Support NeoGAF

[Kenzodielocke]

btw. is there a closed doors presentation in paris? I really would like to see the hinted mounting at PSX.

For the performance difference between the two demos: You realise that they probably worked a lot more for their E3 Demo for it to run as good as possible?

 

[Jobbs]

My #1 most anticipated game. I have to say though the water in certain instances looks a bit odd/bad in the video.

 

[StrongBlackVine]

I have had enough of this slice. I was hoping to see something totally new. Still one of my top games for 2016 though.

 

[Maddrical]

Aside from the utterly pointless experience bar. It, like the floating numbers seem to only be there as a tryhard solution to making an actual RPG.

"See, XP bar!" "See, floating numbers!" "Thus, RPG!"

I don't actually care what genre they want to call it, but if they are actually wanting to make an RPG, and not just saying that to try to appeal to more people, then make an actual RPG. Don't just cram random elements that appear in many games anymore to try and legitimize your claims of what the game actually is.

There's plenty of games that implement RPG-lite elements, it's not like they're going around telling everyone it's a hardcore D&D RPG. Why is there a problem adding RPG elements to an action game?

 

[PSYGN]

Game looks absolutely gorgeous. The landscape and colors remind me of Albert Bierstadt paintings.

 

[Khalifa Jayy]

This is killing WiLD, graphics-wise. Like, another generation ahead. But I regress, I'm sure they're very different games targeting different audiences. I'll be checking out both!

 

[Famassu]

Game looks cool but the whole "SEE. 825. RPG ELEMENTS." felt silly.

Given how certain people go out of their way to try to claim this is not an RPG but just an action game, them emphasizing some RPG elements really isn't as silly as it first seems. Even in this thread we have people like:

It's just an action adventure game closer to Tomb Raider than anything remotely RPGish.

And the E3 era threads were even worse with a lot of people claiming this is not an RPG.

 

[Benzychenz]

Aside from the utterly pointless experience bar. It, like the floating numbers seem to only be there as a tryhard solution to making an actual RPG.

"See, XP bar!" "See, floating numbers!" "Thus, RPG!"

I don't actually care what genre they want to call it, but if they are actually wanting to make an RPG, and not just saying that to try to appeal to more people, then make an actual RPG. Don't just cram random elements that appear in many games anymore to try and legitimize your claims of what the game actually is.

I like XP bars and floating numbers.

 

[Frag Waffles]

Background music sounds absolutely fantastic too. Anyone think that'll be the actual ambient music in game or if it was just for the video?

 

[Famassu]

Aside from the utterly pointless experience bar. It, like the floating numbers seem to only be there as a tryhard solution to making an actual RPG.

"See, XP bar!" "See, floating numbers!" "Thus, RPG!"

I don't actually care what genre they want to call it, but if they are actually wanting to make an RPG, and not just saying that to try to appeal to more people, then make an actual RPG. Don't just cram random elements that appear in many games anymore to try and legitimize your claims of what the game actually is.

Please just stop. You're trying way too hard to drive your silly "this is not a real RPG!" argument based on ignorance and arguments that don't make any sense. Of course experience bars & damage numbers alone don't make this an RPG and it's not like Guerilla is saying those are THE things that totes make this an RPG. There are a lot more elements in the game that do make this an RPG, like having the possibility to approach combat situations in different ways (stealthy, setting traps, head-on, taking advantage of the environment, using enemies' own weapons against them, using different equipment & skills, and I'd guess there are times when you can choose to not attack at all unless you need some resource the enemies drop), exploration of environments for loot & ingredients you can use to craft new equipment, character development, doing quests for different factions and, yes, stats-based gameplay. The only thing that is still a bit unclear if how much choice & consequence is in the actual story/character interactions of the game. Considering they hired one of the lead writers from Obsidian, it's not crazy to assume we'll at least have some dialogue options in this game, if not bigger story-changing decisions as well.

 

[Dark_castle]

Are there unique towns and dungeons in this game? Is it just a singular large open world map with collectibles and quest markers? Are there NPC to interact with? Any shop to buy items and equipment? How is the melee gameplay like? Any classes or skill trees? Is there a linear story progression with allies and villain?

 

[Ninja Scooter]

Are there unique towns and dungeons in this game? Is it just a singular large open world map with collectibles and quest markers? Are there NPC to interact with? Any shop to buy items and equipment? How is the melee gameplay like? Any classes or skill trees? Is there a linear story progression with allies and villain?

Nobody knows. We've literally seen two short gameplay demos of this game and that's it.

 

[Wagram]

Going to be honest here. I think this is going to miss 2016 in order to polish it as best as possible.

 

[Shao Kahn Brewing a Stew]

Going to be honest here. I think this is going to miss 2016 in order to polish it as best as possible.

This will go up against Tomb Raider on PS4 in November 2016.

 

[Kenzodielocke]

Going to be honest here. I think this is going to miss 2016 in order to polish it as best as possible.

Scalebound must be a 2017 game too then.

 

[Radec]

Scalebound must be a 2017 game too then.

And FFXV is 2018

 

[Exentryk]

But it's not...

Are we even looking at the same game here?

But....it's not a shooter..

Aim and shoot arrows or bullets... same thing.

 

[Famassu]

Are there unique towns and dungeons in this game? Is it just a singular large open world map with collectibles and quest markers? Are there NPC to interact with? Any shop to buy items and equipment? How is the melee gameplay like? Any classes or skill trees? Is there a linear story progression with allies and villain?

-Towns/villages, yes, dungeons we haven't heard about yet. Exploring ruins of "ancient" civilizations are supposedly a big thing in this game
-It has a massive open world but I'm not sure if they have confirmed whether it's like Witcher 3's & is divided into a few bigger areas or if it's all seamless.
-in the vid they said that they got the quest they are on in this gameplay demo from one of the tribes shown in the E3 trailer, so NPC interactions of some kind are obviously in.
-They haven't said anything about item buying/selling, but considering this game does have crafting for equipment, it would make sense if there was some kind of economy where you could get rid of those for some kind of currency that you could use to buy stuff
-They haven't really gone too much into melee so far. The game has stealth melee kills and I think we see her swing a weapon in some vid. I've gotten the impression the melee is maybe a bit more like Monster Hunter (though maybe without some of the ridiculous weapons that game has) than The Witcher 3 like sword ballet.
-They have confirmed the game to have some kind of skilltree (i.e. you have to actually unlock the skill where time slows while you're aiming). Whether that skill tree is shit like Witcher 3's or actually worthwhile is something we'll of course have to see for ourselves once the game hits.
-the only thing they've said about the story is the usual press release yargon about a rich & deep story. All we know about it is that we'll get to learn a lot about the different tribes of the world, the ancient civilizations that has left all the ruins of great cities and of course we'll learn more about these robot dinosaurs and what the hell they actually are.

Nobody knows. We've literally seen two short gameplay demos of this game and that's it.

They have TALKED about some of the stuff he asked about, even if it's all largely unshown so far.

 

[The God]

Are there unique towns and dungeons in this game? Is it just a singular large open world map with collectibles and quest markers? Are there NPC to interact with? Any shop to buy items and equipment? How is the melee gameplay like? Any classes or skill trees? Is there a linear story progression with allies and villain?

Guerrilla showed concept art of a King's Landing-esque city with a marketplace, and in the E3 trailer they showed the different tribes and their locations, and PlayStation Access said there were towns and villages.

Machine parts are "the base of the economy" so it sounds like we'll be able to trade and sell. You can use the machine parts you get from the bots to craft armor, weapons and ammo as well.

There is a skill tree and a perk system, no classes.

 

[Cave Johnson]

Aim and shoot arrows or bullets... same thing.

So Skyrim is a shooter?

 

[Ninja Scooter]

Aim and shoot arrows or bullets... same thing.

Skyrim was a pretty good shooter. Zelda too.

 

[glassgannon]

So Skyrim is a shooter?

took words right out of my mouth lol.

also is fallout not an rpg then

 

[bwakh]

Game looks fun, but performance and HUD UI are bad right now. I trust they'll be ironed out by release.

It looks to be a much better HUD than the Witcher 3's for me

 

[TatteredHat]

I have no clue how you arrive to the thought of "maybe development isn't going too well", I really don't. They only revealed it a few months back and just go into some details of that what was presented.

Honestly I don't really know why I got that impression either. Maybe because some of the things they chose to focus on felt arbitrary like floating combat text and the polycount on the Thunderjaw. The Thunderjaw part felt like the guy was reading stats off of a spreadsheet.

Overall, I didn't feel much excitement from the video.

 

[Bishop89]

One of my most anticipated.

The combat is like so much fun

 

[1er tigre]

The compression in this video is killing it. Will wait for the gamersyde footage.

 

[KyanMehwulfe]

you have to trap them because they're so skittish
<proceeds to get attacked by some> ;p


hope they really keep a minimal HUD... even the compass, get rid of that. would be cool to see them try have more natural ways to do things... maybe a comet in the sky that always appears north. exp bar? just have it pop-up after events. HP bar? maybe use an effect like film burn from MGS V. sort of disliked the typical, you got a compass, exp bar, hp bar, loot junk, etc of it (which means nothing conclusive, it's early... just my impression tho).

archery abilities and gameplay looks pretty cool.

 

[Familienoberhauptvogel]

The title is still awful but the footage makes me want to get a PS4, which no other game manages so far.

 

[TBiddy]

That rope placement looked really weird. It didn't place where he aimed. Almost like it was scripted to land in a different spot?

 

[Denton]

Given how certain people go out of their way to try to claim this is not an RPG but just an action game, them emphasizing some RPG elements really isn't as silly as it first seems. Even in this thread we have people like:



And the E3 era threads were even worse with a lot of people claiming this is not an RPG.

Some stats dont really tell me this is an RPG. I want to see varied gameplay, choices, consequences, interactive dialogues. What I have seen so far is an action game with numbers. Almost every game today has numbers and levels, but I wouldn't classify Assassin's Creed or CoD as rpgs because of that.

I guess it depends on everyone's definition of RPG.
Or did I miss some footage where they showed it's an rpg in more than some numbers and hud elements ?

 

[Schrade]

If anyone is complaining about performance issues with the video posted in the OP then they better learn to sleuth better because the fucking video on YouTube is 25fps.

That means if there was a 30fps -> 25 conversion and it was done improperly the framerate gets all fucked up and looks hitchy.

That YouTube video is compressed to shit too so lots of "pop in" might just be compression artifacts if it's not an actual object popping into view.

 

[steven28]

Some off-screen gamersyde footage it's the same scenario but from a different starting point.

http://www.gamersyde.com/news_pgw_off_screen_demo_of_horizon-17264_en.html

 

[Sitris]

I like XP bars and floating numbers.

I have to a agree,one of my favourite features of the Borderlands series is the insane numbers on screen. Same as Diablo, I love health bars and numbers!

 

[Familienoberhauptvogel]

Some stats dont really tell me this is an RPG. I want to see varied gameplay, choices, consequences, interactive dialogues. What I have seen so far is an action game with numbers. Almost every game today has numbers and levels, but I wouldn't classify Assassin's Creed or CoD as rpgs because of that.

I guess it depends on everyone's definition of RPG.
Or did I miss some footage where they showed it's an rpg in more than some numbers and hud elements ?

Yeah nothing about the footage screamed RPG, crafting, leveling, damage numbers really aren't exclusive to RPGs anymore and RPG elements have snuck their way into so many games.

 

[OléGunner]

you have to trap them because they're so skittish
<proceeds to get attacked by some> ;p

I think the reason explained was that some alpha members of the herd will remain behind to protect the others, giving them a chance to escape.

Unless you caught on that and were just being facetious haha.

 

[Rats Off To Ya]

I am all about this game, especially after watching the stage demo and seeing some of the mechanics laid bare.

I still can't get over how brilliantly refreshing the premise is. I mean, robot dinosaurs! Who can say no to that?

Yeah nothing about the footage screamed RPG, crafting, leveling, damage numbers really aren't exclusive to RPGs anymore and RPG elements have snuck their way into so many games.

It's almost as if "RPG" vs. "not RPG" is becoming an increasingly meaningless distinction.

No, that's crazy talk.

 

[Triggerhappytel]

This is killing WiLD, graphics-wise. Like, another generation ahead. But I regress, I'm sure they're very different games targeting different audiences. I'll be checking out both!

This probably also has a team size that's more than 10 times larger, and an equivalent budget. From an image on Wild Sheep's website it looks like there's only twelve of them.

 

[Denton]

It's almost as if "RPG" vs. "not RPG" is becoming an increasingly meaningless distinction.

No, that's crazy talk.

It's not meaningless to those of us who care about more than numbers and levels. If guerilla releases another video in which they show some well written interactive branching dialogs, choices in quests with actual consequences etc., my interest will grow much higher then where it currently is. Again, almost any game today has rpg "elements", but very few games are actual high quality RPGs, especially in the AAA space.

 

[Sitris]

It's not meaningless to those of us who care about more than numbers and levels. If guerilla releases another video in which they show some well written interactive branching dialogs, choices in quests with actual consequences etc., my interest will grow much higher then where it currently is. Again, almost any game today has rpg "elements", but very few games are actual high quality RPGs, especially in the AAA space.

RPGs are not always about branching dialogue and choices with consequences though, until dawn has those features and isn't an RPG. Many RPGs were completely turn based and don't have any dialogue choices or branching consequences. Pokemon is an RPG which basicly has no dialogue or story consequences.
A game having "RPG Elements" like leveling, crafting, skills, etc where you assume the "role" of a character within a game is what makes it a role playing game. Sure that has been stretched further than ever now, but it doesn't magical make this game not an RPG because it does not (at least have not shown at this time)feature these increasingly popular branching story options.

 

[Machinehead]

It's not meaningless to those of us who care about more than numbers and levels. If guerilla releases another video in which they show some well written interactive branching dialogs, choices in quests with actual consequences etc., my interest will grow much higher then where it currently is. Again, almost any game today has rpg "elements", but very few games are actual high quality RPGs, especially in the AAA space.

jRPGs are RPGs and they don't have branching dialogues or choices with consequences either.

 

[ZombAid82]

Never ever next year!

Edit: BTW Awesome Game, can't wait for more!

 

[Familienoberhauptvogel]

RPGs are not always about branching dialogue and choices with consequences though, until dawn has those features and isn't an RPG. Many RPGs were completely turn based and don't have any dialogue choices or branching consequences. Pokemon is an RPG which basicly has no dialogue or story consequences.
A game having "RPG Elements" like leveling, crafting, skills, etc where you assume the "role" of a character within a game is what makes it a role playing game. Sure that has been stretched further than ever now, but it doesn't magical make this game not an RPG because it does not (at least have not shown at this time)feature these increasingly popular branching story options.

Then literally every 2nd game is an RPG by now and the moniker loses any relevance. How do we differentiate what we used to call RPGs then if everything has become an RPG.

 

[Sparrowhawk]

I'm more interested in this game now than I was before. Thought it was funny that the guy presenting it was saying "here are damage numbers and also an experience bar, meaning this is an RPG" like no one believed them or something.

 

[Denton]

jRPGs are RPGs and they don't have branching dialogues or choices with consequences either.

Yes, jrpgs are distinct genre that I personally don't like much, since I prefer western rpgs that give me agency and more freedom.

RPGs are not always about branching dialogue and choices with consequences though, until dawn has those features and isn't an RPG. Many RPGs were completely turn based and don't have any dialogue choices or branching consequences. Pokemon is an RPG which basicly has no dialogue or story consequences.
A game having "RPG Elements" like leveling, crafting, skills, etc where you assume the "role" of a character within a game is what makes it a role playing game. Sure that has been stretched further than ever now, but it doesn't magical make this game not an RPG because it does not (at least have not shown at this time)feature these increasingly popular branching story options.

I did say it depends on everyone's personal definition of what rpg is. To me, crafting and numbers and levels are way less important than agency, choices, consequences. Hence me not being much interested in Horizon until they showcase those aspects. I am still hopeful that they will be in the game and this won't end up just an action game with stats (by my rpg definition).

 

[Sitris]

Then literally every 2nd game is an RPG by now and the moniker loses any relevance. How do we differentiate what we used to call RPGs then if everything has become an RPG.

I don't disagree with what you are saying but I also don't think an RPG has to have branching dialogues, player customisation or even crafting for that matter to be considered an RPG. If every second game has RPG elements then you just pick the one that you feel is most relevant to your interests. But making a statement about Horizon not being an RPG because of dialogue is not fair to the game, when the elements that it does use are very much what has been historically RPG game components. Perhaps the game genre of RPG has become so popular and enjoyed by so many that every second game wants that market, doesn't change the fact that the games are still considered to be Action-RPG, Strategy-RPG, Western or Japanese RPGs and etc, all are, at least in part, RPG games.

I did say it depends on everyone's personal definition of what rpg is. To me, crafting and numbers and levels are way less important than agency, choices, consequences. Hence me not being much interested in Horizon until they showcase those aspects. I am still hopeful that they will be in the game and this won't end up just an action game with stats (by my rpg definition).

That I can very much agree with you on! Different gamers love different games, that's what makes it so exciting when a game has that special factor that feels like it was made to exist just for you.

 

[Magic Mushroom]

This is killing WiLD, graphics-wise. Like, another generation ahead. But I regress, I'm sure they're very different games targeting different audiences. I'll be checking out both!

It's probably a budget difference of tens of millions as well (and gameplay-wise, WiLD is the more interesting title for me).

 

[Rootbeer]

Mmm... so it has open world and rpg elements... in addition to an already very cool setting mashup... damn I am so going to LOVE this game!!

 

[Nev]

Framerate looks atrocious, jesus christ. How can they show this with that garbage rate? Are some people really that lenient? I hope it's Youtube or something but when the herd runs and explode the traps, shit's at like 20fps, and the whole thing looks to be running at like 25fps average. Ugh.

Graphics look rough, like the elements don't mesh with each other, and the "RPG" elements look as RPG as Arkham or RDR. Calling 78-82 metacritic.

 

[Tricky I Shadow]

I feel like I'm seeing a different game here. Don't get me wrong, it looks good, but people are acting like this is the best thing ever. I just don't see it. Graphically it does nothing for me too. Bad pop-in, bad framerate and some wonky animations.

 

[Familienoberhauptvogel]

I don't disagree with what you are saying but I also don't think an RPG has to have branching dialogues, player customisation or even crafting for that matter to be considered an RPG. If every second game has RPG elements then you just pick the one that you feel is most relevant to your interests. But making a statement about Horizon not being an RPG because of dialogue is not fair to the game, when the elements that it does use are very much what has been historically RPG game components. Perhaps the game genre of RPG has become so popular and enjoyed by so many that every second game wants that market, doesn't change the fact that the games are still considered to be Action-RPG, Strategy-RPG, Western or Japanese RPGs and etc, all are, at least in part, RPG games.

But that makes that term meaningless. Thereby CoD and Battlefield are RPGs, Forza is an RPG,...

There's no distinction anymore, same as if I'd call Battlefield a racer since you can drive cars in it.

I don't debate that many games adopted some if not many qualities of RPGs but that doesn't make them RPGs and at this point an Action RPG is almost nondescriptive so much so that a game being touted as "Action non RPG" would be a more apt description, since that is the exception.