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[jeffram]

"I have no idea but I'll then proceed to say things like they're the truth"

The tinfoil on your hat is mighty thick.

I don't really understand your problem. We do not know the financial situation of Xbox because we haven't gotten specific numbers in years.

Then I say here's a theory that I don't believe, but is fun to think about.

Are you saying that not knowing the financial standing in f Xbox (as most don't) means I can't make an off the wall guess on a possibility of what they might be doing with the brand? I dont really understand your problem.

 

[Synth]

And is that that because Microsoft seemed to push multiplayer a lot more, or because the single player aspect didn't measure up well. A lot of Halo 5's praise that I hear isn't the campaign.

The same is for gears of war 4. No they didn't tell me I was strictly talking console games not mobile. EVERYone knows what mobile can pull in for revenue and what not. But the majority of budgets Nintendo,Sony have for their gaming division is on their first party, or publishing efforts for console games. Most of which are not concentrated on Microtransactions for each respected title.

You think God of war, Mario Odyessey, to an extent Mario kart are or going to sell based on those microtransactions?

Microsoft is doubling down because they have failed miserably in the past to have their software division be self sustaining in their sales. Which is why they seem to be focusing on it so much and making a key strategic play.

No, I don't think God of War or Mario Odyssey would sell based on their multiplayer aspects... that's because they've either had no multiplayer, or the multiplayer wasn't considered great. I could imagine a Mario Kart or Splatoon doing rather well though.

Your focus on Halo 5 and Gears 4 is completely misguided. Both IPs have had multiplayer as a core of their playerbases since their first games... even with the original Halo lacking official online. Or are you now also going to suggest that Halo CE and Gears 1 weren't up to par campaign-wise? A strong multiplayer is just naturally more valuable to publishers than strong singleplayer, because the customers remain as consistent business potential, and in the case of stuff like Halo and Gears still bought the product for $60 in the first place also.

Again, as per your own logic, the only reason Sony has more singleplayer focus today, is because their previous attempts at establishing multiplayer userbases failed miserably in the past... not because they wouldn't prefer to (almost every publisher would prefer to).

 

[Memento]

It is bigger than PSN? (aka makes more money?)

How is that even possible?

 

[LordRaptor]

you mean PaaS?
not sure i would call PSN+ and XBLG Software

They're software as a service.
Specifically, they're technically ransomware as they remove features you have paid for in other software until you pay up.

 

[wapplew]

The good news: MS are seriously committed to Xbox, it's not a fad for them, they see this platform as crucial to their business and their future, all those reports we had in the past about them wanting to get rid of it etc were bullshit, it's here to stay.

Of course MS committed to Xbox, any platform/ecosystem holder would be a fool to ignore video game revenue.
I'm sure gaming make up for major part of App Store/Play store revenue, what else will make money for Windows store?

 

[leeh]

As much as I love MLB the Show, I despite the packs and stubs monetization

Pop in the OT here and take a look at people dropping $. And the pack gambling is so much worse than Overwatch loot box gambling as it affects gameplay for a major mode of the game.

It's a mode I would like to dive into but I'm not going to play that bullshit

UC4 has pay to win for MP and Last of Us 2 will likely do it.

Sony is going that route, they just aren't going all-in on it.......and hopefully they won't

First time I've heard of this in these games. UC4 has P2W multiplayer? Seriously?

 

[Kill3r7]

It is bigger than PSN? (aka makes more money?)

How is that even possible?

Advertising? MS has always been aggressive in selling ad space on both 360 and X1.

 

[sibarraz]

I wonder which role plays minecraft in this system.

Like, does microsoft see this game sets the precedent to launch other game as service title into other consoles?

 

[Syrus]

Another xbox thread turn to PS wars thread.

This is good news that they are in profit and supporting xbox

 

[Memento]

Advertising? MS has always been aggressive in selling ad space on both 360 and X1.

But PS4 is 2:1 to One. That means double the amount of people on Live spending on PSN. Double the amount of paid subscriptions. Double the amount of everything. How does Live makes more revenue?

 

[spannicus]

Another xbox thread turn to PS wars thread.

This is good news that they are in profit and supporting xbox

Always and will probably never change. Sad shit

 

[Kill3r7]

What game does NIntendo currently have that's GAAS?

What game does Sony have that's GAAS?

They are making money off of their hardware, off of First party, and off of all the digital sales from their online marketplace.

GAAS yes is something I see expanding, but it's not the end all be all. It's a handful of games that have been successful.

One of which is popular because of both it's online and single player.(GTA V).

GAAS works for certain types of games, and certain gamers gravitate towards it. It doesn't mean you shift your whole division to make all your games like that. Which seems to be MICROSOFT's MO right now.

Sony's biggest boon this gen is mandatory PS+ and the rise of digital sales. That is where the bulk of their revenue and profits comes from, You are right, Sony makes money from all their games but they could make more money by adopting GaaS and they will with time. Heck they already have, two of their biggest franchises UC and TLOU contain MP and MT. Also, Nintendo will soon charge for online play, why are they doing that?

But PS4 is 2:1 to One. That means double the amount of people on Live spending on PSN. Double the amount of paid subscriptions. Double the amount of everything. How does Live makes more revenue?

I have no idea. Customer behavior differs between stores. Advertising would be one thing that close the gap and maybe MT.

 

[wapplew]

But PS4 is 2:1 to One. That means double the amount of people on Live spending on PSN. Double the amount of paid subscriptions. Double the amount of everything. How does Live makes more revenue?

Double amount doesn't equal to double revenue, Xbox users might more willing to spend on in app purchases, average spending per user might be higher on Xbox live.

 

[hanspampel]

But PS4 is 2:1 to One. That means double the amount of people on Live spending on PSN. Double the amount of paid subscriptions. Double the amount of everything. How does Live makes more revenue?

see that is the totally wrong assumption
just like the Appstore is making more money than Google Play with a way lower installbase

 

[MosquitoSmasher]

Always and will probably never change. Sad shit

Yeah it's like Xbox is just not allowed to enjoy some good news. You'd think people overall would consider it good news that Xbox isn't in any danger.

 

[blakep267]

But PS4 is 2:1 to One. That means double the amount of people on Live spending on PSN. Double the amount of paid subscriptions. Double the amount of everything. How does Live makes more revenue?

It's not just xb1 to PS4. You have to include 360, W10 and Xb1

Also larger size doesn't necessarily mean that the users are being monetized the same. We don't know how many PS4 users have a sub vs how many live subs there are

 

[Okami Haundo]

Why does it feel like this quote:

Satya Nadella started by saying that investors were looking at the Xbox business the wrong way “Most of you view gaming as ‘Microsoft has ...an Xbox business,’ I think you understand the console economics. But it’s a much broader thing for us.” Nadella said that Xbox live is the biggest gaming social network, and monetizes far more than any other gaming social network.

... is specifically aimed at Gaf and not just people at BUILD?

 

[Synth]

Double amount doesn't equal to double revenue, Xbox users might more willing to spend on in app purchases, average spending per user might be higher on Xbox live.

Also, 2:1 on consoles doesn't mean 2:1 on paid subscriptions. A lot of people on here repeatedly cite singleplayer content as why they're more or less interested in either's offerings, and say it explains global appeal disparities... in which case you'd also assume that many more people likely use their PlayStations entirely offline, or at least never pay for an online sub (or microtransactions).

 

[Cranster]

It is bigger than PSN? (aka makes more money?)

How is that even possible?

They were first and gamers know Xbox Live is a quality service.

 

[Fiendcode]

But PS4 is 2:1 to One. That means double the amount of people on Live spending on PSN. Double the amount of paid subscriptions. Double the amount of everything. How does Live makes more revenue?

People still use last gen systems (360, PS3, Vita). Live also extends to PC.

 

[greenegt]

Glad the Xbox business is doing well. Now, let's see what they have in the pipeline. Come on E3!

 

[Herp Derpington]

But PS4 is 2:1 to One. That means double the amount of people on Live spending on PSN. Double the amount of paid subscriptions. Double the amount of everything. How does Live makes more revenue?

Having more subscribers doesn't mean more profitable. It could be a simple reality where Live subscribers spend more on IAP. Why is this so hard to believe? If anything it would to me make more sense since the PS4 has a lot more casuals that probably don't spend very much.

 

[blakep267]

Having more subscribers doesn't mean more profitable. It could be a simple reality where Live subscribers spend more on IAP. Why is this so hard to believe? If anything it would to me make more sense since the PS4 has a lot more casuals that probably don't spend very much.

This also. The more and more sales you get, the more likely you are to have larger sections of casual users who don't game as often and won't be buying a sub

 

[Kill3r7]

thats true on a game by game basis. When you are supporting a platform the portfolio needs to be broad, and give a broad audience a reason to buy it. People don't buy a platform to be monetized, they do because there is something on it they want. Now once the're in, sure find them the right software that serves as service. Microsoft needs to have a library that resonates emotionally with buyers before they can monetize the service of those games. It doesn't really make sense to me to have one GasS game after another when you have a customer base that is used to jumping from tent pole to tent pole.

Agreed. Never said you don't need SP IPs and a diversified portfolio. Ultimately you need compelling content whether it is SP or MP only. The biggest third party developer is almost exclusively reliant on MP and EA is not far behind.

 

[JackHerer]

What's funny is that so many people are looking at GAAS as some new bad thing as if it didn't start with Horse Armor (for consoles). Counter-Strike can be categorized as it. Warcraft. Any game that has DLC. Adding more to a game after it's been released to monetize off of it is a GAAS. It's not anything new but it seems the internet wants to go crazy over the term.

Xbox plan is not anything new as well. Their plan is easy, get people hooked into your ecosystem and profit off its usage. Use 1st party games to get people hooked into it no matter the device (PC/Console/Mobile). It's not about selling a console, it's about Xbox Live. Phil plainly says it. They don't need to be Sony or Nintendo, they just need to keep getting more people into their ecosystem and profit off of those users. Watching the briefing I was just like..."ok...this isn't anything new"

Next Wave of Big Hits is clearly their games for the fall and some teases of the future, some mixed reality stuff as well.

When people realize that it's not about just selling a console and it's more about getting people to use Xbox Live to ultimately hook you in, then it makes sense for what MS is trying to do. If you don't like it, fine. They won't get you as a customer...but they will get others and things will change underneath you as the younger crowd don't always care what has been done, they like what they see. I see more grumpy gamers on GAF than anything. But whatevs. Looking forward to E3.

Thank you. Subscription then DLC was the beginning of GaaS. F2p and MTs we're the next step. It's just a term that means extending monetization by supporting the game with regular updates and new content through a longer life-cycle. The extended monetization part can come in many forms and configurations: free DLC/maps with MTs (Halo 5, Overwatch) paid DLC and MTs (Uncharted, CoD, Destiny), or just straight f2p.. all GaaS tactics.

 

[leeh]

I don't really understand your problem. We do not know the financial situation of Xbox because we haven't gotten specific numbers in years.

Then I say here's a theory that I don't believe, but is fun to think about.

Are you saying that not knowing the financial standing in f Xbox (as most don't) means I can't make an off the wall guess on a possibility of what they might be doing with the brand? I dont really understand your problem.

They report gross margin and revenue in their quarterlies and overall revenue in their annual reports.

For example, the Xbox division generated 9 billion in revenue last year which was actually more revenue than what Windows generated.

You don't know cause you don't look and then proceed to make out they don't. So stop with the FUD yeah?

 

[watdaeff4]

First time I've heard of this in these games. UC4 has P2W multiplayer? Seriously?

You know it's true when the PS fanboys polluting this thread didn't even try to come up with some BS spin on it.

 

[Chris1]

Why does it feel like this quote:



... is specifically aimed at Gaf and not just people at BUILD?

Nadella probably doesn't even know what Neogaf is

 

[watdaeff4]

Why does it feel like this quote:

... is specifically aimed at Gaf and not just people at BUILD?

It's not aimed at GAF. The CEO of MS couldn't give a shit about this forum much less make a statement at a meeting like this "aimed" at it

 

[Jaguar Victory]

Advertising? MS has always been aggressive in selling ad space on both 360 and X1.

Why do people propogate this. What ad space on Xbox One?

 

[Drey1082]

Having more subscribers doesn't mean more profitable. It could be a simple reality where Live subscribers spend more on IAP. Why is this so hard to believe? If anything it would to me make more sense since the PS4 has a lot more casuals that probably don't spend very much.

I really think it's the ad sales. I see a lot more advertising on my Xbox and i bet that makes up a large percentage of their live income. It's be fascinating to see the live segment income broken down into it's various components.

 

[spannicus]

Nadella probably doesn't even know what Neogaf is

Thats a good thing. Pretty sure Phil would like to bomb it lol.

 

[JlNX]

What game does NIntendo currently have that's GAAS?

Nintendo is not the best example to push that argument considering that Nintendo have two of the biggest GAAS in Mario Kart 8 and Smash Bros, and you better believe Splatoon 2 and ARMS are the next big two. Infact the way it's going most of Nintendo's new IP's will follow the same GAAS design as Splatoon and ARMS.

 

[Trup1aya]

But PS4 is 2:1 to One. That means double the amount of people on Live spending on PSN. Double the amount of paid subscriptions. Double the amount of everything. How does Live makes more revenue?

It doesn't mean that at all...

Its quite possible that xbox users spend more.

 

[Mass Effect]

But PS4 is 2:1 to One. That means double the amount of people on Live spending on PSN. Double the amount of paid subscriptions. Double the amount of everything. How does Live makes more revenue?

Double the sales does not necessarily mean double the subscriptions.

Double amount doesn't equal to double revenue, Xbox users might more willing to spend on in app purchases, average spending per user might be higher on Xbox live.

I'm almost certain this is the case, which is also one of the factors in why XBL revenue is higher.

Advertising? MS has always been aggressive in selling ad space on both 360 and X1.

Yep, this is probably the biggest factor in revenue being higher. I wish I could find that article from a while back that looked into XBL advertising. The figures were pretty insane.

 

[spannicus]

Why do people propogate this. What ad space on Xbox One?

Guess people dont like them to advertise their games and what games are free with Gold. Ive never seen a pepsi ad or fios etc.

 

[LukasTaves]

Every company structures around what they find success in. MS' main successes within the console space have primarily come from their leadership in regards to online gaming, first with Xbox Live itself, and later with IPs like Halo and Gears where fans showed up for the multiplayer modes as much or more than the singleplayer content. If MAG was a huge success, Driveclub printed money and Home dethroned Second Life, then Sony would likely be focusing more on those aspects. If Kameo sold 10 million, MS would likely be more focused on family-oriented content (which somewhat happened for a while with the Kinect)... if Remedy's games sold 10 million, then they would more likely be focused more on the type of games Sony currently tends to be. But, you asked "where's Sony/Nintendo's GaaS", and people have told you. The reason they're more mobile focused, is because they've been more successful there, and in Nintendo's case Mario Run's relative lack of success will likely prevent them from treating that market in the way they do their consoles.

Great post, but in Ms case I don't even think it's about they only found success on MP games, but more that they realized, and showed everyone that there's so much more money to be made when you have an community engaged with your game.

I may be misremembering but Halo 3 was the first game to make a 1billion dollars in a single entry, or at least that used to be so rare. Now that every big game have followed the path Ms went with leaderboards, achievements, DLC, and so on every big multiplayer game makes a billion per entry.

I feel like I'm repeating myself, but I see that as the main reason behind Game Pass... Ms never found a way to make single player focused games into games that generate 1 billion in revenue per entry, but this have a shot, because with a stream of good games coming and subs coming up the games directly contribute to constant billion revenue.

(Sorry for bringing game pass to every point I try to make, but I truly see game pass as a game changer)

 

[semiconscious]

okay, look: i'm not really sure what this is saying, exactly, okay? but, i mean, who cares, right? ...

 

[Jaguar Victory]

Guess people dont like them to advertise their games and what games are free with Gold. Ive never seen a pepsi ad or fios etc.

Exactly. I feel like I'm missing something or people are just talking out of their backside without owning the console. 360 had ads. One only advertises games on sale on my box.

 

[Samurai G0SU]

But PS4 is 2:1 to One. That means double the amount of people on Live spending on PSN. Double the amount of paid subscriptions. Double the amount of everything. How does Live makes more revenue?

What a very small, narrow minded way to view how a company can earn money. Thanks for making this thread about "myDadcanBeatyouDadUp Warz" officially on ignore now. thank you so much.

 

[blakep267]

Exactly. I feel like I'm missing something or people are just talking out of their backside without owning the console. 360 had ads. One only advertises games on sale on my box.

Yeah. Very rarely will there be that kinda ad. Under the store you may see stuff advertising new tv shows or movies but the main page is just game ads

 

[spannicus]

Exactly. I feel like I'm missing something or people are just talking out of their backside without owning the console. 360 had ads. One only advertises games on sale on my box.

More people just talking a bunch of bs.

 

[leeh]

You know it's true when the PS fanboys polluting this thread didn't even try to come up with some BS spin on it.

I'm rather shocked that I've never seen any mention of this on here, or any thread.

What about them are P2W?

 

[Admodieus]

okay, look: i'm not really sure what this is saying, exactly, okay? but, i mean, who cares, right? ...

You start by buying a device, then you buy content (games) for that device. Then you start playing the games and getting engaged in the ecosystem (friends, achievements, clubs, cloud saves) and ecosystem lock-in begins. Then you are a steady customer for them

 

[Samurai G0SU]

More info from WIndows Central:

http://www.windowscentral.com/heres-some-interesting-stats-about-xbox-one-owners-microsoft-shared-partners?utm_content=buffer6a9cc&utm_medium=social&utm_source=facebook.com&utm_campaign=buffer

A lot more info at the link.

 

[watdaeff4]

Guess people dont like them to advertise their games and what games are free with Gold. Ive never seen a pepsi ad or fios etc.

i can't remember what exactly but I've had non-gaming ads on my dash.

That said it's so insignificant that I can't remember what product(s) they have been lol

 

[MosquitoSmasher]

Hahaha, good question. What they haven't told you is that the next wave of hits are Halo 6, Forza 7 and Gears of War 5.

Joke post, right?

Yes Halo 6 will be undoubtedly be announced, but i think we will see a new Ori as well or something different. Studio Gobo has partnered with MS on a new game, Rare is working on more than Sea of Thieves and who knows what else is in the pipeline.

 

[Beerman462]

I'm rather shocked that I've never seen any mention of this on here, or any thread.

What about them are P2W?

I don't know about UC4, but I quit playing TLOU MP when they started selling loadout slots and weapons packs.

 

[Kill3r7]

Why do people propogate this. What ad space on Xbox One?

I am in the office right now but if you look at the right of your home screen you will see ads, at the very least on the 360. On the X1 they use to be under the recommended section. There is no question that they are collecting data which is useful to advertisers. There is nothing wrong with it.

 

[Bsigg12]

Well this thread seems to have gone as expected.