mdtauk
Member
But the idea is that he was there just for Maya, and is caught up in a case right away which makes him known among the
revolution members
By making his reason to travel related
to Apollo and his adoptive father
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Phoenix Wright: Ace Attorney - Spirit of Justice |OT| Khura'in, not Kurain
- Thread starter GSR
- Start date
But the idea is that he was there just for Maya, and is caught up in a case right away which makes him known among the
By making his reason to travel related
I didn't say change the reason of his travel, just make him slightly more aware.
Him knowing Apollo has a connection and investigating it a little - even we as the player aren't aware until later - as a secondary motivation is fine. He should know too, he's still in contact with Lamiroir and she at least knows Apollo was raised there.
mdtauk
Member
I accept that would make it seem less of a coincidence. I would only say that if that were done, don't let the audience know until the photo was found. Because it is a good moment for the player.
Velcro Fly
Member
DLC case worth it? Finished the main game already.
MetalGearOnlineK
Member
Just finished case 4. I've liked the plots of all of the cases so far, but there's something not clicking with me in this game that's making it hard to get through. Maybe I'm just not remembering the past games properly, but it feels like there is a lot of "filler" in every case. I mean this in the sense that there are SO many flash backs, a lot of pauses in text for character animations to play out (those purple butterflies landing on the prosecutors hand), and just pointless text that doesn't add anything and just draws things out (Minor case 4 spoiler:
. Like I said, I'm really enjoying this game, but I kinda wish it was a bit more streamlined, the things I mentioned above are all overused and only really seem to serve to make the playtime longer in my opinion.
Like the prosecutor explaining the Soba story in detail in case 4
mdtauk
Member
To be fair on the game, there is the ability to skip text, even if you haven't read it yet. So skipping a few things and checking to log to read it if you need to, helps a bit if you feel things are moving slowly. The location text for example, I skip all the time!
KuwabaraTheMan
Banned
I'm finally getting back to this and completed the second case earlier. It was definitely a massive improvement from the first case which I thought was quite bad.
Retinz being the killer was super obvious from the start, and there barely being any other characters in the case didn't help on that end. Still, in spite of that I thought the case was pretty fun, although having only a single day in court was a bit lame and made things feel less complex than usual. Overall it was a nice case, and while I figured out a few of the twists well before the characters did, there were some things that left me guessing until much later.
Betty/Bonny = best girls.
Betty/Bonny = best girls.
...Unless I'm totally wrong, I think Ever17 might have inadvertently spoilered me on the DLC case.
speculation and Ever17 full game spoilers below:
speculation and Ever17 full game spoilers below:
I'm guessing that the whole time travel thing is actually just everyone around Ellen letting her think that she went back in time, similarly to how in the Kid's routes in Ever17 You/Sora/fake Takeshi are manipulating the Kid (and thus, the player) into believing they're in the same timeframe as Takeshi's routes.
Finished the game.
Figured pretty much everything hours before it happened. Forgot to mention it there but
I don't know, it wasn't a bad game but I enjoyed Dual Destinies more and I definitely
Finished the short Phoenix DLC case which wasn't anything to write home about really, now onto Apollo's and the full case later today.
Figured pretty much everything hours before it happened. Forgot to mention it there but
the first time I took a look at the Queen's profile description and saw "It is said that she can channel the dead" or something similar it was obvious what was up. The only surprise was Dhurke's death so that was cool. Apollo choosing to stay was the only thing that made sense from the beginning as well. I was expecting more from the name of the spoiler thread.
I don't know, it wasn't a bad game but I enjoyed Dual Destinies more and I definitely
didn't predict the Phantom's identity.
Fallout Phoenix
Member
Just finished the DLC case
Pretty sad stuff, I had the true culprit spoiled for me before I played the case but it's not like they did a very good job of hiding that it was Pierce.
I did however like the whole time traveling motif even if it never actually technically happened.
I did however like the whole time traveling motif even if it never actually technically happened.
Yeah agreed with the spoiler, they did a great job.
Overall the case was decent. Think I preferred the DD DLC case more. This one was pretty transparent as to where it was headed, but there were some fun moments and some laughs. Some decent emotional bits as well. Much like the full game though, too many unnecessary flashbacks, and the investigation sections could have been more filled out. Wish there had been more new characters as well, felt that was one of the stronger aspects of the last DLC case. Still, it's more Ace Attorney, so I don't have too many complaints.
My problem with PLvsAA isn't so much the twist of the game - even if it compounds on things and creates a dozen plotholes in the process. My problem with the game is that the story doesn't really feel like it has any reason to be a crossover. The characters the story is built around is one I really don't have the patience for either. It has some incredibly unlikable or unmemorable side characters and because of the way the game uses magic, it feels contrived in how it constantly rewrites the rules not for the sake of any real progression but because of pointless plot detours (even Edgeworth's "updated autopsy reports" had reasons to exist). Not only that but the game is just incredibly easy compared to it's predecessors. The multiple witness testimonies was a good idea but it was made way too trivial with all of the aggressively exaggerated tells. AA6 managed to make me sympathize so much more with characters like
Datz and Dhurke
The writing is good but that's really all it had going for it with the weak scenario. It was one of the most disappointing games I'd got to experience personally.
This happened because they try really hard to bring back Phoenix old persona. If Yamazaki were to keep what Takumi had left off in AA4, we wouldn't have him as a lawyer again in the first place.
To be brutally honest, Phoenix Wright at this point just dragged the whole series. His old persona, and fans attachment to it have made the new main characters overshadowed. I admit they've made a good job with Apollo and Athena presentation and their stong position in relation to the story in AA5. Phoenix is still there, becoming a giant that both of them stood on.
Takumi knew this, and it's why he want a fresh start with AJ. He knew that Phoenix will always overshadow his new main character if he were to appear. Capcom intervene, he insert the old character once again but he goes very deep to make sure Phoenix wouldn't be lawyer ever again. He want to make people identify "Hobo" Phoenix being a different character from his past self. He paid this in heavy price as it resulted in irony where titular main character get shafted by the wholly changed previous one as he banked on future game to show Apollo to the fullest. But the game given to Yamazaki instead, and when he gave the badges back to Phoenix, making all Takumi efforts ended up in vain.
AA7 better be without Phoenix as a playable character or we'll just see the same thing since AA4 repeated again. Fans really need to let Old Nick go.
Belgian Dude
Member
Replaying through the first game rn and something that I think AA6 has over the other games are trials with fewer
days in general. I didn't remember Case 3 of the first game having 3 days because the investigations were not memorable at all, and the important evidence you get is on the trials (Investigation Day 1 you only learn the photo is not valid evidence, Investigation Day 2 it's a fetch quest to get Cody's album...). When there are trial splits in AA6 it's because you're in for a NEW investigation section, not one /two more locations/evidences and that's it.
I'll go through the other games to see if that's indeed the case with them but I remember it being the case up to T&T, at least. (and DD suffers a bit from it since Case 4 should be part of Case 5)
I'll go through the other games to see if that's indeed the case with them but I remember it being the case up to T&T, at least. (and DD suffers a bit from it since Case 4 should be part of Case 5)
Magnet_Man
Member
Not even his old persona; his AA1 persona where he bluffs all the time, accuses someone at the drop of a hat, and has borderline panic attacks when faced with opposition.
I miss the Phoenix that would stare down the killers like in cases 1-4, 1-5, 2-4, 3-2, and 3-5.
SoJ ending spoilers
This is totally the cynic in me but when Apollo said he was staying behind, I actually laughed out loud because all I could think of was the staff dusting their hands going "There, Poochy's gone. Time to double down on Phoenix!"
DLC case Turnabout Time Traveler spoiler
Just look at how they handled Trucy and Athena.
I have low expectations for crossovers making sense so that didn't bother me, but otherwise sure.
I liked the progression of "this cannot possibly be true" to "let's act like magic is real" to "oh, magic isn't actually real but the real reason is even more convoluted!". Yeah it's a bit contrived, but all the PL games had fantastical settings that kind of follow that progression. As for side characters, I strongly disagree.
I don't have a good barometer for how difficult or easy AA cases are, but AA6's main difficulty is that it requires specific solutions in situations where it shouldn't be. To me AA games has never been hard or easy, just obscure or straightforward and that's usually decided by the level of twists going on, and PLvsAA didn't lack that, it's just a different kind of story that's going on. Again it's because of the PL influence.
Again I simply disagree. Espella played the damsel in distress role and she isn't as likable as Rayfa for example sure, but AA6 characters also have issues that they are paper thin. What do you know about the Inmees?
They're a loving couple who are rebels.
She's an evil person who lusts for power and plotted against her sister.
She easily believes people and changes sides a couple of times.
Dhurke
Yeah again due to the PL-esque scenario you didn't like it, that's fine. I actually believe that the characters there are better though.
I highly disagree with the notion that Nick has regressed to his AA1 persona - his interactions with Apollo, Athena, Maya etc show how much he's grown as a person and as a mentor.
Case 5 stuff:
Plus - I think it's a little harsh to judge Nick on his overreactions and penchant for bluffs. The former is a staple of Ace Attorney, and isn't just limited to Nick - characters consistently freak out regardless of experience.
The bluffs are perhaps a little more avoidable, but I guess they like keeping the player character as a sort of underdog? It probably doesn't help that Nick seems self aware of this, which can make him look callous at times.
Case 5 stuff:
The Nick who stands by Apollo's side here is definitely not the Nick at the end of AA3. At least not in my opinion.
Plus - I think it's a little harsh to judge Nick on his overreactions and penchant for bluffs. The former is a staple of Ace Attorney, and isn't just limited to Nick - characters consistently freak out regardless of experience.
The bluffs are perhaps a little more avoidable, but I guess they like keeping the player character as a sort of underdog? It probably doesn't help that Nick seems self aware of this, which can make him look callous at times.
Is it just me or is case 4 complete bullshit?
It requires you to have such specific culinary knowledge at one point.
Also it blows my mind that they are still trying to claim AA doesn't take place in Japan.
The whole case is the most Japan I have ever seen.
It requires you to have such specific culinary knowledge at one point.
The difference between ramen, udon, noodles, buckwheat allergies wtf?
Also it blows my mind that they are still trying to claim AA doesn't take place in Japan.
The whole case is the most Japan I have ever seen.
afreaknamedpete
Member
DLC Case Spoilers:
Eh, pretty mediocre. For one Larry did kinda just feel there, maybe I was expecting Punchenbaug levels of ridiculous coincidence, but here it's pretty benign. Also the main villain was really obvious and kinda cheap, the motivation just doesn't really make all that much sense to begin with even. Also is it just me or does the dead sister look EXACTLY like the dead sister from AA5's DLC case?
I feel like they could've done more with the whole "two receptions" thing. As it stood it was figured out way too quickly and then it became just a more conventional mystery. That should've been like a holy shit moment but it was kinda obvious from right out the gate. Also that was the stupidest final climactic thought line sequence ever. Really, Phoenix? Your brilliant case breaking conclusion was to examine the murder weapon?
I feel like they could've done more with the whole "two receptions" thing. As it stood it was figured out way too quickly and then it became just a more conventional mystery. That should've been like a holy shit moment but it was kinda obvious from right out the gate. Also that was the stupidest final climactic thought line sequence ever. Really, Phoenix? Your brilliant case breaking conclusion was to examine the murder weapon?
Shift Breaker
Member
This came out three years ago. I've probably seen it a hundred times since then. That last panel still makes me laugh.
Magnet_Man
Member
That's hardly different from how he treated Maya and Pearl. He's always been a responsible person and pseudo parental figure, but when it's just us and him, he's back to the bluffs and panicking.
Phoenix just seems to go into full blown shock and distraught way too easily. In the other games he'd have the initial animation (occurred more rarer than you'd think actually), maybe make a sarcastic comment to himself and then get right back into the game. Here, he full on dwells on conflicting information most of the time. That's going back to the pacing problem that I have with the game overall. What the game presents is good and reasonable, but it needs to be tighter.
It certainly doesn't help that his sweating animation has been changed from flustered annoyance to what looks like the verge of tears.
It's just easier to write to stereotypes and cliches is what it boils down to. The cliche of Phoenix gets shocked by his argument falling through so he runs to a bluff makes for easy writing. It's kind of like how filler in anime tends to reduce characters to their basest forms. While Phoenix does have a tendency for the bluff, there are more subtle variants to his responses shown in past games than going straight for exasperated.
Yeaaaah it was pretty terrible the way that
whole "twist" was handled. Like they reveal it like it's some crazy shocking thing but it falls totally flat for anyone who doesn't know what the different noodles are made of.
Blackquill is just that much of a weeb.
PorygonVandal
Member
Uhm guys
I remember an animated cutscene that was shown before the game came out where Maya was attacked or arrested, I don't remember what, but she was with Ahlbi, when she is taken she drops her cell phone.....
But I really don't think I saw it in the game at all ._.
I remember an animated cutscene that was shown before the game came out where Maya was attacked or arrested, I don't remember what, but she was with Ahlbi, when she is taken she drops her cell phone.....
But I really don't think I saw it in the game at all ._.
I'm assuming that part is from where she is kidnapped, but it's weird that we didn't get to see it in game (Or I just don't remember it for complex reasons)
I may have also screamed at my game boy for him to cut his hair.
WrenchNinja
Member
I miss hobo nick
Case 5 spoilers
I wondered the same, it was at the end of the demo. I'm not entirely sure if it was the kidnapping or not, if it was then yeah it just happens off screen, but if it wasn't then it was just a red hearing. Ace Attorney demos seem to want to mislead you to shake things off in the main game.
Responses in bold.
It happens in the promo anime which takes place before case 1. That's the reason why Phoenix goes to Khura'in earlier than planned.
That's her being assaulted and then rescued by Nahyuta. I thought there was a clip with the spoiler tagged stuff at the end of the demo too, or maybe I'm misremembering?
Just finished the game (excluding the DLC case). I gotta say, it's definitely one of the best Ace Attorney titles released. There was talk before that it goes off the rails at some point or that it's disappointing in some respects, but I thought it was a massive improvement over Dual Destinies and was fantastic overall.
I had tempered expectations thanks to the return and focus of mysticism, and what seemed to be too many cameos, but neither of these were a problem. hell, Khura'in made for a welcome change in atmosphere and elevated the courtroom stakes in a neat way. The through line was exponentially better than "Dark Age of the Law," and it actually turned out to be way more compelling than I would have expected.
The boost in production values was great. Dynamic camera angles and cutscenes that flowed properly. The anime cutscenes were also far less overbearing than they were in AA5, and also lacked the cringeworthiness they had at times. One thing I had against the presentation was that there were too many flashbacks at times to hammer things home that didn't need to be.
I could continue saying great things about it but, all in all, it's definitely worthy of being a mainline entry in the Ace Attorney series and reaffirmed my faith in the series after it became somewhat uncertain after AA5. Great ending; I was surprised this
I had tempered expectations thanks to the return and focus of mysticism, and what seemed to be too many cameos, but neither of these were a problem. hell, Khura'in made for a welcome change in atmosphere and elevated the courtroom stakes in a neat way. The through line was exponentially better than "Dark Age of the Law," and it actually turned out to be way more compelling than I would have expected.
The boost in production values was great. Dynamic camera angles and cutscenes that flowed properly. The anime cutscenes were also far less overbearing than they were in AA5, and also lacked the cringeworthiness they had at times. One thing I had against the presentation was that there were too many flashbacks at times to hammer things home that didn't need to be.
I like how the methods and motivations behind the cases were not crazy convoluted, but relatively down-to-earth and understandable. It makes resolutions more satisfying than always unfolding chessmaster plots to kill somebody.
I could continue saying great things about it but, all in all, it's definitely worthy of being a mainline entry in the Ace Attorney series and reaffirmed my faith in the series after it became somewhat uncertain after AA5. Great ending; I was surprised this
actually turned out to be the closing entry in what really did form an "Apollo Justice" trilogy.
You mean in the demo trailer?
PorygonVandal is definitely referring to the prologue anime scene.
Btw. @ all the people wanting a different main character than Phoenix next game check the latest translated dev blog:
Personally I loved how Athena interacted with [spoilers]Simon Blackquill[/spoilers] in case 4 and would certainly be happy if they could be the new leading duo in AA7. Of course Apollo is also a fine choice while I would prefer Phoenix to be only the unplayable mentor.
ScraftyDevil
Banned
I've updated my Comprehensive List of Punny Names with characters from the DLC case. Feel free to let me know if any are missing or misguided!
mrmickfran
Member
"Rheel Neh'mu"
I am so done with this game
SO FUCKING DONE
I am so done with this game
SO FUCKING DONE
Keep playing, man. That's not even the worst one.
Finished the DLC case. I thought it was pretty good, although not as much as AA5's IMO, but I'm still glad I payed for it and enjoyed it overall.
By the way, I'd recommend people to not play it until they've finished the main game. Don't want to say why, but yeah.
This was "Deid Mann"-tier. So good.
By the way, I'd recommend people to not play it until they've finished the main game. Don't want to say why, but yeah.
This was "Deid Mann"-tier. So good.
Shift Breaker
Member
It'll all be worth it when you get to case 5 and meet
Paul Atishon
Orniletter
Banned
WrenchNinja
Member
Apollo's "I'm Fine" theme has been my ring tone since AA5 came out. Doesn't look like it's changing.
Case 5 major spoilers
Case 5 major spoilers
I really hope this isn't the last of him
ScraftyDevil
Banned
Yup, and a lot of the Japanese puns are even worse if you can believe it. Like, Cody Hackins' name is just the characters for "otaku" rearranged and April May & Redd White's names used the exact same pun.
The Wheel of Fortune
Member
Any impressions on the DLC case? Where does it rank among the other cases?
Similar threads
- Locked