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TreIII · Dec 7, 2007

Iam Canadian said:
On an unrelated note, it would be a nice touch if the game determined the level of the CPU replacement of a dropout by the dropout's record: a higher difficulty level if the dropout has more wins than losses. Even though Sakurai says that the online game won't keep track of stats, I'm willing to bet that the information is stored, even if it isn't displayed to the player.

Personally, I'm still surprised that fighting games in general have not done more along the lines of what VF4 and Fire Pro Wrestling have already done years ago. Being able to set AI patterns to your specifics, so that you can basically create a "virtual representation" of your own personal fighting style is nifty, and something that I think should have become more commonplace in fighting games by now.

I mean, the way I would have had it, the better players who spend time with the game would be able to craft a representation of themselves through AI patterns, so that, in the case that they did get disconnected, their "ghost" would take over as the pinch hitter. If optimized correctly, players wouldn't be able to tell the difference.

But alas...Smash seemingly will offer a lot, but I doubt that they'll utilize such a feature like this.

Iam Canadian · Dec 7, 2007

TreIII said:
Personally, I'm still surprised that fighting games in general have not done more along the lines of what VF4 and Fire Pro Wrestling have already done years ago. Being able to set AI patterns to your specifics, so that you can basically create a "virtual representation" of your own personal fighting style is nifty, and something that I think should have become more commonplace in fighting games by now.

I mean, the way I would have had it, the better players who spend time with the game would be able to craft a representation of themselves through AI patterns, so that, in the case that they did get disconnected, their "ghost" would take over as the pinch hitter. If optimized correctly, players wouldn't be able to tell the difference.

But alas...Smash seemingly will offer a lot, but I doubt that they'll utilize such a feature like this.

You know, in all honesty, this actually wouldn't surprise me. Sakurai did say that we wouldn't be able to tell that a CPU was pinch-hitting for your opponent, but if it just reverts to standard CPU AI, it's pretty obvious even if a "CPU" label doesn't suddenly appear over your opponent's head. If Sakurai wants it to be truly seamless, then I'd actually kind of expect him to put something like this in even if it's not to te extent that VF4 or Fire Pro Wrestling implement it.

Son of Godzilla · Dec 7, 2007

Excepting that only someone looking to evangalize some point would argue that Halo 3 was more of the same, sure.

I think Halo 3 and Smash both suffer from the same problem, in that they are limited more by the types of games they are than any obvious flaws. They can give you option after option but that will never change the fact that they are fps/platform based fighters. When you get sick of something like that no number of options will redeem the gameplay.

It's a feeling I very distinctly remember from both previous smashes. You play for an hour or however long and then you've had your fill and going for anymore than that is very much unenjoyable.

CreatureX3 · Dec 7, 2007

Plinko said:
Count me in as one who likes Nintendo's way of doing things.

Jumping into an online match without waiting in a lobby is my preferred way of playing. I'm one of the few who actually like Nintendo's online ideas.

QFT! I'm another who loves Nintendo's online ideas. Especially the part where online remains free!

psycho_snake · Dec 7, 2007

WastingPenguins said:
Yeah, I think that is how it'll work. I wonder if you'll be able to switch game modes? I would expect Time mode to be standard for random battle play, but the ability to make game a bit longer wouldn't hurt. Two minutes is so short!

Also, I wonder if you can do random battles with less than four people, or if the game only starts when four have joined. Hmmm.

Hopefully they will allow you to change the game time. I hardly ever play with two minutes because its far too short.

If they do have a standard battle time that you cant change, then they should make it five minutes. Its the perfect time limit; not too long and not too short.

CreatureX3 · Dec 7, 2007

Vlad said:
I think the big thing keeping it from hitting a 10 in a lot of magazines will be the fact that the core gameplay seems to be pretty similar to previous SSB games. It's tweaked, and they've apparently added everything anybody could possibly wish for, but I wouldn't be surprised at all to see several "the additions are nice, but it's still just Smash Brothers" type reviews.

Well that didn't stop Halo 3 from getting 10's.

Although I think those $800 goody bags MS sent to reviewers helped out!

:lol

Wii-za · Dec 7, 2007

Are the updates going to finish with the Japanese launch? or with the American one?

I'm hungry...

Sciz · Dec 7, 2007

Son of Godzilla said:
It's a feeling I very distinctly remember from both previous smashes. You play for an hour or however long and then you've had your fill and going for anymore than that is very much unenjoyable.

I can't say I've ever had that feeling with the Smash series.

As for the CPU pinch-hitter, that's been one of Sakurai's ideas since at least the days of Kirby Super Star, so it shouldn't really come as a surprise to see it again. ;p

NeonZ · Dec 7, 2007

Wii-za said:
Are the updates going to finish with the Japanese launch? or with the American one?

I'm hungry...

The updates probably will start focusing on spoiler stuff after the American or Japanese launch. So, the day they'll stop depends on how much unlockable content the game has.

boiled goose · Dec 7, 2007

Hmm.. Is it only timed matches for random online.......

please dont let it be so....

Firestorm · Dec 7, 2007

Smash isn't going to receive a low grade due to being "more of the same", it'll be one of the reasons since reviewers are all sheep who just stick that in everywhere even if it's a good thing, but it won't be the reason. The reason will be that most of them still consider it as little more than a Nintendo fanboy's wet dream.

However, between Melee and now the fact that SSBM has quite a bit of depth has been shown to a lot more people so there is hope yet that it'll get maybe a 9.0 or something.

AceBandage said:
One thing I'd really like in SSBB is the challenge icon from GH3.
All games should have that on the Wii. Being able to receive a challenge at any time while playing the game is such a useful feature.

Wait a second. A Wii game actually did this? Well damn. We better get more of that.

I can honestly see myself just leaving my Wii on during the time I'm on the computer and just playing when someone enters the room.

AndoCalrissian · Dec 7, 2007

Holy Order Sol said:
I think I'd crack up if I ever noticed the switch to a CPU controlled opponent because it would actually be BETTER than the guy I was facing before.

It would be noticeable, yes, but what if the game rates players on the same 1-9 scale as CPUs in previous Smash Bros.' games, and uses that level for the replacement CPU?

MrCheez · Dec 7, 2007

amtentori said:
Hmm.. Is it only timed matches for random online.......

please dont let it be so....

This is currently my great fear. I have NO desire to play timed matches

BlueSummers · Dec 7, 2007

We have had so many questions about this game answered, yet so many still remain...

Iam Canadian · Dec 7, 2007

MrCheez said:
This is currently my great fear. I have NO desire to play timed matches

Honestly, I wouldn't worry about it. I highly doubt that Sakurai won't allow us to alter the rules.

Mithos Yggdrasill · Dec 7, 2007

Firestorm said:
XD

Anyway:

Elegant. Simple. Modern. I like it.

Firestorm · Dec 7, 2007

I really don't see how it's going to be unnoticeable.... Once they start power shielding every projectile I think it'll be quite obvious!

I'm also hoping there's stock. Time is horrible.

CreatureX3 · Dec 7, 2007

Mithos Yggdrasill said:
Elegant. Simple. Modern. I like it.

QFT! Especially when you consider all the fighters that have to fit on that selection screen.

Holy Order Sol · Dec 7, 2007

Firestorm said:
I really don't see how it's going to be unnoticeable.... Once they start power shielding every projectile I think it'll be quite obvious!

I'm also hoping there's stock. Time is horrible.

What's a projectile ?

[/C.Falcon main]

MrCheez · Dec 7, 2007

I find it really strange that he went with the 'demo' character select screen, especially this late in the game... Why not just show us the real thing, and turn any unannounced characters into question marks or something?

Keru_Shiri · Dec 7, 2007

MrCheez said:
This is currently my great fear. I have NO desire to play timed matches

I read the update as "You don't have to change any of the options to play." Likely things such as Time, number of Stock, etc. will also be put up to lottery.

And even if it is Timed, that's ok, I wanted online to play with my friends from out of town, anything else is just icing on the cake for me.

Holy Order Sol · Dec 7, 2007

MrCheez said:
I find it really strange that he went with the 'demo' character select screen, especially this late in the game... Why not just show us the real thing, and turn any unannounced characters into question marks or something?

So he wouldn't give any indication about the total number of starters/characters ?

Insaniac · Dec 7, 2007

MrCheez said:
This is currently my great fear. I have NO desire to play timed matches

I Guarantee you there will be a stock match for online, it just wouldn't make sense w/o it

Firestorm · Dec 7, 2007

Holy Order Sol said:
What's a projectile ?

[/C.Falcon main]

The stuff that Young Link hits you with while you're trying to do a knee and knocks you to the ground like the girly man you are

MrCheez · Dec 7, 2007

Holy Order Sol said:
So he wouldn't give any indication about the total number of starters/characters ?

I guess what I'm asking then is... WHY must he still keep it a secret at this point? :lol

I mean, if he had an update that needed to show a character select screen this late in the game, seems like he could have just used the real one... We're getting so close... plus that CoroCoro thing is just a week away and that is supposedly showing the full starting roster anyway.

Maybe we're going to get a bunch of starting roster megatons all next week?

MrCheez · Dec 7, 2007

Keru_Shiri said:
I read the update as "You don't have to change any of the options to play." Likely things such as Time, number of Stock, etc. will also be put up to lottery.

If the time/stock option is part of the lottery, that would still bother me...

I don't want to gamble between a mode I like to play and a mode I don't.

I want ALL my matches to be stock...

Anyway I don't want to sound like all I'm doing is bitching. This was a very interesting update and the entire process looks really nice... It's just that this issue could cause me to avoid this entire feature entirely

It's all speculation at this point so I guess we shouldn't worry... but I'm sure these questions won't be answered anytime soon, knowing Sakurai

NeonZ · Dec 7, 2007

I mean, if he had an update that needed to show a character select screen this late in the game, seems like he could have just used the real one... We're getting so close... plus that CoroCoro thing is just a week away and that is supposedly showing the full starting roster anyway.

Hiding the true select screen doesn't seem weird when one considers that we still haven't seen the opening either. I don't know why he's doing it, but I think he's clearly trying to hide some default characters even now.

perfectchaos007 · Dec 7, 2007

I miss Sp0rsk. He's probably too busy losing weight on WiiFit. I blame....ah never mind.

MrCheez · Dec 7, 2007

Hey, I just realized something that I haven't seen anyone mention:

Is this the front MAIN menu screen? I originally thought it was just one of the WiFi mode menus, but instead it seems that the user has select "WiFi Mode" from the main menu and the 'connecting' window popped up over it.}

There appears to be... four big buttons? I'm sure we can create some speculation from this

Iam Canadian · Dec 7, 2007

MrCheez said:
There appears to be... four big buttons? I'm sure we can create some speculation from this

It might be the main screen for a demo version. Alternately, maybe the WiFi mode is accessible from the Vs. screen. But for the sake of speculation, let's assume it is the main menu screen (after all, WiFi is for more than online Vs.).

If I was to guess, I'd say that the four buttons are for Single Player, Vs., Options, and...Trophies?

MGrant · Dec 7, 2007

Iam Canadian said:
If I was to guess, I'd say that the four buttons are for Single Player, Vs., Options, and...Trophies?

Gonna guess that it's Subspace Emissary, Brawl, Wifi, and Options.

MrCheez · Dec 7, 2007

Notice the little slanted pink rectangle at the top of the screen too... on the dojo update, as they navigate deeper into the menus more rectangles are added. This represents the menu hierarchy (Does that make sense? I'm in a hurry typing this as I'm about to leave for work)

Anyway I just went back to the 'spectator mode' update and look what I found:

The options screen of the WiFi menu! Originally I thought this was just a deeper selection of the WiFi options menu, but it looks to be the only wifi options menu judging on the rectangle hierarchy at the top of the screen (In todays update the "WiFi Menu" is two rectangles in and shows an option button... the screen I just posted above is three rectangles in)

What does this mean? Very little as I'm sure you can select your actual battle options from the top of the character select screen (like in Melee). But we can speculate further about the 'operation service' I guess

Iam Canadian · Dec 7, 2007

MGrant said:
Gonna guess that it's Subspace Emissary, Brawl, Wifi, and Options.

I'd expect The Subspace Emissary to be accessible from a general Single Player menu (along with Classic, Training, etc.) like the Adventure Mode was in Melee.

MrCheez · Dec 7, 2007

MGrant said:
Gonna guess that it's Subspace Emissary, Brawl, Wifi, and Options.

Yeah, one of the options has to be "WiFi" as that is what the user selected (see: description at bottom.. and the obvious fact that the connection window popped up)

However, there also has to be some sort of a "gallery" button... you know, for trophys and replays and whatnot.

I'd guess the buttons are: Brawl, Wifi, Gallery, Options. (With Brawl containing both "Single Player" and "Versus" menus)

Disclaimer: I fully realize that these are all just speculative assumptions (Made for fun and to pass time, silly!)... as Canadian mentioned above, these could be demo screens. Or, heck, there could be a tiny fifth button hidden under there.

HK-47 · Dec 7, 2007

This game needs more Piplup and Knuckle Joe

Iam Canadian · Dec 7, 2007

Just Piplup, actually. Because you can never have too much Piplup.

HK-47 · Dec 7, 2007

Iam Canadian said:
Just Piplup, actually. Because you can never have too much Piplup.

Need more Pulpip

PkunkFury · Dec 7, 2007

MrCheez said:
Hey, I just realized something that I haven't seen anyone mention:

Is this the front MAIN menu screen? I originally thought it was just one of the WiFi mode menus, but instead it seems that the user has select "WiFi Mode" from the main menu and the 'connecting' window popped up over it.}

There appears to be... four big buttons? I'm sure we can create some speculation from this

looks to me like it's the wi-fi menu, since on the bottom it says "Play different modes while connected...". This would indicate at least four different playable wi-fi modes. The player chose Vs. in this update, and then a connection window popped up. When the connection was made they were sent here:

which has an options menu, so options is not one of the four buttons...

What could they be? I'm hoping for Vs., Stadium (target/home run stuff), tournament, subspace... but I guess trading could be one of them for trophies, stickers , and stages

MrCheez · Dec 7, 2007

PkunkFury said:
looks to me like it's the wi-fi menu, since on the bottom it says "Play different modes while connected...".

I'm pretty sure that message at the bottom corresponds to what button the user is selecting (check the other screen you posted, where the user is selecting the "With Anyone" button adn the message at the bottom explains it).

So in the case of the original screenshot I was referring to, they would be selecting the "Wifi Mode" button from the (supposed) main menu

PkunkFury · Dec 7, 2007

MrCheez said:
I'm pretty sure that message at the bottom corresponds to what button the user is selecting (check the other screen you posted, where the user is selecting the "With Anyone" button adn the message at the bottom explains it).

So in the case of the original screenshot I was referring to, they would be selecting the "Wifi Mode" button from the (supposed) main menu

ah I see what you mean. This is true. I was also going off of the "select mode" with what appears to be a wi-fi symbol next to it (?) at the top, though. Perhaps when clicking 'Vs.' it tells you on the bottom that you have more modes to slect? But you could be right. If your theory is true, I guess you would access online stadium from within the stadium menu?

edit: also interesting, the player selected the option on the bottom left, which appears to be a pink option. The option on the upper left is also pink, but are the ones on the right green?

Killadji · Dec 7, 2007

MrCheez said:
Hey, I just realized something that I haven't seen anyone mention:

Is this the front MAIN menu screen? I originally thought it was just one of the WiFi mode menus, but instead it seems that the user has select "WiFi Mode" from the main menu and the 'connecting' window popped up over it.}

There appears to be... four big buttons? I'm sure we can create some speculation from this

No, that seems to be the Wifi Menu, you see on the top of the screen ?
There are two little black waves on the red background. Obviously that means communication.
So, in this menu, there probably will be all communication-related options : Friend-codes, Edited-Level-Sending, Video and pics sending, updates (believe)...

Teasel · Dec 7, 2007

ehy guys
according to CVG brawl will be released in europe on Q3
http://www.computerandvideogames.com/article.php?id=177057
i really hope this isn't true,i mean 5 month to translate adventure mode and menus? and what the hell is NOE doing now? are they fiddling their thumbs or what?

Killadji · Dec 7, 2007

Teasel said:
ehy guys
according to CVG brawl will be released in europe on Q3
http://www.computerandvideogames.com/article.php?id=177057
i really hope this isn't true,i mean 5 month to translate adventure mode and menus? and what the hell is NOE doing now? are they fiddling their thumbs or what?

Plus, the game seems to be already translated !

They suck.

Iam Canadian · Dec 7, 2007

I have absolutely no idea why there's a European delay. Considering that they seem to be translating the North American version as of now (the screenshots on the Dojo are in English, after all), I can't imagine why Nintendo of Europe can't do likewise.

AceBandage · Dec 7, 2007

AceBandage said:
One thing I'd really like in SSBB is the challenge icon from GH3.
All games should have that on the Wii. Being able to receive a challenge at any time while playing the game is such a useful feature.

Wish granted?

Killadji · Dec 7, 2007

AceBandage said:
Wish granted?

What is the Challenge icon ?
Is that some kind of icone which appears when someone in your friendlist wants to explode you on a song ?

AceBandage · Dec 7, 2007

Killadji said:
What is the Challenge icon ?
Is that some kind of icone which appears when someone in your friendlist wants to explode you on a song ?

More or less.
An icon will appear when a friend wants to play you online at any time during the game.
Makes it so you don't have to sit in the WFC lobby for a game to start.

Killadji · Dec 7, 2007

AceBandage said:
More or less.
An icon will appear when a friend wants to play you online at any time during the game.
Makes it so you don't have to sit in the WFC lobby for a game to start.

Even when you're playing in solo mode ? Is the game still connected to WFC ?!
That sounds interresting, that reminds me of when I really wanted a similar function on Mario Kart DS (In Mario Kart DS, the icon appears, but only when you're connected and playing a WFC mode).

AceBandage · Dec 7, 2007

Killadji said:
Even when you're playing in solo mode ? Is the game still connected to WFC ?!
That sounds interresting, that reminds me of when I really wanted a similar function on Mario Kart DS (In Mario Kart DS, the icon appears, but only when you're connected and playing a WFC mode).

Correct.
You could be tearing up The Metal in Career mode, or just practicing Black Magic Women on expert, and still receive a challenge.
All Wii games need this feature. So simple to put in, but so useful.

Killadji · Dec 7, 2007

AceBandage said:
Correct.
You could be tearing up The Metal in Career mode, or just practicing Black Magic Women on expert, and still receive a challenge.
All Wii games need this feature. So simple to put in, but so useful.

Thanks.
Now I want this game, I get it on my PS2 but I have to pass to the next level (need to finish the hard mode too, but that's another story...stucked in the part with Slipknot and Muse musics, it sucks)

But...If you need to access the Wi-Fi menu on SSBB, I mean it seems that you have to select something on the menu in order to connect to the WFC...Doesn't that mean that that Challenge Icon won't be in this game ?

SSBB is a game which needs to be connected from the start, when you power you Wii on...

(Excuse my english on some sentences ^^')

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