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May 2014 NPD (U.S. Hardware) Predictions - Closes June 14th

You might be correct, and you're probably one of the GAFers I'm most likely to listen to, but none the less I'm not so sure you're right on this. I don't want to be banned for arguing in their favour too much, but I will point out that Pachter seems to think their legacy numbers are pretty on the spot and leave it at that.

Pachter has full access to NPD data. Pachter's equity research reports never mention VG Chartz. Do you know how much time I think he spends perusing VG Chartz's archives? Little to none.

So when he was preparing that question for Pach Attack, I bet he looked up a couple of games, checked a few numbers, then came to that "generally accurate for legacy numbers" claim. But I refuse to believe for a second that Pachter performed thorough research into Chartz's methodology for legacy numbers.

Let's take a completely random example of a major game...Just Dance 3 Wii sales in 2011.

According to NPD, Just Dance 3 for Wii sold just above 450K in October 2011.


But according to VG Chartz:

XZRaMYP.png



So tell me, how can Chartz be a "pretty on the spot" resource if its numbers for October have a significant 110K discrepancy from the real NPD numbers? 350K and 460K are two very different numbers.


You cannot trust Chartz as a thoroughly reliable source for legacy sales numbers. Maybe some numbers are similar to NPD, but there are definitely many others that aren't.
 

Road

Member
This is a waste of time.

At this point, anyone who believes that site is reliable for anything is in such devolved brain state where logic, reasoning and arguments are no longer identifiable concepts.

Let's just continue laughing at their predictions.

Might as well post my guesses:

[360] 66k
[3DS] 99k
[PS3] 33k
[PS4] 199k
[WIU] 98k
[XB1] 77k

[PSV] 22k

Betting on a PS4 Watch Dogs boost. UK weekly sales doubled, so I expect something in the US due to the similarity of the markets. I probably have Wii U too low. Will give some thought to it on the weekend.
 

prag16

Banned
You cannot trust Chartz as a thoroughly reliable source for legacy sales numbers. Maybe some numbers are similar to NPD, but there are definitely many others that aren't.

Additionally, iirc correctly, Harker indicated that some of the Wii U launch games such as ZombiU, AC3 and BO2 were heavily overtracked by this horrific source. And their false (according to Harker) data still stands to this day.
 

Mpl90

Two copies sold? That's not a bomb guys, stop trolling!!!
PS4 v.s. One: the battle on Amazon.com (guest star, specific Wii U items) - only items already released / coming out till around the next month

Amazon.com, as of 08:47 GMT

PS4 ($399.99) - 8th

Watch Dogs
PS4 ($59.91) - 11th (Tomodachi Life is 12th)
One ($58.81) - 38th (Watch Dogs PS3 is 37th)

Metal Gear Solid V: Ground Zeroes
PS4 ($19.99) - 28th
One ($19.99) - 250th

Call of Duty: Ghosts
One ($19.99; sold by third party) - 29th
PS4 ($39.99) - 68th

Xbox One with Kinect + Titanfall ($499) - 44th

Xbox One without Kinect ($399) - 53rd

Battlefield 4
One ($24.99; sold by third party) - 56th
PS4 ($42.78) - 66th

Assassin's Creed IV: Black Flag
One ($24.99; sold by third party) - 64th
PS4 ($42.76) - 98th

inFAMOUS Second Son
Limited Edition ($51.98) - 71st
Standard Edition ($48.99; only 1 left in stock; sold by third party) - 262nd

EA Sports UFC
PS4 ($59.99) - 72nd
One ($59.99) - 144th

NBA 2K14 - All hope is lost
PS4 ($39.99) - 82nd. All hope is lost
One ($28.99; sold by third party) - 212nd. All hope is lost

FIFA 14
PS4 ($59.96) - 86th
One ($34.99; sold by third party) - 126th

Wolfestein: The New Order
PS4 ($58.58; only 10 left in stock; sold by third party) - 87th
One ($55.77) - 138th

Wii U corner

Mario Kart 8 ($59.99) - 3rd

Wii U Deluxe with NSMBU and NSLU ($310; only 2 left in stock; sold by third party) - 70th
 

noobie

Banned
PS4 v.s. One: the battle on Amazon.com (guest star, specific Wii U items) - only items already released / coming out till around the next month

Amazon.com, as of 08:47 GMT

PS4 ($399.99) - 8th

Watch Dogs
PS4 ($59.91) - 11th (Tomodachi Life is 12th)
One ($58.81) - 38th (Watch Dogs PS3 is 37th)

Metal Gear Solid V: Ground Zeroes
PS4 ($19.99) - 28th
One ($19.99) - 250th

Call of Duty: Ghosts
One ($19.99; sold by third party) - 29th
PS4 ($39.99) - 68th

Xbox One with Kinect + Titanfall ($499) - 44th

Xbox One without Kinect ($399) - 53rd

Battlefield 4
One ($24.99; sold by third party) - 56th
PS4 ($42.78) - 66th

Assassin's Creed IV: Black Flag
One ($24.99; sold by third party) - 64th
PS4 ($42.76) - 98th

inFAMOUS Second Son
Limited Edition ($51.98) - 71st
Standard Edition ($48.99; only 1 left in stock; sold by third party) - 262nd

EA Sports UFC
PS4 ($59.99) - 72nd
One ($59.99) - 144th

NBA 2K14 - All hope is lost
PS4 ($39.99) - 82nd. All hope is lost
One ($28.99; sold by third party) - 212nd. All hope is lost

FIFA 14
PS4 ($59.96) - 86th
One ($34.99; sold by third party) - 126th

Wolfestein: The New Order
PS4 ($58.58; only 10 left in stock; sold by third party) - 87th
One ($55.77) - 138th

Wii U corner

Mario Kart 8 ($59.99) - 3rd

Wii U Deluxe with NSMBU and NSLU ($310; only 2 left in stock; sold by third party) - 70th

MLB not in the list?
 
Hmm, so Wii U was up 666% w/w for MK8 release in the UK. But only 115% w/w in Japan, although the former week also saw an uptick.

(The former presumably reflects how poorly it was selling before the MK8 release, rather than necessarily large absolute numbers.)

David Gibson said that he thought they had done about 400K in Japan, when accounting for digital. But in pure physical it was about 350K. 50-100K in the UK, would probably translate to something like 300-400K in Other?

So that should put MK8 US at around 450K or so in May, based on Nintendo's 1.2M opening for the game - which may or may not include digital (I would assume it does). So double Super Mario 3D World.

Not sure whether all that makes me want to increase my prediction or not.
Remember, that's just for UK.
Lol, oops. Yeah, I thought I wrote that.
 

Mpl90

Two copies sold? That's not a bomb guys, stop trolling!!!
Hmm, so Wii U was up 666% w/w for MK8 release. But only 115% w/w in Japan, although the former week also saw an uptick.

(The former presumably reflects how poorly it was selling before the MK8 release, rather than necessarily large absolute numbers.)

David Gibson said that he thought they had done about 400K in Japan, when accounting for digital. But in pure physical it was about 350K. 50-100K in the UK, would probably translate to something like 300-400K in Other?

So that should put MK8 US at around 450K or so in May, based on Nintendo's 1.2M opening for the game - which may or may not include digital (I would assume it does). So double Super Mario 3D World.

Not sure whether all that makes me want to increase my prediction or not.

Remember, that's just for UK.
 

jvm

Gamasutra.
[PS4] 210K
[WIU] 110K
[3DS] 90K
[XB1] 60K
[360] 55K
[PS3] 30K

Note: This is a quote from a note sent to me by an analyst for Stifel:
The NPD Group is scheduled to release video game sales (U.S. packaged goods) for May '14 on June 16th (NOTE: this is a Monday as the release date was moved due to timing of E3).

So, yes, release on Monday following E3.
 

Abdiel

Member
I agree...Xbox One sales definitely seem like they're lower than last month. And if last month they were 115K, sub-100K seems pretty guaranteed.

I can attest to the trend that the XB1 sales were... slow, in May. And I think some of you are misjudging how informed people might be about the price drop/new sku. Just cause I have had a powerup card in the past from Gamestop, I received 3 separate emails telling me I could pre-ordered the cheaper SKU, their site has been plastered with huge banners stating it, and even a good chunk of the in-store advertisements have been projecting the upcoming new model.

Best Buy is typically more subdued about gaming advertisements, since we don't make a lot of profit on the hardware (Effectively zero, really. No employee discount at all, like apple products), and they make money on accessories and protection plans, stuff that has margin on it (Except for the 360, which they lost so much money on before MS extended the warranties and admitted the hardware faults). Even with the subdued display info, there's been signs in the gaming area around the XB1/ and actually a good bit in the 360 area (as though to sway customers away from that system and towards the new hardware).

MS is really going in hard to try and make the price parity a big 'win' for them. How that will turn out? We don't have many pre-orders for the new sku... But this isn't expected to be a 'launch' situation, it's not like we expect shortages. I'm pretty sure everyone that wants a kinectless XB1 could get one on Monday and we'd still have some left over. At least, of the initial sales (Not saying lifetime, just immediate purchasers, no 'need' to pre-order, it's not like there's any advantage to do so).
 
I can attest to the trend that the XB1 sales were... slow, in May. And I think some of you are misjudging how informed people might be about the price drop/new sku. Just cause I have had a powerup card in the past from Gamestop, I received 3 separate emails telling me I could pre-ordered the cheaper SKU, their site has been plastered with huge banners stating it, and even a good chunk of the in-store advertisements have been projecting the upcoming new model.

Best Buy is typically more subdued about gaming advertisements, since we don't make a lot of profit on the hardware (Effectively zero, really. No employee discount at all, like apple products), and they make money on accessories and protection plans, stuff that has margin on it (Except for the 360, which they lost so much money on before MS extended the warranties and admitted the hardware faults). Even with the subdued display info, there's been signs in the gaming area around the XB1/ and actually a good bit in the 360 area (as though to sway customers away from that system and towards the new hardware).

MS is really going in hard to try and make the price parity a big 'win' for them. How that will turn out? We don't have many pre-orders for the new sku... But this isn't expected to be a 'launch' situation, it's not like we expect shortages. I'm pretty sure everyone that wants a kinectless XB1 could get one on Monday and we'd still have some left over. At least, of the initial sales (Not saying lifetime, just immediate purchasers, no 'need' to pre-order, it's not like there's any advantage to do so).

Given that Best Buy / bestbuy.com represents an approx. 12% of NPD retailer marketshare, this kind of channel check is quite important in projecting an overall trend of console stagnation.

The only question is how do you precisely measure Xbox One's decline?

I think we can all agree that Xbox One will not match last month (115K).

Seeing as you replied to my sub-100K assumption, I assume that it's safe to downgrade Xbox One below that as well.

Originally I predicted that the early price cut will result in a 50% reduction (115K -> 58K).

When you take into consideration all of the data I could find, I think 70K is a reasonable estimate.


PS4 I expect greater stock than last month due to major releases like Watch_Dogs and MLB 14: The Show. It should elevate the console an extra 35K...not enough to match prior months due to a natural May decline, but still an uptake from a slow April because of the circumstances.


I really don't expect a large Wii U hardware boost. There is no doubt that Mario Kart 8 will sell an awful lot, but its effect in the May 2014 results seem to be mostly delegated to existing Nintendo fan adoption.

A 50K boost (48K to 98K) seems appropriate. While Mario Kart 8 will probably elevate the Wii U beyond Nintendo's prior non-holiday tactics to elevate sales, its numbers in May will heavily suffer from a tiny 2 days of tracking.

So with the 2 days of tracking, I expect we will see results reminiscent of a full month of Nintendo's usual non-holiday tactics (see September 2013 Wii U sales).

With the rest, I don't think there will be any change beyond a downward adjustment for May.


So when you put all of these predictions together:



[360] 60K
[3DS] 90K
[PS3] 32K
[PS4] 235K
[WIU] 85K
[XB1] 70K
 

Abdiel

Member
Given that Best Buy / bestbuy.com represents an approx. 12% of NPD retailer marketshare, this kind of channel check is quite important in projecting an overall trend of console stagnation.

The only question is how do you precisely measure Xbox One's decline?

I think we can all agree that Xbox One will not match last month (115K).

Seeing as you replied to my sub-100K assumption, I assume that it's safe to downgrade Xbox One below that as well.

Originally I predicted that the early price cut will result in a 50% reduction (115K -> 58K).

When you take into consideration all of the data I could find, I think 70K is a reasonable estimate.


PS4 I expect greater stock than last month due to major 1st-party releases like Watch_Dogs and MLB 14: The Show. It should elevate the console an extra 35K...not enough to match prior months due to a natural May decline, but still an uptake from a slow April because of the circumstances.


I really don't expect a large Wii U hardware boost. There is no doubt that Mario Kart 8 will sell an awful lot, but its effect in the May 2014 results seem to be mostly delegated to existing Nintendo fan adoption.

A 50K boost (48K to 98K) seems appropriate. While Mario Kart 8 will probably elevate the Wii U beyond Nintendo's prior non-holiday tactics to elevate sales, its numbers in May will heavily suffer from a tiny 2 days of tracking.

So with the 2 days of tracking, I expect we will see results reminiscent of a full month of Nintendo's usual non-holiday tactics (see September 2013 Wii U sales).

With the rest, I don't think there will be any change beyond a downward adjustment for May.


So when you put all of these predictions together:



[360] 60K
[3DS] 90K
[PS3] 32K
[PS4] 235K
[WIU] 98K
[XB1] 70K

It's always kind of an honor to have my anecdotes analyzed by you, Aqua, haha.

As to your predictions, the logic you stated all seems pretty consistent to me. We definitely saw some increase in Wii U sales due to MK8, but it will remain to be seen if it stays positive into the end of June.

I've been more pleasantly surprised by the success of the BL2 bundle for Vita. My local stores have cleared 2 full shipments of the damn things. It's a pre-E3 Sony Handheld miracle.

And while we have seen Watch_Dogs sell well, especially on the PS4 (including a jump in hardware to match), I don't believe you can call a cross-gen 3rd party game 1st Party, Aqua, haha.
 

cornerman

Member
Given that Best Buy / bestbuy.com represents an approx. 12% of NPD retailer marketshare, this kind of channel check is quite important in projecting an overall trend of console stagnation.

The only question is how do you precisely measure Xbox One's decline?

I think we can all agree that Xbox One will not match last month (115K).

Seeing as you replied to my sub-100K assumption, I assume that it's safe to downgrade Xbox One below that as well.

Originally I predicted that the early price cut will result in a 50% reduction (115K -> 58K).

When you take into consideration all of the data I could find, I think 70K is a reasonable estimate.


PS4 I expect greater stock than last month due to major releases like Watch_Dogs and MLB 14: The Show. It should elevate the console an extra 35K...not enough to match prior months due to a natural May decline, but still an uptake from a slow April because of the circumstances.


I really don't expect a large Wii U hardware boost. There is no doubt that Mario Kart 8 will sell an awful lot, but its effect in the May 2014 results seem to be mostly delegated to existing Nintendo fan adoption.

A 50K boost (48K to 98K) seems appropriate. While Mario Kart 8 will probably elevate the Wii U beyond Nintendo's prior non-holiday tactics to elevate sales, its numbers in May will heavily suffer from a tiny 2 days of tracking.

So with the 2 days of tracking, I expect we will see results reminiscent of a full month of Nintendo's usual non-holiday tactics (see September 2013 Wii U sales).

With the rest, I don't think there will be any change beyond a downward adjustment for May.


So when you put all of these predictions together:



[360] 60K
[3DS] 90K
[PS3] 32K
[PS4] 235K
[WIU] 98K
[XB1] 70K

Hey Aqua:
Do you have a record of your previous guesses vs. the real sales figures over the last several months?
 

frizby

Member
[360] 72k
[3DS] 107k
[PS3] 47k
[PS4] 233k
[WIU] 92k
[XB1] 69k

My real prediction: Salt, when the 360 and the WiiU outsell the XB1
 

FourMyle

Member
[PS4] 210K
[WIU] 110K
[3DS] 90K
[XB1] 60K
[360] 55K
[PS3] 30K

Note: This is a quote from a note sent to me by an analyst for Stifel:


So, yes, release on Monday following E3.

Ooh, thanks

[PS4] 190K
[WIU] 100K
[XB1] 100K
[3DS] 70K
[360] 55K
[PS3] 29.9K
 

Faustek

Member
http://www.playstationonline.co.uk/2014/06/may-sales-are-in-ps4-dominates-nearly-2.html?spref=tw

May sales are in, PS4 dominates! Nearly 2 miilion copies of Watch Dogs sold on PS4!
On top of our report of the years console sales, things in the US, XBones home turf is starting to look very bleak with the PS4 sales tripling the flagging console in May.
To make things worse, the Wii U outsold it by nearly 100,000 units.

Playstation 4 sold a massive 577.092 while the WiiU sold 276.396, the XBone sold just 178.481. Near enough 400.000 difference.

Watch Dogs was the big winner with a massive 4 million copies sold over four consoles and Pc in just one week. Ubisoft will have taken note that a massive 1.86 million were sold on PS4.

[PS4]577k
[Wii U]276k
[Xbox One]178k

Tales from the ass? Seems reasonable to me but I see no source.

Fake edit: lol just saw "Xbone One". Seen it mentioned by that moniker to many times to even react these days.
 
http://www.playstationonline.co.uk/2014/06/may-sales-are-in-ps4-dominates-nearly-2.html?spref=tw

May sales are in, PS4 dominates! Nearly 2 miilion copies of Watch Dogs sold on PS4!
On top of our report of the years console sales, things in the US, XBones home turf is starting to look very bleak with the PS4 sales tripling the flagging console in May.
To make things worse, the Wii U outsold it by nearly 100,000 units.

Playstation 4 sold a massive 577.092 while the WiiU sold 276.396, the XBone sold just 178.481. Near enough 400.000 difference.

Watch Dogs was the big winner with a massive 4 million copies sold over four consoles and Pc in just one week. Ubisoft will have taken note that a massive 1.86 million were sold on PS4.

They are monthly, worldwide Chartz "numbers."

26969462_2h6zyvm.gif


Someone should really edit in the Chartz logo onto the old man
 

hepburn3d

Member
so, wonder what the effect will be on June NPD now. Noticed Halo: Master Chief Collection has gone straight to No1 on amazon .uk and .com.

The Kinectless SKU is rising through the ranks to. Will be interesting to see if the momentum is held.

I've never really seen the impact that selling nostalgia has, so can't quite tell what this will do.

I'm still feeling secure in my May predictions. I was hoping for more E3 sales talk so I could gauge my predictions.
 

Mpl90

Two copies sold? That's not a bomb guys, stop trolling!!!
Ok, this is a special edition of my comparions through Amazon, since it's on the heels of E3 Conferences, so there's a bigger "core" component compared to normal charts. This means that, even more than usual for core / Sony items, Amazon placements could not represent actual sales trend.

PS4 v.s. One... v.s. Wii U, on Amazon.com, E3 Edition

As of 19:43, GMT

Halo: The Master Chief Collection ($59.99) - 3rd

White PS4 + Destiny ($449.99) - 4th

Mario Kart 8 ($48.80) - 5th

PS4 ($399) - 7th

Destiny
PS4 ($59.96) - 9th
One ($59.96) - 29th

PS TV
Standard ($99.99) - 11th
DS3 Bundle ($139.99) - 41st

Assassin's Creed: Unity
PS4 ($59.96) - 13th
One ($59.99) - 46th

The Order 1886
Premium Edition ($149.99) - 15th
Collectors ($79.99) - 26th
Standard ($59.96) - 157th

Grand Theft Auto V
PS4 ($59.99) - 20th
One ($59.99) - 94th

Watch Dogs
PS4 ($59.95) - 21st (Tomodachi Life is 17th)
One ($58.82) - 58th

Bayonetta 2 ($59.96) - 32nd

Far Cry 4
PS4 ($59.99) - 34th
One ($59.99) - 121st

Hyrule Warriors ($59.99) - 36th

FIFA 14
PS4 ($39.99) - 42nd
One ($38.87; only 6 left in stock; sold by third party) - 154th

inFAMOUS: Second Son
Limited Edition ($53.99; only 12 left in stock; sold by third party) - 43rd
Standard ($39.99) - 173rd

Uncharted 4: A Thief's End ($59.96) - 44th

The Last of Us Remastered ($59.96) - 45th

One without Kinect ($399) - 50th

The Legend of Zelda ($59.99) - 55th

One with Kinect + Titanfall ($499) - 57th

Xenoblade Chronicles X ($59.99) - 63rd

Forza Horizon 2 Day One Edition ($59.99) - 68th

Call of Duty: Advanced Warfare
One ($59.96) - 71st
PS4 ($59.96) - 133rd

Call of Duty: Ghosts
One ($22; only 15 left in stock; sold by third party) - 73rd
PS4 ($39.98) - 109th

Little Big Planet 3 ($59.96) - 74th

UFC
PS4 ($59.99) - 75th
One ($59.99) - 180th

Wii U Mario bundle ($314.99; sold by third party) - 77th

Halo 5: Guardians ($59.99) - 80th

Sunset Overdrive Day One Edition ($59.96) - 83rd

Super Smash Bros. for Wii U ($59.96) - 86th (for 3DS - 52nd)

Battlefield 4
PS4 ($42.78) - 89th
One ($37.99; sold by third party) - 158th

Batman: Arkham Knight
PS4 ($59.99) - 91st
One ($59.99) - 368th

Killzone: Shadow Fall ($29.99) - 95th

Assassin's Creed IV: Black Flag
PS4 ($42.74) - 99th
One ($36.49; in stock on June 13th; sold by third party) - 174th
 
PS4 v.s. One... v.s. Wii U, on Amazon.com, E3 Edition

Wait Mpl90 what Amazon best sellers list do you use?

Instantaneous is the least useful for comparisons. And June's looks nothing like the placements you have

http://www.amazon.com/gp/bestsellers/2014-06/videogames/?tag=viglink129408-20#1

https://twitter.com/gibbogame/statuses/476801784737177600

Wii U sales increased 4.1x week over week in the U.S. with MK8's release. Adjustments begin! :lol

I might have to ratchet down my Wii U then...
 

prag16

Banned
https://twitter.com/gibbogame/statuses/476801784737177600

Wii U sales increased 4.1x week over week in the U.S. with MK8's release. Adjustments begin! :lol

Hmm. I had Wii U at 105k. Might need to drop that a bit. If for the sake of argument we say 12k for a "normal" week, that means close to 50k for MK8 week, and 86k for the month. Though there could have been a bump in anticipation of MK8. e.g. for the month it could be something like 10k, 10k, 16k, 65k (4.1*16) == 101k. Eh, maybe I'll stand pat...
 
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