octiny
Banned
And it's still peanuts to MS. So his point still stands.
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Console gen over before it's started - PS5. Only 10.3 tflops. Only 36 CUs...
- Thread starter Coulomb_Barrier
- Start date
- Opinion Drama
And it's still peanuts to MS. So his point still stands.
Hawking Radiation
Member
I don't agree OP.
We don't know the services, games and price to decide the gen. If this was the case then the Xbox 360 should have been declared the winner based on specs alone before it launched. We all know the PS3 eventually reeled it in in world wide sales so nothing can be drawn before the gen has begun.
Series X (to me) looks like a $500 console and not a penny less. IF (and that's a big IF) Sony launches PS5 at $400 or $450 and Xbox Series X comes in at $500 then Sony will fly out of the gates. Problem here is that MS will be just as aggressive and if they match PS5, then Sony will have to pull off a miracle to convince the public to get PS5 instead even if the spec's won't be that huge of a difference.
But before all that Sony i feel needs to get their marketing act together. They've done a piss poor job of it so far. The spec talk this morning was fine and dandy but there are millions of Playstation fans around the world that is starved of info on PS5 and they could not even show a practical example of this tech talk by showcasing a demo to go with the numbers and tech jargon.
Now i fear it will be another few months before we see any new PS5 news.
On a personal note, i feel very underwhelmed by this PS5 news. I am a huge Sony fan first and foremost and i have owned x3 Xbox 360's before so i'm not 100% biased but the PS5 backwards compatibility looks to be poor compared to Xbox Series X. This is all just based off info so far from both companies.
At this moment in time i have a PS4 Pro and around 120 games on it. That i will give up in a heartbeat if Series X software and services advantage mirrors that of their hardware advantage.
It really is going to be a close call this gen and Sony needs a shakeup at the top. Someone is seriously dropping the ball.
We don't know the services, games and price to decide the gen. If this was the case then the Xbox 360 should have been declared the winner based on specs alone before it launched. We all know the PS3 eventually reeled it in in world wide sales so nothing can be drawn before the gen has begun.
Series X (to me) looks like a $500 console and not a penny less. IF (and that's a big IF) Sony launches PS5 at $400 or $450 and Xbox Series X comes in at $500 then Sony will fly out of the gates. Problem here is that MS will be just as aggressive and if they match PS5, then Sony will have to pull off a miracle to convince the public to get PS5 instead even if the spec's won't be that huge of a difference.
But before all that Sony i feel needs to get their marketing act together. They've done a piss poor job of it so far. The spec talk this morning was fine and dandy but there are millions of Playstation fans around the world that is starved of info on PS5 and they could not even show a practical example of this tech talk by showcasing a demo to go with the numbers and tech jargon.
Now i fear it will be another few months before we see any new PS5 news.
On a personal note, i feel very underwhelmed by this PS5 news. I am a huge Sony fan first and foremost and i have owned x3 Xbox 360's before so i'm not 100% biased but the PS5 backwards compatibility looks to be poor compared to Xbox Series X. This is all just based off info so far from both companies.
At this moment in time i have a PS4 Pro and around 120 games on it. That i will give up in a heartbeat if Series X software and services advantage mirrors that of their hardware advantage.
It really is going to be a close call this gen and Sony needs a shakeup at the top. Someone is seriously dropping the ball.
M1chl
Currently Gif and Meme Champion
If that 4GB extra on PS4 does not happened, they would be fucked even in this gen...
This is common technique. Occlusion Culling: https://docs.unity3d.com/560/Documentation/Manual/OcclusionCulling.html
This is common technique. Occlusion Culling: https://docs.unity3d.com/560/Documentation/Manual/OcclusionCulling.html
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DunDunDunpachi
Banned
Romulus
Member
Surpassing them in sales? Of course. Nintendo isn't a direct competition anymore. It's a handheld hybrid. People wanting to play COD, BF, etc aren't looking to play it Switch. Nintendo has their own games and market, and all they need is something that works with their exclusive games to sell.
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Dory16
Banned
Get the troll police
Coulomb_Barrier
Member
Good god! You're trying so hard. I hope there aren't tears on your keyboard
I couldnt care less about tlops.
You're not comprehending what I'm saying. Consoles are a business. Sales and revenue matter.
You're asleep at the wheel. 2 more tflops may matter to you and your echo chamber, but it means premium price as 52 CUs is a massive chip.
Mista
Banned
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Rean no Kiseki
Banned
Games are what wins the war not specs, gimmicks are important too to a certain extant but games are always what determines the winner, i think people need to look back at 2009-2013 for both 360 and PS3 to see what i mean, 4K and the like is unimportant at the end of the day and after the honeymoon phase is over.
What's going to win either XBX/PS5 the generation are games, exclusives frequancy/quality, price and services.
What's going to win either XBX/PS5 the generation are games, exclusives frequancy/quality, price and services.
Ogbert
Member
If we’re honest, Nintendo have quietly put themselves in a position where they are going to teabag both Sony and MS for the next decade, if not longer.
They have zero competition. You buy a PC, you also pick up a Switch. More of a Sony guy, well, you pick up a Switch too. Same for Xbox.
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Coulomb_Barrier
Member
MS War Chest
JohnnyFootball
GerAlt-Right. Ciriously.
Correction: Sony is in a very good financial position, but they don't have anywhere remotely close to the cash to sell their system at a loss like MS does.
You could be 100% spot on, and my digital library hopes so. But MS might still have the mother of all Trump cards to play. I'm like 99% certain Phil said they won't be beat on specs or price. Normally I would take that with a grain of salt because "beat on price" is subjective when dealing with different power levels for a product. I still take it with said grain of salt, but I have to admit that MS seems to have taken its current generation licks straight into the gym. Backwards compatibility, raw power, essentially forced cross play this gen, buying up devs, free upgrades to Series X version of One games, Xcloud, etc., etc. If Phil was not giving marketing speak when he said they won't be beat on price, then holy shit I don't see how Sony will compete in the US at least. So now we wait. Was MS giving us their subjective belief on what it means to not be beat on power? Or did they mean that objectively because software sales slices, subscriptions, etc., lead them to decide to absorb huge losses to finally dominate this sphere?
Edit: I do recognize that MS could have alluded to a Series S with the claim they won't be beat on price. If that is the case in fact, then the very real possibility exists that MS ends up in the same position it is currently in come 5 years from now. Maybe not, but my guess is whatever the cheapest model is will be what the vast majority of consumers look at. In such a scenario, they would need to come in cheaper than PS5 to really move the needle for most current PS4 only purchasers to even consider switching eco-systems IMO.
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Coulomb_Barrier
Member
Point is you dont pick up an Series X if you got a PC surely.
HE1NZ
Banned
People like you and me don't drive sales. Very few people are willing to buy a console just to play exclusives.
darkinstinct
...lacks reading comprehension.
LOL, there are still Cerny believers. It's not 10.4. It's 10.28 in boost mode. Which is not what you will get in most games, because it takes power from the overall budget and downclocks the CPU, which itself is needed to actually deliver data over the SSD. The whole system design is a mess because they desperately tried to not be at 9.2 officially. Well, they are. 9.2 TF with full CPU is what the PS5 will realistically deliver, because with XSX at 3.8 GHz constantly for CPU, devs will need every single hertz of that 3.5 GHz max PS5 CPU.
JareBear: Remastered
Banned
If it was locked cpu clock and locked GPU clock (locked 10.2 tf) I’d feel much better than this variable boost talk
Ogbert
Member
Well, you don’t pick up a PS5 either.
PC, Xbox and PS are all fighting over the same space (PC less though).
Nintendo are running in the exact opposite direction.
Coulomb_Barrier
Member
So what will 12.1 tflops mean other than bigger epeen, please explain?
Cos a $500 or even $450 Series X is gonna be 3rd place again. Is this your idea of 'winning'?
Bo_Hazem
Banned
darkinstinct
...lacks reading comprehension.
Absolutely not. We are looking at another 360/PS3 gen, where one will dominate one or two markets and the other as well. Problem for Sony is that Japan imploded as a console market. So Xbox will be slightly ahead of Sony next gen (basically Microsoft had a 10 million lead in the US with 360 and Sony a 10 million lead with PS3 in Japan, while they were even in the rest of the world).
darkinstinct
...lacks reading comprehension.
So what will 12.1 tflops mean other than bigger epeen, please explain?
Cos a $500 or even $450 Series X is gonna be 3rd place again. Is this your idea of 'winning'?
Either Lockhart at 249 is going to crush Sony for the 50 % that don't have a 4KTV yet or Series X will go down to the same price as PS5. Sony is screwed either way. Phil Spencer: We will not be out of position regarding price or performance. Meaning they will be equal or better in both with XSX.
Coulomb_Barrier
Member
PS4 is more expensive worldwide than XB1 and outsold it more than 2:1.
PS5 this time will be cheaper as Sony is all about mainstream. So do the math.
two words Lock Hart
now close this silly thread
D
Deleted member 17706
Unconfirmed Member
The thing is, though, that it appears to not even be as clear cut a case as PS4 Pro vs Xbox One X, which was really just one console being much more powerful than the other in an apples to apples comparison. If Sony's "secret sauce" with I/O throughput and audio "presence" is something unique to their hardware, and it's also less powerful than the XSX, but not even as big of a gap as PS4 Pro vs. Xbox One X, then I don't see them having a lot to worry about assuming the price point is right.
phil_t98
#SonyToo
Sony just become a publisher? hahaha joking of coarse. the ps5 still a great console even though not as good as xbox
Ogbert
Member
But it won’t be cheaper.
MS will match it. They will lose money on it to sell at the same price.
Their strategy has been so clear. They will launch the better console at the same price.
Trying to call it down the middle --> PS4 started off cheaper and more powerful. That combo then gave it momentum that never relented. We still don't know where pricing will actually fall this time, but we know who has the larger theoretical war chest to absorb huge losses if they choose to.
DunDunDunpachi
Banned
If we're talking business
Coulomb_Barrier
I am curious how the price will affect existing prices as well as manufacturing length for the existing consoles. Selling X1X or the PS4 Pro for another 3-4 years at a $200 price point seems like a smart way to scoop up a few tens of millions of extra customers.
People often overlook the fact that PS2's massive sales numbers were only the result of a 13-year manufacturing lifespan.
Coulomb_Barrier
I am curious how the price will affect existing prices as well as manufacturing length for the existing consoles. Selling X1X or the PS4 Pro for another 3-4 years at a $200 price point seems like a smart way to scoop up a few tens of millions of extra customers.People often overlook the fact that PS2's massive sales numbers were only the result of a 13-year manufacturing lifespan.
Coulomb_Barrier
Member
No.
And where is Lock Hart?
Are you ready for Series X to be outsold 2:1 again? 3rd losing gen in a row, MS would then seriously consider pulling the plug
D
Deleted member 17706
Unconfirmed Member
Speaking of Lockhart, why is Microsoft supposedly releasing a "next-gen" console that is less powerful than their current gen top-end model?
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DESTROYA
Member
You say that like its fact but its just your opinion ,maybe your right maybe not.
I believe the PS5 will launch at a cheaper price so the adoption rate will globally be better and most people who bought a PS4 will buy a PS5 and don’t give crap about Tflops like most on GAF do.
Hostile_18
Banned
That is EXACTLY how I feel as a Sony fan as well. I went 360>PS4 and now have 150 digital games but I'm going to have to seriously think about which console to go for. I'll wait for the game conferences first.
What a terrible, misjudged first foot forwards though Sony. How could the team that new the market so well at the start of last gen come up with a tech seminar as the general publics first impression.
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darkinstinct
...lacks reading comprehension.
Because One X is a 4K console, Series S would be a 1080p console. It would basically be 4x as powerful as a One X despite having similar raw performance.
Coulomb_Barrier
Member
Dont be obscene. PS5 can go right down to $400 if needed, bigger contract with AMD in total volume and smaller chips = cheaper price and BOM.
Series X can't go close to that $350-400 nainstream sweetspot. This is business they're not gonna eat $150 loss per console.
D
Deleted member 17706
Unconfirmed Member
I still don't get it. People can run the One X as a 1080p console if they want, no? Why not just keep manufacturing that instead of building an entirely new box?
The rumored Series S lends credence to the idea that MS does not intend to eat too much loss on the X. But if they choose to eat 150, it probably would be a long term gain. A year of Live and other services will cannibalize the loss, if not swallow it entirely. Even if it took 2 years, they'd be looking at 4-5 more years of profit. Plus they would get people into their eco-system for next next gen, which can be a huge blessing and free marketing down the road. The next few months are only getting more interesting.
Xbox is also planning a cheaper model that supports streaming, no?
I believe their plan is to capture both ends of the market. If someone really wants to get a cheap console they could go for the cheap xbox model. For most powerful console/best performance, they would get the Xbox Series X. If they want Sony exclusives, they would buy the PS5. I think M$ strategy is pretty clear to leave the only advantage of buying a PS5 only be PS5 exclusives.
I believe their plan is to capture both ends of the market. If someone really wants to get a cheap console they could go for the cheap xbox model. For most powerful console/best performance, they would get the Xbox Series X. If they want Sony exclusives, they would buy the PS5. I think M$ strategy is pretty clear to leave the only advantage of buying a PS5 only be PS5 exclusives.
Bo_Hazem
Banned
Isn't that the case with Xbox One? Good luck breaking the Xbox 360 number (which is below failure in Sony's standards).
Don't push your dreams that far 
Stuart360
Member
I'm sure the thinking is for the more casual gamers, or parents etc, 'i'm not buying youthat new Xbox, you dont even have one of those 4ktv things'. There are a lot of people stuck on 1080p tv's, and probably will be for years to come until the tv's die. And being able to play the same games as that super powerful Xbox, but on a much cheaper Xbox, that will hook a lot of the more casual crowd in.
Daffy Duck
Member
It’s amazing how the narrative changes when you’re not the front runner anymore.