be excited about, and cheap 360 games (i just got crackdown for $2 at gamestop!) would at least be something
BC? im trying to find something to be excited about, and cheap 360 games (i just got crackdown for $2 at gamestop!) would at least be something
Joke right?
The Xbox brand exists because of Halo.
Mario 64?
WiiSports?
No, you need the big game(s) right from the start. That's why I won't be bothering to buy neither the PS4 or new Xbox at launch.
So far, neither has a game that is stealing the money from my wallet.
Now, if Alan Wake 2 is announced. Different ball game.
But Knack, Killzone, Infamous and Drive Club? At least the PS2 had Tekken Tag.
IOnEI Falcon
Member
That is why we need a Perfect Dark 2. MONEY!
I wouldn't get ahead of myself; we still have two events for the Xbox to show you something, and one for Sony to show you something. All signs are pointing to both of their E3 conferences having bigger game reveals so you never know, Satchel. Come November, you could be a poor sap standing in line like the rest of us!
I wish. That franchise needs another shot, but I doubt MS will risk it.
Lol. If Alan Wake is a big game, what is Killzone then? Superbig?
Glorified G
Member
Aaron Strife
Banned
500 always online
pass
pass
I think he meant personally to him, but in terms of mass-market appeal, I would say those titles are all of similar levels, maybe Alan wake being lower.
I'm talking more from personal perspective.
Right now only God of War could make me buy a PS4 day one, but that's not happening so I'll wait till better games come.
Ditto for Xbox. Given halo 4 and gears judgment just came out, only Alan Wake 2 or Crackdown 3 could pry my wallet open.
So why aren't these tales from the ass? The price already gives it away, pricing is simply not decided at this point. If PS4 is 399 there is no way 720 will be 499. With specs being 33% worse there is no way they can sell against a cheaper PS4 AND for all wie know these aren't two super expensive power consoles, they should not exceed 300 in raw production costs.
Launch date is just as fishy. It's just the typical "they always launched in november".
The rest is just plain copy & pasting existing rumours which doesn't exactly inspire confidence in them. And he's bad at that as well, wie know by now that the always online rumours is based on the devkit requirement to always be connected to the Internet. But that is purely for protection of those devkits after the attempted sale of one on eBay.
Launch date is just as fishy. It's just the typical "they always launched in november".
The rest is just plain copy & pasting existing rumours which doesn't exactly inspire confidence in them. And he's bad at that as well, wie know by now that the always online rumours is based on the devkit requirement to always be connected to the Internet. But that is purely for protection of those devkits after the attempted sale of one on eBay.
Iced_Eagle
Member
They do this for 360 right now though. $99 to get an XNA membership.
You can only use XNA and not the normal XDK. There's been a lot of successful games on the indie marketplace though, and tons of hidden gems. XNA is going away though in favor of straight C++/DirectX, but I hope there is an indie marketplace on the Nextbox as well.
People are forgetting about that rumour where the subsidised Xbox won't work without live
That makes sense if Live is included with the subscription. That's how the current 360 subscription model works I believe (and most subsidized subscription things like cell phones). If you stop paying your monthly bill before your contract is up, you can't use the console, or in the case of cell phones you don't get service. Once you get to the end of your contract, you can do whatever you want, including cancelling your Live subscription if you want and the console will be fine. I assume this would be the same thing.
He's no pastebin. Paul Thurrott is the real McCoy when it comes to Microsoft related rumors.
For me, 2005.
Ah ok then.
BlazingDarkness
Member
There's no proof that's the case at all.
Inflation. The precedent was already set with the current generation. MS and Sony are still selling bundles @ $299. I don't think either of them are going to make the mistake of pricing themselves out of the market, but if you think that either of thse machines will be sold at the same price of the Wii U, then you're kidding yourself. They will both have hardware that will be far more capable and will be bundled with accessories (Kinect, PS Eye, Bt headset, etc). The days of selling loss leading hardware are long gone.
specialguy
Banned
agree with this post.
he's not saying anything unusual though, but my issue is half his comments sound like he's not even claiming to be in the know himself.
anybody can guess it will launch in November. there's literally no other month it could launch in more or less.
James Sawyer Ford
Member
Dismisses Knack, Killzone, InFamous, and Drive Club. Says Tekken Tag is more exciting. Praises Alan Wake 2.
You sir, have bad taste!
Alan Wake is OK, but those launch titles collectively? Would make for a spectacular launch, best ever IMHO.
Last Night.
shinra-bansho
Member
Perhaps, times have changed such that the bolded is no longer the case; i.e. perhaps Entertainment & Devices has been told that they must profit from the start.
specialguy
Banned
Oops wrong thread I suppose.
Mikey Jr.
Member
I am a wifi convert. If your consoles are within a decent range, then the speeds are excellent.
But I had to buy a new router, so I got a hybrid one that has both. Now I have my PS3 and laptop hooked up to them and I have absolutely top notch speeds.
scytheavatar
Member
Rumors are 720 comes with a Kinect; that is going to limit 720's ability to come at a reasonable price.
REMEMBER CITADEL
Banned
After Perfect Dark Zero, I don't think a Perfect Dark game at launch would look too compelling in most people's eyes. Something like Samaritan: The Game would stand a much better chance.
As for Alan Wake 2, i don't know about the mainstream appeal, but it would certainly make me piss my pants.
if they really put an "always on" function to work imho it is just pointing at cloud computing trought ms azure
ms already make ppl pay to play online trought xbl and i think is a suicide to block single palyer games...and make them pay again for multiplayer...lol
theres no economical benefit for them to dont let ppl play offline (in a not multiplayer game) coz u dont pass trought xbl to play single player...
they will leave the choice to the devs..as sony is doing....
again if theres always on function imho it MUST mean cloud computing
already in 2010 they was pushing for it
http://www.microsoft.com/en-us/news/presskits/cloud/docs/The-Economics-of-the-Cloud.pdf
ms already make ppl pay to play online trought xbl and i think is a suicide to block single palyer games...and make them pay again for multiplayer...lol
theres no economical benefit for them to dont let ppl play offline (in a not multiplayer game) coz u dont pass trought xbl to play single player...
they will leave the choice to the devs..as sony is doing....
again if theres always on function imho it MUST mean cloud computing
already in 2010 they was pushing for it
http://www.microsoft.com/en-us/news/presskits/cloud/docs/The-Economics-of-the-Cloud.pdf