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[pa22word]

This is not the norm everywhere in the US. In Maryland we only just got our first speed limit of 70 in the last 2 or 3 years, and it's still only on a 20 or so mile stretch of I-70. Everything else is 55 with the occasional 65.

Jesus

I come from the south/southwest and people here would be in open revolt if you tried imposing a 55 limit on the highway. Where I live now here in OK people only grudgingly tolerate the 70mph limit on most highways and often go 75-80 as a standard.

 

[Ri'Orius]

There's also this:



What the hell is a city doing issuing tickets on the interstate?

What, you think the FBI should be out patrolling the interstate? It may've been built by the feds, maybe it's even owned by the feds, but it's still within the jurisdiction of whatever state or city it's in.

And look y'all, if you want to fuck the companies that are making bank off these cameras? There's a great way to do it: drive at the speed limit. Bankrupt the motherfuckers.

 

[unknownstranger]

This is not the norm everywhere in the US. In Maryland we only just got our first speed limit of 70 in the last 2 or 3 years, and it's still only on a 20 or so mile stretch of I-70. Everything else is 55 with the occasional 65.

70 is the standard in Washington State and I think Oregon as well. I briefly (like 3 minutes) got to drive in Idaho a few weeks ago where it's 80 next to the Oregon border but goes down to 65 as you get closer to Boise.

 

[HiResDes]

I never thought of it that way but damn if that isn’t some stone cold truth she is spitting.

I got one of these in Toledo pulling for her.

 

[Bluth54]

There's also this:



What the hell is a city doing issuing tickets on the interstate?

The interstate section Cedar Rapids has cameras on is on an overpass that goes over part of Cedar Rapids.

 

[Apt101]

What, you think the FBI should be out patrolling the interstate? It may've been built by the feds, maybe it's even owned by the feds, but it's still within the jurisdiction of whatever state or city it's in.

And look y'all, if you want to fuck the companies that are making bank off these cameras? There's a great way to do it: drive at the speed limit. Bankrupt the motherfuckers.

State troopers handle the interstate. Not some private company on the behalf of some pencil pushers.

 

[PataHikari]

So, if I am reading this right, she has three main arguments

* The police can not outsource their powers to non-government entities
* The system favors certain vehicles over other, which violates equal protection
* A city does not have the authority to levy local fines on federally owned roads

I feel like the third is the least likely to get through.

First and second sound totally reasonable.

 

[DOWN]

So, if I am reading this right, she has three main arguments

* The police can not outsource their powers to non-government entities
* The system favors certain vehicles over other, which violates equal protection
* A city does not have the authority to levy local fines on federally owned roads

The case seems actually very nicely argued, though doesn’t excuse her speeding

 

[Unknown Soldier]

I hope she wins. Traffic cameras are revenue generators. No one who runs these cameras actually cares about public safety.

 

[30yearsofhurt]

Heisenberg really sold her up the river on that one.

 

[Cipherr]

If this

is true then the whole thing is bullshit. Either everyone who gets caught on the speed camera gets a ticket or pull it down and no one gets a ticket.

Yeah thats... everything collapses on that. Im one of the like... 2 people on the planet that isn't inherently against the traffic cameras. They aren't going to hire more cops, would be nice if they could focus on other stuff while automated camera dealt with petty shit like speeding, and turning left on red where prohibited etc.

But this collapses when these guys can't just do the shit honestly. If you cant even be honest and give the tickets out evenly regardless of if its a VIP or not, then no one has a leg to stand on defending it.

Always gotta be some fucktard to abuse a position of power. Fucking always. Enjoy sitting in your car in the hot ass summer under an overpass holding a speed gun morons; ruined your own chances of improving your job with this crap.

 

[greycolumbus]

Yeah thats... everything collapses on that. Im one of the like... 2 people on the planet that isn't inherently against the traffic cameras. They aren't going to hire more cops, would be nice if they could focus on other stuff while automated camera dealt with petty shit like speeding, and turning left on red where prohibited etc.

But this collapses when these guys can't just do the shit honestly. If you cant even be honest and give the tickets out evenly regardless of if its a VIP or not, then no one has a leg to stand on defending it.

Always gotta be some fucktard to abuse a position of power. Fucking always. Enjoy sitting in your car in the hot ass summer under an overpass holding a speed gun morons; ruined your own chances of improving your job with this crap.

Would be amazing if it came down to that.

I hate contractors more than speeders so I'm loving this lady. I hope she wins.

 

[kyser73]

She has a really nuanced case, but I feel like her assertion that she wasn't speeding will kill it. Does the difference between 13 over and 11 over matter when you're way over already, or did the company exclusively have a right to ticket anyone 12 over? Unless she has documented evidence of her recording a speed of less than 12 over at the time, she shouldn't have a case for wrongful ticketing which would prevent her from having standing to file the lawsuit. But since the case has made it this far, it must have merit. Hopefully she wins, these privatized solutions are scummy and rife with corruption



Red light cameras are much more problematic than speeding cameras because they change driver behavior in a way that is unpredictable and unsafe, leading to lots of rear-end collisions that put everyone involved at more risk than they would be if there were no cameras there. While speeding tickets might be more annoying and frivolous, they don't actively cause harm like many red light cameras do.

Speed cameras cause the same sort of problems red light cameras do when they're not well hidden. The same type of driver that slams their brakes for a traffic intersection with a red light camera is also going to slam their brakes for a speed camera.

I would buy that a speed camera is less likely to cause a collision, but many areas I've seen speed cameras implemented have has greater traffic build up in that area to the point that the camera rarely ever fires because everyone is stopped or going half the speed limit.

Don't tailgate & don't speed.

If you need to slow down before a camera you're already driving hazardously for the legal limit, and if someone braking for a camera means you rear-end them you were too close AND too fast.

 

[Basileus777]

Don't tailgate & don't speed.

If you need to slow down before a camera you're already driving hazardously for the legal limit, and if someone braking for a camera means you rear-end them you were too close AND too fast.

All of that is beside the point. We shouldn't be implementing revenue raising policies that cause more accidents and make roads less safe to drive on.

 

[JettDash]

In Arizona, you can just throw camera tickets in the trash because tickets aren't valid unless they are personally served. They might send someone to serve you, but if not you are in the clear.

 

[perfectchaos007]

In Arizona, you can just throw camera tickets in the trash because tickets aren't valid unless they are personally served. They might send someone to serve you, but if not you are in the clear.

Arizona/New Mexico they also have signs on the highways that claim to be patrolled by aircraft. I'm pretty sure they are just bluffing.

 

[Crimson-Death]

I love that episode, and another example that our timeline has truly reached cartoonish levels reality.

 

[WhereAreMahDragonz]

Not all heroes wear capes

 

[Mulgrok]

Arizona/New Mexico they also have signs on the highways that claim to be patrolled by aircraft. I'm pretty sure they are just bluffing.

They actually do this in Oregon. Local news had video of them radioing patrol cars to ticket the offenders.

 

[StarCreator]

Don't tailgate & don't speed.

If you need to slow down before a camera you're already driving hazardously for the legal limit, and if someone braking for a camera means you rear-end them you were too close AND too fast.

My complaint is more oriented toward how much traffic the random braking causes, not collisions. I have seen rear end collisions near speed cameras, but it's fairly rare thankfully. Doesn't mean it isn't causing traffic problems nonetheless.

Same with the red light cameras. The ones here are hypersensitive to making sure people come to a full stop on right turns, and I've seen people just opt to not turn on red at all to avoid firing the camera. More traffic all to solve something that wasn't a problem in the first place.

 

[CitizenVectron]

Eh... the 55 is pretty irrelevant overall.

The freeway I live next to has a speed limit of 80, and people just go 95.

Wow, that's 155km/h.

 

[Late Flag]

Good. These cameras are mainly money-grabs and most likely unconstitutional (IMO).

 

[zelas]

Why do Americans hate speed cameras? Because they don't allow you to violate the speeding limits that were clearly put into place for a reason?

Because they are often maliciously placed in unnecessary spots just to raise revenue. Using GW parkway in DC as an example, cops in DC try to justify the heavy handed use of tickets there because of "pedestrians trying to cross the street." First of all, its not a street, it's a highway. It's well traveled enough by pedestrians and motorists to justify putting up pedestrian bridges and fences. Don't want to give that money up though. Second of all the speeds jump from as low as 25mph to as high as 50mph. We know how people behave when around these cameras. Going 20mph on a highway is fucking ridiculous.

There are also several infamous small towns around the country where the speed drops randomly/unexpectedly for tourists and cops are conveniently hidden nearby, some even catching the eye of AAA. There is a track record you're ignoring if you think law enforcement has good reasons across the board for anything they do.

The north Florida town of Waldo has long had a reputation as a speed trap, and it's no wonder. A small segment of highway that runs through Waldo requires drivers to speed up and slow down six times: 65 mph becomes 55 mph; 55 becomes 45; then goes back to 55; then back down to 45; to 55 again and eventually, 35 mph. AAA named the tiny town between Jacksonville and Gainesville one of only two "traffic traps" nationwide and even placed an attention-getting billboard outside the limits of the town to warn drivers to slow down before entering.

...

In 2013, Waldo's seven police officers filed 11,603 traffic citations, according to records obtained by the Gainesville Sun newspaper. That compares with 25,461 citations in 2013 for much larger Gainesville, which has 300 officers and 128,000 residents, including thousands of college students. The fines paid by motorists are a big money-maker. According to the city's 2013 budget, about half of its $1 million in revenue came from "court fines" from tickets issued.

 

[JettDash]

Another reason to hate them is that the cameras are owned and operated by for profit companies who get to keep a cut of each ticket.

If you say that's just asking for corruption, you're right.

A federal judge sentenced former Redflex CEO Karen Finley to 30 months in prison last week for her role in a bribery scheme to win photo-enforcement contracts in Chicago.

U.S. District Judge Virginia Kendall also ordered Finley to pay $2 million in restitution, telling the 57-year-old Arizonan "there is no sense of corporate social responsibility there" and that the case had significant impact on the public.

http://www.phoenixnewtimes.com/news...months-in-speed-camera-bribery-scheme-8833607

 

[Duxxy3]

Traffic cameras should be illegal nationwide. They're bullshit.

 

[UraMallas]

I drive this road, man. Fuck these cameras. Snatch that W, Marla.

 

[F34R]

I'm 100% against traffic cams that initiate violation distribution.

 

[Gero]

Speeding cameras on the highway??? People driving in Texas highways will be furious if they were speeding cameras on any highway. The lowest I've seen speed limit wise is 65, otherwise is 70-75 and people drive up to 90...

 

[ChainedMaster]

Another reason to hate them is that the cameras are owned and operated by for profit companies who get to keep a cut of each ticket.

If you say that's just asking for corruption, you're right.

Doubt it. At least not anymore than the police themselves. Police steal from people all the time through civil asset forfeiture. Cops have a high motivation to ticket people and arrest people, perhaps more than corporations. At least a camera corporation can't take a thousand dollars from your pocket because "a normal person doesn't have that much cash, must be from selling drugs".

 

[JettDash]

Speeding cameras on the highway??? People driving in Texas highways will be furious if they were speeding cameras on any highway. The lowest I've seen speed limit wise is 65, otherwise is 70-75 and people drive up to 90...

They tried doing that in Arizona. I think it was the first state to do so. It didn't last very long. People were PISSED. And the program didn't collect nearly as much money as they hoped because people realized you can just ignore the tickets with no consequences. Now only cities do it and only on roads they maintain.

Doubt it. At least not anymore than the police themselves. Police steal from people all the time through civil asset forfeiture. Cops have a high motivation to ticket people and arrest people, perhaps more than corporations. At least a camera corporation can take a thousand dollars from your pocket because "a normal person doesn't have that much cash, must be from selling drugs".

Most cops don't have a high motive to give out as many tickets as they can. If they do have quotas they are soft ones like simply pulling 15 people over a month. So the ones they do pull over were driving particularly poorly or look suspicious. And they will often just give warnings instead of actual tickets because it doesn't actually make a difference to them.

 

[Escape Goat]

thread title is sensationalist. The court is hearing a case on the legality of outsourcing police activities.

 

[Jarmel]

Good on her.

 

[ChainedMaster]

Most cops don't have a high motive to give out as many tickets as they can. If they do have quotas they are soft ones like simply pulling 15 people over a month. So the ones they do pull over were driving particularly poorly or look suspicious. And they will often just give warnings instead of actual tickets because it doesn't actually make a difference to them.

Well once you look at their civil asset forfeiture policies, you begin to realize they do have incentive to take from civilians. One police department was even caught buying a margarita machine for the office with money obtained through forfeiture. The example of corruption you showed was to win contracts anyway, not unlawfully ticket people who weren't speeding. People are much more at risk from being pulled over by the police than being ticketed through a camera.

 

[Conciliator]

that fact, that it's so easy to just pay your stupid $75 fee, rather than confront the methodology and system, is deceptively powerful. I mean that's definitely me, I'll pay some $75 ticket regardless of how I feel about it because my other option is fighting the judicial bureaucracy. Fuck that. But if we truly believe in a just society then that stuff matters, and it really, really matters for poor and disadvantaged people. So shouts out to the people who are not too lazy to fight the fight.

 

[Aselith]

She has a really nuanced case, but I feel like her assertion that she wasn't speeding will kill it. Does the difference between 13 over and 11 over matter when you're way over already, or did the company exclusively have a right to ticket anyone 12 over? Unless she has documented evidence of her recording a speed of less than 12 over at the time, she shouldn't have a case for wrongful ticketing which would prevent her from having standing to file the lawsuit. But since the case has made it this far, it must have merit. Hopefully she wins, these privatized solutions are scummy and rife with corruption

Actually due to presumption of innocence,the cops have to prove she was speeding. Speed gun calibration usually works but here idk

 

[JettDash]

Well once you look at their civil asset forfeiture policies, you begin to realize they do have incentive to take from civilians. One police department was even caught buying a margarita machine for the office with money obtained through forfeiture. The example of corruption you showed was to win contracts anyway, not unlawfully ticket people who weren't speeding. People are much more at risk from being pulled over by the police than being ticketed through a camera.

Im not saying there is no incentive, but is certainly not the only or even biggest one. Most cops don't go out of their way to pull people over, bust them for petty shit (or nothing) and then take their car/money. Most cops don't even do that many traffic stops.

The only incentive traffic camera companies have is to generate as many tickets as possible. So they will do things like put cameras in places that maximize the number of people they can catch even if it increases accident frequency. They also do things like send tickets to the registered owners of cars even if they clearly weren't driving. Knowing that in Arizona, people can't be held responsible for someone else getting a camera ticket while driving their car or be compelled to snitch on them.

 

[MidgarBlowedUp]

There is also no proof beyond a doubt she was speeding unless the city can prove the traffic camera was calibrated properly and not subject to error due to wet road reflections at the time of incident.

She is 100% in the right and should win the case.