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shiba5 · Jan 28, 2015

Uncle Rupee said:
I don't see the general public harassing female developers. It seems to be a fairly small section of gamers. And they're hardly targeting only female developers. Using these idiots to explain the lack of women in game development, when this is a relatively new trend only made possible by social media, doesn't really get to the heart of the issue, which seems to be the lack of interest in STEM topics shown by girls and women.

It's not a new trend. It's just more visible since we have Twitter and other social media.
I've been in the tech industry since the mid-90s. Sexism was endemic. One guy told me he couldn't believe I was a DBA because women were "too stupid" to work on computers. I've also been sexually harrassed plenty of times, two times that were egregious enough that someone got fired - and I don't like to make waves so no one even knew about all the other instances. Every woman I knew personally had a story about being objectified, belittled, or harrassed.
Now tell me again why women don't find these careers inviting...

JDSN · Jan 28, 2015

Uncle Rupee said:
That is the real problem, and there are much smarter people than me who are trying to figure it out. However, since it appears to start when they are fairly young, it doesn't seem to me to be a result of harassment or sexism. It could be that male and female brains are wired differently enough that this is a natural gap, and no amount of hand-wringing by anyone will be able to change it. It's a problem that extends way beyond the game development community.

Is this the same hard-wiring that made men suddenly stop becoming teachers, coincidentally by the time when women started entering in the field, which triggered the profession itself to become less desirable and thus less the paid than what it was?

Please tell me in which part of your hard-wired theory this real-life example fits? Ugh? Where is the data that refutes it? Where is the explanation of the shift and society punishing that shift by lowering the pay of this women and men? And no, this video doesnt count as evidence.

Mael · Jan 28, 2015

Krejlooc said:
You forgot the bit where people post pseudoscience to justify their prejudice.

Holy crap that's the kind of thing that makes me want to strangle kitten and puppies.
It would at least be funny if they used funny pseudoscience like phrenology or astrology but no, they have to come up with shitty middle school logic and call it biology or some other name they have no idea what it is.
At least the creationists don't try to slander a whole part of science with their shit.

I mean women are not made for CompSci? Why the fuck were most of my teachers female? Why is there such a huge number of female near retiring in the computer field?

Hoje0308 · Jan 28, 2015

Uncle Rupee said:
That is the real problem, and there are much smarter people than me who are trying to figure it out. However, since it appears to start when they are fairly young, it doesn't seem to me to be a result of harassment or sexism. It could be that male and female brains are wired differently enough that this is a natural gap, and no amount of hand-wringing by anyone will be able to change it. It's a problem that extends way beyond the game development community.

Or it's that people enforce gender roles from birth and would rather say, "Oh them? Maybe their brains are just different than ours" than actually take the time to examine the issue. And who are these people that are trying to "figure it out?" If that's the case, then you would be aware of their work and would have educated yourself, no? Now if you haven't made yourself aware and haven't read any studies, then aren't you simply trying to wave it away? And then you go on to make a statement about assumed differences between male and female brain makeup, but not before attempting to relieve yourself of responsibility for what it is you're about to say by stating that you're not smart enough to figure it out.

Alex_Mexico · Jan 28, 2015

Labor said:
He started the Gamergate hashtag

He's not as vocal now but still spits out filth periodically

Lately he's been more busy bashing Obama and democrats and thus not as active as he was before about gamergate but he still spots garbage about it from time to time.

And for those asking, his involvement in gaming extends to a few voice acting roles. He has gone on record saying he's not a gamer by any extension of the word. Somehow he thought there was something to gain by becoming one of the most high profile gamergater on the Internet.

Dragonborn · Jan 28, 2015

One of the reasons I never liked her is that she just kind of feels fake, like she isn't a "real" gamer. Now I'm not saying you have to play a lot of games to critize them but that just rubbed me the wrong way. Admittedly,it's been well over a year since I last paid her any attention so this may have changed but I think that's why she faces so much resistance.

Now, since I am in no way saying that this is reason to attack her. I'm not defending the people who wrote these stupid comments, I'm just giving my own personal reason for why I don't really like her. That said, I would never ask her to shut up or threaten her just because I happen to disagree with her. I feel that goes without saying but threads like these feel like walking on egg shells

SuperLuigi · Jan 28, 2015

I can guarantee you it is not only teenagers posting this bile and doing the harassment, it is grown men and women as well. Just ask any publicly active feminist.

The Technomancer · Jan 28, 2015

Dragonborn said:
One of the reasons I never liked her is that she just kind of feels fake, like she isn't a "real" gamer. Now I'm not saying you have to play a lot of games to critize them but that just rubbed me the wrong way. Admittedly,it's been well over a year since I last paid her any attention so this may have changed but I think that's why she faces so much resistance.

Now, since I am in no way saying that this is reason to attack her. I'm not defending the people who wrote these stupid comments, I'm just giving my own personal reason for why I don't really like her. That said, I would never ask her to shut up or threaten her just because I happen to disagree with her. I feel that goes without saying but threads like these feel like walking on egg shells

Serious question: why did you feel that how you dislike here is relevant to the topic at hand?

Dog Problems · Jan 28, 2015

Dragonborn said:
One of the reasons I never liked her is that she just kind of feels fake, like she isn't a "real" gamer. Now I'm not saying you have to play a lot of games to critize them but that just rubbed me the wrong way. Admittedly,it's been well over a year since I last paid her any attention so this may have changed but I think that's why she faces so much resistance.

Now, since I am in no way saying that this is reason to attack her. I'm not defending the people who wrote these stupid comments, I'm just giving my own personal reason for why I don't really like her. That said, I would never ask her to shut up or threaten her just because I happen to disagree with her. I feel that goes without saying but threads like these feel like walking on egg shells

What is a "real gamer?" What does it take to become one?

Dragonborn · Jan 28, 2015

The Technomancer said:
Serious question: why did you feel that how you dislike here is relevant to the topic at hand?

People were talking about whether or not she was a "real gamer" which reminded me of what I thought.

shiba5 · Jan 28, 2015

Dog Problems said:
What is a "real gamer?" What does it take to become one?

Video game DNA. Duh!

Right. So what does it matter if she's a "real gamer" or not? Every movie critic is not a director or an actor.

Palette Swap · Jan 28, 2015

Just for some fucking perspective.

Amir0x said:
I want to once again point out, as I have done the last few threads about harassment, that this great and well intentioned community which I genuinely love has once again fallen for the trap - myself included this time - of being distracted from the actual issue in order to chase down people placing down variations of irrelevant arguments that have nothing to do with the problem being discussed.

This thread is ostensibly about harassment and how bad it is, but look what it has turned into it.

We have the same M.O. of GGers in all these sorts of topics:

1. "I don't support harassment and this is wrong" BUT ____________. (Fill in the Blank: she's disgusting, she's a fraud)
2. "I think she likes this stuff because she makes money off the attention." (accusations of insincerity based off an absurd premise)
3. "I don't think she's really a gamer anyway." (Why does it matter if she is a gamer? What does that have to do with harassment in this industry and what she is highlighting in this OP?)

In doing so, they subtly shift the conversation away from ground in which they obviously have no ground - their persistent harassment campaigns and grotesque views on women and the industries treatment of them - to arguments about how legitimate a person is, how sinful a person is or whatever in a out-in-the-open attempt at character assassination.

It's the oldest trick in the book, but it's being used to stifle conversation about these issues with such brutal efficiency that it's even taking someone like me who is extremely aware of these methods for a ride.

Dragonborn said:
One of the reasons I never liked her is that she just kind of feels fake, like she isn't a "real" gamer. Now I'm not saying you have to play a lot of games to critize them but that just rubbed me the wrong way. Admittedly,it's been well over a year since I last paid her any attention so this may have changed but I think that's why she faces so much resistance.

Now, since I am in no way saying that this is reason to attack her. I'm not defending the people who wrote these stupid comments, I'm just giving my own personal reason for why I don't really like her. That said, I would never ask her to shut up or threaten her just because I happen to disagree with her. I feel that goes without saying but threads like these feel like walking on egg shells

Edit: welp, see below.

Amir0x · Jan 28, 2015

Dragonborn said:
One of the reasons I never liked her is that she just kind of feels fake, like she isn't a "real" gamer. (POINT THREE) Now I'm not saying you have to play a lot of games to critize them but that just rubbed me the wrong way. Admittedly,it's been well over a year since I last paid her any attention so this may have changed but I think that's why she faces so much resistance.

Now, since I am in no way saying that this is reason to attack her. I'm not defending the people who wrote these stupid comments (POINT ONE), I'm just giving my own personal reason for why I don't really like her (POINT ONE). That said, I would never ask her to shut up or threaten her just because I happen to disagree with her. I feel that goes without saying but threads like these feel like walking on egg shells

.

Amir0x said:
We have the same M.O. of GGers in all these sorts of topics:

1. "I don't support harassment and this is wrong" BUT ____________. (Fill in the Blank: she's disgusting, she's a fraud)
2. "I think she likes this stuff because she makes money off the attention." (accusations of insincerity based off an absurd premise)
3. "I don't think she's really a gamer anyway." (Why does it matter if she is a gamer? What does that have to do with harassment in this industry and what she is highlighting in this OP?)

Damn was hoping for a three for three.

bsod · Jan 28, 2015

Dragonborn said:
One of the reasons I never liked her is that she just kind of feels fake, like she isn't a "real" gamer. Now I'm not saying you have to play a lot of games to critize them but that just rubbed me the wrong way. Admittedly,it's been well over a year since I last paid her any attention so this may have changed but I think that's why she faces so much resistance.

Now, since I am in no way saying that this is reason to attack her. I'm not defending the people who wrote these stupid comments, I'm just giving my own personal reason for why I don't really like her. That said, I would never ask her to shut up or threaten her just because I happen to disagree with her. I feel that goes without saying but threads like these feel like walking on egg shells

http://youtu.be/B7xRV6bNGNU

shiba5 · Jan 28, 2015

Palette Swap said:
Just for some fucking perspective.

We just need a link to that skull guy for the trifecta of shitty GG rebuttal videos.

Demon Lizardman · Jan 28, 2015

If you don't agree with some of her videos, there are better ways to say you don't like them than just sending death threats and acting like a complete psychopath.

Fine Ham Abounds · Jan 28, 2015

Tangentially, am I correct in perceiving an increasing number of "New Atheists" falling for GamerGate? I can only assume this is somehow a phenomenon of spending too much time up your own ass on Reddit. It's an odd thing to see Thunderf00t of all people come up in regards to something like GamerGate, but I guess in recent years he's followed Dick Dawkins off the edge of the Earth.

Thankfully my heart won't be broken unless Jonathan Miller for some reason comes out in favor of GamerGate.

EGM1966 · Jan 28, 2015

Predictably immature and vile responses. And goddamn this thread exposed a few interesting viewpoints too.

Regret Upon Approval · Jan 28, 2015

I meant to post this here but clicked on a post that went to another thread and didn't realize it until it was too late.
My bad.

Anton Sugar said:
Relevant (from ami's thread)

Emily Matthew's survey/study:

Not quite relevant to video games but related to the women and STEM majors discussion arc.

http://www.goldieblox.com/pages/about

Basically a woman coming up with something to encourage interest in engineering for young girls. It was something we talked about in a college course.
I thought it was an impressive undertaking and a great story so I thought I should share it with people when relevant.

I don't know if it is thread worthy alone though.

Dragonborn · Jan 28, 2015

I have no dog in this fight guys, just putting my own opinion out there. I don't hate the woman, far from it, I just personally don't agree with the way she goes about things.

If that suddenly makes me a Gamergater or puts me on equal ground with people sending death threats then wow, well what can I say?

Goes to show both sides have extremes.

ironmang · Jan 28, 2015

oni-link said:
Look at all the games with female leads from last get, basically Tomb Raider and Remember Me, the former was sold off the back of the names legacy and Remember Me was hindered by constant heel dragging by the publisher (they had to cut the lead character being in a relationship in case guys felt weird playing as a girl with a boyfriend)

Then we had Bayonetta and Lollipop Chainsaw, neither doing an amazing job at being inclusive

Even Bioshock Infinite wouldn't put Elizabeth on the cover, and Naughty Dog had to fight to get Ellie on the cover of TLoU

When girls do try and make games they get treated in the same way as Anita

No one is saying stop making games as they are now, they are saying lets make more diverse games that are inclusive to more people

Its not just women, it's all minorities, there are very games with lead characters that are not white males

It's easy to say there should be more female/minority leads in AAA video games but for that to happen someone needs to be willing to risk money on it. I haven't watched her videos in awhile (can't stand the snark) but I don't remember her talking about indie games all that much. That seems to be a better starting point for change.

The Technomancer · Jan 28, 2015

Fine Ham Abounds said:
Tangentially, am I correct in perceiving an increasing number of "New Atheists" falling for GamerGate? I can only assume this is somehow a phenomenon of spending too much time up your own ass on Reddit. It's an odd thing to see Thunderf00t of all people come up in regards to something like GamerGate, but I guess in recent years he's followed Dick Dawkins off the edge of the Earth.

There's a subsection of atheism that that's true for certainly. Man in Black had a good storify on this:
https://storify.com/a_man_in_black/the-redpill-right

shiba5 · Jan 28, 2015

Dragonborn said:
I have no dog in this fight guys, just putting my own opinion out there. I don't hate the woman, far from it, I just personally don't agree with the way she goes about things.

If that suddenly makes me a Gamergater or puts me on equal ground with people sending death threats then wow, well what can I say?

Goes to show both sides have extremes.

Let me get you a torch for all those strawmen.

Sorry for the snark, but people responding to your posts, rather gently I might add, is not extreme. Nor did anyone claim your comments were equivalent to death threats. I mean, have some perspective.

Dog Problems · Jan 28, 2015

Dragonborn said:
I have no dog in this fight guys, just putting my own opinion out there. I don't hate the woman, far from it, I just personally don't agree with the way she goes about things.

If that suddenly makes me a Gamergater or puts me on equal ground with people sending death threats then wow, well what can I say?

Goes to show both sides have extremes.

I'm not trying to give you crap or anything. I'm sincerely curious as to what you think constitutes a gamer.

hey_monkey · Jan 28, 2015

Every time someone pulls the REAL GAMER nonsense, I just think NOT THIS SHIT AGAIN. It doesn't matter if it was followed by the most brilliant reasoning possible. I wouldnt even see it. My brain just shuts down.

Dragonborn · Jan 28, 2015

shiba5 said:
Let me get you a torch for all those strawmen.

Bro, some of you guys are basically saying I'm the same as those dudes just because I personally don't like her videos.

You can bet I find that insulting, and rather extreme.

Amir0x · Jan 28, 2015

Dragonborn said:
I have no dog in this fight guys, just putting my own opinion out there. I don't hate the woman, far from it, I just personally don't agree with the way she goes about things.

If that suddenly makes me a Gamergater or puts me on equal ground with people sending death threats then wow, well what can I say?

Goes to show both sides have extremes.

Nobody said that, so what you can say is something that isn't a strawman instead.

What we are pointing out is that your comment had nothing to do with this discussion, was a disgusting distraction from the issue of harassment, and is the exact playbook used by GGers to distract from the serious issues brought up in the topic, whether you are a member or not.

Perhaps stop using their playbook if you're going to pretend to be so indignant about it. I want you to re-read this comment three or four times before responding so you can grasp what is actually being said.

Hoje0308 · Jan 28, 2015

Dragonborn said:
One of the reasons I never liked her is that she just kind of feels fake, like she isn't a "real" gamer. Now I'm not saying you have to play a lot of games to critize them but that just rubbed me the wrong way. Admittedly,it's been well over a year since I last paid her any attention so this may have changed but I think that's why she faces so much resistance.

Now, since I am in no way saying that this is reason to attack her. I'm not defending the people who wrote these stupid comments, I'm just giving my own personal reason for why I don't really like her. That said, I would never ask her to shut up or threaten her just because I happen to disagree with her. I feel that goes without saying but threads like these feel like walking on egg shells

Again with the, "She's not an expert" nonsense. Do I have to be a Political Science major to know that Jim Crow laws were wrong, or that Joseph Goebbels was a cunt? And do I need to be a journalist or an expert in the field of social networking bullies and douchebags to say that the people who threaten her with rape and murder for making a video are worthless scumbags?
The answer, if you're having trouble with it, is no. You don't need to be an avid gamer to research the industry. Besides, if she really isn't a gamer, the fact that she still manages to make all those videos is both more impressive and also much more depressing. Impressive because of her output, but depressing because, if misogyny is so prevalent in the industry that even a relative outsider can find enough examples to make a series of lengthy videos, than the problem seems even worse than many would like to think. And she's still right.

CosmicQueso · Jan 28, 2015

Dragonborn said:
Admittedly,it's been well over a year since I last paid her any attention

Dragonborn said:
I just personally don't agree with the way she goes about things.

Hmmm. So which is it? Do you ignore her or do you not agree with the way she goes about things? These are somewhat mutually exclusive, no?

shiba5 · Jan 28, 2015

Dragonborn said:
Bro, some of you guys are basically saying I'm the same as those dudes just because I personally don't like her videos.

You can bet I find that insulting, and rather extreme.

Nobody said that. Like at all.
Now imagine getting death and rape threats everyday. That's extreme.

Jacksinthe · Jan 28, 2015

Its time we started installing "punch people through the internet" buttons on our keyboards and mice. This is revolting.

Princess Carl · Jan 28, 2015

Dragonborn said:
I have no dog in this fight guys, just putting my own opinion out there. I don't hate the woman, far from it, I just personally don't agree with the way she goes about things.

If that suddenly makes me a Gamergater or puts me on equal ground with people sending death threats then wow, well what can I say?

Goes to show both sides have extremes.

Do live on a farm, because you seem to have a lot of strawmen laying around.

brotkasten · Jan 28, 2015

The Verge is exposing some of the harassers.

Here's what Anita Sarkeesian's harassers do with the rest of their Twitter time

... As it turns out, some of the most direct threats come from throwaway accounts, or ones that have been suspended. But some of them are extant, long-running feeds from people who... well, it's hard to say that they have regular lives, or passions, because their timelines are mostly just racist or homophobic jokes and insults. But if you trawl deep enough, little pieces of normality peek out. And it makes everything all the more frustrating.

http://www.theverge.com/2015/1/28/7923491/anita-sarkeesian-week-of-sexist-twitter-harassment

My favorite.

BlastProcessing · Jan 28, 2015

Dragonborn said:
One of the reasons I never liked her is that she just kind of feels fake, like she isn't a "real" gamer. Now I'm not saying you have to play a lot of games to critize them but that just rubbed me the wrong way. Admittedly,it's been well over a year since I last paid her any attention so this may have changed but I think that's why she faces so much resistance.

Now, since I am in no way saying that this is reason to attack her. I'm not defending the people who wrote these stupid comments, I'm just giving my own personal reason for why I don't really like her. That said, I would never ask her to shut up or threaten her just because I happen to disagree with her. I feel that goes without saying but threads like these feel like walking on egg shells

To me, she seems like just as much as a "real" gamer as Phil Spencer is. Does she need to wear a Battle Toads shirt to make the grade for you?

Seeds · Jan 28, 2015

Amir0x said:
.

Damn was hoping for a three for three.

Wouldn't her going from I'm not a gamer to presenting herself as one mean whether she's a gamer to not matters to her?

Linkark07 · Jan 28, 2015

Aeana said:
We already have evidence that this is not the case.

That graphics reminded me of my Bachellor's Degree career: on four years (Software Development), we only had at most five girls in our group. Five. Last year were only 2. And we were like 30 dudes.

Mael · Jan 28, 2015

No but you don't get it,
since you're saying that what he says is not relevant you're all as bad as the people sending death threats.
Damn extremists!

Hoje0308 · Jan 28, 2015

Fine Ham Abounds said:
Tangentially, am I correct in perceiving an increasing number of "New Atheists" falling for GamerGate? I can only assume this is somehow a phenomenon of spending too much time up your own ass on Reddit. It's an odd thing to see Thunderf00t of all people come up in regards to something like GamerGate, but I guess in recent years he's followed Dick Dawkins off the edge of the Earth.

Thankfully my heart won't be broken unless Jonathan Miller for some reason comes out in favor of GamerGate.

So we're now lumping people without an irrational belief system in with GG, because you can name one example? Not surprising I guess, given the fact that your entire post seems like an attempt to paint anyone without an invisible friend with the crazy brush.

berzeli · Jan 28, 2015

Dragonborn said:
Bro, some of you guys are basically saying I'm the same as those dudes just because I personally don't like her videos.

You can bet I find that insulting, and rather extreme.

One of the reasons I never liked Dragonborn is that he just kind of feels fake, like he isn't a "real" gaffer. Now I'm not saying you have to make a lot of posts to critize them but that just rubbed me the wrong way. Admittedly, it's been well over a year since I last paid him any attention so this may have changed but I think that's why he faces so much resistance.

Now, since I am in no way saying that this is reason to attack him. I'm not defending Amir0x who wrote those stupid comments, I'm just giving my own personal reason for why I don't really like him. That said, I would never ask him to shut up or threaten him just because I happen to disagree with him. I feel that goes without saying but threads like these feel like walking on egg shells.

Okay, sorry for being a dick (and also assuming that you were a dude, but I couldn't be bothered to stalk your post history so I went with dude 'cause of demographics). But like really, how did you expect people to react? Your post wasn't really relevant to the discussion at hand, and it ends up serving no other purpose than mitigate her harassment (I'm not saying she deserves the harassment but...)

Palette Swap · Jan 28, 2015

AbsintheGames said:
Its time we started installing "punch people through the internet" buttons on our keyboards and mice. This is revolting.

I've been drafting a Request For Comments to develop the wondrous technology of Punch Over IP, this should completely change social media once it rolls out.

Hoje0308 · Jan 28, 2015

Seeds said:
Wouldn't her going from I'm not a gamer to presenting herself as one mean whether she's a gamer to not matters to her?

Wouldn't it have been easier for you to actually read the thread instead of perpetuating this lie?

shiba5 · Jan 28, 2015

Does one have to be born with a joystick to be a gamer? Is there a like a timetable and once you pass a certain number of years, you are a real gamer? If you take a break for a few years and come back to the hobby, can you really call yourself a gamer, you poser?
I'd guess I've been playing games much longer than most of the cretins who Tweet vile shit at Anita, but I'm a girl therefore obviously a fake gamer.
/rolleyes

Also, again, who cares? If someone asked me if I was a "gamer", I'd probably say no. It's not my identity even though I love video games and they are one of my favorite hobbies. (Obviously they are important to me, or I wouldn't post on this forum.)

Mael · Jan 28, 2015

berzeli said:
One of the reasons I never liked Dragonborn is that he just kind of feels fake, like he isn't a "real" gaffer. Now I'm not saying you have to make a lot of posts to critize them but that just rubbed me the wrong way. Admittedly, it's been well over a year since I last paid him any attention so this may have changed but I think that's why he faces so much resistance.

Seriously if we're there trying to paint who's a real gamer and who's not,
I'd say that there won't be many people left.
krejlooc will still be one of them though.

Amir0x · Jan 28, 2015

Seeds said:
Wouldn't her going from I'm not a gamer to presenting herself as one mean whether she's a gamer to not matters to her?

It literally wouldn't matter if she felt it was the single most important thing ever to face mankind, what this thread is about is the endless harassment we can see she receives on a daily basis, what this means about the problems in this industry and what solutions there are to that.

Vincent Grayson · Jan 28, 2015

Hoje0308 said:
So we're now lumping people without an irrational belief system in with GG, because you can name one example? Not surprising I guess, given the fact that your entire post seems like an attempt to paint anyone without an invisible friend with the crazy brush.

He's not wrong though. There is a lot of crossover between the "New Atheist" camp (especially those still salty about that whole Atheism+ thing), the #gg folks, and of course the MRA/redpill people.

I've definitely had a hell of a time finding many people (online, mind you) who are generally liberal, atheist, and also feminist/"SJW"-types.

bsod · Jan 28, 2015

shiba5 said:
Does one have to be born with a joystick to be a gamer? Is there a like a timetable and once you pass a certain number of years, you are a real gamer? If you take a break for a few years and come back to the hobby, can you really call yourself a gamer, you poser?
I'd guess I've been playing games much longer than most of the cretins who Tweet vile shit at Anita, but I'm a girl therefore obviously a fake gamer.
/rolleyes

You can't critique video games or the industry unless you've beaten Halo on legendary.

Dragonborn · Jan 28, 2015

Dog Problems said:
I'm not trying to give you crap or anything. I'm sincerely curious as to what you think constitutes a gamer.

people try downplaying or being sarcastic when someone mentions "real gaming" and I agree that's it's hard to really define. It just something about how genuine one sounds, yOu know?

Like, I'm not saying you should play a certain amount or a certain genre, but the "real gamer" aspect comes about through how I perceive the Genuineness of the person speaking about them, if that makes any sense?

Anyways, I'm dropping that

Amir0x said:
Nobody said that, so what you can say is something that isn't a strawman instead.

What we are pointing out is that your comment had nothing to do with this discussion, was a disgusting distraction from the issue of harassment, and is the exact playbook used by GGers to distract from the serious issues brought up in the topic, whether you are a member or not.

Perhaps stop using their playbook if you're going to pretend to be so indignant about it. I want you to re-read this comment three or four times before responding so you can grasp what is actually being said.

I don't even know what Gamergaters do man. I'm not in tune completely with this whole debate in general. I saw the thread, read the lsst couple pages, saw people talking about being a real gamer and got reminded of why I stopped watching her vids Which is what I posted.

This isn't some nefarious conspiracy where I want to being her down by offering my thoughts. Anyways, I'll just say that this is one of the the reasons I keep out of this arguments. It feels pretty hostile, unless your views fall exactly in line. They feel too intimidating to the average gamer

I didn't mean anything, it was a comment that I just typed out while I surfed Gaf a bit during my break.

Anyways, I'll gi ahead and be on my way. I suppose just continuing to ignore all of this is the best course of action for me.

DirgeExtinction · Jan 28, 2015

Wow, that is utterly despicable. These pieces of shits need to have near death experiences.

The ironic thing is with all those tweets, they're just proving her point.

MrBadger · Jan 28, 2015

shiba5 said:
Does one have to be born with a joystick to be a gamer? Is there a like a timetable and once you pass a certain number of years, you are a real gamer? If you take a break for a few years and come back to the hobby, can you really call yourself a gamer, you poser?
I'd guess I've been playing games much longer than most of the cretins who Tweet vile shit at Anita, but I'm a girl therefore obviously a fake gamer.
/rolleyes

Suddenly, everything makes sense.

Jacksinthe · Jan 28, 2015

Palette Swap said:
I've been drafting a Request For Comments to develop the wondrous technology of Punch Over IP, this should completely change social media once it rolls out.

Based Palette Swap. Day one.

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