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Xbox Live Player Rep is a JOKE

i dont get how making another thread about it on gaf is really gonna fix the problem....

why dont people with this issue just hit up Microsoft or Phil Spencer about it?
 

hardvibes

Member
I've had enough of this bs my microsoft. The rep system is broken.

Forza Motorsport 5 is laggy as fuck, but a lot of player are not intelligent enough to understand this and just report you without even knowing what the hell happened in the race. It's useless to say sorry, or trying to explain. They don't want to listen and start screaming, judging you with their fellow players in the same lobby.

And why with Xbox One you can't even give GOOD rep to a player? On X360 I could.
 
Haha ive posted in the Enforcement Forum some days ago and today i got this Robotic answer...

It really helps...not.

Your reputation has fallen due to negative feedback filed against you by members of the Xbox Live community. The conduct that caused this may include, but is not limited to:
- Communicating with other Xbox Live users in an offensive, derogatory, or disruptive manner
- Utilizing unauthorized hardware/software/account modifications to gain an advantage or disrupt the competitive landscape of Xbox Live
- Exploiting game vulnerabilities or glitches to gain an unfair competitive advantage
- Killing your teammates, quitting early, griefing/trolling other players, or not exhibiting good sportsmanship
If your reputation reaches “Avoid Me” status, you’ll most likely be matched with other low reputation players, and you’ll begin to lose privileges like being able to broadcast your gameplay using Twitch. To improve your reputation score, interact well with others on Live by playing online multiplayer matches without receiving negative feedback.
 
I remember my rep was fine during the Halo 3 days but then Reach came along and it was a difficult game for some to pick up compared to Halo 3. I guess the dmr was too different. I just remember a few matches were i would do really really well, and all of a sudden i noticed my negative feedback coming saying i was modding the game or so form of cheating. I am surprised I am still on "Good" Status.

However people on Halo MCC seem to be less bitchy about it lately. The other day I played lots of H2A games with some XBL friends, and we came across the same teams a few times and we would joke around before the match started cracking jokes like:

"Yeah you kicked our ass last game but dont worry we memorized all your moves last game so we got this" Just fun things like that. Even got a text message that said, "Good game and tell your mates the same"

I feel like there is a bit more positivity out there and even one of the players said the same.
 
I've had enough of this bs my microsoft. The rep system is broken.

Forza Motorsport 5 is laggy as fuck, but a lot of player are not intelligent enough to understand this and just report you without even knowing what the hell happened in the race. It's useless to say sorry, or trying to explain. They don't want to listen and start screaming, judging you with their fellow players in the same lobby.

And why with Xbox One you can't even give GOOD rep to a player? On X360 I could.

Back in 2006 I had people scream down the mic that they will report me in PGR3 for winning a race clean, it's rather sad.
 

joecanada

Member
Haha ive posted in the Enforcement Forum some days ago and today i got this Robotic answer...

It really helps...not.


yeah this does not help most at all, but I will address an earlier topic that was raised, if you are repeatedly spawn killing people or trapping them in their base, this could fit the description of "exploiting game vulnerabilities" and you should probably expect people may want to "avoid" you....

I mean I don't care personally but I could see how that could happen.
 
yeah this does not help most at all, but I will address an earlier topic that was raised, if you are repeatedly spawn killing people or trapping them in their base, this could fit the description of "exploiting game vulnerabilities" and you should probably expect people may want to "avoid" you....

I mean I don't care personally but I could see how that could happen.

Which proves that the system is a total waste and detriment to Xbox Live players. This whole thing is just such an illogical mess it makes my head spin.

A video game's design problems/exploits/glitches etc are the result of the developers code. A person purchases the software and proceeds to play it with the freedom that they choose. If a player comes across a flaw in the game and accidentally/intentionally uses it, it's not the player's fault. The developers should be held responsible and patch their game.

Where is this "blame the user" mentality acceptable in any other industry/service?

I just want to play the game & service that I paid for. I haven't used glitches or exploits and I haven't harassed anyone. This has gone beyond blaming the user to just an "every man for himself" context with the facade of regulation. The current system actually supports online bullying. At least in games like CSGO a report gets sent to Overwatch users who then watch the game and vote if you were cheating/trolling or not.

If this doesn't get fixed soon I'm going to stop giving Microsoft my money for their Xbox Live service.
 
Your reputation has fallen due to negative feedback filed against you by members of the Xbox Live community. The conduct that caused this may include, but is not limited to:
- Communicating with other Xbox Live users in an offensive, derogatory, or disruptive manner
- Utilizing unauthorized hardware/software/account modifications to gain an advantage or disrupt the competitive landscape of Xbox Live
- Exploiting game vulnerabilities or glitches to gain an unfair competitive advantage
- Killing your teammates, quitting early, griefing/trolling other players, or not exhibiting good sportsmanship
If your reputation reaches “Avoid Me” status, you’ll most likely be matched with other low reputation players, and you’ll begin to lose privileges like being able to broadcast your gameplay using Twitch. To improve your reputation score, interact well with others on Live by playing online multiplayer matches without receiving negative feedback.

lol, is this some sort of joke? the system is open to abuse from disgruntled users and they're trying to blame your bad rep on nefarious stuff you could be doing but actually aren't?

there really only should be two options when sending player feedback. giving only good rep and blocking another player from your account. simple.
 
lol, is this some sort of joke? the system is open to abuse from disgruntled users and they're trying to blame your bad rep on nefarious stuff you could be doing but actually aren't?

there really only should be two options when sending player feedback. giving only good rep and blocking another player from your account. simple.

EXACTLY.

I was excited to find out there was a support forum for this, but was immediately dumbstruck to see that every post I clicked on had a captain obvious response that avoids helping the player's issue in the first place. It's victim blaming. This should not be tolerated, especially for a service we pay for.
 

jem0208

Member
I don't think the idea of player feedback is necessarily a bad one, it's the execution which is the real problem.

The main issues with the system is that its far too easy to give a bad report and you don't need any evidence.

I think if they made the whole process a bit of a faff you'd stop the majority of people from leaving reports because they couldn't be bothered. They could also require people to attach a clip of the player's wrong doing and write a description, that would cut false reports down even more and could allow for some form of moderation on Xbox's end.
 

Omega

Banned
I don't think the idea of player feedback is necessarily a bad one, it's the execution which is the real problem.

In a perfect world player feedback is a great idea. Unfortunately we don't live in a perfect world. You get reported if you suck, if you're too good, if you're average. Using a weapon someone thinks is OP? Reported. I don't like your avatar. Reported.
 

JeffG

Member
In a perfect world player feedback is a great idea. Unfortunately we don't live in a perfect world. You get reported if you suck, if you're too good, if you're average. Using a weapon someone thinks is OP? Reported. I don't like your avatar. Reported.

They need to cross reference it with what a player wants in his online experience.

Example

User selects one of the following

a) just learning
b) Just have fun
c) Competitive Matches

etc etc

If the user is in (c) then Unsportsmen like conduct isn't allowed as a complaint.

if you are in a or b and get lots of unsportsmen like complaints. Push that user into (c)

If you paired that with a match making system that splits users on skills, it may have a chance to work.

One issue would be splitting the groups up so small that you wouldn't have enough players.
 
I don't think the idea of player feedback is necessarily a bad one, it's the execution which is the real problem.

The main issues with the system is that its far too easy to give a bad report and you don't need any evidence.

I think if they made the whole process a bit of a faff you'd stop the majority of people from leaving reports because they couldn't be bothered. They could also require people to attach a clip of the player's wrong doing and write a description, that would cut false reports down even more and could allow for some form of moderation on Xbox's end.

Which would be impossible across all of the games. It's a lost cause IMO.

Didn't the MCC opt out of the system altogether? lol
 

Akai__

Member
Which would be impossible across all of the games. It's a lost cause IMO.

Didn't the MCC opt out of the system altogether? lol

No, it only ignores your personal "Blocked Players" list for ranked now. Previously, if you blocked someone, you would never play again with the blocked person. This only works for social now.
 
They need to cross reference it with what a player wants in his online experience.

Example

User selects one of the following

a) just learning
b) Just have fun
c) Competitive Matches

etc etc

If the user is in (c) then Unsportsmen like conduct isn't allowed as a complaint.

if you are in a or b and get lots of unsportsmen like complaints. Push that user into (c)

If you paired that with a match making system that splits users on skills, it may have a chance to work.

One issue would be splitting the groups up so small that you wouldn't have enough players.
bro you're still missing the point. even as you described, an unregulated, unverified reputation system that impairs the reported person's ability to play the games they paid for, is rife with potential for abuse.

You know the thing about a good matchmaking system? You don't need to choose between a, b, or c, because 90% of the time it'll know where you belong...

I mean, I get where you're coming from, but in most shooters there's less serious playlists for those who are just starting the game or who just want to dick around and have fun. There's no need to bend over backwards and change how matchmaking works to suit a broken reputation system and not the other way around.
 
No, it only ignores your personal "Blocked Players" list for ranked now. Previously, if you blocked someone, you would never play again with the blocked person. This only works for social now.

okay thanks. so i guess halo 5 could be full of the same abuse as gears...

do we know how many games it takes to get your rep back?
 

E92 M3

Member
Have you ever thought....

Hey, I could mentor a player like this

or

Maybe I will let him out of the corner before killing him

or

Maybe I will ignore him totally

or

Ha...I will let him kill me and he will feel so good



There are lots of things you can do. No one is forcing you to do anything

Its just a video game

YGQZHYC.png
 

Akai__

Member
You know the thing about a good matchmaking system? You don't need to choose between a, b, or c, because 90% of the time it'll know where you belong...

It sucks so much that TrueSkill has been seemingly dropped across all games.

okay thanks. so i guess halo 5 could be full of the same abuse as gears...

do we know how many games it takes to get your rep back?

Who knows, Jumper is playing Neverwinter since yesterday and is still on "Avoid Me"... Fucking facepalm.
 

joecanada

Member
Which proves that the system is a total waste and detriment to Xbox Live players. This whole thing is just such an illogical mess it makes my head spin.

A video game's design problems/exploits/glitches etc are the result of the developers code. A person purchases the software and proceeds to play it with the freedom that they choose. If a player comes across a flaw in the game and accidentally/intentionally uses it, it's not the player's fault. The developers should be held responsible and patch their game.

Where is this "blame the user" mentality acceptable in any other industry/service?

I just want to play the game & service that I paid for. I haven't used glitches or exploits and I haven't harassed anyone. This has gone beyond blaming the user to just an "every man for himself" context with the facade of regulation. The current system actually supports online bullying. At least in games like CSGO a report gets sent to Overwatch users who then watch the game and vote if you were cheating/trolling or not.

If this doesn't get fixed soon I'm going to stop giving Microsoft my money for their Xbox Live service.


well again I'm not blaming you or accusing you of doing anything, and I don't personally care, but I will say that if a player comes across a flaw in the game and exploits it this is sometimes referred to as "cheating" and perhaps it is on the developer to fix it but if you could for instance drop below the level and shoot people in WAW i would expect people would "avoid" you and I wouldn't blame them, why would they want to play against you when it's inherently unfair and probably not even fun?
Spawn exploits exist and developers I think have a hard time "fixing " them but I don't think you should be surprised when players report you if you are spawnkilling them, because they don't want to play with people who exploit them and are basically preventing them from even playing or having any fun.

For example even minor things in sports are instantly "fixed". When the patriots last year were reporting or not reporting players as eligble receivers (sorry i forgot the actual method they used) people said they exploited the system, the league was pissed and it was instantly fixed. black and white, fixed. The problem is developers can't just instantly fix this.

It's sad really because battlefield has the perfect solution to this, AA guns, but then they made them to weak to actually punish players who were base camping.... it was a perfect opportunity and one I feel they should have used.

Whether you believe it's right or wrong no one will actually play with you if you do these exploits so I don't understand the point of doing it and then being surprised when others "avoid " you either actively or by reporting you. Many games have terms of service that speak against using any type of exploits.

For instance I played on a server in BF3 where the clan who owned the server just sat on Firestorm and spawn camped the enemies for hours... I actually went into the server a few times by accident, spawned in a jet and started bombing their tanks like mad, then they would kick me so I went back in a few more times and got banned. I mean in that case they own the server so whatever, but what the hell were they doing? There was like 7 people in there and they were just quitting out... I guess people find different stuff fun.........
 
well again I'm not blaming you or accusing you of doing anything, and I don't personally care, but I will say that if a player comes across a flaw in the game and exploits it this is sometimes referred to as "cheating" and perhaps it is on the developer to fix it but if you could for instance drop below the level and shoot people in WAW i would expect people would "avoid" you and I wouldn't blame them, why would they want to play against you when it's inherently unfair and probably not even fun?
Spawn exploits exist and developers I think have a hard time "fixing " them but I don't think you should be surprised when players report you if you are spawnkilling them, because they don't want to play with people who exploit them and are basically preventing them from even playing or having any fun.

For example even minor things in sports are instantly "fixed". When the patriots last year were reporting or not reporting players as eligble receivers (sorry i forgot the actual method they used) people said they exploited the system, the league was pissed and it was instantly fixed. black and white, fixed. The problem is developers can't just instantly fix this.

It's sad really because battlefield has the perfect solution to this, AA guns, but then they made them to weak to actually punish players who were base camping.... it was a perfect opportunity and one I feel they should have used.

Whether you believe it's right or wrong no one will actually play with you if you do these exploits so I don't understand the point of doing it and then being surprised when others "avoid " you either actively or by reporting you. Many games have terms of service that speak against using any type of exploits.

For instance I played on a server in BF3 where the clan who owned the server just sat on Firestorm and spawn camped the enemies for hours... I actually went into the server a few times by accident, spawned in a jet and started bombing their tanks like mad, then they would kick me so I went back in a few more times and got banned. I mean in that case they own the server so whatever, but what the hell were they doing? There was like 7 people in there and they were just quitting out... I guess people find different stuff fun.........

I get you man. I'm not defending using glitches and exploits, but I'm not willing to defend the reactionary system in place. A flaw in software is a developer mistake. If a player is using an exploit he isn't manipulating the software, he/she is simply using it. The problem escalates especially if a glitch is easy enough to pull off and people begin to use it as a matter of self defense and preemptive measures because they don't want to put themselves at an unfair disadvantage and would lose otherwise.

This thread wasn't meant to be about that, but it certainly ties into the report system which can reveal the ambiguity of it all.

The main issue is unhindered abuse of the system which hinders innocent players from being able to play.

This isn't innocent until proven guilty or even guilty until proven innocent. You are guilty because someone said so. It's ass backwards.
 

akira28

Member
Wow people fucking with your XBL rep because their pissed at you doing well in Gears of War.

Did I fall into a time portal into 2006 again?

lol, Halo flashbacks.

Too aggressive in play, brehs. I mean, just because I kill you extremely dead, extremely well, in ways you could not have foreseen, doesn't mean I'm a bad person.
 
Some people on the Gears forums have a decent idea. Those who are affected should contact IGN @ http://www.ign.com/support/editorial and let them know this is affecting us.

Hopefully a little press could help push Microsoft to act a little sooner (or at all).

EDIT: I don't know how affective contacting IGN is, but it can't hurt I suppose. I'm getting desperate.
 

Impulsor

Member
This rep system is BS. Seriously, I'm legit scared of going online with the xbox one because of this. I just play private matches and coop with my friends mostly.

I should not be held accountable for butthurt idiots who can't stand being killed or losing against someone better than them.

That and the continuous problems I've suffered while playing MCC with friends are making me hate XBL. With a passion. And also the interface of the console.
 

JeffG

Member
What the fuck. That guy's gotta be trolling, I refuse to believe anyone can believe the ridiculous things he says.

Its ridiculous to have empathy?

Interesting.

The truth is...yes I am a total dick and I love killing those fucking scrubs and I am trolling you.

Is that easier to believe?
 
I'm going to start reporting people who get spawned camped for being unskilled and then they will have to play with all the people reported for being too good.
 
There is an unskilled option, at least last time I checked on the 360, that you can report them for. I don't want to play with these garbage players just as much as they don't want to play against me.

Though to win all I really need is for them to not die because I can take care of the enemy myself.
 

TRios Zen

Member
Wait there are people defending spawn-camping? HAHA, oh man.

I thought there was some form of review on bad feedback? Like it was all reviewed/curated in some way. Sucks that it's being abused, particularly in a game as inconsistent as Gears.

I love it you know, but there is some crazy inconsistency still. Probably as a tribute to ye old host advantage.
 
Update:

Xbox Support says we need to play another MP game and not get reported for our rep to go up. Well jokes on me because the only other MP game I have is the MCC and I just tried to get into a game across a handful of playlists with no success.

So I'm completely hosed.
 

Welfare

Member
Update:

Xbox Support says we need to play another MP game and not get reported for our rep to go up. Well jokes on me because the only other MP game I have is the MCC and I just tried to get into a game across a handful of playlists with no success.

So I'm completely hosed.

Download KI and play some games.
 
Yeah so I was checking out my reccomended friends for XBL and most of them are popular XBL streamers or people who make great game dvr videos. Wow their rep was always "Needs Improvement" or whatever its called. Yeah this needs work.
 

algert

Banned
I like the goal of the program - to separate social and anti-social players - but I don't like how Microsoft is trying to accomplish it. For example, I don't believe players ought to have the ability to report eachother for cheating on Xbox One, since such a thing is effectively impossible for 99.99% of the population.
 
Update:

Xbox Support says we need to play another MP game and not get reported for our rep to go up. Well jokes on me because the only other MP game I have is the MCC and I just tried to get into a game across a handful of playlists with no success.

So I'm completely hosed.

Try Neverwinter, its Free. Yeah its a RPG/MMO but kinda fun when you into it a bit. Hardline is another game that helps. The more players you match, so faster will the Rep go up.
 

UberTag

Member
The trick on how to beat this system is that when you go online during the first 4-6 weeks of a game's release - when all of the casuals are engaged - you need to intentionally lose. Throw matches. Be actively terrible so you don't get your rep tarnished. And, if you play in a team mode, you need to play with people who are all doing the same thing... because if you're the only one throwing and the rest of your group is schooling the opposition, you'll still be reported by association.

Then, after you've amassed countless losses and the casuals quit playing, you can go back to playing up to your actual skill level again against the gamers that are left. Just be mindful of special game events, sales, school holidays or Christmas... things that might result in an influx of casuals dipping their toes in the pond again.
 

Mista

Banned
Its a BIG FUCKING JOKE! Me and my clan just dropped to "Needs Improvement" & "Avoid me" just because we're good in Gears of War. Fuck these hating noobs. Now we cant even find a single game while searching in Gears. Fucking disgrace. Fuck this fucking shit Microsoft!
 
UPDATE
*They changed my rep from red "avoid me" to yellow*

Xbox Live Enforcement team responded to my post via email. Here is the response:
"[DO NOT REPLY to this email address. It is not monitored.]

Hello Sir Fahzgoolin,

Thank you for the inquiry! Following an investigation, the Xbox Live Policy and Enforcement Team has elected to adjust the reputation of this account. However, make sure to avoid in engaging in deliberately disruptive behavior as this can result in a drop in your reputation score again. Please continue to follow the Xbox Live Code of Conduct."


I don't know what "deliberately disruptive behavior" they are talking about, but heck...at least they did SOMETHING.
 
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