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New Dragon Age: Origins Screenshots And Trailer
- Thread starter Nirolak
- Start date
DenogginizerOS
BenjaminBirdie's Thomas Jefferson
My PC can't run DA. Which is a bummer. But I was wondering about the console versions. If a 20GB install is required for PC, has Bioware commented on whether or not the PS3 version will have an advantage over X360 in this area (better audio, better textures)?
Pure expeculation. Oh, trust me, I'm the first one to wish that a single origin could last that long ... remember the troppy list ? It gave motives to suspect that bioware considers the playthrough as the convination of all the origins.Pankaks said:
Plus, 70 hours seems to long [or to good to be true] for each origin.
EA games don't "usually" have that anymore. They have changed their stance on PC DRM.Lime said:
The other review we've seen says that if you absolutely fly through the main quest and ignore all else you will finish it in 40, but most people will take longer.Fakto said:
I don't think they'll be different enough for it to be worth playing every single one. I'm expecting there to be differences, but it won't be a completely different game. If you really did play through them all though I'd imagine you'd cut down the play time of each successive run.Fakto said:
I'm really thinking about supporting this game after seeing the first two reviews and the footage from GB (no thanks to Bioware PR to date that much is certain, which says a lot since I'm a huge WRPG fan). Anyhow I would love to see some 360 footage soonish since that is what I will buy it on, and we're three weeks away from go.
Vercingetorix
Banned
Fakto said:
When developers say its 70 hours, it'll be 30 hours for someone who is familiar with that kind of game, and 40 hours for someone who's new to the genre. In my experience, at least.
bigmit3737
Member
I have a feeling this game is going to be pretty lengthy.
And hoping the modding tools will add a lot as well.
I can already see some of the BG2 cast making an appearance after slight modding.
And hoping the modding tools will add a lot as well.
I can already see some of the BG2 cast making an appearance after slight modding.
I've had the opportunity to ask three different devs about their completion times and they were... 45, 60, and 65 respectively. One of my interviews went live today and I have two more going up over the course of the next few days.
Each origin will take 2-4 hrs to complete and then you'll be free to play the game anyway you like.
Each origin will take 2-4 hrs to complete and then you'll be free to play the game anyway you like.
Lostconfused
Member
Yup definitely some of the prettier looking characters from a bioware game to date.
Lostconfused
Member
Out of 3 total.K.Jack said:
Blackace
if you see me in a fight with a bear, don't help me fool, help the bear!
A Black Falcon said:
You made great points all around. But this is one of the best points.
This is what made me love WRPGs all the way from the Ultima/Wasteland days. And this is why I only play 1 or 2 JRPGs a year... I don't really play RPGs for the battlesystem or for a A to B only story..
I like creating cool characters who I can play like I imagined them. Also I like bad ass weapons that I can see in action.
Blackace
if you see me in a fight with a bear, don't help me fool, help the bear!
AstroLad said:
Well yeah... the writing was so good back then for a lot of games it was like seeing them in action..
It is becoming less and less in games these days... but one thing I hate more than anything is getting some badass weapon and my character looking the same..
Lostconfused
Member
Also got to worry about the way the mouth animates. If you move the sliders around too much it might look wonky. Not that it doesn't look wonky no matter what sometimes.
Edit: although if i remember right the main character doesn't really have spoken lines so might not be a big deal.
Edit: although if i remember right the main character doesn't really have spoken lines so might not be a big deal.
Just found out it'll have no online whatsoever, no co-op or multiplayer. Ah well, guess we'll have to play all those mods single player.
On the subject of DRM and SecuROM
http://arstechnica.com/gaming/news/2009/05/dragon-age-ditches-securom-online-activation.ars
On the subject of DRM and SecuROM
http://arstechnica.com/gaming/news/2009/05/dragon-age-ditches-securom-online-activation.ars
Purkake4 said:
Guess you never played Neverwinter Nights online, community made miniature mmorpgs with the toolset and ran them on community servers etc, people still play it online on those persistent worlds (some had 50 people on all the time, depending on server hardware etc, entire side communities spawned, own forums for the servers and mods they ran etc etc etc, community based gaming at its best imo)
example:
http://nwn.wikia.com/wiki/Aventia
http://nwn.wikia.com/wiki/Eternal_Destiny
Or just create an adventure in the toolset, invite some friends, you DM, stuff like that... The Bioware mod/fan community really made some gems with that NWN toolset
Don't get me wrong, I'm not really complaining, what I've seen so far looks like a very solid game that will keep me occupied for a while, just a shame we won't get that awesome NWNish online stuff
Fredescu said:
I'm buying the PC version, but, the console version give trophys for completing the game with each origin. So, how long to get platinium ? 30 h x 7 horigins = 210 hours ?
That's what I'm saying, seems too long for a single player experience. And at the same time rises my suspucions about those 100 hours being the total amount of play through the game offers, counting all 7 origins.
Anyway, I'm trying to find a review that confirm the 40-70 hours per origin :3
Pickles the Firecat
Banned
Completing the game seven times is bound to take a long time. You'll probably cut that completition time down though as you get familiar with the main quest. It's not going to be as simple as 7x30.Fakto said:
http://gameinformer.com/games/dragon_age_origins/b/pc/archive/2009/10/05/review.aspxFakto said:
"A speed demon could blow through the main story in 40 hours, but thorough players can expect about 70."
whatevermort
Member
Fakto said:
The origin is only a few hours long. Then you go the main quest which will be pretty much the same but with slight repercussions depending on choices, party etc. It's 40-70 hours per playthrough - if you choose to play it more than once then, sure, multiply that number or whatever. But don't expect 6 40-70 hour games on one disc.
I don't know if you guys have seen these but there are a whole bunch of IGN HD videos up on Youtube showing intros to the game itself and various origins.
They all look pretty good and only contain slight spoilers.
Game intro cinematic:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q94rdV9M1M4
Human trouble (City elf origin):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A5hwznpjtUE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rgVSrlbqRUU
Human origin intro:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZjWU7RVEhAA
Noble battle:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V6ljnka2ifo
Throne room battle:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cmM4ZB6V5yo
What struck me is that the dialogue really feels conversational, with the player given 4 real and different options every time as the conversations flow back and forth. There's also some videos showing off the consequences during a quest which has been outlined before.
The combat also looks really solid, with many many enemies onscreen and seemingly lots of potential for tactics, while keeping it all visceral and fairly fast paced.
I also really loved the way Inon Zur's score weaves in and out of scenes. This is some of the best fantasy music I've ever heard.
They all look pretty good and only contain slight spoilers.
Game intro cinematic:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q94rdV9M1M4
Human trouble (City elf origin):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A5hwznpjtUE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rgVSrlbqRUU
Human origin intro:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZjWU7RVEhAA
Noble battle:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V6ljnka2ifo
Throne room battle:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cmM4ZB6V5yo
What struck me is that the dialogue really feels conversational, with the player given 4 real and different options every time as the conversations flow back and forth. There's also some videos showing off the consequences during a quest which has been outlined before.
The combat also looks really solid, with many many enemies onscreen and seemingly lots of potential for tactics, while keeping it all visceral and fairly fast paced.
I also really loved the way Inon Zur's score weaves in and out of scenes. This is some of the best fantasy music I've ever heard.
I hadn't seen this
http://social.bioware.com/wiki/dragonage/index.php/Inspiration
I imagine you can keep everyone happy no matter what you do with enough gifts.
http://social.bioware.com/wiki/dragonage/index.php/Inspiration
I imagine you can keep everyone happy no matter what you do with enough gifts.
Gorgon
Member
OK, I'll provide a few comments so that you don't feel I let you hanging there and that your time was wasted
Sure, but most people will save anywhere if only to avoid loosing hours of gameplay and going through all of it again. But yes, no one forces you.
I agree, I may not have been completely clear separating both at times while I was writing, but I'm perfectly aware of it. Agreed.
I think that we need to separate a few things here. The moral choices, branching paths, etc do add depth to western RPGs (something that is almost totally missing from JRPGS). However I woudn't exactely call it complex because they are quite simple and juvenile for the most part. Characters don't have anywhere near the depth of movie or book characters, the branching is extremely limited in its game effects and how it affects the game world, the dialogue choices and NPC reactions are for the most part predictable and juvenile. They add a LOT of flavour and "depth" to the game, but I would hardly call it "complex". We could discuss why ad eternum but suffice it to say that to really pull it out in a believable, complex way it would cost multiple times more time and money and it would need to be the equivalent to tens of 60 hour-long games. It's simply not practible. Plus the writting has a long way to go and things don't work in games the way they do in movies or books.
I really don't think anyone died mutch in any of the BG games. One of things that are typical of western RPGs is that you can rarely make a fatal mistake during combat that cannot be, how to say, circumvented/annuled? You may make a lot of mistakes and die but you don't really need to create a big startegy to overcome most anymies or anything like that. It's a pretty much just start the cobat and "see how it goes" and in most cases it goes well.
Mods are not a fair example because consoles don't have mods (with very few exception this gen on the PS3) and mods are not comercial products subject to sales and player demand and everyone can do them the way they want and put them free to download on the net.
I think it's a bit to simplistic to say that a game just because it only has one character is necessarily "lacking in depth". You can make a complex game with one character and a simpel game with many controlable characters. It all depends on how complex and deep is the system and on which aspects of combat you are concentrating on. I understand what you mean, but that is an affirmation that is too simplistic and reductive.
IT's my favourity RPG ever too!
I already apologised if some of my writting apparently wasn't clear when refering to difficulty and complexity. As I said before they are not the same thing, my appologies. Regarding Planescape, I think it's the best writting ever in an RPG BY FAR, but read my comments regarding choices, dialogues, branching etc above.
Totally agree with you mate. I'm not defending jRPGs over WRPGs. Never did. This all began because I felt that many rpg gamers in the west simply misunderstand JRPGs and have a very superficial and juvenile notion of what is and is not available.
When I made that coment I was thinking about difficulty. And yes, dungeon-crawlers are certainly "hardcore". I think they deserve the term "hardcore" more than the more platable modern RPGs, to be honest. I was not refering to complexity, though. When I made that comment I was in a way also answering (in my head at least) someone else's comment about console games beying "pussified" and talking about "...games for those that are not afraid to die". I still think that there's more "pussificated" games in the west than in Japan (I'm talking about difficulty here), in relative terms. The continuous comercial success of difficult dungeon crawlers in Japan (less nowadays but they nerver stoped beying produced and Wizardry is more alive there than anywhere else) shows it. There's still comercial sucess to be found in Japan with ihnerently difficult RPGs, something that is basically extinct in the West.
Far enough. However you also have to take into account that in the West RPGs where always associated with a more hardcore gamer crowd, mostly related to fantasy fans, while in Japan RPGs cover a much wider spectrum and audience, from Pokemon stuff, to RPGs for younger kids, to Gothic Lolitas RPGs, to god-knows-what. Overall it's obvious that the percentage of compex and/or difficult rpgs are lower when you pool together the entire range of the genre there. But in the west the genre was for the most part limited to 95% fantasy games for fantasy RPG fans. It doesn't even cover the same population slice in terms of users. Its a very different reality. The important point is that there is a market there for complexity and difficulty and that market never died out, while here although they the games wehre always directed at a more core crowd they did get "pussified". This is a very interesting part of this discussion, really, and we could spend hours on end discussing this.
Ah, ok then. I was speaking essentially for console gamers in general and I though the best example would be the japanese market.
But still I think that the idea that console gamers "want" simpler games is wrong. Last time I checked those simpler RPGs made by Western Devs sold pretty well on PC too so I guess its the market in general that wants them. Console gamers play what they get as everyone else.
Many of those genres aren't unpopular...they simply don't exist so it's a mute point to say that console gamers don't want them. Just go over to the IL2 forums for the console game and look at how many people are bitching that the game was dumbed down for consoles and they didn't want that. The problem is that devs themselves are afraid of putting money because they can't predict the market. They don't necessarily know the market better than you and me, if they did no game would ever bomb...
Also there is an obvious problem with controlers that simply aren't the best thing for some genres. I already stated in another thread that I have my doubts about DA:O on consoles precisely because of that. But saying that DA:O needs to be dumbed down because console players don't want to "go through the depth of a PC game" and they just want "to relax" is, pardon my expression, a pile of bulshit (not directing that at you mate, don't take personaly).
Just to finish this discussion (really mate, no more, I don't have time for this!!!) I'll ansewr this one:
No. Let me give you an example from another game, chess. Chess is extremely easy to learn and understand. Any child can play it. However below that apparent simplicity in rules lies a great challenge if you wnat to play seriously. You'll have to think strategically and try to predict every outcome and every move that can come out of the game may turns into the future while you're playing. The megaten games are bit a like this. They feel like chess. It's not unnecessary difficulty, its just that the magic system forces you to analyse you enemies and plan the entire strategy for the battle in which, like chess, you may die because of a wrong move (or spell, or item, or whatever) used at the wrong time in the wrong place with the wronf enemy. This is why those games are so loved by the comunity. There's nothing like that in the western RPGsm in which everything is more straighforward and mistakes are less punitive and (relatively) easily overcome as the battle progresses. I'm obviously simplifying here but you get my gist.
Anyway, thanks for your trouble posting al this, but really, I can't keep up with this, I'm already wasting a lot of time that I need to use elsewhere. If you want just send me your Messenger adress or something so that we can discuss this in real time some other time.
Pew, I'm wasted! :lol
That's fine to me, even though I don't consider it a must. It's a matter of preference. I think a game like Demon's Souls for example (I say DS because I'm now playing it) would loose some of its charm if I could save anywhere for example.A Black Falcon said:
A Black Falcon said:
Sure, but most people will save anywhere if only to avoid loosing hours of gameplay and going through all of it again. But yes, no one forces you.
A Black Falcon said:
I agree, I may not have been completely clear separating both at times while I was writing, but I'm perfectly aware of it. Agreed.
A Black Falcon said:
I think that we need to separate a few things here. The moral choices, branching paths, etc do add depth to western RPGs (something that is almost totally missing from JRPGS). However I woudn't exactely call it complex because they are quite simple and juvenile for the most part. Characters don't have anywhere near the depth of movie or book characters, the branching is extremely limited in its game effects and how it affects the game world, the dialogue choices and NPC reactions are for the most part predictable and juvenile. They add a LOT of flavour and "depth" to the game, but I would hardly call it "complex". We could discuss why ad eternum but suffice it to say that to really pull it out in a believable, complex way it would cost multiple times more time and money and it would need to be the equivalent to tens of 60 hour-long games. It's simply not practible. Plus the writting has a long way to go and things don't work in games the way they do in movies or books.
A Black Falcon said:
I really don't think anyone died mutch in any of the BG games. One of things that are typical of western RPGs is that you can rarely make a fatal mistake during combat that cannot be, how to say, circumvented/annuled? You may make a lot of mistakes and die but you don't really need to create a big startegy to overcome most anymies or anything like that. It's a pretty much just start the cobat and "see how it goes" and in most cases it goes well.
Mods are not a fair example because consoles don't have mods (with very few exception this gen on the PS3) and mods are not comercial products subject to sales and player demand and everyone can do them the way they want and put them free to download on the net.
I think it's a bit to simplistic to say that a game just because it only has one character is necessarily "lacking in depth". You can make a complex game with one character and a simpel game with many controlable characters. It all depends on how complex and deep is the system and on which aspects of combat you are concentrating on. I understand what you mean, but that is an affirmation that is too simplistic and reductive.
IT's my favourity RPG ever too!
I already apologised if some of my writting apparently wasn't clear when refering to difficulty and complexity. As I said before they are not the same thing, my appologies. Regarding Planescape, I think it's the best writting ever in an RPG BY FAR, but read my comments regarding choices, dialogues, branching etc above.
Totally agree with you mate. I'm not defending jRPGs over WRPGs. Never did. This all began because I felt that many rpg gamers in the west simply misunderstand JRPGs and have a very superficial and juvenile notion of what is and is not available.
When I made that coment I was thinking about difficulty. And yes, dungeon-crawlers are certainly "hardcore". I think they deserve the term "hardcore" more than the more platable modern RPGs, to be honest. I was not refering to complexity, though. When I made that comment I was in a way also answering (in my head at least) someone else's comment about console games beying "pussified" and talking about "...games for those that are not afraid to die". I still think that there's more "pussificated" games in the west than in Japan (I'm talking about difficulty here), in relative terms. The continuous comercial success of difficult dungeon crawlers in Japan (less nowadays but they nerver stoped beying produced and Wizardry is more alive there than anywhere else) shows it. There's still comercial sucess to be found in Japan with ihnerently difficult RPGs, something that is basically extinct in the West.
You keep mentioning the Megaten magic system as your example of the depth of JRPGs. But as I've said a bunch now, that's one semi-niche series, while most JRPGs have nowhere near that kind of depth... having some examples of ones with some kind of depth (not the kind PC RPGs have but something else) is nice, but it does nothing to disprove the idea that on average JRPGs are simpler than WRPGs. Shin Megami Tensei isn't an average JRPG series and you know it.
Far enough. However you also have to take into account that in the West RPGs where always associated with a more hardcore gamer crowd, mostly related to fantasy fans, while in Japan RPGs cover a much wider spectrum and audience, from Pokemon stuff, to RPGs for younger kids, to Gothic Lolitas RPGs, to god-knows-what. Overall it's obvious that the percentage of compex and/or difficult rpgs are lower when you pool together the entire range of the genre there. But in the west the genre was for the most part limited to 95% fantasy games for fantasy RPG fans. It doesn't even cover the same population slice in terms of users. Its a very different reality. The important point is that there is a market there for complexity and difficulty and that market never died out, while here although they the games wehre always directed at a more core crowd they did get "pussified". This is a very interesting part of this discussion, really, and we could spend hours on end discussing this.
Ah, ok then. I was speaking essentially for console gamers in general and I though the best example would be the japanese market.
But still I think that the idea that console gamers "want" simpler games is wrong. Last time I checked those simpler RPGs made by Western Devs sold pretty well on PC too so I guess its the market in general that wants them. Console gamers play what they get as everyone else.
Many of those genres aren't unpopular...they simply don't exist so it's a mute point to say that console gamers don't want them. Just go over to the IL2 forums for the console game and look at how many people are bitching that the game was dumbed down for consoles and they didn't want that. The problem is that devs themselves are afraid of putting money because they can't predict the market. They don't necessarily know the market better than you and me, if they did no game would ever bomb...
Also there is an obvious problem with controlers that simply aren't the best thing for some genres. I already stated in another thread that I have my doubts about DA:O on consoles precisely because of that. But saying that DA:O needs to be dumbed down because console players don't want to "go through the depth of a PC game" and they just want "to relax" is, pardon my expression, a pile of bulshit (not directing that at you mate, don't take personaly).
Just to finish this discussion (really mate, no more, I don't have time for this!!!) I'll ansewr this one:
No. Let me give you an example from another game, chess. Chess is extremely easy to learn and understand. Any child can play it. However below that apparent simplicity in rules lies a great challenge if you wnat to play seriously. You'll have to think strategically and try to predict every outcome and every move that can come out of the game may turns into the future while you're playing. The megaten games are bit a like this. They feel like chess. It's not unnecessary difficulty, its just that the magic system forces you to analyse you enemies and plan the entire strategy for the battle in which, like chess, you may die because of a wrong move (or spell, or item, or whatever) used at the wrong time in the wrong place with the wronf enemy. This is why those games are so loved by the comunity. There's nothing like that in the western RPGsm in which everything is more straighforward and mistakes are less punitive and (relatively) easily overcome as the battle progresses. I'm obviously simplifying here but you get my gist.
Anyway, thanks for your trouble posting al this, but really, I can't keep up with this, I'm already wasting a lot of time that I need to use elsewhere. If you want just send me your Messenger adress or something so that we can discuss this in real time some other time.
Pew, I'm wasted! :lol
bigmit3737
Member
Purkake4 said:
Check out NWN's community due to the robust multiplayer mods.
bigmit3737
Member
Why don't the spells have any dmg listed?
I rechecked the GB video, it seems spells don't have dmg listed.
I rechecked the GB video, it seems spells don't have dmg listed.
Yes, that would just mean you require more gifts which aren't likely a very limited resource. Deal breakers change all that of course and it's possible the approval boost falls quick.sendu said:
I hear at least weapons have mouse over tooltips that show the damage so it's possible you can see the spell damage the same way. The damage is based on your magic stat and some other spellpower boosting things stat so I suppose they decided it would be confusing to show it on that menu.bigmit3737 said:
e: the difference between certain non-damaging spells is even harder to gauge though