Psychoward
Banned
Destiny doesn't have free content updates and most lootboxes at least give you permanent skins lol.
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In Destiny 2, shaders are now one-time use. (And yes, tied to microtransactions.)
- Thread starter ZeoVGM
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Destiny doesn't have free content updates and most lootboxes at least give you permanent skins lol.
NullPointer
Member
The ones you buy aren't consumables though. The ones you unlock through gameplay are specific to item type (primary, secondary, titan, etc).
And Titanfall's post-release maps and modes are all free.
C'mon son
BigEmil
Junior Member
Unfortunately you are right 😒
The fact that you can preview shaders kind of crumbles the entire premise of OP's complaint. You can play around and test all you want, just when you commit you can apply them. Framing that as an attack on fun and then insinuating in the thread title and OP that the mechanic as a whole is so closely associated to microtransactions is.. what?
Like, I'd rather them not be consumable but damn, y'all really take shit to the extreme.
Like, I'd rather them not be consumable but damn, y'all really take shit to the extreme.
MTs for permanent shit is annoying but "ok". MTs for temporary things is disgusting.
They're charging microtransactions for cosmetics that were free in the previous title. This is different than if they had just charged for them right out the gate. Also, they made it into a consumable item that you'd have to buy every time.
benicillin
Banned
It does. They have seasonal events that have included new maps, game modes, etc and the major QOL updates like when TTK and Age of Triumph came out were both free to everyone.
Conkerkid11
Member
What free content updates?
Destiny 2 doesn't put out content that justifies a monthly fee. Hell, they don't even have dedicated servers for multiplayer. The Rocket League devs have bigger bills to pay in terms of their servers.
At issue is redesigning core systems around microtransactions, which they did here. The previous thread was about microtransactions that were entirely optional and did not interfere with the underlying game design.
Free content updates? Destiny had like $150 of mandatory DLC.
RichiRamjag
Member
Here come the corporate stooges...
This was my issue with their introduction via things like rep boosts and such. It was always going to lead to changes in game design that would push us closer to microtransactions such as these.
Yeah I'd be A-ok with this if it meant that content updates were free ala OW. I can handle cosmetic DLC that pays for that stuff but taking old systems out of the game that were in the previous one, and charging for that content is stupid (of all games).
Demoskinos
Member
Eh, its no different than MMO's charging for premium dyes and stuff. FFXIV does this where you can buy multiple buckets of dye for armor/weapons on the real cash shop.
As long as there is still a reliable way to get them in the game via playing the game I see no problem with this tbh.
As long as there is still a reliable way to get them in the game via playing the game I see no problem with this tbh.
Complicated
Banned
They introduced microtransactions to Destiny ostensibly to pay for free content updates that they weren't able to sustain for some reason. I guess they needed to squeeze more money out of people to support their game properly if this is any indication...
Are those dyes permanent? If yes ≠ same ; If no = both situations are shitty.
Would everyone be okay if they ties shaders to lootboxes like Overwatch?
So every lootbox give you 3 or 5 shaders that can be apply to any and all armor pieces you have, as many as you want.
Any duplicate shaders can be convert to coins which can be used to purchase any particular shader you want.
You can gain lootboxes from Strike, Raid, leveling up, and PvP or you can purchase them from the store using real money.
So every lootbox give you 3 or 5 shaders that can be apply to any and all armor pieces you have, as many as you want.
Any duplicate shaders can be convert to coins which can be used to purchase any particular shader you want.
You can gain lootboxes from Strike, Raid, leveling up, and PvP or you can purchase them from the store using real money.
Stone Ocean
Member
They're permanent to a specific set of gear, if you swap you need to reapply them.
That said, only a few, special dyes can be purchased with real money. 95% of the dyes you can get hassle free from NPCs or craft them yourself. And even then you have a chance of getting the premium stuff through your retainers provided they're leveled up, and you can also buy them from other players.
SirMossyBloke
Member
Shouldn't that be the other way around?
So shaders (cosmetics) arent entirely optional? Does this interfere with the underlying game design? How? Yeah, it definitely sucks, but... it is colors. Biggest change is from not consumable to consumable. But does that interfere with the game's design? I dont think so.
The change is obviously for money reasons which sucks but this seems par for the course in MMO like games (consumable dyes). When fashion is an end game, the vultures will swoop in.
Dont see how this changes the core game at all. Just making fashion hounds pay more. Lol
Isn't one of the core game selling points being that this Destiny Avatar and character is YOUR character though? And one of those aspects is personalizing your character's weapons, armor and even the colors of those things. So yes, this does affect a major core element of Destiny. One of the big features people enjoyed about D1 was indeed the shaders you got and people wore proudly because they looked great/were an indicating of you having done X to get it.
Demoskinos
Member
No they aren't. But again as long as you can earn them in game I don't see the big deal. Thats my personal breaking point for "is this too far" If you can still earn a thing in game without ponying up real cash then I'm fine with them selling a shortcut to that item.
Some people value their time more some value their money more.
Trickster
Member
I honestly don't see a compelling reason yet for why the shaders shouldn't just be permanent like they were in Destiny 1 were their fanbase loved collecting them.
I mean things are supposed to be better in a sequel, not this weird "better in one way, worse in another" way that they've done it. It's just such a bizzare thing to do from any standpoint other than "because fuck you give me money"
Do you just pull this out of your ass? In most MMOs dyes are either crafted consumables which are trivial to replace, or they're permanent unlocks. The only ones that's not generally true in are the f2p asian cash grab MMOs.
Guild wars 2 just permanently unlocks dyes, for example. Older western MMOs that have them as consumable aren't hard to replace, they're just not a system that was built into the games so that's their way to easily put them in.
Limiting character customization so that you'll pay to get more ability to do so, is like the single hallmark of F2P garbage. People like cosmetics and like to look unique and different. Having a costume unlock or whatever is one thing, at least it's permanent, making it a consumable is when you think 'maybe this game should be F2P'
For Chroma, I wish it worked like this:
You attach an orange Chroma to a piece of armor, it's there forever. I would have then tried to get all the colors for all my Chroma pieces. Then you can just cycle between them all.
RichiRamjag
Member
Exactly. I loved messing around with the armor and swapping colors. It's just more inconvenient grind meant to push you toward buying them.
Stop trying to excuse this. If destiny one was like this, then perhaps, but this is a shitty change. Armor customization was a big part of destiny one. Bungie somehow found out a way to make it a grind though in the name of pushing microtransactions in 2. It's very disappointing to see.
Oh yes. There was a dedicated Reddit I believe.
MikeyKlump
Member
Did people in Destiny 1 really swap out shaders that often anyways?
This doesnt stop that. They made dyes consumable for money. However, the core didnt change. You can get them in game. You can customize more of your armor.
Besides the fact that they did this for money, how does any of what you said change? It doesnt.
franklyshankly
Member
Yes.
I mean, any time you get a new piece of gear, at bare minimum if you're 100% content to always have the same color combinations.
Oh hey look it's the "x does it so it's no different".
I guess this is the new normal.
Do you remember when in other games it was no different to just have it as a thing added on for nothing?
grfunkulus
Banned
I don't think most are defending it. We're just not ready to condemn the game and post angry text walls on the internet about it yet.
Trickster
Member
I did fairly often. Either because I got bored with how I looked or because I got new items that looked better with certain shaders
If you realize your own threshold then surely you must understand why this draws a line for others.
BreezyLimbo
Banned
what's next
Cosmetic armor that expires in 7 days that you have to rent again?
Cosmetic armor that expires in 7 days that you have to rent again?
This, and IIRC shaders aren't exclusive to Bright Engrams either.
Gross exaggerations all around.
I did, tbh.
Depending on my activity, whether PvE, Raiding, PvP, or even tooling around. I had 4 or 5 shaders Id' put on, ESPECIALLY when they let the cloaks change colors as well (Cloak of Taniks, anyone?).
But alas, microtransactioned shaders are the new meta.
WELP.
Time to find some armor I like and stick with it.
It "stopping that " isn't the problem here or anyone's argument and never was. The fact that it's definitely a more expensive and more tedious change is everyone's problem. It's a change that makes a specific aspect of what people view as one of the core features more grindy, annoying and somewhat of a chore.
LumpOfCole
Member
This is correct for Guild Wars 2, an upgraded and vastly superior dye system compared to the original Guild Wars where dyes were consumable. Its like Destiny 2 pulled a reverse Guild Wars with this change.
I addressed this in my previous post.
Destiny is a loot game. A big part of that loot is the visuals and it's fun to find loot that makes your character look cool. You can dismiss that as cosmetic and not important but it's absolutely a core part of the game that a lot of players care about. That's not really up for debate. It's part of the game.
Destiny had a shader system where you collected shaders once, and could apply them to whatever combination of armor you wanted.
Destiny 2 reworked that into a consumable-based system so they could sell them on the side.
So yes, they reworked a game system - how shaders worked and the surrounding loot stream - to facilitate microtransactions.
Previous dabbling in things like XP boosters could be ignore wholesale because the rest of the game was not touched. That is not the case here.
Team Filler
Member
I don't like this at all, but by now players have made it very clear to Activision-Blizzard that paid cosmetics are just fine. I am enjoying the salt coming from some of my friends who defended overwatch loot boxes to me, though. I mean, it's just cosmetics right? And at least here you aren't rolling the dice when you pay for them, right?
Demoskinos
Member
Sure, and you have options. Don't buy the game and don't engage with the micro-transactions. There are plenty of games that I've shoved to the side and only plan on buying once I see them on a deep discount for various reasons. Its cliche and been said a thousand times but vote with your wallet on this one.
The market dictates if they keep doing this. If they don't find it to be lucrative then they'll stop.
It is almost entirely different. The dyes in the Mog Station are a specific selection that can be found rarely in-game, but can also be bought from other players. FFXIV is an actual MMO with a player economy, and Destiny 2 isn't. Not to mention that the vast majority of dyes can be bought from NPCs or easily crafted in bulk. Dyes are not the cornerstone of FFXIV's business model. These are two extremely different scenarios.
I laughed when I saw they were consumable. Fuck that.
I'm also laughing at how often our rewards show up at eververse instead of the postmaster. Fuck that too.
The monetezation is incredibly tacky. Like XM interrupting their music for a pledge drive.
Give me an honest price for the game and be done with it if that is what it takes. I don't want to be interrupted by shitty commercials.
I'm also laughing at how often our rewards show up at eververse instead of the postmaster. Fuck that too.
The monetezation is incredibly tacky. Like XM interrupting their music for a pledge drive.
Give me an honest price for the game and be done with it if that is what it takes. I don't want to be interrupted by shitty commercials.
Mr.Deadshot
Member
This was more a general statement for all modern online-games. Microtransactions basically replaced paid DLC and/or monthly fees. It was totally expected that Destiny has something like this. Really, it's the norm today for almost all AAA-games, especially multiplayer-stuff. If it's such an issue for some people they simply shouldn't buy the game or wait like 1 day after release before buying ...
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