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[Camp Freddie]

Wow, I haven't seen a more pointless argument since, "Gone Home - is it a game?".

Like all genres, MMO is not a fixed definition. People just looked at a bunch of games with similar characteristics and bunched them together.
The nature of gaming (like all art forms) is that people will mix styles from different genres, so the resulting works escape easy categorisation.

Destiny is an FPS with elements taken from MMORPGs. There is no widely accepted name for what it is, but "shared-world shooter" seems like an accurate term.

Next up on GAF, "Tomatoes - Fruit or Vegetable?".

Back to the OP, I'm a bit worried that the explore modes will get boring quickly. There's not much really there, beyond waiting for an event to spawn. The 'quests' are extremely tedious and I generally ignored them in order to go exploring.
I hope Bungie will take an active role in tweaking the explore zones to keep things interesting. Just tweaking the spawns and loot drops for a weekly community quest would be cool, and not a huge development burden.

There's enough content for a good game, I'm not sure it'll be the sort of masterwork that we talk about fondly for the next decade.

 

[DryvBy]

That game doesn't function at all like Destiny and you know it.

And Destiny doesn't function like an MMO...

You said Ehh, "yeah.. its an MMO in every way except the actual massive part. Nowadays the name means more then just "a ton of players together in one spot." Keeping that asterisk in mind, I would still call it an MMO."

...so my question still stands. Battlefield 4 in an MMO?

 

[Trickster]

And Destiny doesn't function like an MMO...

You said Ehh, "yeah.. its an MMO in every way except the actual massive part. Nowadays the name means more then just "a ton of players together in one spot." Keeping that asterisk in mind, I would still call it an MMO."

...so my question still stands. Battlefield 4 in an MMO?

Have you ever played an mmorpg?

 

[DryvBy]

Have you ever played an mmorpg?

Never. Not one in my entire life. Unless Battlefield 4 counts.

 

[QaaQer]

Arguing whether it's a MMO anything or not has to be one of the dumbest and most pointless things ever.

which generation does it belong to? Is it dead? How do I know the color blue is to you is the same to me when one hand is clapping?

 

[Trickster]

Never. Not one in my entire life.

That certainly explains why you would say Destiny doesn't functions like an mmo.

 

[joecanada]

Wow, I haven't seen a more pointless argument since, "Gone Home - is it a game?".

Like all genres, MMO is not a fixed definition. People just looked at a bunch of games with similar characteristics and bunched them together.
The nature of gaming (like all art forms) is that people will mix styles from different genres, so the resulting works escape easy categorisation.

Destiny is an FPS with elements taken from MMORPGs. There is no widely accepted name for what it is, but "shared-world shooter" seems like an accurate term.

Next up on GAF, "Tomatoes - Fruit or Vegetable?".

Back to the OP, I'm a bit worried that the explore modes will get boring quickly. There's not much really there, beyond waiting for an event to spawn. The 'quests' are extremely tedious and I generally ignored them in order to go exploring.
I hope Bungie will take an active role in tweaking the explore zones to keep things interesting. Just tweaking the spawns and loot drops for a weekly community quest would be cool, and not a huge development burden.

There's enough content for a good game, I'm not sure it'll be the sort of masterwork that we talk about fondly for the next decade.

I believe all fruits are defined as having a fruiting body containing the seeds within. Therefore tomatoes, pumpkins, cucumbers, are all fruits by definition....

...I'll show myself out.


But seriously am I missing something? Is this thread really all about defining what destiny is just so that people can explain why others should not like it? I enjoyed it, and I do have some questions about content, which will be answered on September 9. No big deal.

 

[Chaos17]

Never. Not one in my entire life. Unless Battlefield 4 counts.

Play WoW for free and taste what is an mmorpg.

 

[MrAndySchneider]

Next up on GAF, "Tomatoes - Fruit or Vegetable?".

Fun quote:

"Knowledge is knowing that a tomato is a fruit. Wisdom is knowing that a tomato doesn't belong in a fruit salad."

And on topic: Yes.

 

[BokehKing]

How do we know how much this game is scaled back from an MMO if we did not come out yet? . We have no idea how they plan on supporting it or what they will be turning on know the weeks after release.

 

[commish]

That certainly explains why you would say Destiny doesn't functions like an mmo.

Ummm Destiny absolutely doesn't function like an MMO. And I've put thousands of hours into MMOs. I'm pretty sure we are beyond the "Destiny is an MMO".

Have you played Planetside 2? That's a MMOFPS. Destiny isn't.

 

[QaaQer]

How do we know how much this game is scaled back from an MMO if we did not come out yet? . We have no idea how they plan on supporting it or what they will be turning on know the weeks after release.

The beta was for testing their infrastructure. They aren't going to be adding a bunch of untested stuff for launch, unless they are cra-cra.

I hope they add a bunch of untested stuff for launch and we get a cra-cra game.

 

[Icyflamez96]

Well no matter what anyone says, you can't have an MMO without the massive number of players, period. There is so much confusion over this.

People constantly say that Destiny is an MMO or like an MMO..... It'd be much more acurrate to say Destiny is or is like a MMORPG. Planetside 2 is an MMO, and I know that's not the type of game people refer to when comparing "MMOs" to Destiny

 

[Muffdraul]

Good, good. Cancel those Ghost Edition pre-orders, fuckers. Daddy regrets not jumping on them.

 

[KingErich]

It's not an MMO unless MMO means Miniature Multiplayer Online. It's just Bungie's attempt to make a Borderlands 2 clone with Halo combat. It isn't ambitious. It isn't unique. It's an always online shooter where you see a small amount of other players dancing.

 

[Doc_Drop]

It's not an MMO unless MMO means Miniature Multiplayer Online. It's just Bungie's attempt to make a Borderlands 2 clone with Halo combat. It isn't ambitious. It isn't unique. It's an always online shooter where you see a small amount of other players dancing.

The dancing was really strange,felt out of place tbh.but it seems to have been really popular for some reason

 

[Bitmap Frogs]

In the end-game piece IGN just uploaded, the lead designer cites 20 hours as the campaign completion time.

 

[WonderCheese]

As I explained above, it's valuable when managing expectations.

MMO brings with it certain expected standards. People expecting Destiny to be an MMO might be disappointed when they realise how many people you see online at once.

They might also be disappointed in the density of explorable areas in terms of interactive elements like NPCs and small village hubs.

Destiny is a hybrid, it takes ideas from RPGs, MMORPGs, and FPSs and makes something familiar but different. In terms of an FPS it's extremely ambitious, but in terms of an MMORPG it's scaled back considerably. That perspective is key.

This is an excellent post, especially your last paragraph.

 

[Jest Chillin]

In the end-game piece IGN just uploaded, the lead designer cites 20 hours as the campaign completion time.

The 20 hours is not an actual quote from Luke Smith. It's not really possible to ascertain if that's an arbitrary number chosen by the author or if it's something Luke expressed to him that he chose not to include a direct quote of.

 

[Doctoglethorpe]

As I explained above, it's valuable when managing expectations.

MMO brings with it certain expected standards. People expecting Destiny to be an MMO might be disappointed when they realise how many people you see online at once.

They might also be disappointed in the density of explorable areas in terms of interactive elements like NPCs and small village hubs.

Destiny is a hybrid, it takes ideas from RPGs, MMORPGs, and FPSs and makes something familiar but different. In terms of an FPS it's extremely ambitious, but in terms of an MMORPG it's scaled back considerably. That perspective is key.

Thats a fair point. It may be nessisary for some people to not get the idea its going to be an fps WoW in space. Personally, I don't need the differentiation though. Just seems like a complication. Shared World Shooter is a new term, so it brings with it all kinds of questions. MMO is pretty straight forward, even if the specifics of how "massive" it actually is isn't set in stone by the word.

And Destiny doesn't function like an MMO...

You said Ehh, "yeah.. its an MMO in every way except the actual massive part. Nowadays the name means more then just "a ton of players together in one spot." Keeping that asterisk in mind, I would still call it an MMO."

...so my question still stands. Battlefield 4 in an MMO?

BF4 doesn't have dungeons, raids, multiplayer filled open worlds, loot, leveling, and idle npcs tied to all those things. So no, its not. Do you see what i'm getting at here? The word MMO implies more then just massive multiplayer, regardless of what the dictionary will tell you. Gif is supposed to be pronounced jif but that doesn't mean anybody cares to do so. Being "incorrect" is irrelevant. I don't know how much clearer I can be about this, so thats my final word. End of the day its just a semantics argument, like everything. I don't even really care what people call it, I was just trying to explain why many people would call it an MMO, and why it makes sense to do so, right or wrong.

 

[Zakalwe]

BF4 doesn't have dungeons, raids, multiplayer filled open worlds, loot, leveling, and idle npcs tied to all those things. So no, its not. Do you see what i'm getting at here? The word MMO implies more then just massive multiplayer, regardless of what the dictionary will tell you.

There are MMO games that don't have any of those things. Sims Online, Planetside 2, Age of Empires Online (rip), etc...

MMO literally just means what it says, nothing more.

 

[Icyflamez96]

There are MMO games that don't have any of those things. Sims Online, Planetside 2, Age of Empires Online (rip), etc...

MMO literally just means what it says, nothing more.

Yeah I mean why do I post these comments if no one is going to even take it into consideration?...

 

[TheOMan]

Cryptarch starts at level 0

Every engram you buy or let him decipher nets you +50 (Common Engrams) which you can buy off him very cheap, or +100 (Green Engrams) from drops from Strike missions or enemies that you kill that drop them, those deciphered engrams add points to his Rank which you level up, you can see your rank in that circle that next to him which fills up little by little

The reason you want to level him up is the better Rank he is, the better he can decipher the lower tiered color items, but also lets you acscess to the higher tiered color engrams
You can have a Rank 1 Cryptarch decipher your blue engram, but most likely it'll net you a blue material
Say of your Cryptarch is level 12, now he deciphers it and you most likely will get a weapon/gear piece of same color or 1 tier below, the more you rank him up, the he will identify, decipher, and net you good reward

Raising his levels is not easy.
(Don't hold me to the numbers they might be off if changed for retail)
You need 2000 points to get him to Rank 1, then +100 added for each rank, so Rank 5 you'll need 2500 points
Common (white) give you +50 which you can buy off him for 250 glimmer per, they are always present, Uncommon (green) give you +100 which you also can buy after hitting a certain rank but sometime do go away they are pricier from 450-600 Glimmer Per, they come on sale from time to time
I'm guessing Rare (blue) and Purple (Legendary) will get a +150/200 in the deciphering points department

Once you start raising his ranks, every time you reach a new rank, you get a reward sent to you in the mail for getting him to that rank
I burned my rewards to see what I got and most of my blues/purple engrams turned into materials, but once I hit Rank 10, and got another blue reward, it turned into a rocket launcher, level 10, nice stuff to upgrade
So the best option is to save those rewards for down the line when your cryptarch is more ranked up and can really identify/decipher it for you
Hell the best thing about him is you save up some engrams and level yourself up in the process, the engrams have to at least match you in your level
So if your level 3 and get a green engram, it would better to save it till you are level 10 and rank 5+ with cryptarch so that engram can become something awesome

The way I efficiently ranked him up was by Glimmer farming in Rocket Yard and opening chests running in a loop around the area, running room to room where chest spawns, just kept doing the grind for 5 hours, which netted me 25,000 Glimmer which was the cap for the BETA (so roughly 5,000 Glimmer/hour)

Then I would go buy Cryptarch out, and start him deciphering stuff, then I would dismantle said weapon/gear and repeat the process till I have no more glimmer amount to buy from him
Repeat again
Once I got to 5+, he started offering Green Engrams on occasions before his refresh stock time
So once again I bought out the green version hoping to get good weapons but also net me Rank+ on him
Once I hit Rank 10 with him, I tried to see what my Green Engrams would be, and started becoming level 9-10 items (Beta cap was 8), with the rare occasion it netting me a Blue weapon in the process

Very cool - thanks for the explanation. I will be certainly keeping this in mind when Destiny hits.

 

[Futaba]

i don't personally care what people want to class the game as, i just want to plat it again.

 

[Exploratory]

http://www.ign.com/articles/2014/07/30/destiny-beta-brings-in-over-46-million-players?+main+twitter

Activision Blizzard has announced over 4.6 million Guardians took part in the recent Destiny beta.

The exact figure came in at 4,638,937, which is pretty astonishing considering how short a period it was available for.

Thats a lot of people. I wonder what the preorder amount is like now. I bet there is a lot more of them than before. Thats pretty awesome tho.

I canceled mine but I'm sure not everyone had the same reaction.

 

[coolasj19]

When the news broke of the amount of content being less than I anticipated, I was ready to go all "PRE-ORDER CANCELLED!!" but then Battlefield got delayed, and then Evolve got delayed. And then I realized I only plan on purchasing one retail priced game (Driveclub probably) this holiday season. Then my Facebook gaming group of friends started going crazy over the Destiny Beta and now here I am on the verge of cashing in some Target credit and pre-ordering away. Honestly, I would much rather spend $60 on not such a content rich new IP (just assuming here), than buy another FIFA or CoD. At the end of the day, it's more playing with my friends than content that matters.

EDIT : Pre-ordering is dumb but I do it so that that money is absolutely committed. So that I can guarantee to myself that I'll get what I want.

 

[Amir0x]

When the news broke of the amount of content being less than I anticipated, I was ready to go all "PRE-ORDER CANCELLED!!" but then Battlefield got delayed, and then Evolve got delayed. And then I realized I only plan on purchasing one retail priced game (Driveclub probably) this holiday season. Then my Facebook gaming group of friends started going crazy over the Destiny Beta and now here I am on the verge of cashing in some Target credit and pre-ordering away. Honestly, I would much rather spend $60 on not such a content rich new IP (just assuming here), than buy another FIFA or CoD. At the end of the day, it's more playing with my friends than content that matters.

Honestly there will be plenty of content. Ramming through the campaign is not the only incentive imo.

 

[Norns]

It's not an MMO unless MMO means Miniature Multiplayer Online. It's just Bungie's attempt to make a Borderlands 2 clone with Halo combat. It isn't ambitious. It isn't unique. It's an always online shooter where you see a small amount of other players dancing.

Cool, thanks for your opinion.

 

[Karl Hawk]

i don't personally care what people want to class the game as, i just want to plat it again.

I am not looking forward to see this thread on first page again.

 

[glottis8]

I canceled mine but I'm sure not everyone had the same reaction.

why did you cancel it? will you reconsider buying it after it launches?

 

[Karl Hawk]

why did you cancel it? will you reconsider buying it after it launches?

He did say he'll wait for reviews and gaf impressions before he buys it, but I'm not holding my breath.

When the news broke of the amount of content being less than I anticipated, I was ready to go all "PRE-ORDER CANCELLED!!" but then Battlefield got delayed, and then Evolve got delayed. And then I realized I only plan on purchasing one retail priced game (Driveclub probably) this holiday season. Then my Facebook gaming group of friends started going crazy over the Destiny Beta and now here I am on the verge of cashing in some Target credit and pre-ordering away. Honestly, I would much rather spend $60 on not such a content rich new IP (just assuming here), than buy another FIFA or CoD. At the end of the day, it's more playing with my friends than content that matters.

EDIT : Pre-ordering is dumb but I do it so that that money is absolutely committed. So that I can guarantee to myself that I'll get what I want.

Destiny is not the type of game where you play single-player to the end and call it a day. It has plenty of activities (Especially the PvE side) that should give tons of replay value, especially on end-game with Raids and Weekly/Daily Nightfall missions.

Bungie is known to support their games with post-launch content, and Destiny will be no exception.

 

[Darklord]

4. The Reef is supposedly a second social hub.

wtf? No way, that's tiny then. That seems crazy for a game that's mean to be a MMO/Borderlands style game. Borderlands had a huge world and MMO's are gigantic. I'll be super bummed out if it's just tons of backtracking.

 

[Mr Reasonable]

Bungie is known to support their games with post-launch content, and Destiny will be no exception.

I don't doubt that there'll be plenty of post launch content, I think the concern is that there'll be hardly any at launch, until you or your hand in your pocket again to buy some.

 

[Karl Hawk]

I don't doubt that there'll be plenty of post launch content, I think the concern is that there'll be hardly any at launch, until you or your hand in your pocket again to buy some.

I clearly understand that position and I think some people have every right to be concerned, but I feel that there were some who made baseless assumptions or jumped to conclusions without any clear evidence.

 

[Lord of Castamere]

I still think every area represented in pvp will make an appearance in pve. I think Old Russia will be the only location on Earth, but will open up into 3 areas all tied together. If true then there will be 9-10 areas in the game minimum. I just find it odd that the Community manager mentioned that the Moon would be the smallest map when Old Russia (from what we've seen) is smaller than the moon, either he was mistaken or Earth is much much larger than what we've seen. The moon is the only location that has one area in pvp, there are actually 2 pvp maps based off of Ocean of Storms.

 

[failgubbe]

Pre-order kept

 

[Karl Hawk]

I still think every area represented in pvp will make an appearance in pve. I think Old Russia will be the only location on Earth, but will open up into 3 areas all tied together. If true then there will be 9-10 areas in the game minimum. I just find it odd that the Community manager mentioned that the Moon would be the smallest map when Old Russia (from what we've seen) is smaller than the moon, either he was mistaken or Earth is much much larger than what we've seen. The moon is the only location that has one area in pvp, there are actually 2 pvp maps based off of Ocean of Storms.

At this point, relying on the Beta data dump is useless as we already know it's incomplete and very likely not representing the final game.

Pre-order kept

Better than those ''Pre-order cancelled'' posts

 

[Llyrwenne]

I still think every area represented in pvp will make an appearance in pve. I think Old Russia will be the only location on Earth, but will open up into 3 areas all tied together. If true then there will be 9-10 areas in the game minimum. I just find it odd that the Community manager mentioned that the Moon would be the smallest map when Old Russia (from what we've seen) is smaller than the moon, either he was mistaken or Earth is much much larger than what we've seen. The moon is the only location that has one area in pvp, there are actually 2 pvp maps based off of Ocean of Storms.

I don't mean to offend you, but this combination of misinformation, false assumptions and expectations based in nothing are exactly what got this shitstorm started. Old Russia is bigger than the Moon, the Moon just 'feels' bigger because it's a more open space vs. the corridors of Old Russia. There will only be one area per planet. Old Russia is what it was in the Beta, only with the addition of being able to properly explore Grottoes and having King's Watch, Jovian Complex and the Seraphim Vault / Bunker Ras-3 opened up ( though these areas may be reserved for missions and just not available in Explore, like Devil's Lair ). The PvP maps do not represent playable singleplayer space. Mercury is exclusive to the Crucible according to the datamine and if you expect anything more, you're just setting yourself up for disappointment.

There's always the possibility that the Beta was a super-old build and Bungie added tons of stuff since then, or that Bungie is just holding a ton of stuff back, but basing your expectations in those possibilities means that you are inevitably setting yourself up for disappointment.

Stop doing this stuff to yourselves.

 

[Fracas]

I told a couple friends about this earlier and now they plan on just renting the game. rip

I was going to buy the LE but with all the other games I want coming this fall, I don't think Destiny will hold my attention for more than a few weeks (even though I've enjoyed what I've played). Even more so after seeing that the game may not be as large as I was led to believe. I'll probably just walk into a gamestop on launch day and pick up a vanilla copy, if I don't go the rental route as well. Depends on how much cash I feel like blowing/impressions from nonpartial gaffers.

edit: Also, it's going to be really disappointing when Old Chicago ends up as paid DLC.

 

[failgubbe]

I put in almost 20 hours in the beta so im sure i and most people that enjoyed the beta will have a great time, especially with PVP being awesome. One area per planet isnt really a problem, i think the whole game offers more content then most games that are the same price with the campaign, strikes, raids and PVP etc

 

[Lord of Castamere]

Old Russia is bigger than the Moon, the Moon just 'feels' bigger because it's a more open space vs. the corridors of Old Russia.

I disagree. The moon may have less on the surface but with it's underground areas easily matched, and I believe surpassed the cosmodrome. The moon also had several locked areas, and undoubtedly a lot of mission areas cut out too. I also don't see why the linearity of the maps matter area is area.

 

[coolasj19]

Honestly there will be plenty of content. Ramming through the campaign is not the only incentive imo.

Destiny is not the type of game where you play single-player to the end and call it a day. It has plenty of activities (Especially the PvE side) that should give tons of replay value, especially on end-game with Raids and Weekly/Daily Nightfall missions.
Bungie is known to support their games with post-launch content, and Destiny will be no exception.

Eh? Oh, I'm not talking about the campaign, I'm talking in terms of roaming space. I'm the guy who spends a couple of hours a day listening to podcasts and doing those silly "Collect X amount of Y" missions. I need lots of space to roam and do things and what I was originally promised "You can walk all the way to that city you see in the distance." is apparently no longer true. I spent like 10 minutes trying to hop across that broken freeway just outside the wall of Old Russia. I wanted to see and explore that Empty Fallout Wasteland-esque environment. That's what I'm annoyed about. Raids, Strikes, PvP are good and all but I've done that before in one shape or another. Though, when it comes down to it, I need a substantial game my friends are going to be playing and I suppose filling in the FPS gap in my PS4 like library wouldn't hurt either.

Yo Bungie, make bigger Explore areas.

 

[Altima]

I don't care and I will buy the game.

 

[Ingueferroque]

It's not an MMO unless MMO means Miniature Multiplayer Online. It's just Bungie's attempt to make a Borderlands 2 clone with Halo combat. It isn't ambitious. It isn't unique. It's an always online shooter where you see a small amount of other players dancing.

bi

 

[Cse]

Yo Bungie, make bigger Explore areas.

I'm sure they want to, but I imagine they're being limited in some fashion by the 360/PS3.

 

[Karl Hawk]

I'm sure they want to, but I imagine they're being limited in some fashion by the 360/PS3.

I can say for certain that Bungie should be able to expand and improve the foundation they made for Destiny once they make it current-gen only (PS4/XB1) starting with Destiny 2 and beyond.

 

[viveks86]

I disagree. The moon may have less on the surface but with it's underground areas easily matched, and I believe surpassed the cosmodrome. The moon also had several locked areas, and undoubtedly a lot of mission areas cut out too. I also don't see why the linearity of the maps matter area is area.

Bungie confirmed that the moon is their smallest map. Not sure what is there to debate after that

 

[broony]

I need lots of space to roam and "You can walk all the way to that city you see in the distance."

Where did they say this? Which article or video?

 

[Llyrwenne]

Where did they say this? Which article or video?

They stated in BCD sessions of the E3 gameplay reveal demo that the space behind / beyond the starting point ( where you started in Old Russia, with the rusted cars outside the wall ) was 'actual geometry' / 'playable space' and that they could go there now but wouldn't 'in the interest of time'. That's all it ever was though; statements during Behind Closed Door sessions at the reveal of the game. If you based your expectations in those statements, you have the full right to be disappointed, and I think it wouldn't be wrong of Bungie to admit that those were ambitions they aren't going to meet with this first incarnation of Destiny and that they should not have made those statements that early on, before such a thing was actually implemented.

However, to my knowledge, they never said stuff like 'You can walk to that city you see in the distance', and further promotional material, trailers, interviews, statements and what we played in both the alpha and beta did not imply these things either.

 

[broony]

They stated in BCD sessions of the E3 gameplay reveal demo that the space behind / beyond the starting point ( where you started in Old Russia, with the rusted cars outside the wall ) was 'actual geometry' / 'playable space' and that they could go there now but wouldn't 'in the interest of time'. That's all it ever was though; statements during Behind Closed Door sessions at the reveal of the game. If you based your expectations in those statements, you have the full right to be disappointed, and I think it wouldn't be wrong of Bungie to admit that those were ambitions they aren't going to meet with this first incarnation of Destiny and that they should not have made those statements that early on, before such a thing was actually implemented.

However, to my knowledge, they never said stuff like 'You can walk to that city you see in the distance', and further promotional material, trailers, interviews, statements and what we played in both the alpha and beta did not imply these things either.

Exactly. Never said anything like his quote.

When they talked about the vista in old Russia in the live demo, they said that their designers would fill that area at some point in the future. Which is obviously not going to happen now. They could have easily thought that area would be populated, but they chose to use the resource elsewhere in the game, or just simply the presenter, which was DeeJ i believe, was misinformed at the time.

It was never a theme of the previews that the scale is going to to crazy big, with epic worlds to explore. It was definitely implied that the areas would be sizable, but never "walk to the city in the horizon" big.