FinalStageBoss
Banned
Perfect top 5
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Empire Magazine's Greatest 100 games of all time [Reader Voted]
- Thread starter Markitron
- Start date
MiamiWesker
Member
Can someone explain to me why TLOU is IMPORTANT? I love it but it doesn't really have any innovation in game design or storytelling. The story is just really good.
If they can't crack this reader popularity poll your favorite series smells bad and all the Belmonts stink. Especially Julius. Get a haircut and a shave you bum.
Corpsepyre
Banned
Memes as well.
Vigilant Walrus
Member
Well also, Empire being a film magazine you can see why they would choose a game with a strong narrative as their winner!
Petrae
Member
Nobody plays those games anymore. What's a Castlevania, anyway? 1997 was, like, forever ago to these kids. The Dark Ages.
Empire is Famitsu for movies. It's mostly a shit rag. Movie industry mark magazine.
Streets of Rage 2 or really any belt-scroller is entirely absent too. It feels like arcades never existed in this list. Kinda sucks when lists don't really represent history, just popularity. Plus the fact that it doesn't give people a good idea of variance and other things to potentially try out.
Or Shenmue 3. The cure for cancer will come out first. Maybe it will be the Shenmue 3 pre-order bonus.
Awesome contribution there chap. Pat yourself on the back for some more words well spent.
TLoU will stand the test in my opinion. It'll be seen as a landmark in the marriage between gameplay and storytelling. Kinda unfair on Uncharted, but it is what it is.There are a lot of better movies than The Godfather
Critical acclaims have a meaning when something stands the test of time. There's a reason Seven Samurai is considered one of the greatest movie ever (zero Oscars) and Slumdog Millionaire is nowhere to see in any Top list (11 Oscars).
What I mainly meant is that TLoU doesn't need defending, in the same way that you wouldn't bother defending Thriller. It speaks for itself.
I might as well answer this because I'm the one that said it (although I did retract it). My loose thoughts were that TLoU was the first time I realised games could be more than they were. I know that's vague, but it's the best way I can put it. It just has something 'more' to it. It's the type of game I want to show to non-gamers as an example of why I'm proud of my hobby.
Good call, there are no arcade games on that list, are there? Not even Donkey Kong or Pac Man. Again, such failure.
Well, if you make claims like "most important" I would think you have more to back that up than shit all. I mean we're talking about a one year old game here. Even if you think it's the best ever, how important could it possibly be?
I would post a gif but I hate gifs. Needless to say, this got me.
No, you see the game about shooting and feelings is more important than the games that made the shooting and feelings game possible.
For me it's on par with Metroid Prime. Easily top 5.
MP was #72 on the list
The greatest game of all time, done a great disservice
The 2nd greatest, MegaMan X, was completely snubbed. :/
Street Fighter II, technically.
I would say that more and more, Street Fighter fans are gravitating towards Third Strike being the best Street Fighter though.
MGS essentially built the foundation for cinematic games. What other game during or before that time had such emphasis on storytelling through traditional means? Drawn and animated boxes with no voice acting isn't what inspired developers, nor was it that novel. MGS plays like a game and is presented like a movie. Ninja Gaiden isn't presented like a movie, its presented like a game. You won't hear debates about the story in Ninja Gaiden.
The cutscenes in MGS are framed like scenes in a movie. The performances given are serious, and are excellent. Kojima and his team added self awareness, where the characters had observations about their own universe. Naomi distrusts that Solid Snake has legitimate emotions, due to, well, being a cold blooded agent. Liquid Snake calls Solid Snake out for enjoying the killing, thereby saying the player enjoys the drama and conflict created by engaging with the gameplay.
As for MGS2:
http://www.deltaheadtranslation.com/MGS2/
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T-2YuPGYabw
Give me an essay or 35 minute video on the themes of TLOU and how to interpret the game itself.
People take storytelling in gaming for granted. It wasn't always like this. TLOU isn't some sort of savior of storytelling in console games.
I don't really see how TLOU is "important" at all. How will the medium evolve differently because of its influence? What innovation did it bring to the table?
The answer is not at all and none. It's another - well executed, I am sure - entry in a sub-genre (cinematic third person action adventures) which has existed for a long time, and which was already in ascendance at its release.
Super Mario Bros. Deus Ex. Ultima 4. Defense of the Ancients. Tetris. Doom. Minecraft. Wizardry. Street Fighter 2. Gradius. Those are titles which have shaped the medium (and its just a tiny subset of them).
The answer is not at all and none. It's another - well executed, I am sure - entry in a sub-genre (cinematic third person action adventures) which has existed for a long time, and which was already in ascendance at its release.
Super Mario Bros. Deus Ex. Ultima 4. Defense of the Ancients. Tetris. Doom. Minecraft. Wizardry. Street Fighter 2. Gradius. Those are titles which have shaped the medium (and its just a tiny subset of them).
It's a fair point, which is why I fell back to simply 'best'. My assessment of the importance of the game was based on how I feel it will affect other titles in the future, and that's purely speculative.
I will be quoting my post when it's voted 'most important video game' in 2025 Empire Magazine though
barneystuta83
Member
Dat Shenmue at
seven
That's adorable, but you're deliberately avoiding the point.
If someone made a list of the best movies of all time, you wouldn't want a soundtrack to be the determining factor for the top spot.
No it fucking didn't.
Memes have been a concept since the 70's, for Christ's sake. Metal Gear Solid fans give the series way too much credit.
Colonel Nasty
Member
What a shit list. It's like GameFaqs wrote it. Final Fantasy 7&8?!?! Last of Us isn't even the best Naughty Dog game from last gen.
Petrae
Member
I joked earlier about Empire readership not knowing what an "arcade" is, but truthfully, I don't think many game players today know, either. Lots of people have short memories when it comes to games they like, while others simply weren't around or weren't old enough to appreciate them.
Reader-voted lists-- without the balance of a list from those rooted in the field with some experience and knowledge-- don't carry too much merit.
Sight and Sound (a proper film magazine) did a poll in 2012 by over 1000 critics, academics, writers. Three silent movies were in the top 10, another in 11th and many more in the top 100.
http://explore.bfi.org.uk/sightandsoundpolls/2012/critics
You're right. The only point I was making is how prescient MGS2 was on the subjects of digital information accumulation and the surveillance state.
The game itself also played with videogame hype culture and videogame culture in general.
We will probably never see another MGS2 in this medium. Whereas TLOU 2 will be coming in 4-5 years.
The movie comparison doesn't fit because gaming is a thousand-years old industry.
MikeE21286
Member
Elite at 67?
Is that game even released?
Is that game even released?
List is breathtakingly bad. League of Legends over Dota? Nah son.
It's probably the original Elite.
It's probably the original Elite.
My sarcasm detector exploded.
That's cool, if it comes to that I'll be there to whine about how Empire is wrong yet againIt's a fair point, which is why I fell back to simply 'best'. My assessment of the importance of the game was based on how I feel it will affect other titles in the future, and that's purely speculative.
I will be quoting my post when it's voted 'most important video game' in 2025 Empire Magazine though
Not a determining factor, but certainly an important and possibly even major factor. Empire simply stated that Last of Us's story is what really set it apart, but that doesn't mean it's gameplay was anything less than stellar either.
MiamiWesker
Member
Good answer but let me ask you have you been playing games long. I had that same feeling way back in 1996 when I first played Resident Evil (hence my name and love for the franchise). That was that game that made me go "wow gaming can become so much more than movies and any form of entertainment".
The Godfather didn't shaped anything either and is considered the greatest movie ever made by some.
TLOU:R is important in that it shows what developers can do when they put effort in ALL aspects of a game, great characters, best gunplay of its class, great story, 1080p, 60fps, great art direction, great performances by the voice actors, great animations, great GORE, inovative approach to game design that I will not name becuase of spoilers, game is long, has game+, weapon progression and character progression, character arcs, incredible sound mixing and sound design, and some stuff I forget.
Now when you combine ALL of that in a single game it becomes what I and many claim the game is and what Empire Magazine says is teh greatest game.
When someone ask "what iks the pefect game" the answer is and will be untill a better game comes "The Last of Us: Remastered"
I actually found its gameplay to detract from the story of a terrifying urban apocalypse. Clickers and enemy NPCs (generally), by the end of the game, are just obstacles to story bits. It's hard to develop clickers as genuinely terrifying when you are just destroying tons of them by the end of the game. I guess that, in terms of a cinematic videogame, it certainly exemplifies the medium, but it doesn't really make a good case for it.
You are implying that The Last of Us doesn't have great gameplay. I disagree. The Last of Us is one of my favorite games not just because it has a good story, but because it has excellent gameplay. I didn't beat it 4 times to watch cutscenes, I played it 4 times because it's fun as hell.
So I think it's fine that you think it's not a good game, but your opinion is no more valid than mine, and I think this poll shows that a lot of people agree with me.
Readers voted for the games on the list, not the editors.
And you didn't argue your points well, you're listing game features without any elaboration.
Acquiescence
Member
This list alone is worth it just to see all the complaining that has resulted in TLoU coming out on top. The game would only just about make it in my top 20 personally, but it's hard to deny that it's a worthy number 1 choice. It's a joy to play, to look at and to listen to, it's obviously struck a chord with the masses and they love it... so suck it up!
Sheesh.
Sheesh.
SeventhSon
Member
*scanning the list, nodding at greatest games of all time, could nitpick order, gets to #1*
wut
wut
Exactly. The Last of Us has exceptional gameplay. It is one of the best third person shooters ever made by a long shot, and as I said before, it stands right next to Resident Evil 4 for me.
Dude, I started with RACE on the VIC-20 back in '83. I've owned every mainstream (and most niche) systems and played literally thousands of games over the last 30 years. I've seen plenty of milestones come and go, but none felt as 'complete' as TLoU. It made me feel like games had hit their version 1.0, and it was time for the next stage.
For me the combat and gameplay was the main crux of the game. The narrative, character exposition etc just the glue that held it all together, offered me a breather in pacing solace, gave my actions more meaning, and gave the entire game and all it's scenario's more purpose.