GeordieMark
Member
There was a lot of talent at Bullfrog, but many of those guys went on to form Lionhead with Molyneux.
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Molyneux can't keep his promises part ??: Godus Kickstarter edition
- Thread starter More_Badass
- Start date
There was a lot of talent at Bullfrog, but many of those guys went on to form Lionhead with Molyneux.
BRocknRolla
Member
Why? Why? Why? What about it is so amazing? The guy has lots of ideas, and delivers on the merest fraction. He sells his games based on his innacurate descriptions and somehow people applaud him for it. He's hot air and nothing more. No part of me gets what about him is "amazing."
I for one do not understand the praise he gets in the least. How many times do you have to dissapoint, or even straight up lie to your fans before they turn on you? This guy apparently has an unlimited get out of jail free card.
If only. But every times he's brought up, someone always finds a way to talk about him like he's something special.
It's important to understand that a Molyneux Kickstarter isn't funding whatever his current grandiose claims are.
It's funding the development of useful life skills for you personally!
Such as 'Fool and his money', 'Sucker born every minute', and 'Due diligence'!
From that perspective it was a smashing success.
It's funding the development of useful life skills for you personally!
Such as 'Fool and his money', 'Sucker born every minute', and 'Due diligence'!
From that perspective it was a smashing success.
s_mirage
Member
It's worth bearing in mind that, judging from the game credits, he was only one designer out of many on several of the Bullfrog classics. He appears to have had very little to do with Syndicate for example.
It really pisses me off that he seems to be given almost sole credit for a bunch of games where his input appears to have been limited. If people are going to try to excuse him by listing all the classics that he made, perhaps the list should be limited to those where he actually was design lead, rather than those he was credited on by virtue of being the studio's boss.
It really pisses me off that he seems to be given almost sole credit for a bunch of games where his input appears to have been limited. If people are going to try to excuse him by listing all the classics that he made, perhaps the list should be limited to those where he actually was design lead, rather than those he was credited on by virtue of being the studio's boss.
BibiMaghoo
Member
He created the god game genre.
But that means he is also indirectly responsible for Spore.
Hmm.
0/22
GeordieMark
Member
Even if you discount the games he produced, you're still left with some classic games. The guy invented a genre.
I'm making no more posts on this. I get that people are pissed at some 'broken promises' (which I think is kinda dramatic), but some of the posts here border on hostility towards the guy. That's bullshit frankly. If this is supposed to be a forum for people who genuinely love games and gaming, you have to have some respect for a guy who was a pioneer.
A con artist's past is no reason to respect them today.
Peter Molyneux is a con artist. He is a liar, and people who trust him and give him their money deserve every cent they lose and more.
Jinfash
needs 2 extra inches
At least his new game is aptly named this time around.
Krappadizzle
Member
You're one of those "gaming is life" people huh?
He's a liar, sure. Don't buy his games. I've now solved your problem.
flatearthpandas
Member
I don't dislike him either. I never believe a word he says and haven't given him a dollar since Fable 1, but it is amusing watching someone with such a consistent track record continue to get people hyped and disappointed. There is enough evidence out there that I can't even feel bad for them.
Not at all. He's proven himself to be a liar repeatedly. I wouldn't trust somebody like that in business or personal life, regardless of what career they choose. Brian Williams deserves to lose his job and never be hired in journalism just as Peter Molyneux deserves his current company to collapse and every enterprise he enters in any position of authority to fail before it can lift off.
And yes, I won't and don't buy his games. I also make it a point to mention that he's a complete liar whenever he decides to start lying in public again, which he already has for his new game based on the quotes presented.
edit: And for whatever it's worth, people trying to forgive his repeated deception because he made some good games twenty years ago are exhibiting far more of a "games are the only thing" attitude than I am. They want to forgive somebody who defrauded people during his kickstarter because he worked on good games two decades in the past.
Compsiox
Banned
This is only true for the last 2 decades.
AusRoachman
Member
the trial sounds like an apt name for his new project.
Stallion Dan
Member
An experience never seen before, as the people who spend money on the game reach into as yet untapped feelings of denial over what was promised and what they got.
bigbaldwolf86
Banned
So the good he did in the 90's means he gets a free pass for the last decade and a half of crap? I'm sorry but I don't buy that.
Fable 2 is one of my favourites from the entire lifespan of the 360, it does a lot right. The third instalment was definitely not up to the same standard but wasn't bad or crap.
The thing with PM is that you really just should absolutely not believe or listen to his crazy talk in relation to an upcoming game he's working on. Just wait for the end product and decide from there. For that reason I steered clear of Godus and as we see now, it was probably for the best.
I do genuinely believe he means well, something like a friend you'd never lend money to and take certain things said with a pinch of salt at best but his heart appears to be in the right place. I don't think he will ever deliver a revolutionary product again, but I think if surrounded by grounding forces could easily make some very good games in pre-established genres.
That said I do believe someone needs to have a quiet word in his ear regarding Godus, the situation described in that article is unacceptable and sadly probably his biggest failure to date.
Mike Works
Member
Even though there's no way in hell I would ever kickstart a Peter Molyneux game, and it's really easy to make a joke about those who would, this shit needs to stay near the top of the forum. It shouldn't be forgotten and he shouldn't be let off with a jovial Haha, that Peter Molyneux and his promises...
Especially considering this quote of his in the article where he outright states that he lied to all of the potential backers, and people that put down money who were promised rewards aren't going to get them (let alone a finished game):
Especially considering this quote of his in the article where he outright states that he lied to all of the potential backers, and people that put down money who were promised rewards aren't going to get them (let alone a finished game):
That's not acceptable. Say what you want about the Kickstarter model (I've never funded anything and doubt I ever will, personally), but outright lying about your rewards and then turning to the next game should not be legal.
badnewsbeers
Member
Whatever happened to the guy who won Curiosity? Is he involved with body's now? What does he do?
Doctor Ironic
Member
I think I remember hearing that he didn't spend any money on Curiosity (was only using the smallest free pick) and didn't even have any interest in Godus, which is hilarious if true.
I liked him because even though he would overpromise, I'd still enjoy the finished product greatly (talking about the Fable games here). I knew people were going to be disappointed and complain, but I at least expected him to deliver a finished product at some point after accepting everyone's money. Just ditching the project to hawk some other thing is prettype fucking low.
Isn't this part of the problem? I mean the not realising after all the disappointments that really it was the team at bullfrog that created great games, in spite of Moly working in the same office.
Phat Michael
Banned
i LOVED Fable 2. Thought it was really good. Loved the boardgame mission in Fable 3.
Fable 2 introduced the really interesting economics minigame into the story. I loved that so much and i wish more games allowed you to buy real estate and earn rent while the machine was switched off.
I wonder how much cash i would get now if i booted up Fable 2?
Sounds like fraud to me. Molyneaux is a scam artist.
AWizardDidIt
Member
I've always thought that even when he wasn't fulfilling on all of his aims when designing a game, Molyneux always at least brought a creativity to his games that at least elevated them to something special. Black and White, Fable 1 and Fable 2 were all fabulous games even if they were flawed in their way with some really ingenious ideas.
Beyond that though... hard to defend the guy. Curiosity was a... well a curiosity that seemed mostly pointless even as an art piece. Godus just seemed ill-conceived from the get-go.
I dunno. I legitimately think he's one of those really important figures in gaming in a positive way, but I can't really get behind anything he's done recently and I sorta wish he'd just take a bow and get off the stage before he tarnishes his legacy any further.
Beyond that though... hard to defend the guy. Curiosity was a... well a curiosity that seemed mostly pointless even as an art piece. Godus just seemed ill-conceived from the get-go.
I dunno. I legitimately think he's one of those really important figures in gaming in a positive way, but I can't really get behind anything he's done recently and I sorta wish he'd just take a bow and get off the stage before he tarnishes his legacy any further.
I'm tempted to believe that. Dungeon Keeper and Theme Hospital are just so good that you can hardly believe he helped make them
You have no idea....
Let's be honest, he couldn't possibly have worked on every Bullfrog games. They released like 2-3 titles each year form 94 to 97. At some point there was probably 5 or 6 titles in production at the same time.
I know he didn't even touch Theme Hospital (he's barely credited as "Moral Support") and I doubt he was really involded in more than 1 or 2 games for this period.
He was supposed to be "Executive Designer" on the Movies, wathever that means, but again, I doubt is involvment in the production was real. At the same time, Lionhead was working on Black & White 2, were he was Lead Designer. 2 Games + running a AAA studio + his family, while having time to promise you the impossible, sorry but no.
Some of them founded Mucky Foot, then came to Lionhead. Lionhead management is probably the old Bullfrog management today.
Wathever Molyneux had, he lost it. And it was probably more the ability to put together great teams than being a genious of game design. (and tbh, that could be even more impressive, considering what Bullfrog managed to produced in 3-4 years)
HP_Wuvcraft
Banned
This is the best description of Molyneux ever.
Have you checked the credits out for some of these games to see his actual involvement in them? Let me help you...
Syndicate:
http://www.mobygames.com/game/dos/syndicate/credits
Producer
Peter Molyneux
Magic Carpet:
http://www.mobygames.com/game/dos/magic-carpet/credits
Executive Producer
Peter Molyneux
Populous had 4 designers:
http://www.mobygames.com/game/amiga/populous/credits
Games Design
Peter Molyneux, Glenn Corpes, Kevin Donkin, Les Edgar
The Movies had 8 designers:
http://www.mobygames.com/game/windows/movies/credits
Fable had 4 designers:
http://www.mobygames.com/game/xbox/fable-/credits
Designers
Peter Molyneux, Dene Carter, Ben Huskins, Mark Webley
Yeh, about Theme Hospital...
http://www.mobygames.com/game/dos/theme-hospital/credits
Moral Support
Peter Molyneux
CecilRousso
Member
The comparisons between Fable and Godus are wrong, since there's a huge difference between trying and delivering something, and just not even trying to do what he promised.
The issue here is that they lied to get money, did something completely different then expected, and then even left the project to a newly hired team to salvage it. People claim to know what to expect from him, but this is different, and much much worse.
The issue here is that they lied to get money, did something completely different then expected, and then even left the project to a newly hired team to salvage it. People claim to know what to expect from him, but this is different, and much much worse.
I'm surprised to see a lot of people in here be so salty about him. Opinions and all that, but I never really had any hate for the guy. Does he lie? Sure. Is he a crazy idealist? Ab-so-lutely. But he's got a nice demeanor, he's extremely passionate about the medium, and in general seems like he means well. Have I been disappointed by his games before? Sure. But even when a game couldn't possibly live up to his promises? I've still had a decent time with them. Black & White II currently leaps to mind.
Nonetheless, I've always viewed him as the gaming industry's crazy grandpa. Happy to have him around, just be skeptical about what he says. And as always, buyer beware.
OccamsBlender
Member
Populous III. Dungeon Keeper.
Clearly Molyneux managed to steal the glory and credit from someone(or somebodies) with these titles.
DistortionOfReality
Member
That may be true, but why leave out Black & White, another cracking game from the studio?
Concept & Design Lead, Programmer
Populus may have had him as one of 4 designers, but again he was one of two programmers, and owner of the original concept. (The man worked in DOS and windows through his career, not the Amiga)
The man may be a liar and serial over exaggerator, but credit where credit is due. He clearly has worked to get to recognition he has.
Yes, you're right about Populous with coming up with the original concept, but the other games I listed he always - wrongly - gets the credit for and no one else.
DistortionOfReality
Member
True, and the Theme Hospital 'Moral Support' is both damning and laughable in that respect.
Bastard. He should be blackballed.
Dreamwriter
Member
There was a recent interview where he basically said Kickstarter is the devil, and not really designed for the way he works - he said it's too easy to over promise, especially when you need that last little bit of funding, and that during development changes always come up but with Kickstarter you've given expectations for the final product that have now changed. He said if he had to do it again he would have waited until the game was halfway done before running the Kickstarter, so everybody would have a better idea about what the final game would be.
Not sure what you are getting at, he chose not to use Unity for Godus because it wasn't really designed for the kind of procedural 3D layered world he wanted, while he had a programmer who could knock out an old-school game engine for it in no time. Of couse, if he had used Unity, he would have been able to deliver on the Linux version. Instead his choice of coding the game with his own engine made cross-platform quite difficult, so he used AirPlay/Marmalade for that, which doesn't support Linux at all.