TherapistGaymer
Banned
Good news and you're still in here arguing about fan this insider that. How about go read the specs over and over and be happy. You are getting real passionate.
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LED Guy?
Banned
Oh man, It's getting more and more clear that the 12+ TF for PS5 is true, I CANNOT WAIT FOR THE XBOX FANBOYS' MELTDOWNS!
Fulcizombie
Banned
What ? How does saying double digits=RDNA, WTH am I reading here ? He never mentioned RDNA before MS’ announcement, sorry but that’s the truth.He knew it already by saying double digits, you keep splitting hairs right now after you lied multiple times.
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
LED Guy?
Banned
He did say it before Microsoft, you lied again, he said they are Navi-based GPUs and they are more powerful than AMD's most powerful Navi GPU in July/August which is the RX 5700 XT (9.75 TFs).
Dabaus
Banned
I hope the ps5 is more than 9 tflops just to prove colbert wrong. Cant stand when someone has an agenda but attempts to hide it, not very good i might add.
BlacknGold_Blood
Member
I wish you could tell us in vague terms what we are missing in the GitHub leak.
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
Fulcizombie
Banned
Why not, people have thousands of posts here saying the same things, I am just presenting facts with real timelines, sorry if that offends you. I am not making predictions, just stating the facts. These facts are that osirisblack got everything wrong in the pro/xbx situation. He has changed his stance about 100 times (first the ps5 is more powerful, then the XSX, then the ps5 will be ).
Facts about Klee:never mentioning RDNA BEFORE MS’ announcement at TGA. Saying that Sony will reveal the ps5 in February and «he will return then».
This is all we know about these «insiders» until Sony announces the ps5’ specs, the rest is speculation. Last post, see you after Sony’s announcement.
DrDamn
Member
Didn't MS say RDNA last June at E3?
I thought the point Klee made about the double figures was that it was RDNA TF, not in terms of GCN.
Mr Moose
Member
The post above yours just proved you wrong.
We expect a written apology, no less than 500 words.
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Fulcizombie
Banned
Well I stand corrected. See you after Sony’s reveal to see what the «insiders» got right.
happy pappy?
Rusco Da Vino
Member
Ok here is what I’ll say, taken from what I’ve been told plus captain obvious statements.
* Both systems are rdna 2, but not. They are essentially rdna 1.9 so to speak, with features bolted on, meaning that you can call it the next generation of rdna, you could even call it rdna 2 if you wanted. I wouldn’t myself but that seems to be what they are doing so ok.
* as of very recently SX still had the cpu power crown in an older dev kit (which still wasn’t final), which matches these specs. Sony have a more final dev kit out that matches their target specs that is clocked slightly lower. The actual difference in cpu clock speed isn’t as high as you may think, but still in favour of SX (like a couple hundres MHz) Cpu clocks can be changed slightly, if you have enough room for it, but don’t expect miracles. I don’t have a value, a hard figure, sorry.
* GPU power grunt is much much the same as the above, with SX taking a lead over PS5, again based on target specs and finality of dev kits. This can also be changed if you have the room for it, even now, but again talking slight, slight clock increases. PS5 is already having higher temp thermals, so I doubt they can do much (see below). I also don’t have a concrete figure here
* memory wise, both systems are on par. 16gb ddr6. Let go of the HBM2 dream, it was never on the cards to begin with. What I can’t ascertain however, is if either are using a split memory pool for OS level tasks. I haven’t had a single straight answer on that one, other than “its complicated, but yes, and no”. That leads me to believe that possibly something else is going on here. If the PS5 has a separate look of let’s say 4gb DDR4 then they can use the full 16gb for games opposed to less for the SX. But what’s been alluded to for me is a bit strange, almost like you don’t have to worry about it as much. Which I can’t understand at all? Any ideas?
* cooling wise I’ll mention again that SX is silent, even in its older dev kits. But PS5, everything I’ve heard has said quiet, much quieter than ps4, but they had issues with thermals being too high still. Seems to be an ongoing thing as this has been an ongoing issue. So i expect both to be quiet, sx slightly quieter, but much better than the jet engines of today. That also lines up with a higher boom price for cooling on PS5, because maybe they are at a good sound level, but not at a good thermal level, so are pushing that further.
* SSD tech, I’ve covered so many times it makes my eyes bleed. Sony are targeting about 5.5-5.8gb/sec. SX are “within 1gb/sec of this, maybe lower if they hit their target”. Essentially, the controller quality and speed difference are in favour for PS5, but as with other components it won’t actually matter for 99% of shit you see or do, and even first parties will have a hard time showing that. Don’t expect this massive 2x faster rubbish that some people are peddling.
* nobody knows anything to do with price. Nobody. Anybody that comes along and starts blabbering about price like a set in stone thing is full of it. If I had to guess, I would say they will be on par, due to how similar things are? But that’s a guess. Both companies can take a Loss but that’s up to them. I would wager £450-£500 myself, as anything more would be a tough ask. But this is an interesting battlefield to watch.
* terra flop wise, it’s hard to get a clear picture of. I’m actually going to say what I was told earlier... “Notice MS keep saying it’s 12tf of power, but not once have they said 12.0tf?” So it’s possible SX may be higher than a bang on 12tf, such as 12.2. No idea. But target specs for PS5 have been high 10tf to low 11tf for a while, including their more final dev kit. It’s worth noting that if PS5 release let’s say a 11.2tf PS5 and ms release a 12tf SX, the price of the systems will be essentially on par, but the performance will also be so damn close you wouldn’t really notice unless pointed out. I don’t know why people are posting above 13tf, 13.8? Haha, ok. Erm, look, the 12 dream was very hard to reach at a decent price, a decent thermal balance profile and keeping things realistic. A small margin of difference lower in tf power isn’t gong to make a huge difference to price of components. But pushing higher is going into too far into the expensive vs achievable realm. It’s just not going to happen. Your walking head first into an area where price, heat and yields are all working against your profit margins, and it’s just not realistic to think any of that. But who knows? Maybe Sony have a trick up their sleeve? But if they do, my few friends with dev kits (one first party) haven’t been privy to it.
That’s pretty much all I’ve been told, all I can tell without going into “on shit” territory, and a little guess work. Based on a few chats with a few friends of mine, that all could be tales from their arse, are all strikingly similar despite working for different dev houses in different locations. I have no idea about form factor or what the consoles look like, sadly. The final PS5 dev kit that’s floating around is still very much like the V shape, just smaller. So who knows, maybe they are going that way with design? No idea.
Only reason I’ve posted the above as i have, is so if anything breaks news wise for Sony, I have something to point back to, because even though I’ve spent weeks posting in this thread and people have read a lot of my break downs etc, suddenly I have to provide evidence etc of past posts? so here is the search term to find it “GavsPostNobodyGivesAShitAbout”.
But I won’t stress it enough... these consoles are going to be so close. It will be like picking between two twin sisters, one with a mole on her left tit and one with a mole on her left arse cheek. But decide if your a boob or a tit man and have some fun. I’ve been saying that for a while, and before that the ps5 had the edge. Things change, as they did a few times before, but I’m thinking this is where the doe fall this time.
I’m not an insider, I never want to be called that, I just have a few friends I’ve worked with before who work at a few select places. Om an indie developer who has worked with several people in the past who have access to development kits. For all I know they are having a laugh with me, but it all seems to match up, and if you read the tea leaves, it all makes sense as a good prediction.
So as always just go enjoy the games you want on the system you like. The above is all pure speculation, don’t take it as final, don’t take it as insider knowledge, just have a little fun with it. The 9tf dream is dead. But so is the dream of one console being vastly better than the other. I know instantly people will jump on me and start having a go, and that’s to be expected. I’m essentially telling you something you don’t want to hear, so it’s inevitable. But use your noggins lads.
Juat have fun, and be excellent to each other.
I have spent like 13h looking for a comment from you were you said anything about both console being RDNA2 (RDNA1.9) but I find nothing...
Could it be that you read it from
Tommy Fisher
? 
Gavin Stevens
Formerly 'o'dium'
I have spent like 13h looking for a comment from you were you said anything about both console being RDNA2 (RDNA1.9) but I find nothing...
Could it be that you read it from
Not gonna lie, I actually have no idea who tommy fisher is. As for rdna, I havent posted about it on Gaf too much as it wasn’t required, but I didn’t say I did? Everything else i have said though. As for 13h? Dude use the search bar haha
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SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
no one knows wtf is going on with github, i doubt devs would know which means osiris likely doesnt know.
what we do know is that the clockspeeds of the ps4 and pro are in the ariel and oberon gpu profiles. thats literally the only link.
you know where we found the xbox one and xbox one x cpu clockspeeds? in an amd gpu leaked last week with the exact 1.7 and 2.3 clock profiles. its gpu was clocked at 1.2 ghz. and yet you dont see anyone from team github giving it any kind of validity even for lockhart because that would only be 3 tflops. i guess team data doesnt like it when the data doesnt suit them.
mckmas8808
Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
The equivalent to something like that today would be 24GBs of HBM2 RAM stacked!
jackets with pockets
Banned
Since fan is short for fanatic, it doesn't matter if you're a boy or a man, you're still a fanatic.
thicc_girls_are_teh_best
Member
What's the time frame for this? The only time I was speculating anything less than 10TF was for PS5 and that was due to the Github leak. After that it's mainly been the steppings benchmarks for Oberon, which just happen to be incidentally related with the Github thing but are otherwise fully independent of that (they aren't predicated on the Github leak, if anything it's the other way around now). And a little more recent than that I've been optimistic in a future stepping or revision that might fit most with what other sources are saying, putting PS5 well ahead of 10TF again but my betting on that range (10.44-11.04) depends on some other evidence coming forth in a couple months (if it surfaces, hopefully).
I never really wavered thinking XSX would be 12TF, but I did entertain the possibility of it being 10TF or so due to speculation from posters like
VFXVeteran
and
R
R600
. But that was more "back of the mind" idea; I still primarily felt it would hit 12 and that was even before the TGAs, just going by messaging from MS up to that point and their seemingly renewed hardware focus in the console division to not repeat a mistake like the XBO.Ah you know its all good. It was the old amd post from last year that said about ps5 was Navi but Scarlett was next gen rdna (but Xbox also said in Scarlett video they are using Navi). Was just a thought since xsx was confirmed as rdna 2 if their was a chance ps5 was rdna 1. But I think it should be safe to say the ps5 is also rdna 2.
Amd said rdna 2 on 7nm+, but next gen consoles are on 7nm. Which would roughly line up withGavin Stevens saying that are about 1.9 rdna - so close that they can call it rdna 2.
But you never know haha.
Ah cool, appreciate that. I might remember that post now, it was interesting but probably just being vague for the sake of vague. There was also something from their CES showing this year when they put the slide up for their upcoming products that caught my attention for next-gen systems. It was part of a sizzle promo or something before they got into elaborating on their products, but I can't find it on Youtube.
It had something to do with the ordering when they mentioned certain RDNA features and then showed MS's XSX, after that showing Sony's PS5 but there was text prefacing before each. Had to rewind the stream to see what that was about, but I think it wasn't anything big in terms of being a differential, would've noted that had it been.
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Kazekage1981
Member
Will PS5 and XsX will have some sort of built in hardware upscaling and clean up of previous gen games? If PS1, PS2, PS3 games are backwards compatible with PS5, will it look similar to bleemcast upscaling?
NathanDiego
Member
lol you didn't expected that huh
01011001
Banned
no one knows wtf is going on with github, i doubt devs would know which means osiris likely doesnt know.
what we do know is that the clockspeeds of the ps4 and pro are in the ariel and oberon gpu profiles. thats literally the only link.
you know where we found the xbox one and xbox one x cpu clockspeeds? in an amd gpu leaked last week with the exact 1.7 and 2.3 clock profiles. its gpu was clocked at 1.2 ghz. and yet you dont see anyone from team github giving it any kind of validity even for lockhart because that would only be 3 tflops. i guess team data doesnt like it when the data doesnt suit them.
3tf would make sense... 12/4=3.
a system made to run 1/4 resolution with exactly 1/4 the GPU performance. If I were Microsoft tho I would try to have some overhead just in case... maybe up-clock that thing a bit?
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TherapistGaymer
Banned
And still going huh
Dory16
Banned
Guess who knows the number of PS5 Teraflops at this stage? Phil Spencer, that's who. There are so many ways he could have found that out by now, it's not even funny. And his announcement yesterday is that of someone who knows that the competition has an inferior number. You dont list that number first and in capitals on your breaking news announcement unless you know it won't be matched, especially if nothing obliges you to explicitly reveal it in the first place. Spencer could have done the exact same announcement without a number of Teraflops and leave it for later.
But keep dreaming about a 15 TF PS5, I mean it's theoritically possible.
no one knows wtf is going on with github, i doubt devs would know which means osiris likely doesnt know.
what we do know is that the clockspeeds of the ps4 and pro are in the ariel and oberon gpu profiles. thats literally the only link.
you know where we found the xbox one and xbox one x cpu clockspeeds? in an amd gpu leaked last week with the exact 1.7 and 2.3 clock profiles. its gpu was clocked at 1.2 ghz. and yet you dont see anyone from team github giving it any kind of validity even for lockhart because that would only be 3 tflops. i guess team data doesnt like it when the data doesnt suit them.
What am I looking at here? 1 is SX and 2 is lockheart?
Gamernyc78
Banned
PSVR super cutting edge for consoles, ridiculous innovation in a new way to play on consoles but you know until thy do it its not a competent innovation
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FranXico
Member
Nobody is claiming that. He probably means PS5 is getting pretty close. Enough to win his bet.
FranXico
Member
Someone should reach him, maybe he could come back here.
TherapistGaymer
Banned
He tried because like you right now, regardless of the crazy he thought he would share info to both. He likes being in this forum due to the crazy of the last and decided to spread and give new info, pics, and verification here to the mods. We really have a lot to be happy about and you are just being whinny and nitpicky at this point. Just let it go man or the mods can help you with that. We at neogaf get bored real quick with any sides harping on one thing too long. Go be happy and Power Those Dreams man. It's an awesome time!
mckmas8808
Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
Full Playstation BC from PS1 to PS4 on the PS5 would be considered a major bomb, since we all know Playstation has a better collection of games over the last 25 years.
TherapistGaymer
Banned
I'm going to have a field day, its crazy.
Mr Moose
Member
1 is CPU, 2 is GPU (for possibly Lockheart).
FranXico
Member
Making all PS1 through PS3 games actually downloadable though... licensing nightmare.
TherapistGaymer
Banned
God after all of that exhaustion first. Always do your research again before going into debate.
M.Night Shyamalan
Member
penello is a fucking joke, he believed Colbert and others that are clearly there with an xbox agenda was right (without reason)PS5 is 8TFlops and he ran with it. Sure the guy that said on gaf 6 years ago spewing dual gpu in xbox talk.. sure, he isn't biased.. Era has lost its way and the mods are banning for the dumbest shit reasons. I see lots of console warring going on there, seems like it's being encouraged after yesterday.
There is no sensibility in that next gen thread, same arguments around github, same guys derailing the thread, even ok with assholes on there harassing that sony engineer guy.
Cant wait for the PS5 reveal, i think that will shut many up.
Roronoa Zoro
Gold Member
That's actually the best play. Everyone assuming that silence means scared should remember E3 2013. Sony was kinda wishy washy before then regarding DRM and check ins which made me assume they had a similar policy. Then they went after MS and just crushed everything. If they come out with anything close to series x power wise and are even or better in price and show one big IP they'll have stolen the hype
M.Night Shyamalan
Member
There are individuals there now claiming Vega based PS5 talk...Damn.
Disco_
Member
HBM2 wouldn't get them significantly higher clocks. Sure HBM draws less power/produces less heat, but that heat is IN the APU. With gddr6, the heat is away from the die and could potentially have its own heatsink. The only real heat/power advantage hbm would have is less overall power draw, which really means nothing as there are no limits to how much total power these consoles can draw. The only limitations are imposed in sleep state, media playback, stand-by.
XBOX announces monster specs that we all should be happy about yet half the discussion is about github. WTF are we doing here?
Even if you took 21 years off for most of the fanboys here, they'd still be old enough to drive.
I might upgrade to Big Navi as well, but gaming on PC will be a side dish if it happens. My attempt of playing Xbox exclusives if they come up with something interesting but with a careful approach to minimize their profit out of me.
It's 2020. You can't be a fanman, you have to be a fanperson.
You're looking at the next Surface laptop.
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
1 is the cpu.
2 is the gpu.
Both are Lockhart. Both have lower specs than we thought.
Fun Fanboy
Banned
Dammit! That was my line!
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
oh shit. What if the Lockhart is a laptop or tablet.
LED Guy?
Banned
The time frame was in July and August 2019.What's the time frame for this? The only time I was speculating anything less than 10TF was for PS5 and that was due to the Github leak. After that it's mainly been the steppings benchmarks for Oberon, which just happen to be incidentally related with the Github thing but are otherwise fully independent of that (they aren't predicated on the Github leak, if anything it's the other way around now). And a little more recent than that I've been optimistic in a future stepping or revision that might fit most with what other sources are saying, putting PS5 well ahead of 10TF again but my betting on that range (10.44-11.04) depends on some other evidence coming forth in a couple months (if it surfaces, hopefully).
I never really wavered thinking XSX would be 12TF, but I did entertain the possibility of it being 10TF or so due to speculation from posters like
Ah cool, appreciate that. I might remember that post now, it was interesting but probably just being vague for the sake of vague. There was also something from their CES showing this year when they put the slide up for their upcoming products that caught my attention for next-gen systems. It was part of a sizzle promo or something before they got into elaborating on their products, but I can't find it on Youtube.
It had something to do with the ordering when they mentioned certain RDNA features and then showed MS's XSX, after that showing Sony's PS5 but there was text prefacing before each. Had to rewind the stream to see what that was about, but I think it wasn't anything big in terms of being a differential, would've noted that had it been.
saintjules
Member
Just the highlights from the other side that were posted in threadmarks saying he was verified and credible. But a whole history, not sure.
Edit: Here's something, but it's going back from August.
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DeepEnigma
Gold Member
PSVR super cutting edge for consoles, ridiculous innovation in a new way to play on consoles but you know until. Thy do it its not a competent innovation
Just like streaming was total trash to the cutting edge enthusiasts (it still is to me) on here who make fun of anything less than 144hz and anything more than 20-30ms input lag on LCDs... but watch out for the xCloud though!!!111!
#FuckStreaming ... I see you.
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Bo_Hazem
Banned
Gamernyc78
Banned
Lol
not to mention all Xcloud previews have been 720p res cap something fanboys use to make fun of on Psnow But now it's not funny
Fun Fanboy
Banned
And if it's not true, yours will be pretty glorious to watch as well!
demigod
Member
Lol
But now it's not funny
What, its 720p?!?
Quite the opposite lol.
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