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Northeast Championship (NEC) XII | Fighting game tournament | December 3-4
- Thread starter USD
- Start date
No, it's not, because it is something that is truly COMPLETELY random. You literally have zero control over it as Wesker. And it does hit hard, especially in X-Factor... or you can X-Factor/DHC off of the few random hits and kill a character.
You have to look at the bigger picture a few random hits actually makes.
Anyway, I agree it's still early, but it's been a silly mechanic in the game from the start. Chris G was pushblocking during it to extend blockstun and avoid cross-ups. Sure, let's wait a few tournaments in first, but I think that a reserved adjustment to the glasses makes a lot of sense... but Capcom will probably nerf the shit out of him instead.
Xfactor beams do even more than that with chip damage, and they aren't as easily punishable.
Not to mention there are actually characters who are capable of punishing from full screen for more damage (Hawkeye, Dr. Strange) and it's virtually impossible to avoid.
I've never seen a match where a Phantom Dance cross up led to anything consequential. Ever. That's why it is a non-issue to me. Probably should be patched out, but where priorities lie, there's about a million things I'd rather have patched in/out than that. No one ever bitched about it in Vanilla cause it amounted to nothing, despite said randomness.
ThatCrazyGuy
Member
Your talking meta, yet you don't realize the BS meta of the random cross up? You are doing a raw hyper that is hard to punish, and getting basically a XF1 bonus for just doing it. The extra damage is icing on the cake. I want the glasses buff.
Dude, just on principle , you should want a super move that RANDOMLY CROSSES UP be not in the game. wth.
You want random in fighting games? I don't.
it combos into dhc's
They should patch it out, and get rid of the glasses bullshit. But knowing Capcom, they'll just nerf his health to 800k or some shit.
Didn't know it was 1 frame, but that went in the mix up category of stuff I mentioned.
KingofSarus
Banned
C'mon Arturo! For SK!!
SolarPowered
Member
I'm not following this. It sounds like you are contradicting yourself here.
*scratches head*
DHC into two more hypers? Sounds pretty easy to do on paper.
Nah, that is his thing, bro.
WTF are you talking about? x-factor beams don't cross-up randomly - if you see it, you know that once blocked, you just push block it.
The current phantom dance, however, it randomly crosses up when you least expect it - even after blocking it. It's fucking random and dumb.
lowhighkang_LHK
Member
Not to mention a -1 on block launcher. Whereas everyone else is seemingly -10 frames and beyond on launcher.
...the fuck is that shit.
Ravaged implies a severe nerf as in dropping down to Hsien-Ko/KFC tier which none of the top characters from Vanilla recieved. Wolverine is still a great character, not only shown by Rog, but Noel and Justin before him. I was trying to point out that, while they (top tier from vanilla) did have some move priority and damage changes, those characters that were tops in Vanilla are still damn good now. Did they receive more changes than Wesker? Yes, but they are far from ravaged. Again, I think we generally agree, but the word ravaged threw me off.
Do I think Wesker will need some changes? Absolutely. Do I think he needs to be adjusted right now? No way, I think the game needs way more time before we see a v2012 style patch.
Speaking of which, I'm kind of feeling some SF action right now. I can actually play SF competently (at a basic level anyway) and it works well with my old man reactions. Add me to those excited for v2012.
sixteen-bit
Member
Hold dat cr.MP
darkressurection
Banned
Man, I wish I had the sort of patience that Die and Art are showing.
LOL even if a random Phantom Dance cross up does only 50K damage it's still fucking dumb (for the record it does closer to 150K-300K depending on how early it crosses up and way more if in X factor). Matches can and have been decided on this property on the move. It's not just that it crosses up... it buffs up Wesker when he uses it and if you connect you can even go into DHC -> X factor for the kill. Like let's say I am Wesker vs Dante against their last character... I random Phantom Dance get a hit on a BLOCKED cross up... DHC into Million Dollar and then X factor for the character kill. So many people at the tournament just did this move randomly highlighted the dumb factor that is attached to the property of this move.
People defending this shit is hilarious. Seriously please continue.
The meta game of UMVC3 as of this post is you either have Wesker on your team on anchor or you don't and you have characters in every slot who have decent/good match ups against Wesker. Because if you don't you are done at tournaments. If the meta game of a FG is based around ONE CHARACTER... that is grounds for a balance change.
Why do people keep bringing up Sentinel to Wesker like it's the same thing? MVC3 was a completely new game, new engine and nothing was figured out about any character. We know a lot more now than we did. That's why EVERYONE here said that Wesker was going to be hella popular at NEC... and guess what he was HELLA popular at NEC!
People defending this shit is hilarious. Seriously please continue.
So when should we get the glasses change? After EVO when we go through 8 Wesker teams in top 8 and a Wesker team winning EVO... again?
The meta game of UMVC3 as of this post is you either have Wesker on your team on anchor or you don't and you have characters in every slot who have decent/good match ups against Wesker. Because if you don't you are done at tournaments. If the meta game of a FG is based around ONE CHARACTER... that is grounds for a balance change.
Why do people keep bringing up Sentinel to Wesker like it's the same thing? MVC3 was a completely new game, new engine and nothing was figured out about any character. We know a lot more now than we did. That's why EVERYONE here said that Wesker was going to be hella popular at NEC... and guess what he was HELLA popular at NEC!
People bitched about it plenty but back then you didn't have mashable hypers doing more damage, air X Factor and Phantom Dance buffing the hyper before it even begins.
darkressurection
Banned
Yo good shit Arturo!
sixteen-bit
Member
Good shit art.
Lost Fragment
Obsessed with 4chan
DAT ARTURO
Parallax Scroll
Banned
There are a lot of west coast killers who don't use Wesker and weren't at NEC. Let's see what happens at SCR.
sixteen-bit
Member
MGS2/4 Vamp on deck
How am I contradicting myself? If a patch was released later into the metagame when Phoenix and Wolverine stuff emerged, they would have a better picture of the overall balance environment rather than going off of early conjectures and annoyances. The same way people came up with anti-Sent strats, and even anti-Phoenix strats later on makes it clear that you have to let a game develop before you suddenly inject it with a bulk amount of margin of error in the form of a balancing patch
KingofSarus
Banned
HOLY SHIT!!! THAT IS THE MANLIEST WOMAN I'VE EEEVVVEEERRR SEEN!!
sixteen-bit
Member
But KOF will bring the Pure, Honest Fighting
Rickenslacker
Banned
I didn't know John Romero played fighting games.
That's happy medicine right? Remembered him from when he cosplayed as Vega - seems like a weeabo.
Who's defending it? Read my posts, it's quite obviously bullshit, both Wesker mechanics. Anytime something is rebalanced or changes are made on a cast-wide degree, you shouldn't be fishing for nerfs PERIOD so early. It doesn't mean jack shit if it's a new game or not. Let said new balancing, new environment develop. The Sentinel comparison is 1:1. If you say that it needs to be removed now, your being 100% ignorant of potential counter-strats, especially if you DO believe that the metagame revolves around Wesker at this point, which you do in fact agree with. I don't know why this is so difficult to understand.
sixteen-bit
Member
Double Psycho Punisher is hilarious.
Enzo, you're one of my boys in Mahvel GAF, but advocating against a Wesker "re-evaluation" and citing that random cross-up isn't an issue is kinda "C'mon, son." And this is with casual level observations.
Edit: Actually I misunderstood you (somewhat) there, my bad.
@h3ro: Didn't really mean ravaged in the sense of "hide yo' tools, hide yo healf cuz Capcom's nerfin' errybody out here!" Just saying that they really did some heavy re-tweaking of what was considered the highest cusp of the vanilla metagame with tweaks that were both made blatant for the characters and subtle with system changes. Yet, even with all of this taken into consideration, with the combination of the sunglasses mechanic & his entire game plan being "hit really hard on first opening" not only does he run trains through teams, all the characters that hard countered him (while still good to ok at it) have to be even more careful to start their shenanigans than Wesker has to be to body them in one Ground - Air Magic series to THC.
In other news, Bipson match was LOL.
Edit: Actually I misunderstood you (somewhat) there, my bad.
@h3ro: Didn't really mean ravaged in the sense of "hide yo' tools, hide yo healf cuz Capcom's nerfin' errybody out here!" Just saying that they really did some heavy re-tweaking of what was considered the highest cusp of the vanilla metagame with tweaks that were both made blatant for the characters and subtle with system changes. Yet, even with all of this taken into consideration, with the combination of the sunglasses mechanic & his entire game plan being "hit really hard on first opening" not only does he run trains through teams, all the characters that hard countered him (while still good to ok at it) have to be even more careful to start their shenanigans than Wesker has to be to body them in one Ground - Air Magic series to THC.
In other news, Bipson match was LOL.