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Rumor: PS5 devkits ~ 13 TFLOPS

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But it won't be Nvidia making the GPU for the PS5
Hence why my conservative GTX 1080Ti perfomance estimate (12-13TF)
Your claims of Navi being "much better" is unfounded
We have info on all resources being put into Navi development and taken from Vega
Radeon7 is a salvaged card with an architecture not designed around the 7nm node unlike Navi
Latest leaks suggest that CU for CU Navi can't even match Vega 20
Leaks? you mean one YT video.
"Big Navi" one day that will surpass the Radeon 7
I said between Vega64 and 1080Ti performance not better than 1080Ti
 
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I have no dibs on Sony or Nintendo. Sony is quite hard to crack and they tend to me less leaky than Microsoft from my experience personally. Nintendo I don't really care for personally, despite the fact that I do like the Switch and their games.

I am more of an xbox/MS kind of guy, it's easier for me to find the information on that end or at least to scrap for something. Microsoft's strategy right now is too buy out studios left and write from one end of the world to another to be able to cover all kinds of different game genres, whether its FPS, Racing, RTS, TPS, RGPs and whatever other genres and combos you can think of. They're not playing around anymore and truly want to build up a 1st party portfolio and show the world what they can do. Over the last decade Microsoft has been known for Gears/Halo/Forza and while that will still be the case, many new franchies will come alive as well along with your sequels and so on. If you want to really to put a name on me or anything of that sort well I'd just advise you think of me as a Squirrel who runs around and pretends to mind its own business and gathering information in the background while pretending to play careless, dumb and not interested :)

P.S. Some people speculated and are hoping that CD Projekt Red and Creative Assembly will be bought. I will tell you right now that I know for a fact that is NOT happening and WON'T be happening. So put those hopes too rest.

I had to do a bit of digging to find the reference, but I see you klobrille. ;)
 
SanGoku, you've already said ""Leaked" spec sheet shows 1080Ti performance in the 150w-180w bracket"

That's quite the target. As of right now, the best AMD have managed to accomplish is 1080ti performance in the 300 watt bracket. And this is at 7nm.

You are essentially saying that the Radeon 7 isn't a good example because you claim it wasn't specifically designed for 7nm whereas Navi was. And that could be true. But it is also an unknown.

So what you are doing is putting all your eggs in that unknown basket.

Sure, maybe the fact that Navi was designed for 7nm will make a difference in terms of electrical efficiency. We will see. But in order to hit your leaked target of 1080ti levels of performance at 150 watts, electrical efficientcy is going to have to DOUBLE over another AMD GPU that is also at 7nm. That seems unlikely.
 
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Nice catch! Just don't force him to admit it here. Wouldn't want him to be banned from that other forum for associating with us heathens.

Hes one of the very few reasons I even go over there. If he posted here more, I could save myself from having to wade through the bs over there to find the worthwhile posts. Lol
 
I have no dibs on Sony or Nintendo. Sony is quite hard to crack and they tend to me less leaky than Microsoft from my experience personally. Nintendo I don't really care for personally, despite the fact that I do like the Switch and their games.

I am more of an xbox/MS kind of guy, it's easier for me to find the information on that end or at least to scrap for something. Microsoft's strategy right now is too buy out studios left and write from one end of the world to another to be able to cover all kinds of different game genres, whether its FPS, Racing, RTS, TPS, RGPs and whatever other genres and combos you can think of. They're not playing around anymore and truly want to build up a 1st party portfolio and show the world what they can do. Over the last decade Microsoft has been known for Gears/Halo/Forza and while that will still be the case, many new franchies will come alive as well along with your sequels and so on. If you want to really to put a name on me or anything of that sort well I'd just advise you think of me as a Squirrel who runs around and pretends to mind its own business and gathering information in the background while pretending to play careless, dumb and not interested :)

P.S. Some people speculated and are hoping that CD Projekt Red and Creative Assembly will be bought. I will tell you right now that I know for a fact that is NOT happening and WON'T be happening. So put those hopes too rest.
🐿
 
The only thing we've consistently been hearing from these "fantasies" is that PS5 seems to be offering at least 12.9TF. Massive grain of salt.
 
The specs need to come out fast(numbers, clock speeds, AMD CEO's Salty Cooch Sauce). It's all so tiresome.

I want them too, but it will be quite a while since they will be tweaking clocks, etc..

Then we will have new shit to complain about when it drops, lol.
 
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The specs need to come out fast(numbers, clock speeds, AMD CEO's Salty Cooch Sauce). It's all so tiresome.

I doubt clocks are even decided yet. There are probably ballpark figures but the clocks will depend on the power curve and yield of the node/architecture Vs the target power consumption figures.

If the node is good and the arch clocks well then clocks and Tflops might be higher than ballparked and the inverse is also true.
 
If those rumors are true, then amd's graphic division need to abandon GCN as soon as possible and start working on the next chip asap

GCN as an instruction set architecture / ISA has already been iterated on and while the core limit of number of SP's per CU and CU's per chip is indeed there, I doubt it is what is causing problems such as this.

Changing ISA could give opportunity for a revolution in the design, but it would undo years of evolution in optimising compilers and programmers experience in developing solutions that run efficiently on AMD GPU's. Not to say that AMD would not make something easy to develop for or that they would be unable to evangelise their new approach, but thanks to consoles as far back as the Xbox 360 and now the last 6+ years on Xbox One and PS4 they have raised a generation of developers on GCN, you can understand their resistance there... especially while there is a lot they can improve on without changing the architecture.
 
GTX 1080 in 2020 would be a disappointment and around 10TF.

Gtx1080 is around 8/9TF, the original expectation. Expections skyrocketed after mark cerney unveiled ps5. No idea why, he didnt imply any specs. Leaks started to adjust higher too.
12,9TF amd seems to be 8/9TF gtx1080. Things start to make sense now. That would mean early 2016 gpu level performance, and i doubt amd can beat nvidias RT solution this fast.

If those rumors are true, then amd's graphic division need to abandon GCN as soon as possible and start working on the next chip asap

They allready do, 'Next-Gen' is their new architecture and coming late 2020, too late for PS5 and sony probably needs the old gcn for better BC, or cheaper to implement BC.

'Next gen' will be high end chip.
 
GCN as an instruction set architecture / ISA has already been iterated on and while the core limit of number of SP's per CU and CU's per chip is indeed there, I doubt it is what is causing problems such as this.

Changing ISA could give opportunity for a revolution in the design, but it would undo years of evolution in optimising compilers and programmers experience in developing solutions that run efficiently on AMD GPU's. Not to say that AMD would not make something easy to develop for or that they would be unable to evangelise their new approach, but thanks to consoles as far back as the Xbox 360 and now the last 6+ years on Xbox One and PS4 they have raised a generation of developers on GCN, you can understand their resistance there... especially while there is a lot they can improve on without changing the architecture.
They are already working on a GCN successor. It wouldn't be the first time they revamped their architecture either. GCN seems well suited for compute task but not flexible enough for tensor calculations (which is what compute is mostly used for outside of gaming). On the gaming front they are ridiculously bandwidth limited and their CU's cache and micro-op architecture is incredibly inefficient. The power draws, results from moving information across a chip or getting bits from something like memory. These two things form the vast majority of power consumption on a gpu chip. We can tell that is the problem for AMD gpu's as they tend to scale better with faster gpus. Effectively they have not been able to solve it in 6 redesigns. This thing gotta go
 
They allready do, 'Next-Gen' is their new architecture and coming late 2020, too late for PS5 and sony probably needs the old gcn for better BC, or cheaper to implement BC.

'Next gen' will be high end chip.
I am aware that they do. I mean that they should literally move the entirety of their team off this project. Release what they have, and concentrate every last bit of man power on next-gen (whatever that is). Remember how they initially had next-gen for 2020, now tell me how that will co-exist with a "big" navi chip in early 2020. Arcturus is supposedly using some of their next gen arch, would be great to see how that scale.

In addition something tells me that next-gen is potentially GCN as chiplets (shrug)
 
I hope so... but doubt it. If you are familiar with Adored TV you'll know he doesn't spread FUD against AMD. He's a huge AMD fan.

What he's heard and is reporting on may not be true. But for him to report on it like this you can be sure that he believes it.

He does spread FUD, anything to get views. I say this as it was him alone in that December video that seriously hyped up Navi (alongside Ryzen 3000) with what turns out to be purely speculative specs and even prices as a 'leak' from his 'sources'. People are so quick to forget. He's leading you all down the garden path constantly.

Here's the video, so he's basically now saying all of this is make belief:



Navi bit is at the end.
 
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He does spread FUD, anything to get views. I say this as it was him alone in that December video that seriously hyped up Navi (alongside Ryzen 3000) with what turns out to be purely speculative specs and even prices as a 'leak' from his 'sources'. People are so quick to forget. He's leading you all down the garden path constantly.

Here's the video, so he's basically now saying all of this is make belief:



Navi bit is at the end.


I have watched that video and am aware with his predictions.

We will know shortly how many of his predictions were right and which were way off. And if it turns out everything he was saying was pure fantasy then I will change my tune and agree with you.

But his predictions and supposed sources seem well thought out and plausible ( maybe I just want to believe? ).

It occurs to me that maybe I don't know what FUD means. My comments were based on knowing that usually he is full of praise for all things AMD. He is no AMD hater spreading FUD. It takes a lot for him to say something negative about AMD so if he's suddenly so critical of Navi I can't help but think he has good reason.

But maybe you are right.
 
Thats too bad.



And what have ppl done so far on forums? Hes atleast peddling back, guess that isnt easy but expecting gold and all for ps5 and be dissapointed wont be more easy though.
WCCFamdmicrosoft2.jpg


He got to taste her sauce. Oh ya!
 
I have watched that video and am aware with his predictions.

We will know shortly how many of his predictions were right and which were way off. And if it turns out everything he was saying was pure fantasy then I will change my tune and agree with you.

But his predictions and supposed sources seem well thought out and plausible ( maybe I just want to believe? ).

It occurs to me that maybe I don't know what FUD means. My comments were based on knowing that usually he is full of praise for all things AMD. He is no AMD hater spreading FUD. It takes a lot for him to say something negative about AMD so if he's suddenly so critical of Navi I can't help but think he has good reason.

But maybe you are right.

He does love AMD but he loves money more, and he's realised he can make $2500 a month and rising by making these videos.

Let me repeat: he was the one that started the hype job on Navi in December when people were saying it would be more disappointment given how far off Vega was compared to the competition (in efficiency at least). You gotta understand he makes these videos to make money, more Patreon subs the more he makes. So he has to keep making content that causes a stir based on 'leaks' even if the source (could be himself) is highly spurious or info speculative.
 
These discussions are mostly pointless until specs, or at least Navi, are/is out. Youtubers will hype and trash everything for clicks, whatever they need to do to avoid looking for a real job.
 
ps5 beats anaconda?

a734ltdpfaw21.jpg

It could go either way tbh and the difference will be minor so it doesn't matter in the end. But I really want that to happen so bad so I can see the faces of people at Digital Foundry...oh and we will be back again to analysis filled with the importance of Controllers , OS and play where your friends are Lol.
 
It could go either way tbh and the difference will be minor so it doesn't matter in the end. But I really want that to happen so bad so I can see the faces of people at Digital Foundry...oh and we will be back again to analysis filled with the importance of Controllers , OS and play where your friends are Lol.

well 30% is no small matter. this would mean sony has special navi sauce deal and ms has 7nm vega gimp deal. did MS go with esram again taking up half the die space?
 
Anybody could post that on 4chan, come on.
Of course, same goes for beyond3d or reddit or anywhere else, really.
Don't believe any leaks or fanboy hitpieces favoring either console.
Only official announcements will have real specs.

true but it could still happen even if the sauce is full of shit. it would be interesting if the had another ps4 vs xo scenario. maybe phil will go on stage and tell everyone they have the most transistors in their machine..
 
true but it could still happen even if the sauce is full of shit. it would be interesting if the had another ps4 vs xo scenario. maybe phil will go on stage and tell everyone they have the most transistors in their machine..
Not likely IMO. I speculate the machine specs will actually be closer than last gen. Unless one console launches much later than the other.
 
well 30% is no small matter. this would mean sony has special navi sauce deal and ms has 7nm vega gimp deal. did MS go with esram again taking up half the die space?

Thats impossible, both Sony and MS are reaching the power limit of these GCN cards, differences in power will be mainly attributed to clock speeds and cooling solutions.
 
true but it could still happen even if the sauce is full of shit. it would be interesting if the had another ps4 vs xo scenario. maybe phil will go on stage and tell everyone they have the most transistors in their machine..

You're trying so hard you're sweat is turning blue. :D
 
Not likely IMO. I speculate the machine specs will actually be closer than last gen. Unless one console launches much later than the other.
Thats impossible, both Sony and MS are reaching the power limit of these GCN cards, differences in power will be mainly attributed to clock speeds and cooling solutions.


always about PS5 never xbox.
 

always about PS5 never xbox.
AMD has deals with Sony and MS. It is just not the time for them to comment on what they are doing with MS yet. Sony asked them to go ahead and promote the PS5 already, but not Microsoft.

What someone is talking about means nothing in the end.
 
ps5 beats anaconda?

a734ltdpfaw21.jpg
look for the timing😉. we have rumors that Navi has thermal problems and when it is true PS5 will have only 8-9TF, a insider telling us PS5 has 25-30% better performance than xbox nextgen............Sony task force in panic attack mode
 
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look for the timing😉. we have rumors that Navi has thermal problems and when it is true PS5 will have only 8-9TF, a insider telling us PS5 has 25-30% better performance than xbox nextgen............Sony task force in panic attack mode
The same can be said about the timing of new rumours that bring concern about Navi... shortly after the CEO of AMD publicly promoting Navi.
Who would gain from spreading FUD? ;)
 
I'll go with adoredtv's leaks over a random post warning not to "believe Xbox heads" with wild percentages.
Going by the jump from 28nm to 14nm you'd expect around ~165-175W for Vega 64 power at 7nm. Looking at the updated adored navi cards, I think he's still a tad generous on the pricing, and I'd expect Navi to consume a smidge more than AMD's listed TDP(I believe he mentions that power consumption could be higher than his updated list, but I'll need to skim again).
updatenaviplanned.jpg

I've been looking over some of the Gonzalo coverage and it seems at least plausible to me that it's PS5 with CPU at 1.6GHz(probably base for BC)/3.2GHz max. It's allegedly "Navi 10 lite". They were listing it with 1GHz core initially, then 1.8GHz later.

Polaris 10 RX 480 was a 150W TDP(listed) card that consumed more like 166W in heavy gaming. The year it released, Sony had it in the $399 PS4 Pro with a ~30% decrease in clock speed and lower memory bandwidth, total system power consumption at ~155W. A year later MS had it in the $499 Xbox One X at 6TF with total system power consumption of ~172W. They list a max core clock, but they are also power capping the GPU. I'd be curious to get a performance log and see how the core clock and wattage roll over a gameplay session.

Gonzalo with 44CUs/48CUs, 1.8GHz core, nice cooling and tuning gets you 10-11TF at $499. I guess I'm not a $399 believer anymore.¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Anyyyway...
tenor.gif
 
I'll go with adoredtv's leaks over a random post warning not to "believe Xbox heads" with wild percentages.
Going by the jump from 28nm to 14nm you'd expect around ~165-175W for Vega 64 power at 7nm. Looking at the updated adored navi cards, I think he's still a tad generous on the pricing, and I'd expect Navi to consume a smidge more than AMD's listed TDP(I believe he mentions that power consumption could be higher than his updated list, but I'll need to skim again).
updatenaviplanned.jpg

I've been looking over some of the Gonzalo coverage and it seems at least plausible to me that it's PS5 with CPU at 1.6GHz(probably base for BC)/3.2GHz max. It's allegedly "Navi 10 lite". They were listing it with 1GHz core initially, then 1.8GHz later.

Polaris 10 RX 480 was a 150W TDP(listed) card that consumed more like 166W in heavy gaming. The year it released, Sony had it in the $399 PS4 Pro with a ~30% decrease in clock speed and lower memory bandwidth, total system power consumption at ~155W. A year later MS had it in the $499 Xbox One X at 6TF with total system power consumption of ~172W. They list a max core clock, but they are also power capping the GPU. I'd be curious to get a performance log and see how the core clock and wattage roll over a gameplay session.

Gonzalo with 44CUs/48CUs, 1.8GHz core, nice cooling and tuning gets you 10-11TF at $499. I guess I'm not a $399 believer anymore.¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Anyyyway...
tenor.gif

Why not both?
 
Why not both?
The claims are incongruent. Adoredtv said they are running hot and only about the same *edit* max clocks as Vega 20. MS already has experience with premium tuning and cooling with the Xbox One X. Seems impossible they'd get anything from AMD that could be bested by 30% at the $499 price point with the same release window.¯\_(ツ)_/¯
 
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Gtx1080 is around 8/9TF, the original expectation. Expections skyrocketed after mark cerney unveiled ps5. No idea why, he didnt imply any specs. Leaks started to adjust higher too.
12,9TF amd seems to be 8/9TF gtx1080. Things start to make sense now.
lol keep pushing the 8tf narrative, all it takes is one yt video for the 8tf hopes and dreams to make a reappearance.
You can quote me on this, PS5 wont be less than 12tf
 
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That's quite the target. As of right now, the best AMD have managed to accomplish is 1080ti performance in the 300 watt bracket. And this is at 7nm.
Vega is not representative of the best amd can do at 7nm
You are essentially saying that the Radeon 7 isn't a good example because you claim it wasn't specifically designed for 7nm whereas Navi was. And that could be true. But it is also an unknown.
That much is an undeniable advantage Navi has over Vega, nothing unknown about it
Navi is all a better arch than vega that had more resources put into it
So what you are doing is putting all your eggs in that unknown basket.
and you are putting yours on one YT video. Not that different.
Sure, maybe the fact that Navi was designed for 7nm will make a difference in terms of electrical efficiency.
It will there's is no ifs and buts there, the only thing you could argue is the extent to which it will.
 
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