Parakeetman
No one wants a throne you've been sitting on!
I do believe all the positions in battle mattered due to the ranges of the weapons the characters had.
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
My lengthy defense of the most hated Persona game
- Thread starter randomkid
- Start date
I do believe all the positions in battle mattered due to the ranges of the weapons the characters had.
XiaNaphryz
LATIN, MATRIPEDICABUS, DO YOU SPEAK IT
It should be obvious that the chars in P1/P2 are vastly superior to P3 and P4.
kunonabi
Member
P2: EP is one of the finest rpgs ever made. P2: Innocent Sin on the other hand is easily the worst game in the series if you ask me. Maybe the PSX original was better but I found the psp version to be meh.
Parakeetman
No one wants a throne you've been sitting on!
Wouldnt say superior just different. Since its a reflection of the "era" when it was made too so to speak.
What did you mean then? Ah, I think you mean it should be looked upon just as well as P 2-4? Or that it should be considered a classic just as FF VI is?
Parakeetman
No one wants a throne you've been sitting on!
Argh ok I blame all of you here for this. Gonna go out to the convenience store now and get a 10,000 PSN card to get P1 P2 IS / EP D: lol
Yup. Honestly the formation system not being modified for the remake is a symptom of my only complaint with it.
The biggest problems with the original Persona are the dated user interface, which was completely fixed in the remake, and the 90s design choice. While they did a number of minor changes to the design (such as replacing the 3D World map with the one used in P2/P3), they weren't willing to go the full distance and you still get an odd formation system. At least the menu for formations isn't ass now.
Some people are sadly unaware of the other meanings of the word "canon."
Character wise
P2 > P3 > P4 > P1
but to each own.
although, I might have to rank P1 above P4 because of a certain shoe horned character in P4G.
Dark Schala
Eloquent Princess
I'd also argue that the Saturn/PS1/PS2/DC was probably Atlus's strongest in terms of originality and output.
Saturn stuff was the bomb. I haven't played the PSP version of Devil Summoner yet, so I'm wondering if it's better than the Saturn version. It was very cool to see the amount of detail the dungeons had. If the PSP version plays out much faster than the OG Saturn version (because battles were sloooooooooowwww) and is more balanced, then that'd be a neat pickup.
Saturn stuff was the bomb. I haven't played the PSP version of Devil Summoner yet, so I'm wondering if it's better than the Saturn version. It was very cool to see the amount of detail the dungeons had. If the PSP version plays out much faster than the OG Saturn version (because battles were sloooooooooowwww) and is more balanced, then that'd be a neat pickup.
I haven't read that Jung book in years. I know I had to read it for a class once, so the relationship between Jungian philosophy and Persona didn't really click at the time (and this was prior to Persona games coming out more often so that might contribute). But going back and thinking about it, you're right: Persona 4 exhibited this the most.
Much as they're all playable and fun, keep in mind P2 IS had the encounter rate turned up to 11, and P1 had it turned up to 10. Both were made easier, but IS got made easier to the point where setting it to hard doesn't even make the random encounters a challenge. The bosses still hold a bit of difficulty, but those aren't exactly constant.
It's worse than the Saturn version, because it doesn't run as well. It's an emulated version running in a little window on the PSP screen, with extra bugs/slowdown. There are no changes to balance or basically any game content.
If that's the case, well... then they needed to implement that better. Unless the characters moved themselves automatically or through the story, I never used that system and got by fine by leveling and persona fusing.
Parakeetman
No one wants a throne you've been sitting on!
I still remember that action game they released called Maken X on the dreamcast. Was so awesome getting that at launch in Japan. They even had a manga based off of it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZGcyIkR5EPM
The PS2 era the digital devil games were great and a lot of GAF members favorite Nocturne.
Its going to be amusing to play again thats for sure. Lately thanks to the PSV TV been on a huge "retro" kick playing PS1 stuff. Will be great to remember all the terrible things again lol Anyways out the door I go~
I don't see how that is possible, but to each their own.
It's honestly not even a big issue past the beginning. Check the range of each of your users, take into account what Persona abilities they have, and place them accordingly stacked as close as possible.
Dark Schala
Eloquent Princess
Gross. How could they make that version even worse?
I'd hope they give a Soul Hackers treatment someday. I thought the game was interesting despite some of my gripes with the loyalty system. Soul Hackers was ultimately the better game out of the two, but I'd like Devil Summoner to get another shot.
BLACK AMERICAN PSYCHO
Junior Member
Well I haven't played 3, but 4 was fun, they weren't particular hard, but then again I didn't really found the battles in P1 and P2 that hard either, except for the Joker, fuck his possession ability.
Hated Ginko and Michel. Beyond that I like P2's cast. Even the worst ones on the P1 cast were better thank Ginko and Michel..... So obnoxious.
Parakeetman
No one wants a throne you've been sitting on!
One last thing is this thread and all the talk of the series made me remember I had not played Devil Summoner the game which came out before Soul Hackers. D:
I wonder if PSN has it as it was released on the PSP too I think... Wait no it doesnt
I wonder if PSN has it as it was released on the PSP too I think... Wait no it doesnt
kunonabi
Member
The problem was Mark was there was really one formation worth using. Mark had to stay in the same spot the entire time since moving him anywhere else completely screwed up the rest of the party.
cj_iwakura
Member
I've been replaying Revelations, and I can agree with everything but the localization. It just steals the game's personality and slaps a terrible US stereotype over it. It was not a bad idea, but horribly executed. They took Takehisa Kandori, a charismatic villain over
, and made him into Guido Sardenia, an immature mobster.
The music was truly stellar, though, and is massively underrated. So far, apart from Ayase's Theme, my favorite track(which also got remixed in the PSP version) is Black Snow.
the course of the first three games
The music was truly stellar, though, and is massively underrated. So far, apart from Ayase's Theme, my favorite track(which also got remixed in the PSP version) is Black Snow.
Hey, let's not be talking crazy now. Persona characters generally tend to be on a tier of their own compared to other video games, but the gap between P3 and P1 isn't anywhere near that massive....I just thought some of SEES was incredibly one-dimensional. Outside of Yukari, Junpei, Ken, and Aigis the rest just felt like they were tropes with a bit of flare on top.
Persona 1 was a decent game, with great characters and a decent story. Mechanically, I think it's actually a lot better than Persona 2, but it's still mediocre. I just wish demon negotiation wasn't so crappy, and that the characters were more mechanically varied from each other. (They all just kind of blend together, barring their designated arcana). My feelings towards the new OST are mixed; some of the new tracks, the quantity is completely unacceptable. P1P reuses the same songs over and over again.
I still need to play through the Snow Queen questline.
I still need to play through the Snow Queen questline.
cj_iwakura
Member
Also, despite how much 'hate' P1 gets, interestingly enough, it's the best selling game in the series according to some numbers that got posted. The PSP remake sold more than all the rest, and the PS1 release was huge.
Even though I like some of the pieces on P1 PSP's soundtrack (especially the rendition of Reiji's theme), it definitely didn't need to be updated to be more like Persona 3/4. It really snatches away a lot of the game's original personality.
buddha0991
Member
This man, the original P1's atmosphere was very repressive.
Well, it was the best selling game. Persona 4 is now the best selling for a single entry thanks to Persona 4 Golden.
I'm kind of indifferent regarding the soundtrack. The highs of the original soundtrack are very high, but on the other hand it's got some real low points. I also feel that the PSP soundtrack is also more consistent with the games that come after it. On the other hand, the PSP doesn't quite have exceptional standout tracks like Awakening Legend or Deadline, and its remake of some tracks (Specifically Mad Hospital, Thanatos Tower and Night Queen) are not as impressive sounding as the originals. Oh, and the atmosphere is different, as you mentioned.
But nothing else about the game is consistent with the games after it, so why should the music have been updated to become so? It creates a very weird dissonance.
DidntKnowJack
Member
Love the box you have pictured in the OP, btw. What is that a special edition of the PS1 version or something? Or Japanese version of PS1?
On the contrary, I feel most of the remake was updated to be very consistent with the games that came after it. Especially with the new animation scenes and the modern user interface. I don't feel any dissonance at all outside of perhaps disappointment for some of the missing tracks.
The interface was updated, but the new interface is nothing like the interfaces in P3/4, so I don't agree with that. Soul Hackers got an interface update, too, but it didn't get a major soundtrack overhaul (thankfully).
cj_iwakura
Member
Didn't most of the character themes get condensed into a couple of generic ones? And the Hospital comes to mind in particular. The original track contains screams in the background, which gives it a wildly different atmosphere than the remake version.
I think it still holds up. Well, "holds up" might be the wrong phrase, but I find it very much playable. Blasting a game because of its age is kind of silly imo.
As Dark Schala mentioned, it really is a nice bridge between mainline SMT and Persona. I think it's special because of that.
It also has the best shop music evar.
As Dark Schala mentioned, it really is a nice bridge between mainline SMT and Persona. I think it's special because of that.
It also has the best shop music evar.
voodoopanda
Member
I remember renting this game, at the time I hadn't really played that many games and had no idea what a Shin Megami Tensei was. The only JRPG I'd played at that time was probably just Final Fantasy 7.
I remember really liking it because it felt like a dark, atmospheric mystery that I didn't quite understand. I never really "got it" but just sorta wandered around the weird locations and experimented with the weird combat/talking system before having to return it to Blockbuster. It had a very intriguing vibe but I just didn't have enough time.
Many years later I got into Shin Megami Tensei and it's become one of my favorite things but I've never gone back to try to play Persona 1.
I remember really liking it because it felt like a dark, atmospheric mystery that I didn't quite understand. I never really "got it" but just sorta wandered around the weird locations and experimented with the weird combat/talking system before having to return it to Blockbuster. It had a very intriguing vibe but I just didn't have enough time.
Many years later I got into Shin Megami Tensei and it's become one of my favorite things but I've never gone back to try to play Persona 1.
Guess we'll have to agree to disagree there then, especially regarding the new interface.
Yeah. The original soundtrack had some really good highpoints. The remixed versions of Mad Hospital and Night Queen are inferior to the originals. Especially Night Queen with it's lack of intro.
We discussed this in the community thread too, but a similar issue exists with the P2 remixed soundtracks. Compare the original version of Monad Mandala, with the version used in the PSP remake. Doesn't quite have that impressive feel.
Yeah the PSP soundtrack doesn't really work for the game. I did think that this new track for the Karma Palace was very nice though, it doesn't match the original classic at all but it's got a nice moodiness to it that gets at a different part of what the original soundtrack was going for.
Parakeetman
No one wants a throne you've been sitting on!
I remember my friend and I used to sing that shit lol Was sad when I heard the "remix" of it which replaced the original. D:
Downloads in progress. The convenience store had the latest attack on titan manga too so double score
buddha0991
Member
Man those arranges are good though!
BTW, currently building a team to take on Beelzebub.
That's a box of the retail PC version! It came out in Japan in 1999 and I like it better than either of the PSX covers.
buddha0991
Member
I want to play this version! Here is a list of changes, dunno if there is more.
The player can distribute the stats for all party members, not just the main character.
Characters do not automatically select a new target if their original target is killed before they act.
Experience after battle is distributed equally among party members.
The player can turn off battle animations.
There is no voice acting.
Stumpokapow
listen to the mad man
As someone who has very limited familiarity with the series I just wanted to pop in and congratulate randomkid on a really boffo thread with what seems to me to be pretty good back and forth with respondants.
Parakeetman
No one wants a throne you've been sitting on!
Thats badass, I had no idea they released a PC version. Just found it on the JP amazon, only used copies available for around 20 USDish.
Interesting that ascii was the publisher.
Indeed, fantastic post and good to see interesting comments in this thread.
Parakeetman
No one wants a throne you've been sitting on!
http://www.amazon.co.jp/gp/product/B005F9CR5W/
All used tho...
---
Separate note Devil Summoner is on the JP PSN PSP version. Just checked now.
All of them have the box as far as I can tell. However, they are apparently missing some extras (trading cards?) that came with it.