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[gwiz210]

So when are we going to get some n64 games that arn't mario and haven't been ported a million times?

 

[mosaic]

The expansion pak was just a RAM expansion, it didn't give the N64 any additional horsepower... Wii has plenty of RAM, so I imagine the games will be whatever size they're supposed to be and work as if you were playing them on an N64 with the memory pak installed. All the emulator is going to do is gobble up another 4MB of system memory when it runs.

 

[jarrod]

The expansion pak was just a RAM expansion, it didn't give the N64 any additional horsepower... Wii has plenty of RAM, so I imagine the games will be whatever size they're supposed to be and work as if you were playing them on an N64 with the memory pak installed. All the emulator is going to do is gobble up another 4MB of system memory when it runs.

True, but MM on GameCube did have some hiccups... I'm sure they'll get everything ironed out for the VC release though.


Now, where's my Dragon's Curse and Beyond Oasis? I need those games stat!

 

[Krowley]

just wanted to mention that mario 64 is 100x sweeter using the cube controller. the 64 stick just feels nasty nowadays and i can't endure it anymore. the cube controller brings this game back to life for me.

beautiful expierience.

 

[RaidenZR]

He also said the DVD-Wii is coming out in September which could have more space, but I would have to redownload all my games (all 5 of them haha), but wow that sucks.

This is the least of the Wii's issues. And yes, there are plenty of items that bother the hell out of me, but you're pretty constantly negative in here. What's up man? Are you not getting a single drip of satisfaction from the machine?

 

[Pud]

This is the least of the Wii's issues. And yes, there are plenty of items that bother the hell out of me, but you're pretty constantly negative in here. What's up man? Are you not getting a single drip of satisfaction from the machine?

Being a fan of another company and a general detractor of anything Nintendo will do that to ya. Swallowing your pride and purchasing something you perceive as inferior is hard sometimes (just ask Amir0x, whos tag is 'buys consoles to justify his trolling').

 

[bridegur]

How many N64 games do people expect to be released over the VC's lifespan? With the absence of Rare's games, I can think of about 10. With Banjo-Kazooie not appearing on the VC, is there a chance of a rerelease on XBLA?

 

[mosaic]

Oy, the Wikipedia VC list says Super Mario RPG is hitting Monday, and lists Streets of Rage as coming soon. I love Streets of Rage, but I must say, I'd rather have a chance to play through Super Mario RPG again. I never bothered to finish it back in the day.

 

[beelzebozo]

Oy, the Wikipedia VC list says Super Mario RPG is hitting Monday, and lists Streets of Rage as coming soon. I love Streets of Rage, but I must say, I'd rather have a chance to play through Super Mario RPG again. I never bothered to finish it back in the day.

 

[ninjaurbano]

i'm thirsting for some 8-bit fix, so i said what the heck and downloaded Kid Icarus. so playing the game for the first time in my life, and man, it's kicking my ass.

Dont give up. I almost did.

After the first 3 areas of the first level, the game becomes much easier and better.

I'm also playing for the first time. It's so much fun.

 

[EphemeralDream]

Oy, the Wikipedia VC list says Super Mario RPG is hitting Monday, and lists Streets of Rage as coming soon. I love Streets of Rage, but I must say, I'd rather have a chance to play through Super Mario RPG again. I never bothered to finish it back in the day.

What page does it say this on?

 

[Bloodwake]

If Mario RPG hits this Monday, I will cry happy, happy tears of joy.

Same with DKC, even though I'm looking forward to Donkey Kong Country just a little bit more. Mario World, Kid Icarus, Super Castlevania IV, and Mario Brothers have really got me hooked on platformers at the moment.

 

[Stumpokapow]

Oy, the Wikipedia VC list says Super Mario RPG is hitting Monday, and lists Streets of Rage as coming soon. I love Streets of Rage, but I must say, I'd rather have a chance to play through Super Mario RPG again. I never bothered to finish it back in the day.

Super Mario RPG is not hitting on monday.

As you can see looking back through this thread, it is possible to use a minor hack to find upcoming games on the virtual console. While many games, Streets of Rage included, are up there, Super Mario RPG is not.

 

[Dr. Jade]

Yes well if Wiki is to be believed then Zelda OOT is coming out next week and Star Fox 64 is coming March 26th .... hmmmm ....

 

[jko]

Dont give up. I almost did.

After the first 3 areas of the first level, the game becomes much easier and better.

I'm also playing for the first time. It's so much fun.

yeah, i kinda like the difficulty of the game...believe it or not, it's a breath of fresh air after waves and waves of easy games they put out nowadays. "Zelda TP WILL be hard"....gimme a break.

 

[Krowley]

I'm thinking about buying kid icarus... I never played through it in the old days. High difficulty is sort of tempting me.

edit// BTW... It would be cool if nintendo added some equivelant to achievments to these old games. Just beating some of the harder 8bit games is a pretty amazing achievment.. Games like the first ninja gaiden are pretty taxing.

 

[jko]

I'm thinking about buying kid icarus... I never played through it in the old days. High difficulty is sort of tempting me.

it's fun...i like it. its HARD though, be forewarned. but people seem to be saying it gets easier...

 

[Dragona Akehi]

True, but MM on GameCube did have some hiccups... I'm sure they'll get everything ironed out for the VC release though.

That's because the emulator used for MM was written specifically for OoT; they never really bothered making MM work "properly" with the engine. The emulator being used now is entirely new, supposedly.

Now, where's my Dragon's Curse and Beyond Oasis? I need those games stat!

Damn straight!

 

[ninjaurbano]

Kid Icarus is hard, but fair. No need to play the game all over again once you hit the checkpoints. This is something rare on old games.

Nowadays, I can only get fun with hard games, like this one. So, I prefer Kid Icarus than any other good (and easy) next-gen game. And we are talking about a game released 20 years ago.

 

[jarrod]

How many N64 games do people expect to be released over the VC's lifespan? With the absence of Rare's games, I can think of about 10. With Banjo-Kazooie not appearing on the VC, is there a chance of a rerelease on XBLA?

I'd expect by the end of Wii's lifetime, there'll probably be a good 40-60 N64 games available depending on the region.

Damn straight!

The VC has the potential to be ARPG paradise... nobody besides Nintendo, Squeenix or Falcom seem really interested in making new ones (and even then, Zeldae are the only ones worth playing as I'm not touching any JP PC imports) so I might as well just relive my childhood.

ARPGs > *

 

[Pachinko]

I second that N64 motion, I mean how many games could they possibly want to put up there. That 40-60 number seems way off. You got mario, zelda, mario kart, zelda MM, starfox 64, paper mario, F-zero64, Excitebike 64, 1080 snowboarding, waverace, pilotwings, super smash brothers and possibly diddy kong racing. That's 12 , maybe 13 games tops. Sure that's nintendo published games only but with so few 3rd parties totally signed on so far that doesn't leave to many more releases- I suppose Konami could throw Castlevania 64 up there in either of it's incarnations and there are a couple of bomberman 64 titles so that could potentially push that total up to 17. Certainly this number would go up if midway got in on it and there are a few offshoot franchises from nintendo that could wind up there but I'm not sure why they'd bother- mario party 1-3 and mario golf being the titles in question. Even if nintendo did put up those other oddball titles and midway started putting out VC games that'd still only push the total to perhaps 30 games.

 

[cvxfreak]

Capcom had better put RE2 on the VC. They published like 3 N64 games ever, so there's little excuse not to publish RE2 and MM64 some day.

 

[Oblivion]

That's because the emulator used for MM was written specifically for OoT; they never really bothered making MM work "properly" with the engine. The emulator being used now is entirely new, supposedly.

How does that work, though? MM was running off the same engine. I always thought it was cause of the expansion pack or something.

 

[Dragona Akehi]

Capcom had better put RE2 on the VC. They published like 3 N64 games ever, so there's little excuse not to publish RE2 and MM64 some day.

Superior version of RE2 for the bloody win!

 

[Dragona Akehi]

How does that work, though? MM was running off the same engine. I always thought it was cause of the expansion pack or something.

Emulation was written for OoT, and didn't involve the use of the RAM pack. MM is coded differently from OoT, though sharing the same engine. The beauty of building upon an existing engine...

 

[Oblivion]

Emulation was written for OoT, and didn't involve the use of the RAM pack. MM is coded differently from OoT, though sharing the same engine. The beauty of building upon an existing engine...

Gotcha.

 

[ninjaurbano]

Wii hardware is very limited to emulate N64 100%. So, I expect that a lot of games wont be released for technical reasons (including RE2).

 

[AntMurda]

Wii hardware is very limited to emulate N64 100%. So, I expect that a lot of games wont be released for technical reasons (including RE2)

Are you serious? Resident Evil 2 should be one of the easier games to emulate. Wii should have no problem emulating any game. Even the 64DD games.

 

[Pud]

Wii hardware is very limited to emulate N64 100%. So, I expect that a lot of games wont be released for technical reasons (including RE2).

:lol :lol
I hope by 'technical' you mean 'it doesn't have controller pack/rumble pack' because any other argument would be rather ludicrous. Especially conerning the already-released N64 games that run better and look nicer than they ever did on that black 90mhz box.

 

[bumpkin]

If Mario RPG hits this Monday, I will cry happy, happy tears of joy.

Same with DKC, even though I'm looking forward to Donkey Kong Country just a little bit more. Mario World, Kid Icarus, Super Castlevania IV, and Mario Brothers have really got me hooked on platformers at the moment.

I'm with you on wanting both games tomorrow, but if the ESRB ratings page still yields any insight into what's coming down the pike, DKC and Mario RPG are not listed for Wii yet. So either Nintendo got wise to it and asked ESRB to stagger revealing newly rated titles on the VC, or they aren't coming tomorrow.

I hope I'm wrong though, 'cuz I want both!

 

[Justin85]

I had some time on my hands avoiding other work, and I came up with a list of likely N64 titles based on licensing issues and companies that have announced support for the Virtual Console (thus the absence of companies like UbiSoft):

1080 Snowboarding
AeroFighters Assault
Midway’s Greatest Arcade Hits 1
Beetle Adventure Racing
Bio FREAKS
Body Harvest
Bomberman 64
Bomberman 64: The Second Attack
Bomberman Hero
Castlevania 64
Chameleon Twist
Chameleon Twist 2
Chopper Attack
Command & Conquer 64
Cruis’n USA
Cruis’n Exotica
Cruis’n World
Custom Robo
Custom Robo v2
Deadly Arts
Diddy Kong Racing
Donkey Kong 64
Doom 64
Dr. Mario 64
Dual Heroes
Excitebike 64
F-Zero X
Gauntlet Legends
Gex 64
Harvest Moon 64
Hey You, Pikachu!
Hybrid Heaven
Hydro Thunder
Kirby 64
Legend of Zelda: Majora’s Mask
Legend of Zelda: Ocarina of Time
Mace: The Dark Age
Mario Golf
Mario Kart 64
Mario Party
Mario Party 2
Mario Party 3
Mario Tennis
Mega Man 64
Mischief Makers
Mortal Kombat 4
Mortal Kombat Mythologies: Sub-Zero
Mortal Kombat Trilogy
Ms. Pac-Man Maze Madness
Mystical Ninja
Mystical Ninja 2
Off Road Challenge
Ogre Battle 64
Paper Mario
Paperboy 64
Pilotwings 64
Pokemon Puzzle League
Pokemon Snap
Pokemon Stadium
Pokemon Stadium 2
Quake 64
Rampage 2: Universal Tour
Rampage World Tour
Resident Evil 2
Ridge Racer 64
San Francisco Rush
San Francisco Rush 2049
Sin and Punishment
Snowboard Kids
Snowboard Kids 2
Space Station Silicon Valley
Star Fox 64
Star Soldier: Vanishing Earth
Stunt Racer 64
Super Mario 64
Twisted Edge Snowboarding
War Gods
Wave Race 64
WinBack
Yoshi’s Story

That's 80 games (granted a lot of them suck), but Nintendo will have plenty if they keep to this one release a month routine.

 

[Pud]

(thus the absence of companies like UbiSoft)

Nah, Ubi will support with their N64 titles as well. They will just repackage those N64 games and sell them at full price.

 

[VOOK]

Nah, Ubi will support with their N64 titles as well. They will just repackage those N64 games and sell them at full price.

Like this one?

 

[jarrod]

I second that N64 motion, I mean how many games could they possibly want to put up there. That 40-60 number seems way off. You got mario, zelda, mario kart, zelda MM, starfox 64, paper mario, F-zero64, Excitebike 64, 1080 snowboarding, waverace, pilotwings, super smash brothers and possibly diddy kong racing. That's 12 , maybe 13 games tops. Sure that's nintendo published games only but with so few 3rd parties totally signed on so far that doesn't leave to many more releases- I suppose Konami could throw Castlevania 64 up there in either of it's incarnations and there are a couple of bomberman 64 titles so that could potentially push that total up to 17. Certainly this number would go up if midway got in on it and there are a few offshoot franchises from nintendo that could wind up there but I'm not sure why they'd bother- mario party 1-3 and mario golf being the titles in question. Even if nintendo did put up those other oddball titles and midway started putting out VC games that'd still only push the total to perhaps 30 games.

Well, just looking at the licensees that've confirmed support (counting only their own IPs at that... which cuts out a ton of sports games)...

Nintendo: 39 games
Midway: 25 games
Hudson: 12 games
Konami: 11 games
Kemco: 8 games
Bandai Namco: 6 games
Taito: 5 games
Takara Tomy: 4 games
Banpresto: 3 games
Square Enix: 3 games
Atlus: 2 games
Capcom: 2 games
KOEI: 2 games
Sunsoft: 2 games
Chunsoft: 1 game
SEGA: 1 game

TOTAL: 126 games!

...now I doubt we'll see everything from all those companies, but then you also need to factor in that only one of the confirmed VC supporters is a western oriented company, and the vast majority of N64's 3rd party support came from the west. 40-60 N64 games over Wii's lifetime is actually sounding sort of low now looking at that.

 

[Cosmonaut X]

1080 Snowboarding
Bomberman 64
Castlevania 64
Donkey Kong 64
Dr. Mario 64
Excitebike 64
F-Zero X
Kirby 64
Legend of Zelda: Majora’s Mask
Legend of Zelda: Ocarina of Time
Mario Golf
Mario Party
Mario Tennis
Mega Man 64
Paper Mario
Pilotwings 64
Sin and Punishment
Star Fox 64
Wave Race 64
Yoshi’s Story

Of the games you list, these are the ones I'm thinking are more likely to hit the VC, and even some of these (Dr Mario, Mega Man) are looking a bit shaky. I'm not sure how significant it is, but it's interesting that there are no third-party N64 games out or in the pipeline, so perhaps it's possible the N64 catalogue may end up being heavily Nintendo-dominated, if not comprised solely of Nintendo games. I hope not, and I hope we get some more announcements about third-party VC support soon - esp. from the companies who came out in support of it last year.

 

[ninjaurbano]

Are you serious? Resident Evil 2 should be one of the easier games to emulate. Wii should have no problem emulating any game. Even the 64DD games.

RE2 is unplayable on N64 emulators for PC. It's a very complex game to emulate, using MusyX audio compression technology, among other things.

:lol :lol
I hope by 'technical' you mean 'it doesn't have controller pack/rumble pack' because any other argument would be rather ludicrous. Especially conerning the already-released N64 games that run better and look nicer than they ever did on that black 90mhz box.

Some N64 games requires more CPU power to emulate than others (even if it looks worse). And I dont see how this controller pack/rumble pack could be a issue to emulate.


If you want to know the probability of a N64 to be released on VC, I would recommend to check the emulation status of this game on current N64 emulators for PC.

Believe, there is a reason why N64 games takes too long to be released on VC (and why there is only a few).

 

[Jiggy]

I had some time on my hands avoiding other work, and I came up with a list of likely N64 titles based on licensing issues and companies that have announced support for the Virtual Console (thus the absence of companies like UbiSoft):

1080 Snowboarding
Diddy Kong Racing
Excitebike 64
Hey You, Pikachu!
Pokemon Stadium
Pokemon Stadium 2

Can't speak for the others on your list, but these should all have barriers--1080 and Excitebike because of the licensing, DKR because it has Rare-owned characters in it, and the Pokemon trio because they used N64 peripherals used exclusively for those games.

 

[Pud]

:lol I said wow. Look, do yourself a favour and get a Wii, download Mario 64 and experience what the N64 could NOT do (60fps, cleaner textures, etc). The document-less high-level emulation that PC emulators use is nowhere near as effecient as the game-specific HLE that Nintendo is using for every one of their N64 games on the VC thus far. Yes, some games will take more CPU power than others, but an 800mhz PPC with 80mb of RAM will have absolutely no issues with anything a 90mhz box with 8mb of memory kicked out, ESPECIALLY to those who made the system and have every piece of documentation on it. When you are tweaking a game-specific emulator for each title, you will make sure that all of the technology is there to run the said title in that emulation environment.

 

[ninjaurbano]

Yes, some games will take more CPU power than others, but an 800mhz PPC with 80mb of RAM will have absolutely no issues with anything a 90mhz box with 8mb of memory kicked out

Ok, i think you dont have any idea how emulation works. Based on your "knowledge", Sega Saturn emulation would be easier and require less CPU power, since its less powerful than N64.

Look, do yourself a favour and get a Wii, download Mario 64 and experience what the N64 could NOT do (60fps, cleaner textures, etc).

The game is only running at a higher resolution (640x480). Big deal. This was possible since 1999 (when UltraHLE was released).

The framerate is NOT improved.

The document-less high-level emulation that PC emulators use is nowhere near as effecient as the game-specific HLE that Nintendo is using for every one of their N64 games on the VC thus far.

Maybe it helps. But it can't perform any miracle.

And I still waiting for a emulated game released commercially with a emulation as good as the emulators available for PC. And that includes NES and SNES available for VC (with a emulation made by Nintendo itself).

 

[jarrod]

The game is only running at a higher resolution (640x480). Big deal. This was possible since 1999 (when UltraHLE was released).

The framerate is NOT improved.

Super Mario 64 and Mario Kart 64 aren't 60fps, but their framerates are most definitely "improved". Output at 480p isn't the only addition to N64 games, framerates are now locked (even in 4p splitscreen for Mario Kart!), and sprite objects and textures have clearly been smoothed out to coincide with the resolution bump.

 

[Conrad Link]

I'm pretty sure NINTENDO would know how to emulate their own system and have a lot more resources available to their coders than the home emulator programmers working away in their garages would. :lol

Hey I'm not underestimating home programmers, I've seen some of the amazing stuff homebrew etc programmers pump out - but comparing what the current fan made N64 emulators can do to what Nintendo's own thing can do is a bit silly.

 

[ninjaurbano]

Super Mario 64 and Mario Kart 64 aren't 60fps, but their framerates are most definitely "improved". Output at 480p isn't the only addition to N64 games, framerates are now locked (even in 4p splitscreen for Mario Kart!), and sprite objects and textures have clearly been smoothed out to coincide with the resolution bump.

I doubt. True FPS helps set timing. If a game isn't designed to run at a "improved framerate" based on other timing factors (like Mario 64 and Mario Kart), you can expect a lot of glitches.

 

[SnakeXs]

I doubt. True FPS helps set timing. If a game isn't designed to run at a "improved framerate" based on other timing factors (like Mario 64 and Mario Kart), you can expect a lot of glitches.

What

Spoiler

dog.gif

?

 

[jarrod]

I doubt. True FPS helps set timing. If a game isn't designed to run at a "improved framerate" based on other timing factors (like Mario 64 and Mario Kart), you can expect a lot of glitches.

Framerates aren't upped, but they're now locked... which definitely what I'd consider "improved". No glitches either so far (at least for Mario 64, haven't downloaded MK).

Someone should do a side by side comparison... I've heard claims of improved draw distance and popup also, but I can't say myself really (as the old N64 is long gone by now).

 

[wsippel]

Ok, i think you dont have any idea how emulation works. Based on your "knowledge", Sega Saturn emulation would be easier and require less CPU power, since its less powerful than N64.

The Saturn wasn't that powerful, but insanely complex hardware. And complexity is more of a problem than raw performance. Still, Nintendo not only has professional coders working on the emulators, they also have exact design specs of the original hardware, as well as sourcecodes and official SDKs. It's next to impossible for the homebrew emu scene to create comparable emulators.

And I still waiting for a emulated game released commercially with a emulation as good as the emulators available for PC. And that includes NES and SNES available for VC (with a emulation made by Nintendo itself).

Care to elaborate? VC emulation is perfect for all systems but N64, there's no more room for improvements. Games look exactly the same, sound exactly the same, and play exactly the same. Online play and such would be nice, of course, but that has nothing to do with the emulation.

 

[ninjaurbano]

Framerates aren't upped, but they're now locked... which definitely what I'd consider "improved".

A lot of N64 games use locked FPS. Mario 64 is locked at 30fps. Not sure about Mario Kart, I need to use Fraps to check. But anyway, I doubt they are different than running on a real N64.

I'm pretty sure NINTENDO would know how to emulate their own system and have a lot more resources available to their coders than the home emulator programmers working away in their garages would. :lol

Yes. But I'm talking about a hardware limitation. No matter how good your code is, you cant expect to do things only possible with a better setup.

 

[BrodiemanTTR]

So, tomorrow's update?

 

[MrDaravon]

So, tomorrow's update?

Press release doesn't usually hit until sometime later tommorrow morning (I think buddyc said around 10am last page).

 

[wsippel]

Yes. But I'm talking about a hardware limitation. No matter how good your code is, you cant expect to do things only possible with a better setup.

Well, I've seen homebrew MIPS emulators, and I've seen Silicon Graphics proprietary MIPS emulator. The latter is several times (!) faster than even the fastest homebrew emulator on the same hardware...

 

[jarrod]

A lot of N64 games use locked FPS. Mario 64 is locked at 30fps. Not sure about Mario Kart, I need to use Fraps to check. But anyway, I doubt they are different than running on a real N64.

Neither Mario 64 or Mario Kart were an always stable 30 fps, both dropped below it at times. They evidently don't do that anymore... have you played either on the Virtual Console?

Both games definitely have improvements going beyond a simple resolution bump.