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[BlackJace]

It was my first time on GAF for E3, and besides the 3DS, this is my first console launch. Holy fuck has GAF gone insane. From both sides, my god.

 

[RedSwirl]

We're more likely to see the Wii U being the lead platform next gen rather than for any of the remainder of this gen. It's going to have the largest marketshare and developers in their right minds will target the lowest common denominator.

The sales of ZombiU, Black Ops 2, Assassins Creed 3, Rayman Legends, FIFA 13 and Aliens Colonial Marines will show publishers that there's a market for bringing 'hardcore' titles to the U. Some people are going to be surprised by seeing the U being the lead platform next gen I think.

I Definitely think the sales of those games as well as the hardware will be telling. If all those games do sell very well on the Wii U it'll send a signal to publishers that they can make money on the platform, and that's ultimately what matters to them.

As for as the "leading platform," that usually ends up being the lowest common denominator hardware-wise that publishers think has a market for their games. If that market does turn out to present itself on the Wii U, then perhaps.

Looking at this:

And this:

PC is leading next gen. Everything else is just porting down.

By this logic PC should have been the lead SKU with mostly console down-ports this gen. Instead things have been the other way around, with 360 being the lead SKU and every game being up-ported to PC.

I think that ultimately, either the Wii U or the weaker of the other two console will end up being the lead SKU for most games next gen. The most powerful hardware has never been the leading development platfrom in console gaming.

 

[OMT]

I don't get the stupid hate for IdeaMan. I mean he has proven that he has some informations, from actual developpers. None of them said ram is a bottleneck. None.
Now, I still think Wii U is more powerfull than PS360.
Not that much, but powerfull enough to run at least same games with one more screen.
Because yes, comparisons show only one screen. Wii U also render a second 480p screen. Now as far as I know, Wii U is like an Xbox 360+. Slightly more powerfull, newer tech so no need to fake some effects and finally enough power to render 2 scenes.
People says :"lol complaining about rushed port."
But it seems those games are rushed port. Rushed to be ready at line up, and developped by smaller B-team with limited budget.

It's because he pushes the idea that the WiiU is significantly more powerful than the existing HD systems, but not in the ways that seem to matter to most GAFers. He seems to see it as having powerful new functionality options that will provide for new gaming experiences that the older consoles couldn't hope to match; in other words, he sees it as a playground that will be far more fun than currently exists. GAFers seem to be looking for a machine that delivers a more powerful version of current experiences, which the WiiU does not seem to be aiming for, so much. Needless to say, this difference in perspective can easily lead to animosity.

 

[OldJadedGamer]

why would anyone lead on wiiu?

I think Japanese developers will for niche titles but the hige Western titles won't

But Bayonetta 2...

This system is ripping me to shreds. Nintendo hardware keeps getting worse and worse, but the games are enticing. Shoot... I have more Wii games than I do 360 or PS3(not together). The hardware is just so bad though...

First party published doesn't count.

It's kind of true though. Not the developers fault but the publishers making them create a port in 3 months tops.

There were rushed PS2 ports at the launch of the 360 but all those next gen ports performed better than the last gen version. This is not the case with the WiiU.

 

[Anth0ny]

We're more likely to see the Wii U being the lead platform next gen rather than for any of the remainder of this gen. It's going to have the largest marketshare and developers in their right minds will target the lowest common denominator.

The sales of ZombiU, Black Ops 2, Assassins Creed 3, Rayman Legends, FIFA 13 and Aliens Colonial Marines will show publishers that there's a market for bringing 'hardcore' titles to the U. Some people are going to be surprised by seeing the U being the lead platform next gen I think.

what in the world

 

[Reiko]

I Definitely think the sales of those games as well as the hardware will be telling. If all those games do sell very well on the Wii U it'll send a signal to publishers that they can make money on the platform, and that's ultimately what matters to them.

As for as the "leading platform," that usually ends up being the lowest common denominator hardware-wise that publishers think has a market for their games. If that market does turn out to present itself on the Wii U, then perhaps.



By this logic PC should have been the lead SKU with mostly console down-ports this gen. Instead things have been the other way around, with 360 being the lead SKU and every game being up-ported to PC.

I think that ultimately, either the Wii U or the weaker of the other two console will end up being the lead SKU for most games next gen. The most powerful hardware has never been the leading development platfrom in console gaming.

It was split between the 360 and Ps3 since they were both very powerful.

But it really comes down to the ease of development tools that makes the decision much easier.

 

[Kazuma Kiryu]

See, I'm not saying they don't look better than what we've got now, but they just don't look all that different to me.

That Agni's Philosophy demo.... that looked amazing, mind.

so, exactly the point, they look better. looking different is up to the developers, and those 3 games are only a tiny sample of what's coming next-gen.

 

[Ryoku]

Wii U lead platform? I don't know... I think that's a very bold statement, especially considering that the other two aren't even out yet. In Japan, however, we can say with some accuracy that Wii U may indeed be the lead platform for some titles, but in the western regions, it will be either the PS4 or 720 (whichever has the higher install base). Not saying that Wii U doesn't have a chance in the west for lead platform, but I think it's not likely.

 

[codhand]

Wii U lead platform? I don't know... I think that's a very bold statement, especially considering that the other two aren't even out yet. In Japan, however, we can say with some accuracy that Wii U may indeed be the lead platform for some titles, but in the western regions, it will be either the PS4 or 720 (whichever has the higher install base). Not saying that Wii U doesn't have a chance in the west for lead platform, but I think it's not likely.

you coulda just said "lol lead platform"

 

[i-Lo]

I By this logic PC should have been the lead SKU with mostly console down-ports this gen. Instead things have been the other way around, with 360 being the lead SKU and every game being up-ported to PC.

I think that ultimately, either the Wii U or the weaker of the other two console will end up being the lead SKU for most games next gen. The most powerful hardware has never been the leading development platfrom in console gaming.

The PS3 and 360 are very comparable in real world. The PS3 only stands out when it comes to exclusives as most multiplat games are either on par with the 360 version or inferior. The point is, you're right, the games do get ported to PC after development on console. It is what has held back the graphical march forward on PC save a few entries.

However, the next gen consoles are closer to PC in architecture than ever before if rumours are true. Add to that the Direct X 11 capability and we are about to see a generational shift on PC, and the consoles from sony and MS are the impetus. Therefore, it makes absolutely zero sense to lead on WiiU when developing for XB3/PS4 and then porting to PC will not only be easier but also yield visual fidelity on a mainstream scale as displayed by SW1313, WatchDogs and beyond.

 

[ymmv]

It doesn't come down to brute force mate. Launch day ports on any new platform are a pain in the arse to work on - even Deep Thought would struggle with day one ports due to a completely new architecture and time needed to bring said port to the new platform amid constant SDK and hardware revisions.

You'll see patches during this next week or two fixing performance issues as per usual. This isn't anything new, although I guess this is the first time patches have been implemented on a Nintendo home console.

You'll find both the PS4 and 720 having the same problems with ports that the U is having now, no matter how much more powerful they are. It always happens with new hardware, has always happened in the past with new hardware and will always happen in the future with new hardware.

That's nonsense. The PS4 and 720 will be a lot faster than the current gen. Yes, PS720 launch games will be unoptimized and won't show the full capabilities of the next gen hardware, that's a given. But those games won't have problems with ports. PS360 games that have been turned into next gen launch games will benefit from the x times faster hardware. Just look at how Rare turned Kameo, originally a GC/Xbox game, into a 360 launch game that pushed far more geometry and animated characters than any Xbox game.

The reason why Wii U ports struggle to keep up with the PS360 is that the new Nintendo console isn't 6-10 faster than the previous gen. If you add up the slower CPU, slower RAM and faster GPU it's on par with the 7 year old Xbox 360, a piece of hardware developers are intimately familiar with. The combination of (almost) equal hardware capabilities plus less development time led to weak Wii U launch games. But the PS4 and Xbox 720 will be miles ahead of their predecessors. What else would be the point of Sony and MS releasing new consoles?

 

[Ryoku]

you coulda just said "lol lead platform"

I'd rather take the time to make a detailed post--in this case, at least.

 

[gamergirly]

So the Wii U has 43% slower, but 200% more RAM than PS360 (If counting the 1 GB for the OS)

Clearly many people don't have a fucking clue what 43% slower RAM even means in the context of the rest of the Wii U's components, of which most of them arent even known yet (CPU clockspeed, GPU, EDram) and how all of that is gonna interact with each other on a system that is architecturally diffent that the PS360.

Most of GAF has degraded themselves to ingnorant, fanboish trolls, not capably of any rational thought. Just like animals. Throw them some numbers and they'll glady jump on them with their premature conlusions and half-knowledge of things. I bet my immaginary dog knows as much as most of the people here about the Wii U's hardware, overall capacity or prospect of success in the market.

Which is the whole problem with this debate atm. Looking back, the Wii Speculation and Wii Final Specs threads were much more mature in their discussions. I find thread titles like this premature

 

[SapientWolf]

I Definitely think the sales of those games as well as the hardware will be telling. If all those games do sell very well on the Wii U it'll send a signal to publishers that they can make money on the platform, and that's ultimately what matters to them.

As for as the "leading platform," that usually ends up being the lowest common denominator hardware-wise that publishers think has a market for their games. If that market does turn out to present itself on the Wii U, then perhaps.



By this logic PC should have been the lead SKU with mostly console down-ports this gen. Instead things have been the other way around, with 360 being the lead SKU and every game being up-ported to PC.

I think that ultimately, either the Wii U or the weaker of the other two console will end up being the lead SKU for most games next gen. The most powerful hardware has never been the leading development platfrom in console gaming.

The PC is already the lead platform for next gen. The only question is how long that will last.

Which is the whole problem with this debate atm. Looking back, the Wii Speculation and Wii Final Specs threads were much more mature in their discussions. I find thread titles like this premature

No they weren't. The people with accurate info were being jumped on. And posts like Mlatador's certainly aren't helping to raise the level of discourse in this thread.

 

[The Abominable Snowman]

I am not a dev so maybe someone who is in the know can answer this.

From what we are seeing we aren't getting too much AA in these games. Originally there was some talk that this eDRAM would be able to pretty much provide "free AA" and possibly other post processing effects for free. However now that it seems to be required to prop up the ram does it no longer provide the benefits it could have if it was paired with faster ram since it is being leaned on so heavily?

eDRAM being used for other things?

many high-utilization 360 games use tiling, but that wasn't very effective because of the slow RAM bandwidth of the 360.

 

[thirty]

why the fuck do people defend nintendo? they barely invest in making good hardware, with the NSMB series they barely invest in making decent games with one of their most beloved if not their MOST beloved character. Why do you people continue to defend and invest in a company that doesnt care about you anymore? we're no longer their target demographic. i say screw em.

 

[Fourth Storm]

No, from what I've been reading in many convoluted WiiU threads here, the GPU in the console has a bandwidth of about 50GB/sec which is about 4 times the bandwidth of the RAM. As a lay person, I thought that the system is only as fast as the slowest component. Thus, a GPU with around 12GB/sec should have sufficed given bandwidth the processing speed are two different things. In the regard, couldn't the system save on even more power?

These threads are convoluted, yes. But I don't think anyone really knows the specs of the GPU. Maybe a stock RV740 has that amount of bandwidth to its GDDR5 memory, but again that is a function of the memory controller on the GPU. It is now clear that Nintendo have swapped out that part with their own solution, which supports the eDRAM and DDR3 memory pools. In addition to that, the GPU is almost certainly less powerful than an RV740 given the measurements, so whatever info you heard is incorrect.

 

[BlackJace]

why the fuck do people defend nintendo? they barely invest in making good hardware, with the NSMB series they barely invest in making decent games with one of their most beloved if not their MOST characters. Why do you people continue to defend and invest in a company that doesnt care about you anymore? we're no longer their target demographic. i say screw em.

Because they make games that people happen to enjoy. Pretty simple.

 

[gundamkyoukai]

The PC is already the lead platform for next gen. The only question is how long that will last.

I expect it to stay that way for most games that getting a PC version .
Even if PS4\ 720 end up being the lead platform all rumors point to them being really easy to port stuff to and from .
So it going to be PC, PS4 , 720 all close to each other compare to Wii U just like this gen .
Only thing is it not going to be as bad as Wii thanks to the GPU .

 

[Always-honest]

I am not a dev so maybe someone who is in the know can answer this.

From what we are seeing we aren't getting too much AA in these games. Originally there was some talk that this eDRAM would be able to pretty much provide "free AA" and possibly other post processing effects for free. However now that it seems to be required to prop up the ram does it no longer provide the benefits it could have if it was paired with faster ram since it is being leaned on so heavily?

Yeah, i'm worried about this. I was promised AA on games. I have yet to see a game that uses good AA on wii-U

 

[Chao]

With all this slow ram, slow CPU, and general doom talk about WiiU's power, it seems to me like people already forgot what Nintendo showed at E3. I'm specifically talking about the Zelda tech demo.

It may not look like a huge generational leap, but as far as I know this was put together in a few weeks with the Twilight princess assets and it looks pretty damn good

So what are you so worried about? If the second batch of WIIU games look like this (and I'm sure they will) I'm satisfied

http://m.youtube.com/results?q=zelda tech demo#/watch?v=27Lf4uVuE50

 

[Barack Lesnar]

I don't get the stupid hate for IdeaMan. I mean he has proven that he has some informations, from actual developpers. None of them said ram is a bottleneck. None.
Now, I still think Wii U is more powerfull than PS360.
Not that much, but powerfull enough to run at least same games with one more screen.
Because yes, comparisons show only one screen. Wii U also render a second 480p screen. Now as far as I know, Wii U is like an Xbox 360+. Slightly more powerfull, newer tech so no need to fake some effects and finally enough power to render 2 scenes.
People says :"lol complaining about rushed port."
But it seems those games are rushed port. Rushed to be ready at line up, and developped by smaller B-team with limited budget.

While he may have had some legit info, you can't deny that there's an obvious slant in his posts. I'm not sure you can see it but anyone reading them objectively can. Any hint of bad news is always slanted and spun in a way to downplay it, just like we've seen with his posts in this thread regarding the ram and in the Metro thread regarding ports. You can read his post history and find this common trend. This is why people have been skeptical of him, despite the fact that his info is probably legit.

Which is the whole problem with this debate atm. Looking back, the Wii Speculation and Wii Final Specs threads were much more mature in their discussions. I find thread titles like this premature

This is so far from the truth I'm not sure where to begin. Please see the gangbanging of Arkam in one of those speculation threads linked some pages back. Not to mention that this info on the ram speed is more solid than 90% of the vague insider info we were led to believe in the speculation threads.

 

[LeleSocho]

I'm specifically talking about the Zelda tech demo.

Which is nothing special tech wise... it ran at 720p with a lot of aliasing, nice lightning but the rest was doable on other consoles

 

[iamshadowlark]

By this logic PC should have been the lead SKU with mostly console down-ports this gen. Instead things have been the other way around, with 360 being the lead SKU and every game being up-ported to PC.

I think that ultimately, either the Wii U or the weaker of the other two console will end up being the lead SKU for most games next gen. The most powerful hardware has never been the leading development platfrom in console gaming.

There's a whole lot of false equivalencies here. As of now, I don't even think the WiiU will get much more third party support than the Wii. Any next-gen game being ported to 360/PS3 may get a WiiU port but I don't think anything based around say, UE4 would.

As for the Next XBOX/PS I think they will be pretty similar in design and power, so the lead version will be either/or. There's no rule really.

 

[kinggroin]

I am not a dev so maybe someone who is in the know can answer this.

From what we are seeing we aren't getting too much AA in these games. Originally there was some talk that this eDRAM would be able to pretty much provide "free AA" and possibly other post processing effects for free. However now that it seems to be required to prop up the ram does it no longer provide the benefits it could have if it was paired with faster ram since it is being leaned on so heavily?

I'm thinking, that I best, the eDRAM will work as an equilizer. when properly utilized, we should be seeing parity with the 360 and PlayStation 3.I think it's best to lower expectations of this system out performing current generation platforms in any meaningful way.

 

[Teletraan1]

eDRAM being used for other things?

many high-utilization 360 games use tiling, but that wasn't very effective because of the slow RAM bandwidth of the 360.

From what I have read over the years the eDRAM in the 360 wasn't big enough so they had to resort to tiling and these sub-HD resolutions to fit into those space constraints. The rumored size of the Wii U eDRAM would have eliminated those problems.

 

[Azure J]

This is so far from the truth I'm not sure where to begin. Please see the gangbanging of Arkam in one of those speculation threads linked some pages back.

The ganging up on Arkam came at a time when everyone was tense from "teh random developers" commenting on things in dismissive tones while the less high profile but similarly in the know people were saying things to the contrary. Wires were crossed on a nigh regular basis. As the thread(s) went through its paces, most sane people eventually came to the same expectations as Arkam, difference being Arkam was voicing more than moderate disappointment in aspects of the system while others had gone through their pains and grown to accept what was coming. Nothing about the final specs is surprising if you were in those threads from the start to now and nothing about the system's design says anything to dissuade what it was assumed to be, a more capable "Nintendo box with potential for the odd game or two".

Edit: The only thing in question is ports from 720/PS4 really. Strong chance the WiiU won't get them, but a similarly strong chance that the system won't suffer content droughts as bad as those on the original Wii.

 

[codhand]

the denial from wii u fans is matched only by the hubris of ps4 nextbox fans

 

[AstroNut325]

the denial from wii u fans is matched only by the hubris of ps4 nextbox fans

The difference is... we (Orbis/Durango fans) have somewhat tangible ideas on what the technical capabilities of next gen systems will be BASED on actual products and showcases thus far from Epic, Square, Crytek, and others. And at the very least we can expect a modest bump in terms of capabilities.

BUT... if Orbis and/or Durango land with RAM specifications below that of their predecessors AND a weaker CPU... then the streets (read: forums) will be lined with blood!

 

[JoshuaJSlone]

The WiiU is unable to properly handle current gen ports which are in their twilight years. If you are expecting that people will buy software made for XB3/PS4 that looks like an anti-aliased version of WiiU's release then you are delusional.

An XB3/PS4 upport of a Wii U original will be a very different thing than an XB3/PS4 upport of a Wii U port from X360/PS3.

 

[codhand]

The difference is... we (Orbis/Durango fans) have somewhat tangible ideas on what the technical capabilities of next gen systems will be BASED on actual products and showcases thus far from Epic, Square, Crytek, and others. And at the very least we can expect a modest bump in terms of capabilities.

BUT... if Orbis and/or Durango land with RAM specifications below that of their predecessors AND a weaker CPU... then the streets (read: forums) will be lined with blood!

true but u miss my point

who says enough people will care what they are capable of?

 

[RedSwirl]

It was split between the 360 and Ps3 since they were both very powerful.

But it really comes down to the ease of development tools that makes the decision much easier.

Most games still lead on Xbox 360, and most of them still sold more on Xbox 360. The PS3 has only in the last couple years been able to claw its way back up to parity in hardware sales and the quality of multiplatform ports.

Ease of development isn't necessarily the main priority either. Last gen the PS2 was supposedly the most difficult platform to develop on, but because it got that sales lead and massive 3rd party support, it became the lowest common denominator for multiplatform games, and PS2 versions were almost always the lead sellers.

However, the next gen consoles are closer to PC in architecture than ever before if rumours are true. Add to that the Direct X 11 capability and we are about to see a generational shift on PC, and the consoles from sony and MS are the impetus. Therefore, it makes absolutely zero sense to lead on WiiU when developing for XB3/PS4 and then porting to PC will not only be easier but also yield visual fidelity on a mainstream scale as displayed by SW1313, WatchDogs and beyond.

But will developers use that as an opportunity to more easily port from PC, or port to PC? This will likely be the question early on, and then later one of the consoles will still turn out to be the lead SKU for most games with PC up-ports.

As for the Wii U, do we actually know how different it is from PC hardware? Or even how different it will be architecturally from the other two consoles? We could end up in a generation where all four platforms are so similar as to make ports between them easier than ever.

But like I said, in the Wii U's case that still depends on how much of a market for publishers' games makes itself evident on the system. That's what will ultimately matter.

 

[BlackJace]

The difference is... we (Orbis/Durango fans) have somewhat tangible ideas on what the technical capabilities of next gen systems will be BASED on actual products and showcases thus far from Epic, Square, Crytek, and others. And at the very least we can expect a modest bump in terms of capabilities.

BUT... if Orbis and/or Durango land with RAM specifications below that of their predecessors AND a weaker CPU... then the streets (read: forums) will be lined with blood!

Ugh, I understand your point, but using pronouns like "us" and "we" make these topics devolve into an "Us vs. Them" mindset. Sub-GameFAQs level stuff.

 

[v1oz]

Arkam is the only guy to trust on WiiU insider info. The fact that he's been found to be legit by the mods confirms this.

 

[jehuty]

I really don't get why so many posters are upset about the Wii U and Nintendo. I assumed that by now most dedicated gamers (i.e people who game a lot) knew that Nintendo just has a different philosophy than Microsoft or Sony. Sure Nintendo could have maxed out specs for the Wii U and sold it at a huge loss but that isn't their strategy at all. They follow the blue ocean strategy and going toe to toe against Microsoft and sony is not a viable or even smart business course of action.

The Wii U was always about finding a new way to be different enough to get people who don't game all the time (read: casuals), to actually buy the thing. Nintendo made sure that the Wii U met the minimum HD requirements mostly because it rather be safe than sorry (plus the console comes with a completely unique control with it).

So yeah, The Wii U isnt true next gen (whatever that means), and there is no point in defending the system. It will fill a niche among people who will buy it for Nintendo games, and tons of casuals who will love the idea of a tablet controller that they can watch movies or do social network things on.

All these spec numbers only matter to a very small percentage of people who actually play games. Sony and Microsofts next system will be significantly stronger than the Wii U and that's okay. If gamers are afraid that the Wii U will be the lead console then they really a prematurely worrying about nothing. Sure japanese devs will support the Wii U, but for western devs they will keep putting their bests efforts on Sonys and Microsofts systems. If you don't like the Wii U, its pretty easy not to buy one.

 

[XtremeXpider]

I have a question:

If Wii U has a (supposed) slower ram than PS360... Why there are not developers complaining about less bandwidth?

 

[IdeaMan]

hehe, can't help but smile a bit upon reading this. Ideaman isn't a techhead, he never claimed to be, he's a former games journalist and i guess his understanding of technology is at least on par with such journalists as that idiot this weekend that kept insisting that the WiiU discs are standard DVD's. So there's that.

Further more, just to be clear, neither of you are techies either (me neither for that matter, only a fraction of posters on neogaf have any authority on the matter). But it's funny to see people with no more understanding of the WiiU tech than him, targeting him, labeling him as some nitwit. At least he has sources so i'll read what he has to say more carefully than most other posters, including you.

Well, i hope having more knowledge than the average game journalist, it's thanks to that that the questions asked to Shin'en were so thorough But just a mildly advanced & hardware enthusiast techie, for the really advanced techies, you should ask blu, Alstrong and 2/3 other folks around here, i've never hidden that.

About the rest, thanks Some of their posts (from always the same 3 or 4 people) stinks a bit "for the sake of being mean to a guy we have as a target since months", it's a pity, i went past the sterile quote wars and resentment on internet since 2001, it's a waste of time. Let's all be friends !

 

[test_account]

The sad part is that they're not even in HD.

720p is HD too.

 

[Log4Girlz]

I really don't get why so many posters are upset about the Wii U and Nintendo. I assumed that by now most dedicated gamers (i.e people who game a lot) knew that Nintendo just has a different philosophy than Microsoft or Sony. Sure Nintendo could have maxed out specs for the Wii U and sold it at a huge loss but that isn't their strategy at all. They follow the blue ocean strategy and going toe to toe against Microsoft and sony is not a viable or even smart business course of action.

The Wii U was always about finding a new way to be different enough to get people who don't game all the time (read: casuals), to actually buy the thing. Nintendo made sure that the Wii U met the minimum HD requirements mostly because it rather be safe than sorry (plus the console comes with a completely unique control with it).

So yeah, The Wii U isnt true next gen (whatever that means), and there is no point in defending the system. It will fill a niche among people who will buy it for Nintendo games, and tons of casuals who will love the idea of a tablet controller that they can watch movies or do social network things on.

All these spec numbers only matter to a very small percentage of people who actually play games. Sony and Microsofts next system will be significantly stronger than the Wii U and that's okay. If gamers are afraid that the Wii U will be the lead console then they really a prematurely worrying about nothing. Sure japanese devs will support the Wii U, but for western devs they will keep putting their bests efforts on Sonys and Microsofts systems. If you don't like the Wii U, its pretty easy not to buy one.

Quite simply, most of these posters want a "complete package". A system with enough horse-power to run current engines easily and with notable performance improvements is encouraging. It would mean there was no real good reason not to see plenty of multi-plats from third party developers and it would lead one to believe that even next-generation titles should make a respectable appearance on the machine. This only sweetens the deal for Nintendo fans who were already intending to purchase the system. The promise of high quality first party titles with excellent third party ports of current generation hits and respectable ports of next-generation titles is alluring.

But what we had hoped for for so long does not appear to be coming to pass. The Wii U really is the Wii's successor. Meaning, the hardware has inherited the design philosophy of "good enough hardware at bargain basement prices". The Wii U is in no way targeted to anyone who would consider themselves "hardcore". It is once again targeting the family living room. This is disappointing to some who hoped for more than a machine which seems to have been designed around showcasing a gimmick which only Nintendo will consistently use in any creative fashion.

A system that could be genuinely considered a competent entry into the next-generation is something we Nintendo fans were yearning for, and again, will not be receiving, to our disappointment.

 

[Kyuur]

I wonder if people realize that if the 720 and PS4 get the 4-8GB of RAM that have been touted, they're going to have just as slow speeds as the Wii U... You can't get that much RAM for a decent price point without sacrificing something.

 

[Easy_D]

With all this slow ram, slow CPU, and general doom talk about WiiU's power, it seems to me like people already forgot what Nintendo showed at E3. I'm specifically talking about the Zelda tech demo.

It may not look like a huge generational leap, but as far as I know this was put together in a few weeks with the Twilight princess assets and it looks pretty damn good

So what are you so worried about? If the second batch of WIIU games look like this (and I'm sure they will) I'm satisfied

http://m.youtube.com/results?q=zelda tech demo#/watch?v=27Lf4uVuE50

Where did the "Twilight Princess assets" shit even come from? NOTHING in that demo looks like it came out of Twilight Princess. Based on the same style? Yes. But the assets look made for the demo.

 

[Log4Girlz]

I wonder if people realize that if the 720 and PS4 get the 4-8GB of RAM that have been touted, they're going to have just as slow clock speeds as the Wii U... You can't get that much RAM for a decent price point without sacrificing something.

So you think the next-generation systems will have trouble running games like Epic Mickey 2 as well?

 

[BossRoss]

Graphics don't push the console industry anymore, I dont know how to break it to you folks.
We have essentially reached a point where any idea a developer has for his game can be realized in HD on all 3 platforms. Sure one system may have a few more shadows here or there, but its been proven over and over that immersive gameplay trumps graphics.

This is why WiiU is ahead of the curve. They are thinking outside the box for ways the make the experience of playing games more immersive, not by upping the polygon count. I consider myself a non-biased gamer, who owns a 360, a PS3 and a gaming PC with a GTX 570. I had more fun playing ZombiU the other night than I can remember. Having radio messages coming in over the gamepad, sorting my inventory, scanning areas for loot, solving puzzles was very satisfying. The game looks great, and not once did I stop to think, "This sure could use some soft shadows and anti-aliasing...nyahhhh".

If the Kinect, Move, Wiimotes have proved anything, its that console manufacturers are looking for new immersive ways to present gameplay ideas. Its no longer a table flop contest to see who has the largest videocard under the hood.

 

[Taurus]

why the fuck do people defend nintendo? they barely invest in making good hardware, with the NSMB series they barely invest in making decent games with one of their most beloved if not their MOST beloved character. Why do you people continue to defend and invest in a company that doesnt care about you anymore? we're no longer their target demographic. i say screw em.

Because Nintendo is a games company, that makes games. No music, no movie, no format war bullshit etc. Games.

And, without Nintendo game industry would crash and burn.

 

[Bam Bam Baklava]

Wii U being the lead platform? Am I really seeing someone try to make that case?

 

[charsace]

Looking at this:

And this:

DX11/Opengl4 is leading next gen.

Fixed

 

[Log4Girlz]

Graphics don't push the console industry anymore, I dont know how to break it to you folks.
We have essentially reached a point where any idea a developer has for his game can be realized in HD on all 3 platforms. Sure one system may have a few more shadows here or there, but its been proven over and over that immersive gameplay trumps graphics.

This is why WiiU is ahead of the curve. They are thinking outside the box for ways the make the experience of playing games more immersive, not by upping the polygon count. I consider myself a non-biased gamer, who owns a 360, a PS3 and a gaming PC with a GTX 570. I had more fun playing ZombiU the other night than I can remember. Having radio messages coming in over the gamepad, sorting my inventory, scanning areas for loot, solving puzzles was very satisfying. The game looks great, and not once did I stop to think, "This sure could use some soft shadows and anti-aliasing...nyahhhh".

If the Kinect, Move, Wiimotes have proved anything, its that console manufacturers are looking for new immersive ways to present gameplay ideas. Its no longer a table flop contest to see who has the largest videocard under the hood.

Graphics are still an integral part of the equation. The Wii U pushes dramatically improved graphics over the Wii.

 

[grimshawish]

why the fuck do people defend nintendo? they barely invest in making good hardware, with the NSMB series they barely invest in making decent games with one of their most beloved if not their MOST beloved character. Why do you people continue to defend and invest in a company that doesnt care about you anymore? we're no longer their target demographic. i say screw em.

They hold fruit up and stare at it without explanation during video streams directly to their customers.

 

[Raytow]

Because Nintendo is a games company, that makes games. No music, no movie, no format war bullshit etc. Games.

And, without Nintendo game industry would crash and burn.

hahahahahahah ohohohoohohho oh shit, you are serious?

 

[The Abominable Snowman]

I wonder if people realize that if the 720 and PS4 get the 4-8GB of RAM that have been touted, they're going to have just as slow speeds as the Wii U... You can't get that much RAM for a decent price point without sacrificing something.

Nintendo chose low power DDR components which are actually more expensive than faster, fullsize full voltage DDR chips.