Support NeoGAF

[Nikana]

I never said they cant do it. Im saying its not the best thing to do. The only Backwards compatibility that is necessary is PS4, which runs on PS5.
PS1-3 would be a nice perk but it isn't necessary (Like it or Not).
There focus should be on making new content and making the PS5 Hardware sing thus driving sales and getting folks into the ecosystem and driving PS Plus subs.
Only a miniscule of people in the grande scheme of things would buy a PS5 to Play Metal Gear Solid 3. That's the truth. Just sayin.

You keep staying things as if they are facts that are opinions.

If their focus was truly on the current gen then again, why did they invest so heavily on the catalog dating back far with PS Now?

And if people didn't want to play older titles that were synonymous with playstation like Final Fantasy 7 then why are other companies rereleasing them and trying to sell them again?

Do people want to play Madden 04 on their ps5? No. But to write off the entirety of a back catalog as non existent in the realm of desire to play is silly.

One of the launch games on PS5, arguably their biggest one in fact, is a ps3 game being remade. Yet their back catalog isn't important?

Will have to agree to disagree.

 

[Diddy X]

Sounds pretty good, will get an S.

 

[Strider Highwind]

They actually said this in one of those Inside Xbox videos and people just ran with the usual twitter narrative lol.

 

[T-Cake]

I hope they manage to add "Call of Duty Classic" to the BC list at some point. It's on my bucket list to play through every Xbox Call of Duty single player campaign and the only one missing is the very first one.

 

[TigerKnee]

without additional patches the One X will run games at higher resolutions.
the Series S might get patches that remove the framerate cap in some games, so you would have a higher resolution on One X but a higher framerate on Series S in these titles.

also due to the vastly superior CPU games like KOTOR or GTA4 should run way smoother on Series S than on One X.

in general, games that have a hard time hitting their target/max framerate on One X will most likely hit it on Series S, games like Earth Defence Force 2025, GTA4, GRAW1+2, the 360 version of Bioshock Infinite, Bioshock 1+2 and many more games that have an unstable framerate even on One X will basically stay either at the max framerate or very close to it. (I wouldn't guarantee GTA4 to hit 60fps for example since that game is absolutely terribly optimised)



as you can see in this video, KOTOR runs WAAAAAAAAY better on One X than on og Xbox and even noticeably better than on One S.

on Series S this game should hit a full 60fps. the CPU is often the bottleneck in these instances since the CPUs inside current systems are dogshit (this comparison is almost an insult to dogshit tbh.) and emulation is always straining the CPU to begin with.

the performance difference you see in the video between One and One X aligns pretty well with the difference in their CPU performance
and where the games are GPU bound the Series S should also power through with no issue since it "only" renders at 1440p with a GPU that's very close in performance to the One X's GPU

but of course, on Series S this particular game will "only" run at 1440p, while the One X runs it at 1920p
so all in all, it basically comes down to this: One X = Higher Resolution in some 360 games and all og Xbox games,
Series S = Higher Framerate across the board with every game

Don't forget decreased load times via SSD

 

[DarkMage619]

What is your problem? The console can do 4K. The HDMI cable is not broken, 4 TFLOPS for an RDNA2 chip can render that resolution with non trivial math per pixel, and we are talking about original Xbox and Xbox 360 games here.

Your best answer is to tout the company line without any critical thinking and defending their business decision and not reading what other people type (?!? which results in an almost canned response that reads like a script).

This would be almost fine and not hilarious if you were not also shouting about how white knightly pro-consumer they supposedly are in everything they do

What are your thoughts on the XSX? Does it run back compatibility the way you think it should? If so then it appears that MS has addressed the market for those who want 4k gaming. The XSS even upscales less than 4k content to 4k. Perhaps that will address the complaints you have about a non 4k box running games at 4k. I'm sure MS could have designed the XSS with more ram and a drive and have it run all games in 4k but then it would appear that we would be talking about the XSX and again that product ALREADY EXISTS. It isn't the company line it is a fact. To have multiple boxes running games the same way is redundant. The XSS is a budget friendly option for people who don't want the extra features. It isn't designed to replace the X1X; it isn't designed to run games at 4k. It's not that hard to understand. Despite that it STILL runs those games better than X1X regardless. Pretty great huh!

The stuff about pro-consumer is pretty funny. Maybe you think pro-consumer is telling your customers that you believe in generations right before announcing many of your major titles coming to an older platform. Maybe you love the idea of re-paying for a game that came out 2 generations ago. Maybe you like half-hearted back compatibility that isn't doing most of what MS has going on with the Xbox. The real question is what is YOUR problem? As I have said the XSS is fine. You want more features you can get more it's called the XSX.

 

[REDRZA MWS]

Let's say,for example,I want to play the Xbox 360 game, Ninja Gaiden II. I own the physical copy. I heard that if I were to play the game on a console from the Xbox One family, my physical NG2 disc simply acts as a “key” to allow me to download the digital version of the game from the Xbox Store for free. Obviously I can't do this with Series S – because there's no optical drive. So would I have to rebuy Ninja Gaiden II from the Xbox Store?

If what you are saying is true, that on your Xbox one s/x, you put the disc in, install the title, and it converts to a digital license..... if those are al true then that BC game should show up in your game library, and should be downloadable digitally on the Series s/x. Again, if you are saying once old BC games are installed it converts to a digital license.

 

[Kagoshima_Luke]

Cool. Unfortunately, Series S is dead to me for BC without a disc drive. I own too many physical Xbox and 360 games.

 

[Kagey K]

If what you are saying is true, that on your Xbox one s/x, you put the disc in, install the title, and it converts to a digital license..... if those are al true then that BC game should show up in your game library, and should be downloadable digitally on the Series s/x. Again, if you are saying once old BC games are installed it converts to a digital license.

It doesn’t convert it to a digital license. You still need the disc to play.

That leaves the user to decide what is more important their physical collection (get an X) or saving money up front (get an S).

The same dilemma exists with PS4 BC and their Systems so it seems like a moot point.

 

[Riky]

You always need the disc as a licence check, that's not new. If you had the Xbox One S All Digital then you couldn't use your old discs, if you wanted to use your old discs then you wouldn't buy an all digital console. Same as I won't be able to use my disc copy of Last Of Us 2 on a PS5 DE.

This is very simple stuff.

 

[Aguero9320]

it should be the same. maybe a tiny bit faster on X due to the CPU being slightly higher clocked.
but we're talking differences of half a second or less here

I'd have thought it may be faster on the Series S (at least in some instances) due to smaller file sizes?

 

[Breakage]

If what you are saying is true, that on your Xbox one s/x, you put the disc in, install the title, and it converts to a digital license..... if those are al true then that BC game should show up in your game library, and should be downloadable digitally on the Series s/x. Again, if you are saying once old BC games are installed it converts to a digital license.

I've never owned a current gen console. I've only heard that the physical disc simply acts a key to unlock the digital version for free.
In my view all next gen consoles regardless of spec should have had an optical drive as standard, especially when you consider next gen game sizes and download times.

 

[Trogdor1123]

Wouldn't it be wonderful if Sony said.... Anything.... About theirs

 

[Calverz]

I wish it was that simple, and that would work in general, but I dont think that would be up to standard for today.
Example: I have the old 60GB PS3 Phat backwards compatible version that has PS2 hardware inside.
Europe got the 80GB PS3 that did emulation, overall it was ok but some games wasnt too hot.

What I'm saying is Sony can do it, but they would have to test Every. Single. Game. In the process, that time and money is better spent on creating new games.
Your making the exact criticism towards (which is legitimate) Sony that folks made at the beginning of the PS4 gen. But we see how that turned out.

Na the whole bc thing was more widely accepted at the beginning of last gen because neither system supported bc. Now we have one that has the feature (and is pretty fucking good at that) and one that doesnt. Its pretty poor.

 

[TheGreatWhiteShark]

Cool. Unfortunately, Series S is dead to me for BC without a disc drive. I own too many physical Xbox and 360 games.

if you have a cyberpunk x right now, the upgrade path for you is x not s anyway

 

[Rusty Shackelford]

Imagine putting your GTA VC disc in the Series X and playing in 4K/60 with all music in tact. They never really stated if BC was going to be limited like before, or most games will play.

 

[01011001]

I'd have thought it may be faster on the Series S (at least in some instances) due to smaller file sizes?

well that's only for Series S|X games and some Xbox One X enhanced titles, but true, in theory some games might load faster due to that

 

[hemo memo]

Nice.

Your move Sony....






















..........














......

oh.

Sony is too busy messing up pre-orders and game trailers.

 

[NEbeast]

Most of this is redundant without a disk drive. So the majority of people would need to buy most their collection again? I'm sure that wasnt intentional.

 

[01011001]

Most of this is redundant without a disk drive. So the majority of people would need to buy most their collection again? I'm sure that wasnt intentional.

well everyone who has XBLG will have a shitton of 360 games simply through that. you get 2 each month. recently they also had multiple og Xbox games in games with gold.

games with gold had about 170 Xbox 360 games since it was introduced.
all of which are backwards compatible as far as I know, or at least all of the ones that released
since the Xbox One is backwards compatible, which would still be about 80 or so

 

[NEbeast]

well everyone who has XBLG will have a shitton of 360 games simply through that. you get 2 each month. recently they also had multiple og Xbox games in games with gold.

games with gold had about 170 Xbox 360 games since it was introduced.
all of which are backwards compatible as far as I know, or at least all of the ones that released
since the Xbox One is backwards compatible, which would still be about 80 or so

I guess that makes it ok?

 

[01011001]

I guess that makes it ok?

yes.. that makes it ok that the exclusively digital system still gets this feature...

the fuck are you even on about? would it be better for you if it wasn't backwards compatible or what are you fucking saying here?

almost every back compat game is available digitally too you know.

is it okay for you that the all digital PS5 plays PS4 games or is that also not ok?

 

[IfuckinghateReddit]

The Fallout games might even work properly now!

 

[geordiemp]

Nice.

Your move Sony....

You do realise that just scaling the resolution without higher textures it still looks like shit ?

Thought not.

Ps4 games will get double the frame rate, will probably only look decent if they have ps4pro textures...

Also I have played most good games on 360 and ps3, time to move on thanks.

 

[NEbeast]

yes.. that makes it ok that the exclusively digital system still gets this feature...

the fuck are you even on about? would it be better for you if it wasn't backwards compatible or what are you fucking saying here?

almost every back compat game is available digitally too you know.

is it okay for you that the all digital PS5 plays PS4 games or is that also not ok?

Damn, take a deep breath. I'm talking about people who have a massive collection of physical OGgames. Not everyone has gold, so they are royally fucked. The S should have had a disk drive to be a true back compat console. It's not that hard to understand.

 

[01011001]

You do realise that just scaling the resolution without higher textures it still looks like shit ?

Thought not.

Ps4 games will get double the frame rate, will probably only look decent if they have ps4pro textures...

if you ever saw Gears 3 in 4K on One X and you still say this then you might wanna get your eyes checked.

also Sony has not communicated any plans to work with developers to get back compat games running at higher framerates.
some cross gen games might get it, that's it.

Damn, take a deep breath. I'm talking about people who have a massive collection of physical OGgames. Not everyone has gold, so they are royally fucked. The S should have had a disk drive to be a true back compat console. It's not that hard to understand.

I mean, the just don't buy the S???

that's like buying a DVD player and then complain about it not being compatible with VHS tapes. DON'T BUY THE THING THEN that doesn't play the games you own.

it's really easy. this feature is a good feature. there's no downside for it also being on the all digital versions of the new consoles. just don't buy the all digital version if you don't want to he all digital, it's really easy.

 

[geordiemp]

if you ever saw Gears 3 in 4K on One X and you still say this then you might wanna get your eyes checked.

also Sony has not communicated any plans to work with developers to get back compat games running at higher framerates.
some cross gen games might get it, that's it.

I played Gears3 when it was out thanks, and my eyes are fine I can appreciate nice looking games on my LG OLED and last gen stuff upscaled is still putting lipstick on a pig.

If you cant see difference to old games, then just play last gen if thats your thing.

Look. I have over 40 ps4 pro enhanced games to play at 4k60 on ps5 that I have not even started yet and they are all AAA, I am not interested in playing old games from 360/ps4 era.

I dont want any MORE ps4 quality games either, got enough, bring on some next gen zen 2 shit pls. Only Ratchet so far but keep hoping.

 

[01011001]

I played Gears3 when it was out thanks, and my eyes are fine I can appreciate nice looking games on my LG OLED and last gen stuff upscaled is still putting lipstick on a pig.

If you cant see difference to old games, then just play last gen if thats your thing.

Gears 3 ha such high quality Textures that at 4K it looks a billion times better simply because of the higher resolution.

games like that benefit from higher resolutions a lot.

Mirror's Edge also looks ridiculously good at 4K and especially with the added HDR support on One X.

there are a lot of 360 games that had really high resolution textures and pretty high quality assets in general, and the graphics were held back by the low resolution.
Halo 3 also looks a billion times better at 4K, Assassin's Creed 1 had its shadow resolution tied to the render resolution, so that game's 4K patch automatically improved shadow quality as well.

 

[Senua]

You do realise that just scaling the resolution without higher textures it still looks like shit ?

Thought not.

Ps4 games will get double the frame rate, will probably only look decent if they have ps4pro textures...

Also I have played most good games on 360 and ps3, time to move on thanks.

You do realise your saltiness is way more transparent than you think

 

[THEAP99]

 

[geordiemp]

You do realise your saltiness is way more transparent than you think

Is it ? I played all those games, I move on, its not that interesting.

But just pointing out that increasing the resolution without upgradfing textures and lighting is not what doubling teh resolution looks like. Take it however you want. I dont really care.

 

[Pallas]

This makes me wonder why they didn’t offer a series S with a disc drive then.

 

[NEbeast]

if you ever saw Gears 3 in 4K on One X and you still say this then you might wanna get your eyes checked.

also Sony has not communicated any plans to work with developers to get back compat games running at higher framerates.
some cross gen games might get it, that's it.



I mean, the just don't buy the S???

that's like buying a DVD player and then complain about it not being compatible with VHS tapes. DON'T BUY THE THING THEN that doesn't play the games you own.

it's really easy. this feature is a good feature. there's no downside for it also being on the all digital versions of the new consoles. just don't buy the all digital version if you don't want to he all digital, it's really easy.

Isnt that the point? People are going to buy this thinking its fully BC , it isn't. Whatever, clearly BC is the new next gen.

 

[TheGreatWhiteShark]

You do realise your saltiness is way more transparent than you think

nah, he doesn't have the slightest idea

not only he is picking and choosing from eurogamer video to give false impressions, but also


he is very upset too

Isnt that the point? People are going to buy this thinking its fully BC , it isn't. Whatever, clearly BC is the new next gen.

uhmm what?

 

[NEbeast]

Sadly, all the diehards will ignore this.

 

[Kagey K]

Ps4 games will get double the frame rate, will probably only look decent if they have ps4pro textures...

Source?

This is the best I can find.

PlayStation®5 | Play Has No Limits | PlayStation

Everything you need to know about the PlayStation®5 console and PlayStation®5 Digital Edition with a new slim PS5 design. The best PS5 games, PS5 accessories, and the DualSense wireless controller.

www.playstation.com

Game boost
Enjoy faster and smoother frame rates in select PS4 and PS VR games.

Paints a way different picture than you try to sell it as.

 

[Kagey K]

Sadly, all the diehards will ignore this.

As all idiots on Twitter should be Ignored.

 

[Komatsu]

I literally purchased an Xbox One X due to the amazing way in which BC was implemented. Being able to take Witcher 2 from the shelf and play it in glorious 4K, KOTOR, Jade Empire, Fable II, Ace Combat 6, to say nothing of Panzer Dragoon Orta. Glad to hear they are still investing in it and looking forward to seeing more titles added in the future.

 

[tillbot8]

Very very nice Microsoft, that's the way to do it!

 

[sixamp]

Will the series X/s play OG xbox dvds or just digital games ?

 

[Panajev2001a]

Source?

This is the best I can find.

PlayStation®5 | Play Has No Limits | PlayStation

Everything you need to know about the PlayStation®5 console and PlayStation®5 Digital Edition with a new slim PS5 design. The best PS5 games, PS5 accessories, and the DualSense wireless controller.

www.playstation.com

Game boost
Enjoy faster and smoother frame rates in select PS4 and PS VR games.

Paints a way different picture than you try to sell it as.

Not even MS promises frame rate doubling in all of the games, they imply more than a few but never state ALL or most even.

 

[Kagey K]

Will the series X/s play OG xbox dvds or just digital games ?

Well the S won’t for sure, the X should but there has been no official confirmation.

 

[sixamp]

Well the S won’t for sure, the X should but there has been no official confirmation.

I thought Backwards compatibility meant you were able to play your old physical games of xbox&360 . If you're only playing digital copies then is that really BC? I don't BC on console, I use emulators on pc

 

[TheGreatWhiteShark]

As all idiots on Twitter should be Ignored.

microsoft has issued a new development suite that is for simultaneous development across pc, xbone/x and series S/X.
sony, while boasting in the investor brochures that their strategic target is to enter pc market, they still run upgraded ps4 dev tools.
I am sure they will upgrade their tools in order to fill their goals, when they will be able to do so.
until then, they remove the videos saying "cross-gen & pc" in order to not upset the herd.

 

[Kagey K]

I thought Backwards compatibility meant you were able to play your old physical games of xbox&360 . If you're only playing digital copies then is that really BC? I don't BC on console, I use emulators on pc

The S doesn’t have a disc drive.

 

[TLZ]

I'm very confused. MS said SS will run things the same way One S did.

But also the caveat here is that those games will need patching to get any SS enhancements, right?

 

[sixamp]

The S doesn’t have a disc drive.

I know that. How exactly are you BCing if you aren't using your old game discs? Are u just buying an old game from a gen or 2 ago and playing it on your xbox? If you are buying the games from the Xbox store is that really backwards compatibility or just making an old game available to buy.

 

[Phrixotrichus]

Old games... Cool...I guess?

 

[Komatsu]

I know that. How exactly are you BCing if you aren't using your old game discs? Are u just buying an old game from a gen or 2 ago and playing it on your xbox? If you are buying the games from the Xbox store is that really backwards compatibility or just making an old game available to buy.

You will be able to play the your BC-supported games with your physical discs on the Series X, which has a disc drive. You pop it in and the console will download the game to your disk. With the Series S, all your digital purchases will carry over. So, for example, if you bought CoD: World at War digitally on your XB360, you can also download the game on the Series S/X. Those are not ports - the games are running on a virtual Xbox 360 GPU running on top of the hypervisor. It's really a marvel of technology and really encourage you to check it out.

 

[DragoonWalker]

It sucks that the company with the better, deeper, and more diverse back catalog across 4 gens has the console with no backwards compatibility. Still, good for MS.