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Next Xbox is ‘More Advanced’ Than the PS5 according to Insiders.

Panajev2001a

GAF's Pleasant Genius
Right now I think Microsoft is on a completely different level as far as engineering software and Hardware.

I am partial to the hypervisor based solution allowing them to update system OS and Game OS at a different cadence, also interesting how they found a viable way to fully virtualise the GPU too without a huge performance hit... also impressed by the software dealing with BC on the X and the quality of most emulation (although we are nowhere near 90% of the Xbox 360 titles being supported for BC yet... quantity vs quality and all that sure...).

I do not see you point on the HW side of thing beside waiting longer, opening the check book with more of the Windows/Azure originated money, and targeting a higher MSRP passing some of the extra cost to customers when looking at X vs Pro in terms of engineering. Both are very competently designed pieces of HW fulfilling their objectives.

In terms of engineering, I also like new architecture and clever custom extensions meant to help something punch above their weight as the developer familiarises with the platform (the point of fixed specs consoles)... both PS4 and PS4 Pro SoC’s were admittedly a step ahead (either ideas or release window or both... see PS4 smart bet on unified GDDR5 and async compute extensions they worked directly with AMD on)... while the X was able to refine the chip for an extra year and offset the cost by raising the price (but stuck with the existing GPU architecture), PS4 Pro bet on Polaris with some extensions from Vega likely pushing for some additional custom extensions that became part of Vega too (same thing that occurred for the original PS4 GPU).
 

Armorian

Banned
If Navi is GCN options for are MS limited, only things that could make GPU better are clocks and memory BW - they could spend more on cooling (like they did in X1X) to achieve higher clocks but that also means more losses in production and potentialy more faulty units after launch.

If it's next gen architecture (without GCN limits) then they could just use bigger chip.

Every option above means more money to spend on production.
 
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ethomaz

Banned


The only reason Sony beat Ms from performance standpoint this generation was that Microsoft got distracted with kinect and TV TV TV. Right now I think Microsoft is on a completely different level as far as engineering software and Hardware.

Funny enough is that what MS did with X was just copy what Sony did with PS4 because when they did stick with their own hardware engineer XB1 happened.
 

CyberPanda

Banned


The only reason Sony beat Ms from performance standpoint this generation was that Microsoft got distracted with kinect and TV TV TV. Right now I think Microsoft is on a completely different level as far as engineering software and Hardware.

I don't remember seeing that part in the DF video at all. Weird.
 

Foxbat

Banned
Funny enough is that what MS did with X was just copy what Sony did with PS4 because when they did stick with their own hardware engineer XB1 happened.

Nope. It takes a bit longer to develop a console with so many changes. If MS would've just copied Sony, it would've released later than it did.

Also, if MS had copied Sony, then the X would've been a half-assed console that sounds like a vacuum cleaner.
 

ethomaz

Banned
Nope. It takes a bit longer to develop a console with so many changes. If MS would've just copied Sony, it would've released later than it did.

Also, if MS had copied Sony, then the X would've been a half-assed console that sounds like a vacuum cleaner.
Wut?

X is the same winner hardware engineer Sony did with PS4 in 2013 and repeated with Pro is n 2016.

It has nothing in common with original XB1 and S.

X is basically a Pro done a year late added $100 to the price point.
 
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Panajev2001a

GAF's Pleasant Genius
Nope. It takes a bit longer to develop a console with so many changes. If MS would've just copied Sony, it would've released later than it did.

Also, if MS had copied Sony, then the X would've been a half-assed console that sounds like a vacuum cleaner.

Neither design is half assed unless you drink marketing kool-aid, c’mon...
 
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Snake29

RSI Employee of the Year
Sony always explained that they could create a more TF console then the PS4 Pro at that time, but it was not their goal to spend that amount of R$D in a mid-gen console. They were already developing the PS5 before the Pro came out.

Cooling will definitely something they will improve. They already did it massively with the latest Pro revision.
 

Foxbat

Banned
Wut?

X is the same winner hardware engineer Sony did with PS4 in 2013 and repeated with Pro is n 2016.

It has nothing in common with original XB1 and S.

X is basically a Pro done a year late added $100 to the price point.

Nah. The X is basically a better all around console than the Pro.

How exactly is the X a copy of the Pro? "Same winner hardware engineer" doesn't make sense to me.
 

Armorian

Banned
Nah. The X is basically a better all around console than the Pro.

How exactly is the X a copy of the Pro? "Same winner hardware engineer" doesn't make sense to me.

X1X GPU was designed separately than pros as it uses standard Polaris compared to Polaris with 2xFP16 in Pro (feature added to Vega arch), same thing happened with PS4 and X1 when Sony was using GCN 1.1 (maybe you can call it a prototype) and MS GCN 1.0.

So far Sony had better arch. from AMD and MS had stronger GPU in X1X. MS could end up using upgraded Vega... I don't belive it but it's possible :p
 
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Foxbat

Banned
Neither design is half assed unless you drink marketing kool-aid, c’mon...

See, I would believe you, except that you liked ethomaz's original quote. So I take it that you also believe MS copied Sony when it comes to the X/Pro?

And yes, the Pro is kinda a half-assed kit tbh. Sure the X came out a year later, but there's really nothing in the X that Sony couldn't have put in the Pro if they wanted to. If you're going to parade around the 4k pr for a mid gen refresh, you should probably go all out to achieve it on a consistent basis.

Then there's the "Pro-mode". Upscaling previous games was a pain. Sony should've implemented a better way of doing it. Games like Driveclub and Bloodborne never got the treatment because of Sony's poor implementation, and suffered because of it.

There's also the jet-like engine noise that every Pro makes. Suspiciously, some Sony fanboys got one that was quiet, but the issue is prevelent enough to where it's a legit problem. MS trumped Sony with their cooling solution on the X which is why it runs in stealth mode all the time. I'd give Sony a break on this one, but the OG PS4 was way too loud as well. They should've seen that issue coming. MS was forward thinking enough, and the OG Xbox One ran whisper quiet as well due to the oversized fan.

But yeah... Let's pretend the X copied the Pro, and that they're both equal.
 
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TGO

Hype Train conductor. Works harder than it steams.
Funny MS went with Anaconda, both Jaguars and Anacondas are known to eat each other.
 

Foxbat

Banned
X1X GPU was designed separately than pros as it uses standard Polaris compared to Polaris with 2xFP16 in Pro (feature added to Vega arch), same thing happened with PS4 and X1 when Sony was using GCN 1.1 (maybe you can call it a prototype) and MS GCN 1.0.

So far Sony had better arch. from AMD and MS had stronger GPU in X1X. MS could end up using upgraded Vega... I don't belive it but it's possible :p

2XFP16 was over hyped. Plenty a gaming forum (including this one) was chock full of people hyping how FP16 doubled the TFlops. The Pro actually had 8TFlops making the X a wash before it even released. Funny how that turned out.

The X meanwhile had a better gpu, cpu, and cooling solution. While the original XB1 was big, MS managed to get all that into a console that was roughly half the size.... Far smaller than the double stacked eraser behemoth that Sony designed.
 

Ar¢tos

Member
Disregarding specs (raw numbers), I have more faith in Sony designing hardware than MS (regarding customizations in the consoles) . Probably because they have been doing it for longer and in many different type of electronics.
Sometimes a good implemented customization can get you more than more raw power.
 

MilkyJoe

Member
Disregarding specs (raw numbers), I have more faith in Sony designing hardware than MS (regarding customizations in the consoles) . Probably because they have been doing it for longer and in many different type of electronics.
Sometimes a good implemented customization can get you more than more raw power.

X and pro say hi.
 

V4skunk

Banned
Most of the insiders and journalists do not have a clue about hardware specs! Including 90% of the gaming industry.
PS4 was blatantly more powerful at launch in specification and the media took a while to say so.
 

Foxbat

Banned
1 year difference say hi...

Also: "sometimes", Google the definition if in doubt of meaning.

1 year difference says hi indeed.

If you're singing that tune, then explain what happened with the PS3 vs the 360. It released a year later, and games still ran superior on the 360.

So the last three main consoles made by both MS and Sony goes like this for hardware and customization.

360>PS3
PS4>XB1
XBX>Pro

That's 2 out of 3 for MS, but yet you've got faith in Sony. It's perfectly fine to prefer one brand over another, but don't act like it's for obvious reasons it isn't.
 

Snake29

RSI Employee of the Year
1 year difference says hi indeed.

If you're singing that tune, then explain what happened with the PS3 vs the 360. It released a year later, and games still ran superior on the 360.

So the last three main consoles made by both MS and Sony goes like this for hardware and customization.

360>PS3
PS4>XB1
XBX>Pro

That's 2 out of 3 for MS, but yet you've got faith in Sony. It's perfectly fine to prefer one brand over another, but don't act like it's for obvious reasons it isn't.

The PS3 was overall the more powerful console and not the 360. It was the Cell that made it hard to develop for Most of the 3rd party games in the first years.

Microsoft did a good job with the cooling in both One and X, but Sony had more "advanced tech" in the PS4 and Pro SoC. I still believe Sony will have again the more custom hardware for the PS5.
 
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Shin

Banned
You know it's next gen when most of the responses and articles are about my console is better than yours.
After watching the DF PS5 video I made that 8K gif, now there are Tweets about that section, people in the PS5 thread in full defense and some even claiming they never saw that part - crazy.
In regards to Anaconda what it is or isn't or will be, no one really knows as everything about it so so secretive and tight lipped to the point sites are running in circles.
I think both consoles will be pushing 12TF whether flat or 1TF+ above the other won't matter for much except bragging brights, all in all we win in the end - eye candy is coming.
 

Three

Member
A lot of people dont understand how 'big business' works. Both Microsoft and Sony will know exactly what each other are making, whether by paying people off, leaks, spies (yes all this stuff happens in big business, Google it), and in this case, its the same god damn company providing the tech for both consoles. Spencer wouldnt say that (and he said it multple times) if there was a chance he would get egg on his face.
Of course we won't give a 40% power advantage to playstation we invented directX. Do you remember Penello with egg on his face? Not saying it's going to happen again with spencer but it's not like it hasn't happened before. Also look at how many times Spencer and co talked about VR support during Xbox One X launch and Crackdown cloud tech then look at reality. Not everything they say is gospel.
 

Foxbat

Banned
The PS3 was overall the more powerful console and not the 360. It was the Cell that made it hard to develop for Most of the 3rd party games in the first years.

Microsoft did a good job with the cooling in both One and X, but Sony had more "advanced tech" in the PS4 and Pro SoC. I still believe Sony will have again the more custom hardware for the PS5.

Agreed. The PS3 was more powerful, yet Sony's ineptitude in design led it to perform worse than the 360. The Cell was an absolute pain to develop games for. Doesn't matter how much horsepower a car has if it can't get out of first gear.

What exactly is "advanced tech"?
 

Kenneth Haight

Gold Member
It's not about more power or little advantages, it's about how and what you do with what you have.
Look at what the Sony First Party do with a mere PS4.
As long as Sony has the best developers working for it, they're golden.

Yeah the first party games that have Sony have got this gen have really made me happy with my purchase. I’m not rushing in to preordering anything until we get the full specs and that is going to be months away. Exciting times ahead.
 
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Armorian

Banned
2XFP16 was over hyped. Plenty a gaming forum (including this one) was chock full of people hyping how FP16 doubled the TFlops. The Pro actually had 8TFlops making the X a wash before it even released. Funny how that turned out.

The X meanwhile had a better gpu, cpu, and cooling solution. While the original XB1 was big, MS managed to get all that into a console that was roughly half the size.... Far smaller than the double stacked eraser behemoth that Sony designed.

FP16 is indeed under used on both consoles and PC and that's because Pro is only machine of the 4 that has support of it and Vega arch. is only one capable of it on PC right now (maybe Turing uses it too? IDK). Devs won't bother to create something for one platform of the 4 that is third in install base.

The PS3 was overall the more powerful console and not the 360. It was the Cell that made it hard to develop for Most of the 3rd party games in the first years.

Microsoft did a good job with the cooling in both One and X, but Sony had more "advanced tech" in the PS4 and Pro SoC. I still believe Sony will have again the more custom hardware for the PS5.

PS3 had more raw power but it was bottlenecked by low memory bus (for RSX), fixed shaders (it wasn't much problem for exclusives wich could be tailored around it) and as mentioned before hard to develop Cell. It was bad design simply.
 

Three

Member
1 year difference says hi indeed.

If you're singing that tune, then explain what happened with the PS3 vs the 360. It released a year later, and games still ran superior on the 360.

So the last three main consoles made by both MS and Sony goes like this for hardware and customization.

360>PS3
PS4>XB1
XBX>Pro

That's 2 out of 3 for MS, but yet you've got faith in Sony. It's perfectly fine to prefer one brand over another, but don't act like it's for obvious reasons it isn't.
The PS3 had production issues which was why it came late. Its tech didn't change however.
Agreed. The PS3 was more powerful, yet Sony's ineptitude in design led it to perform worse than the 360. The Cell was an absolute pain to develop games for. Doesn't matter how much horsepower a car has if it can't get out of first gear.

What exactly is "advanced tech"?
The PS3 leaned heavily into parallel processing. It actually is very standard now. It wasn't ineptitude in design at all except the split ram pool. It's biggest downfall was manufacturing issues caused it to launch a year late and people struggled to make games with highly parallel code. Towards the end of the gen most high profile games were performing equally.

Then the same ineptitude in memory design happened with the Xbox one and ESRAM. The launch xbox one right now offers absolutely crap performance and no HDR support but a launch PS4 was fairly futureproof. People don't remember launch 360 either. It had no HDMI, no WiFi whatsoever, no HDD as standard, all people remember is the cheaper price and the performance of skyrim on PS3. I will never buy an xbox at launch anymore because it is usually made to be cheap and you get a decent version only later. To be completely honest I won't buy an xbox at all because their games come to PC which is a good thing.
 
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Mista

Banned
The thing about rumours of one of models being 4TF is that X is already 6TF. Kind of weird to release a new set of consoles and the base model is weaker than a last gen system from 2017
Releasing two consoles for the new-gen might be true but what doesn’t make sense is one weaker than the X and one stronger
 

bitbydeath

Gold Member
Releasing two consoles for the new-gen might be true but what doesn’t make sense is one weaker than the X and one stronger

Maybe it’s a typo and the 4TF is supposed to be 14TF. 12TF being the weak console would make more sense.
 

Ar¢tos

Member
Speaking of VR, how can MS later adopt it? They don't seem interested in creating their own tech, is it possible to adapt one of the pc VR solutions to a console?
 

thelastword

Banned
Funny enough is that what MS did with X was just copy what Sony did with PS4 because when they did stick with their own hardware engineer XB1 happened.
That whole vlogcast by DF was one of jeering and hmmpf, with Alex laughing like a hyena at every turn....They mocked 8k.. and just Like Brad Sams, Alex said "we knew this would be what Sony would show"......Then he downplayed the hell out of the SSD tech, since Cerny said that would be much faster than current PC solutions........I mean Alex didn't even know the details about the spiderman improvements on PS5, but here he is sitting on a discussion already giving his take and deflecting and then midway asks "what were the details again?" Richard explains the 19 to .8 seconds fast traversal and also the traversal through Manhattan where data loading in not being affected like in the PS4 version and therefore not limiting Spiderman's advancement in the world as quickly as he can speed away....He says 'Oh" and goes straight back deflecting.....Oh this will be because of PCiE4 which comes with Ryzen 2, so PC will have this tech by then too......You don't know the tech behind this, I mean, why say this in such a way........It's like they just want to downplay everything about this reveal.....Of course the 8k mocking and when asked "Do you think MS has anything to worry about?" FFFT, ha ha, come on now Rich, MS is more than good bey-bee.....

I'll bet you, if this was an MS reveal, the SSD bit, the 8k bit, the mocking, laughing and jeering would not exist, this would be a serious video without all this deflecting.....They would talk up SSD's, they would talk up 8k and raytracing etc....., Look at how they respond to raytracing, something they've been super excited for like kids on speed, but check how hohum, their recption is that PS5 will have RT, "well I don't think it will be all that great and match Turing, hyena laugh", one said, maybe with 30fps games they can do something, everything is toned down in excitement..... OTOH, It almost looks like, they're already preparing to damage control if MS does not offer 8k or an SSD solution as good as Sony........I mean, look here, these guys are concerned about propietary storage on a PS5 (FCOL), when you could put your own HDD's on a playstation console since PS2, Sony led that charge......It's also insulting people's intelligence the way they speak about BC and MS...You would have sworn BC and MS were joined at the hip.........The first console to do full BC for two generations in a row was Sony, the only gen Sony did not do it is this one because of the PS3 architecture......

MS BC is just noise by it's fans, it changed nothing for them, reports shows that no one is playing those BC games, well maybe a few, because MS has been starving it's base of quality AAA exclusives this entire gen, so they have no choice.....Still, the report shows, that there are hardly that many hours logged in on BC titles on XBOX, so I'm pretty sure the base is playing multiplats instead.....Sony offers BC next gen because, it's X86 to X86, it's simple to do and it makes sense, it will be 100% of PS4 games BC'd, compared to the drip method MS is using......So I've played NG2 quite a few times on my 360, I have to wait years till the end of this gen just to play it at 1700p, this is not why I buy a new gen console....BC helps in the beginning of the gen, not so much after 6 months of a new generation, most people will never touch a PS4 game again after they see PS5's visuals, no matter how much noise you're hearing....especially from the MS camp this gen...

This is just like the Crossplay thing, journalists are pretending that MS is leading the charge on everything.....MS has shown BC is very important and impactful? Really? Where is the stats to prove that? because there are stats to show otherwise...It's like one big AD for MS everytime. BC did nothing for them, crossplay did nothing for them, they did not have the best solution for BC anyway, which is all games playable day 1, they also don't have a prayer in crossplay adoption compared to the competition, but they made noise about that too,. MS is leading the charge in nothing ...Most of the X enhanced games are not even true 4k or run at a rock solid framerate, so there's nothing amazing there.....Lots of these games have stuttering too, even shown from Leadbetter's own video.....

Now another trend I see is that people want to demand the whole of the UAE for $400.......They want PS4 BC, they won't stop there though, they want PS3 BC, they want PS2 and PS1 BC.....100% all games, so they can play all prior Sony software Day1....They want all that at $400 and will eventually complain about it if Sony don't deliver...Some are already, mostly non Sony fans putting this out there, so if Sony does not deliver it, they will say they are dissapointed and make a row online...Yet they are satisfied with drip methods of BC from MS for an entire gen, where framerate still tanks in those BC games...Where is the demand for full OG XBOX BC, full 360 BC on day 1? Oh no you won't see that here Micho...

ethomaz ethomaz : Yet they could only copy the basics..... and it took them an additional year, with no custom engineering like you saw in PRO. No extra instructions on CU's, no 64 rops, no Vega features, No ID buffer, NO CB hardware etc...In essence, a very basic design where they removed stuff and kept polaris as it was, got the max basic CU's from polaris minus the redundant ones and were able to up the clocks higher because there was less complexity in the silicon compared to PRO......So they put a very basic vacuum chamber in the XBONEX and talk a storm about it like they do everything and add 4 GB more memory. Such a marvel of enginneeing.......You would ahve thought such a basic and cost saving design without much in engineering and lower prices 1 year later would be offered at $400, No, they said here's your True 4k wonder, NO CB no upscaling device for $500, that backfired something fierce, now it's cheaper than PRO most places you go, where sometime back they were begging PRO owners to trade their consoles for it.....Plllllease TRADEEE>

Most of the insiders and journalists do not have a clue about hardware specs! Including 90% of the gaming industry.
PS4 was blatantly more powerful at launch in specification and the media took a while to say so.
That time, ther was lots of deflection...Lots of that IGN video that HeisenbergFX4 HeisenbergFX4 posted, lots of "The Most Balanced Console" articles by Eurogamer or "Does higher Resolution matter by DF", most of the faceoffs were negligible in rez, looks pretty close on a 1080p set, does not look bad at all.....:messenger_smirking:.....720p + 900p to 1080p, it does not look that bad tbh, looks pretty close due to TAA.....Do you remember the "Best Looking 720P game renaissance period?" Quantum Break and Halo 5 were such games were such games, there could have been more.....This gen was surely something innit.....?
 

Darius87

Member
You know it's next gen when most of the responses and articles are about my console is better than yours
ironic that's coming from you because you were one who claimed that new xbox is better then ps5.
After watching the DF PS5 video I made that 8K gif, now there are Tweets about that section, people in the PS5 thread in full defense and some even claiming they never saw that part - crazy.
what's really more crazy that people like you after cerny ps5 details reveal, started in full mode damage control, rather then some people have short memory.
In regards to Anaconda what it is or isn't or will be, no one really knows as everything about it so so secretive and tight lipped to the point sites are running in circles.
except for DF they made subtle lols/jokes for you to confirm it like every other rumor so it must be true .
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V​
Seems to be a wrap as Digital Foundry kinda confirms PS5 will be "weaker" than Anaconda.
 

ANIMAL1975

Member
Maybe it’s a typo and the 4TF is supposed to be 14TF. 12TF being the weak console would make more sense.

Releasing two consoles for the new-gen might be true but what doesn’t make sense is one weaker than the X and one stronger

But wasn't the rumor that the 4tf machine was the streaming only device?... If true it doesn't need to have a stronger GPU, the game is rendered on the server side, isn't it?
 

Geki-D

Banned
ironic that's coming from you because you were one who claimed that new xbox is better then ps5.

what's really more crazy that people like you after cerny ps5 details reveal, started in full mode damage control, rather then some people have short memory.

except for DF they made subtle lols/jokes for you to confirm it like every other rumor so it must be true .
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With quotes proving it tho.
tenor.gif
 

ethomaz

Banned
Nah. The X is basically a better all around console than the Pro.

How exactly is the X a copy of the Pro? "Same winner hardware engineer" doesn't make sense to me.
It is better because it is $100 a year late lol

The chip used in X is a copy what Sony did in 2013 and complete different than what MS did in 2013.

There is no direct sucessor to XB1/XB1 S in terms of hardware engineer because it was a bad design with eSRAM, dozen of DMAs, DDR3 memory system, others hardware units that used silicon space due the weird and slow for games memory system, etc etc.

X design engineer is not like XB1/S.

X is identical to PS4/Pro (you can say Pro is more advanced due the use of more modern parts) that Sony designed in 2013, the same APU layout, same GDDR5 memory system, same hardware units, etc etc.

What are you seeking is the same hardware engineer design used in three consoles: PS4/Slim, Pro and X.

The difference between them are the price/size of the silicon so the bigger one is more powerful than the smaller one.

MS had to copy the better hardware engineer from Sony to create X. X and Pro hardware are a bigger and more expensive version of PS4.

Just to me more clear even using the same hardware design you can compare these three in two categories:

More Powerful: X > Pro > PS4
More Advanced: Pro > X > PS4
 
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ANIMAL1975

Member
Speaking of VR, how can MS later adopt it? They don't seem interested in creating their own tech, is it possible to adapt one of the pc VR solutions to a console?
If i remember right, that even was the original plan for the X, why they dropped it i sincerely don't know...
The oficial excuse was some spinning shit like _ it's too soon, the tech is not really there yet, neither the software to justify the investment, something like that,... when in reality they were promising support for the existing devices on the pc market. Lol
 

thelastword

Banned
BTW, PS3 was more powerful than 360, there's no argument to be made here.....Console power is measured by specs and first party games....PS3 exclusives consistently outshined in-house MS efforts...Technically, MS had a better GPU, but Sony had a much better CPU, which could also handle graphics tasks, overall PS3 was the superior piece of kit.....


10% people discussing/speculating about hardware specs.

90% SonyGAF downplaying the rumors and saying stuff “well specs don’t matter, PS5 is gonna win because Sony has better games!!”
I don't see any downplaying in these parts......

It's like this, if A question is posed, what do you know about next gen consoles?

PS5: Oh PS Architect Cerny said we should expect, 8k, Zen2, Raytracing, SSD, PS4 BC etc....

XB2: Ohhhh well, Asschitect Brad Sams said "XB2 will be more powerful", which he heard from his cousin who has 700 followers on twitter.....

One is official, the other is tales from the ass, with absolutely no spec/arch details.......So tell how can anyone downplay,what does not exist.....

The only time when there will be a discussion on MS vs Sony tech is when MS makes an official statement on XB2.....Till then, the only console we have genuine info on is PS5.........

ironic that's coming from you because you were one who claimed that new xbox is better then ps5.

what's really more crazy that people like you after cerny ps5 details reveal, started in full mode damage control, rather then some people have short memory.

except for DF they made subtle lols/jokes for you to confirm it like every other rumor so it must be true .
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Hmmmmm, money post if I ever saw one.........

They are mocking 8k for a good reason, even most powerful GPUs on the market can't render modern games with playable framerate in 8k and that's with current gen level of gfx.
8k for indies, and AA titles........You think PS5 can't do Guacamelee at 8k 60 or Stardust or Pool or Resogun, Strider and the list goes on, even more ambitious games than these btw.....I'm pretty sure they will be able to run a few PS4 games in 8k as well...No one is saying LOU3 and UC5 will be 8K, does not detract from 8k being viable in the least...
 

Geki-D

Banned
If i remember right, that even was the original plan for the X, why they dropped it i sincerely don't know...
The oficial excuse was some spinning shit like _ it's too soon, the tech is not really there yet, neither the software to justify the investment, something like that,... when in reality they were promising support for the existing devices on the pc market. Lol
It is a big risk. This gen MS were pretty poorly placed already, so launching an expensive add-on that'll need it's own set of exclusive games would be insanity. Sony also cut costs by making the already existing PS4 camera & PS3 Moves usable on it. MS would have had to make and sell all new stuff (they sure as hell weren't going to resurrect Kinect) and that sell would have been tough. I doubt Sony would have bothered either if the PS4 wasn't selling so well.

MS will jump into VR next gen if their new console gains momentum. They were right to ditch it this gen, it would have only ended up an utter failure compared to PSVR that's on the system way more people already owned.
 

THE:MILKMAN

Member
I think from Mark Cerny's interview we have to be careful what we take from it. MrFox over at B3D helpfully pointed out that Mark isn't directly quoted stating anything for e.g 8K graphics, not releasing this year or even having a SSD.

The reporter states more than Mark.
 

SaucyJack

Member
That whole vlogcast by DF was one of jeering and hmmpf, with Alex laughing like a hyena at every turn....They mocked 8k.. and just Like Brad Sams, Alex said "we knew this would be what Sony would show"......Then he downplayed the hell out of the SSD tech, since Cerny said that would be much faster than current PC solutions........I mean Alex didn't even know the details about the spiderman improvements on PS5, but here he is sitting on a discussion already giving his take and deflecting and then midway asks "what were the details again?" Richard explains the 19 to .8 seconds fast traversal and also the traversal through Manhattan where data loading in not being affected like in the PS4 version and therefore not limiting Spiderman's advancement in the world as quickly as he can speed away....He says 'Oh" and goes straight back deflecting.....Oh this will be because of PCiE4 which comes with Ryzen 2, so PC will have this tech by then too......You don't know the tech behind this, I mean, why say this in such a way........It's like they just want to downplay everything about this reveal.....Of course the 8k mocking and when asked "Do you think MS has anything to worry about?" FFFT, ha ha, come on now Rich, MS is more than good bey-bee.....

I'll bet you, if this was an MS reveal, the SSD bit, the 8k bit, the mocking, laughing and jeering would not exist, this would be a serious video without all this deflecting.....They would talk up SSD's, they would talk up 8k and raytracing etc....., Look at how they respond to raytracing, something they've been super excited for like kids on speed, but check how hohum, their recption is that PS5 will have RT, "well I don't think it will be all that great and match Turing, hyena laugh", one said, maybe with 30fps games they can do something, everything is toned down in excitement..... OTOH, It almost looks like, they're already preparing to damage control if MS does not offer 8k or an SSD solution as good as Sony........I mean, look here, these guys are concerned about propietary storage on a PS5 (FCOL), when you could put your own HDD's on a playstation console since PS2, Sony led that charge......It's also insulting people's intelligence the way they speak about BC and MS...You would have sworn BC and MS were joined at the hip.........The first console to do full BC for two generations in a row was Sony, the only gen Sony did not do it is this one because of the PS3 architecture......

MS BC is just noise by it's fans, it changed nothing for them, reports shows that no one is playing those BC games, well maybe a few, because MS has been starving it's base of quality AAA exclusives this entire gen, so they have no choice.....Still, the report shows, that there are hardly that many hours logged in on BC titles on XBOX, so I'm pretty sure the base is playing multiplats instead.....Sony offers BC next gen because, it's X86 to X86, it's simple to do and it makes sense, it will be 100% of PS4 games BC'd, compared to the drip method MS is using......So I've played NG2 quite a few times on my 360, I have to wait years till the end of this gen just to play it at 1700p, this is not why I buy a new gen console....BC helps in the beginning of the gen, not so much after 6 months of a new generation, most people will never touch a PS4 game again after they see PS5's visuals, no matter how much noise you're hearing....especially from the MS camp this gen...

This is just like the Crossplay thing, journalists are pretending that MS is leading the charge on everything.....MS has shown BC is very important and impactful? Really? Where is the stats to prove that? because there are stats to show otherwise...It's like one big AD for MS everytime. BC did nothing for them, crossplay did nothing for them, they did not have the best solution for BC anyway, which is all games playable day 1, they also don't have a prayer in crossplay adoption compared to the competition, but they made noise about that too,. MS is leading the charge in nothing ...Most of the X enhanced games are not even true 4k or run at a rock solid framerate, so there's nothing amazing there.....Lots of these games have stuttering too, even shown from Leadbetter's own video.....

Now another trend I see is that people want to demand the whole of the UAE for $400.......They want PS4 BC, they won't stop there though, they want PS3 BC, they want PS2 and PS1 BC.....100% all games, so they can play all prior Sony software Day1....They want all that at $400 and will eventually complain about it if Sony don't deliver...Some are already, mostly non Sony fans putting this out there, so if Sony does not deliver it, they will say they are dissapointed and make a row online...Yet they are satisfied with drip methods of BC from MS for an entire gen, where framerate still tanks in those BC games...Where is the demand for full OG XBOX BC, full 360 BC on day 1? Oh no you won't see that here Micho...

ethomaz ethomaz : Yet they could only copy the basics..... and it took them an additional year, with no custom engineering like you saw in PRO. No extra instructions on CU's, no 64 rops, no Vega features, No ID buffer, NO CB hardware etc...In essence, a very basic design where they removed stuff and kept polaris as it was, got the max basic CU's from polaris minus the redundant ones and were able to up the clocks higher because there was less complexity in the silicon compared to PRO......So they put a very basic vacuum chamber in the XBONEX and talk a storm about it like they do everything and add 4 GB more memory. Such a marvel of enginneeing.......You would ahve thought such a basic and cost saving design without much in engineering and lower prices 1 year later would be offered at $400, No, they said here's your True 4k wonder, NO CB no upscaling device for $500, that backfired something fierce, now it's cheaper than PRO most places you go, where sometime back they were begging PRO owners to trade their consoles for it.....Plllllease TRADEEE>

That time, ther was lots of deflection...Lots of that IGN video that HeisenbergFX4 HeisenbergFX4 posted, lots of "The Most Balanced Console" articles by Eurogamer or "Does higher Resolution matter by DF", most of the faceoffs were negligible in rez, looks pretty close on a 1080p set, does not look bad at all.....:messenger_smirking:.....720p + 900p to 1080p, it does not look that bad tbh, looks pretty close due to TAA.....Do you remember the "Best Looking 720P game renaissance period?" Quantum Break and Halo 5 were such games were such games, there could have been more.....This gen was surely something innit.....?

That is a quality rant. Love it. Thanks.
 
Regardless of which system is a bit more powerful, it's getting to a point that us console gamers should be getting some sweet games. I know..... someone with a wild PC rig will get better specs and tons of sliders to tune the game perfectly, but let's face it, a console with let's say 12 TF (which is double XBox X) should be able to churn out 4k games with stable frame rates and great textures.

But as usual, it all comes down to devs. If they are going to take those 12TF and just pump it into useless flair, where the core game has dumb AI, shit physics and bounces around 24 to 30 fps, then us gamers are going to get a wet one shoved up our bungholes again if game maker's X, Y, and Z prefer slideshow gameplay, but has raytraced lighting.


That is the beauty of it, especially your first sentence..always get both to enjoy best of both worlds.
 

Geki-D

Banned
I think from Mark Cerny's interview we have to be careful what we take from it. MrFox over at B3D helpfully pointed out that Mark isn't directly quoted stating anything for e.g 8K graphics, not releasing this year or even having a SSD.

The reporter states more than Mark.
This is all true, though the Spiderman loading demo suggests the SSD thing isn't just speculation from the journo. 8k however, I feel like Cerny probably just stated something to the effect of 8k (limited games, upscaling...) and the journo just reported that as "supporting 8K".

I think if Wired did actually say anything that was blatantly out of line with what Cerny was saying, Sony would asked them to update the article with a correction.
 

Aceofspades

Banned
That whole vlogcast by DF was one of jeering and hmmpf, with Alex laughing like a hyena at every turn....

I agree that DF showed clear bias talking about PS5. Its simply because Rich Leadbetter is a die hard Xbox fan and its extremely hard for some so called "Journalists" to stay neutral prior to each console Gen.

but you know what... MS will reveal the next Xbox and it will have the exact feature set of PS5, at that time you will see DF gushing over those revolutionary "features" 🤣

Sony has faced similar attitude from media for ages, its not a new thing. they will be laughing as usual come 2027 when they sold over 100m consoles "again" and their competitor with all this media backing and imaginary "advance features, hidden GPUs and clouds of the world 🤣" will be struggling to crack 40m units.

DF can hmmmph, laugh, mock all they want, they just can't prevent the inevitable 🤣
 
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