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[Liu Kang Baking A Pie]

People always have very rose-colored glasses about Chappelle's Show. They had a fair number of sketches that were marginalizing and disrespecting minorities. That's like 90% of the reason Chappelle quit.

I watched all of it this year. It's still mostly great.

AFAIK, he quit when a white guy was laughing too hard at a scene he felt was inappropriate for a white guy to laugh at like that. He knew he was going places he didn't like and getting reactions he didn't want.

Spoiler

Chappelle was the original SJW.

 

[border]

I watched all of it this year. It's still mostly great.

Chappelle's Show - Reparations 1
Chappelle's Show - Reparations 2

There's at least half a dozen things to complain about here alone. The very premise of the sketch is basically "If given money, black people will waste it on frivolous bullshit and that is hilarious". Even inside that there's still a slew of very cheap, very easy jokes about things like penis size, fried chicken, gold, diamonds.

There's also shorter bits like this that have a premise that barely goes beyond "LOL black people like ribs" and a fart joke.

 

[genjiZERO]

Her racial comedy is clearly in gest, but I just don't think it's very funny.

 

[Liu Kang Baking A Pie]

Chappelle's Show - Reparations 1
Chappelle's Show - Reparations 2

There's at least half a dozen things to complain about here alone. The very premise of the sketch is basically "If given money, black people will waste it on frivolous bullshit and that is hilarious". Even inside that there's still a slew of very cheap, very easy jokes about things like penis size, fried chicken, gold, diamonds.

There's also shorter bits like this that have a premise that barely goes beyond "LOL black people like ribs" and a fart joke.

I definitely see where you're coming from, and some of these lines wouldn't fly today. There's still a world of difference here between Chappelle exaggerating the stereotypes of his own race under extraordinary circumstances and the jokes about Mexicans Schumer tells, but both comedians are generally employing the "I'm playing dumb/a character" thing that makes the absurdity land in a way that worse comedians can't manage.

Maybe a big part of this is also that Chappelle is way more charismatic and has his heart on his sleeve while Schumer is still a bit too distant and guarded for most people to be able to relate to her and see where she's coming from. That's why her sex comedy lands more than her race jokes.

 

[genjiZERO]

I watched all of it this year. It's still mostly great.

AFAIK, he quit when a white guy was laughing too hard at a scene he felt was inappropriate for a white guy to laugh at like that. He knew he was going places he didn't like and getting reactions he didn't want.

Spoiler

Chappelle was the original SJW.

Yeah my understanding is that he thought it was getting too mean spirited and didn't have the poinincy. I agree with him frankly, seasons 1 and 2 are great. But the racial scenes in the third one are tacky.

 

[GorillaJu]

I watched all of it this year. It's still mostly great.

AFAIK, he quit when a white guy was laughing too hard at a scene he felt was inappropriate for a white guy to laugh at like that. He knew he was going places he didn't like and getting reactions he didn't want.

Spoiler

Chappelle was the original SJW.

Where did you hear this story?

 

[A Link to the Past]

Where did you hear this story?

If they can't find it, I'll just say that I also read that.

 

[Rabbi_Vole]

What's Amy's appeal?

 

[Liu Kang Baking A Pie]

Where did you hear this story?

Here's a good overview: http://spring.newsvine.com/_news/2006/07/14/287958-the-sketch-that-made-chappelle-say-enough

Very relevant line here:

His laughter struck Chappelle as wrong, and he wondered if the new season of his show had gone from sending up stereotypes to merely reinforcing them.

 

[J10]

What's Amy's appeal?

She's funny. That's why people like comedians.

 

[Delta Assault]

What's Amy's appeal?

Being funny, I think.

 

[Rabbi_Vole]

Being funny, I think.

Maybe I'm just not in her target audience

 

[MHWilliams]

Where did you hear this story?

It's a well-known story.

The third season hit a big speed bump in November 2004. He was taping a sketch about magic pixies that embody stereotypes about the races.

The black pixie‚ played by Chappelle‚Äîwears blackface and tries to convince blacks to act in stereotypical ways. Chappelle thought the sketch was funny, the kind of thing his friends would laugh at. But at the taping, one spectator, a white man, laughed particularly loud and long. His laughter struck Chappelle as wrong, and he wondered if the new season of his show had gone from sending up stereotypes to merely reinforcing them. "When he laughed, it made me uncomfortable," says Chappelle. "As a matter of fact, that was the last thing I shot before I told myself I gotta take f______ time out after this. Because my head almost exploded."

The guy who interviewed him for Time.

Well, his take on things is he was not happy with the direction of the show. He thought that--you know, the show deals with some very difficult material, sexual, racial, political, and he wanted to come out exactly the way he wanted to come out.

Because Dave Chappelle knows comedy means something. Him on his recent comedy:

Chappelle, 41, was in town to deliver the commencement address to this year’s graduating class of his alma mater, the Duke Ellington School of the Arts. In explaining why artists are important to contextualizing the world, he cited Dolezal.

“The world’s become ridiculous,” he told the awestruck grads at George Washington University’s Lisner auditorium. “There’s a white lady posing as a black lady. There is not one thing that woman accomplished that she couldn’t have done as a white woman. There’s no reason! She just needed the braids! I don’t know what she was doing.”

Despite the mention in his speech, backstage and no longer held to the constraints of a 15-minute time slot, Chappelle revealed why he would wait a while before he incorporated any Dolezal jokes into his act, if he decides to do so at all.

“The thing that the media’s gotta be real careful about, that they’re kind of overlooking, is the emotional content of what she means,” Chappelle said thoughtfully, between drags of American Spirit cigarettes. “There’s something that’s very nuanced where she’s highlighting the difference between personal feeling and what’s construct as far as racism is concerned. I don’t know what her agenda is, but there’s an emotional context for black people when they see her and white people when they see her. There’s a lot of feelings that are going to come out behind what’s happening with this lady.

 

[Game-Biz]

What about this joke?

Take, for example, a bit where she says, "I used to date Hispanic guys, but now I prefer consensual!"

Gotta say I laughed pretty hard.

 

[plasmawave]

Russell Peters is the best.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VELXE7xvVHo

 

[Laughing Banana]

It's kind of weird to see, just by reading the 1st page alone of this thread, that people suggest whether the jokes are acceptable or not depend on whether it's funny or not. The hell? Either they are acceptable or not; whether they are funny or not do not and should not have anything to do with it.

 

[NervousXtian]

Love Amy Schumer.. and I love her show.

If you don't like a comedian just watch someone else, it's like if you don't like certain kinds of music don't listen to it.

It's kind of weird to see, just by reading the 1st page alone of this thread, that people suggest whether the jokes are acceptable or not depend on whether it's funny or not. The hell? Either they are acceptable or not; whether they are funny or not do not and should not have anything to do with it.

Those people don't even believe what they wrote. They are just trying to fit in with the crowd here by pretending not to support this kind of thing and acting like she's not funny makes them think they fit in.

It's stupid. Either you find it offensive or you don't. It being funny doesn't mean it's no offensive. You are right, that's a stupid argument.

I think it's offensive, and I find it funny, and I have no problem with it.

 

[A Link to the Past]

Love Amy Schumer.. and I love her show.

If you don't like a comedian just watch someone else, it's like if you don't like certain kinds of music don't listen to it.



Those people don't even believe what they wrote. They are just trying to fit in with the crowd here by pretending not to support this kind of thing and acting like she's not funny makes them think they fit in.

It's stupid. Either you find it offensive or you don't. It being funny doesn't mean it's no offensive. You are right, that's a stupid argument.

I think it's offensive, and I find it funny, and I have no problem with it.

Why is it black-and-white? So you can't enjoy something and criticize it? You can't dislike something and criticize it? At what point does it become okay to criticize something?

 

[Ties]

the anti-sjw pseudo backlash on gaf makes me laugh tbh lol

 

[Karkador]

The comedians attitude is to say intentionally provocative things using the most potent taboos of our society (ie racism) because the greatest pain elicits the greatest laugh.

I'm trying to figure out what kind of pain Schumer is working through and expressing catharsis about through her jokes on Hispanic people. Is Amy Schumer Hispanic?

 

[Opto]

All art is sacred from criticism! But goddamn if my video games have anything less than 60 frames per second, then the artists are a bunch of money grubbing shams

 

[thepotatoman]

And that's how the legalization of marriage between man and animal came into being.

 

[Camwi]

Maybe I'm just not in her target audience

I don't think she's funny either, but man people need to lay off comedians. Nothing should be sacred when it comes to comedy.

 

[JCX]

I am not going to start joking about safe material. And don’t ask that of me. I love what I do and won’t let anyone take that away. I ask you to resist the urge to pick me apart.

Trust me. I am not racist. I am a devout feminist and lover of all people. My fight is for all people to be treated equally. So move on to the next person who is more deserving of your scrutiny and not the girl in your corner.

This seems to speak to the tendency or perception of liberals to eat their own. The bolded argument isn't as much a statement of not being racist, as much as it's saying "there are really bad racists out there who deserve your scrutiny. Not me, I am one of the 'good allies' "

I don't think telling a basic joke about Mexicans is very edgy (I hear it at open mics more than I'd like to). Amy is better than that joke.

 

[excelsiorlef]

the anti-sjw pseudo backlash on gaf makes me laugh tbh lol

They literally sound like the people claiming gay marriage means it'll soon be illegal to own a bible. Especially that stupid web comic that was posted earlier that had people going omg so true.

This seems to speak to the tendency or perception of liberals to eat their own. The bolded argument isn't as much a statement of not being racist, as much as it's saying "there are really bad racists out there who deserve your scrutiny. Not me, I am one of the 'good allies' "

I don't think telling a basic joke about Mexicans is very edgy (I hear it at open mics more than I'd like to). Amy is better than that joke.

It's pure bullshit deflection and not to mention as usual one can do more than one thing at once.

 

[Winter John]

It's kind of weird to see, just by reading the 1st page alone of this thread, that people suggest whether the jokes are acceptable or not depend on whether it's funny or not. The hell? Either they are acceptable or not; whether they are funny or not do not and should not have anything to do with it.

The only concern a comedian should have is whether their set is funny or not.

 

[andthebeatgoeson]

She was actively playing on racist thoughts.

'Hey, black people talk loudly at the movies'. It's fucking lazy. Like, some bad sketch of what diet racists say when no minorities are around. Fuck out of here.

 

[GorillaJu]

Here's a good overview: http://spring.newsvine.com/_news/2006/07/14/287958-the-sketch-that-made-chappelle-say-enough

Very relevant line here:

That is understandable but very different from the way you first told it, which came across as "Chapelle didn't want white people to laugh at his jokes."

 

[MHWilliams]

Nothing should be sacred when it comes to comedy.

Of course not. With a great setup and delivery, you can joke about anything. But you know what else isn't sacred?

Comedy.

There can be good jokes, great jokes, bad jokes, and everything in between. And as Chapelle noted, if you get it wrong, you end up reinforcing the thing you're trying to skewer. He believed in it enough to walk away from a multi-million dollar show.

So what makes people think they know better?

 

[Liu Kang Baking A Pie]

Yeah, she's way funnier than these jokes. The 12 Angry Men episode was spectacular.

That is understandable but very different from the way you first told it, which came across as "Chapelle didn't want white people to laugh at his jokes."

Don't know how you get that out of

AFAIK, he quit when a white guy was laughing too hard at a scene he felt was inappropriate for a white guy to laugh at like that. He knew he was going places he didn't like and getting reactions he didn't want.

My description is almost the same in detail and context as what the article says.

 

[Ran rp]

Amy is using the paraprosdokian technique in a lot of her material, which is basically just ending a seemingly normal statement in an unexpected way; guys like Steven Wright and Mitch Hedburg did this a lot. The punchline of a joke's only purpose is to surprise you, so in that way the joke works purely on a technical level. Whether or not it's offensive to a group seems secondary to the art of crafting and devliering the joke. It being racially charged is basically just like putting hot sauce on it and when taken in context, it doesn't seem like there's a statement being made so much as she's just trying to be surprising by playing with stereotypes. The joke works because it's fucked up and wrong and she's giving the audience the benefit of the doubt that they know that.

"wow! are you catching all of these random racist remarks?! hilarious! i'm so bad! i don't believe them but i'll still use them to prop myself up!"



"also i AM a feminist lol support me"

 

[Kitsunebaby]

Considering pretty much all of Amy's racial humor that I've seen involves turning herself into a caricature of a racist and making that ridiculously racist caricature the butt of the jokes, I don't quite understand those who think she's racist. I see those jokes as mocking racism, not mocking a race, though maybe that's just me being optimistic.

 

[PrincessDan]

Something from Bill Maher regarding criticism of comedy that I found amusing. He also uses the same joke. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZNJyDyCocGQ

 

[fritolay]

Jerry Seinfeld was and is correct.

 

[entremet]

Her movie will come out and bomb, and she will fade away just like most comedians.

Lots of cynicism from you in comedy threads of late.

Why? Did comedians spit in your drink?

Just curious. I'm not being confrontational. I generally like your post, which is why I ask.

 

[JCX]

The only concern a comedian should have is whether their set is funny or not.

That is understandable but very different from the way you first told it, which came across as "Chapelle didn't want white people to laugh at his jokes."

Comics call it "blood laughs" when you're telling an edgy joke that is coming from a good place, but people laugh at the wrong part of the joke or laugh in a way that makes it seem as if they don't get the actual point. That's what Chappelle was worried about.

I had a bit that would do well pretty consistently, but it made me feel bad to tell because of the way it framed someone in the joke. Even though the mechanics of the joke were sound, it just wasn't worth telling anymore.

 

[Laughing Banana]

The only concern a comedian should have is whether their set is funny or not.

Hmm, well, of course it's their job; but I can't honestly agree to that in the absolute sense kind of way. Told poorly, a "racist" or "bigoted" joke can create a situation where a racist audience will say, "see, see! I'm right!" instead of "huh, let me think about that for a moment." I don't know, I just don't see comedy as something that is so unique and separate from the world around us that it can be used to say whatever whichever anyone want just because.

 

[Lazyslob]

i still dont know why comedians respond to these people

 

[T-0800]

Secret to not being banned on GAF................I'm a comedian.

 

[adamsappel]

I find her quite funny.

 

[anaron]

fucking love her but she, like anyone else, is entirely worth being critiqued both good and bad.

 

[AlimNassor]

Comedy means being as racist and offensive as possible. It's a racists wet dream. I won't shed tears for a comedian who thinks it's funny to be racist.

 

[RockTurtle]

They literally sound like the people claiming gay marriage means it'll soon be illegal to own a bible. Especially that stupid web comic that was posted earlier that had people going omg so true.



It's pure bullshit deflection and not to mention as usual one can do more than one thing at once.

da fuq?

 

[excelsiorlef]

da fuq?

Being criticized for making racist jokes means no one can ever tell a joke again because they'll all be banned

Gays getting rights means the bible is going to get banned

Just like gay marriage won't be the end of the bible, getting criticized for making a racist joke won't be the end of comedy.

It's not complicated.

 

[CrunchyFrog]

I think her bit comes across as offensive because the majority of the humor in it comes from punchlines resting entirely on alienating black people as outsiders/different. "Tampora/Tapioca" hyuk black names are weird "or whatever" hyuk I can't be dicked to pretend to care about this black person's name "I won't do a 'black woman impression' *does a 'black woman impression'*" hyuk stereotypes black people are weird. It's at the very least, yeah, incredibly lazy lowest common denominator kind of stuff, and it's hardly original either.

Now, I don't think there's anything inherently wrong with pointing out stuff that you find weird/different for comedic effect, even if race does play into it, even if you make people uncomfortable to get a point across, but you have serious issues if your whole bit revolves entirely around that kind of 9 year old school kid "you're weird" mentality and nothing else which this one clearly does. You can argue whether or not she has the right to do this kind of comedy or whether it's offensive, but you're gonna have to seriously strain to convince me that that minute and 44 seconds is in any way insightful or well-written comedy.

 

[Banglish]

I find racist jokes funny. If that makes me a terrible human being, I'm sorry.
My friends make "indian jokes", I make "white" jokes, we make fun of ourselves and eachother, laugh at the stupidity of sterotypes.
We have fun with our differences but in the end it just brings us closer together.

 

[RockTurtle]

Being criticized for making racist jokes means no one can ever tell a joke again because they'll all be banned

Gays getting rights means the bible is going to get banned

It's not complicated.

oh so you do get the difference between something being literal and something being hyperbole!

this thread was getting me worried for a second!

 

[excelsiorlef]

oh so you do get the difference between something being literal and something being hyperbole!

this thread was getting me worried for a second!

Is this because I used the word literally in its colloquial usage.

Would you have said dafuq if I said they figuratively?

Are we going down the path of pedantry.

 

[liliththepale]

I think her bit comes across as offensive because the majority of the humor in it comes from punchlines resting entirely on alienating black people as outsiders/different. "Tampora/Tapioca" hyuk black names are weird "or whatever" hyuk I can't be dicked to pretend to care about this black person's name "I won't do a 'black woman impression' *does a 'black woman impression'*" hyuk stereotypes black people are weird. It's at the very least, yeah, incredibly lazy lowest common denominator kind of stuff, and it's hardly original either.

For what it's worth, she does the same bit re: super-white names. In one show, for example, she made fun of a guy in the audience being named Grayson instead of something like Steve.

 

[GorillaJu]

Comics call it "blood laughs" when you're telling an edgy joke that is coming from a good place, but people laugh at the wrong part of the joke or laugh in a way that makes it seem as if they don't get the actual point. That's what Chappelle was worried about.

I had a bit that would do well pretty consistently, but it made me feel bad to tell because of the way it framed someone in the joke. Even though the mechanics of the joke were sound, it just wasn't worth telling anymore.

I know exactly what you mean and it happened a lot with the Chapelle show and happens frequently with K&P too. You kind of learn things about people you didn't really want to know when they're quoting parts of the joke that aren't intended to be the punchline.