Azurro
Banned
"I'm too rich to care how much I spend on my PC" - and people say I'm wrong when saying that PC Master Race culture is all about the e-peen.
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RDNA2 Isn't As Impressive As It Seems
- Thread starter BluRayHiDef
- Start date
"I'm too rich to care how much I spend on my PC" - and people say I'm wrong when saying that PC Master Race culture is all about the e-peen.
Ascend
Member
Why cherry pick the best case scenario?
GaviotaGrande
Banned
I rather go around making an impression that "I'm too rich to care how much I spend on my PC" instead of "I'm too poor to buy a X thing so I will shit on everything it represents". Sadly this forum is filled with people representing the latter state of mind."I'm too rich to care how much I spend on my PC" - and people say I'm wrong when saying that PC Master Race culture is all about the e-peen.
llien
Member
Generally speaking, and in this thread and context in particular, this is an idiotic fanboi statement.
Azurro
Banned
I rather go around making an impression that "I'm too rich to care how much I spend on my PC" instead of "I'm too poor to buy a X thing so I will shit on everything it represents". Sadly this forum is filled with people representing the latter state of mind.
I don't want to be mean, but I don't think anyone cares how much you spend on your PC, mate.
GaviotaGrande
Banned
Clearly some do care, "mate", as they laugh that component X was overpriced. It's only fair that I'll laugh back. "Mate". Plus I'm not talking numbers.
Azurro
Banned
I really, honestly don't care how much you spent on your PC mate, I was just pointing out what a silly attitude it was because nobody cares, it doesn't make you look like a baller or anything like that.
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GaviotaGrande
Banned
Good, "mate". I hope more people will adapt your attitude and stop laughing at other people purchase choices. It's only healthy!
Bernd Lauert
Banned
Nope, just a fact.
Azurro
Banned
I find interesting that when you felt attacked, you replied with the "look at how much money I have". Is that to hide some sort of insecurity?
GaviotaGrande
Banned
You cracked the code. And, this is exactly what I said - word for word.
But enough about me, let's talk computer graphics. Agree, "mate"?
llien
Member
"I'm too rich to care how much I spend on my PC" - and people say I'm wrong when saying that PC Master Race culture is all about the e-peen.
It is particularly hilarious coming from people who actually did not buy the more expensive and faster card like 6900XT or 3090, but opted for puny 3080 meant for toothless heebiejeebies living in a shack somewhere....
Armorian
Banned
Team green => Nvidia
Team red => AMD
Team blue => Intel
I thought it was obvious.
I've shared concrete example of DLSS 2.0 doing what one would expect from TAA based solutions to do, blur things:
if I understood your answer right, one should not judge TAA based upscaling with some NN post processing on it, until one buys Ampere cards and tests it.
That's ok.
Does it have to be Ampere card, or can I buy Turing (I recall I can't do it with Pascal, as even though GPUs are great at NN inference, it doesn't work on it, for some reason) to judge if that upscaling supported by a handful of games is worth going with otherwise inferior product?
If it's not a secret, how much did you pay for your 3080?
There is one very simple answer why RT reflections look like this on the picture above. RT is calculated by using native resolution, if native res is lower (like with DLSS before algorithm kicks in) RT reflections are lower res as well. Do you get it?
In this game anything other than RT reflections looks slighty better with DLSS compared to TAA and it doesn't have TAA ghosting! (thing that I hate about TAA the most).
Azurro
Banned
You cracked the code. And, this is exactly what I said - word for word.
But enough about me, let's talk computer graphics. Agree, "mate"?
To be honest I find your mental state more interesting. What do you feel you are compensating by pointing out the specs of your PC? Perhaps you feel frustrated that it did not provide you with certain social status even after spending an above average amount of money on a PC part?
GaviotaGrande
Banned
My mental state is tip-top but thank you for your concern. I mentioned my specs because they are relevant to the convention. I would be more worried about people with a loser state of mind that go around and comment on other people buying decisions. That's just sad.
Also, the average amount that people spend on a PC shouldn't be your concern. I'm worried about your mental state now. You clearly do care.
Azurro
Banned
My mental state is tip-top but thank you for your concern. I mentioned my specs because they are relevant to the convention. I would be more worried about people with a loser state of mind that go around and comment on other people buying decisions. That's just sad.
Also, the average amount that people spend on a PC shouldn't be your concern. I'm worried about your mental state now. You clearly do care.
I genuinely do find your decision process and mental state interesting. Why the constant insults and put downs, is there maybe something you are compensating for? Do you see PC part ownership as a competition? What do you expect to get when you win?
ZywyPL
Banned
"I'm too rich to care how much I spend on my PC" - and people say I'm wrong when saying that PC Master Race culture is all about the e-peen.
That's not really how it works, quite the opposite - despite what people say and act like, they DO care how much they spend on their PC parts, and that's exactly why they'll always pick the ones that offer the best performance. Because last time I checked, RDNA2 cards aren't coming at 49-99$ where you can just blindly throw out money and don't even care if the cards are bricked out of the box, but they will be in the same price range as Ampere cards, we're talking about hundreds of dollars, so people who have 500/600/700$ to spend on their next GPU will choose the best offer.
Now, the benchmarks are still not there yet obviously, but if all the rumors/leaks so far turn out to be true, whoever wants to play at 4K TV with RT will have no other option than NV offering, mostly due to DLSS because that's what will allow for 60FPS+ gameplay. For QHD, well depends, but I guess those with 144Hz displays will also opt for NV, again, thanks to DLSS and the framerate it gives. For 1080p or 1440p60, Big Navi cards should do a pretty good job, but then again, if you can have double of that performance for the same price tag, then why the hell not? Or save some cash by buying a lower tier card that will have the same RT performance? AMD needs to sort out their own upscaling feature ASAP if they want to compete, there's just no other way around it, maybe DirectML used in Series X is a glimpse of what's coming to Radeon cards, who knows, but the sooner they'll figure it out the better.
Because if RT performance on RDNA2 cards will be subpar compared to its rasterization performance, then IMO AMD should undercut NV by 100$, or offer cheaper cards without RT cores, because I really don't see a single reason in spending 500-700$ for a GPU with feature that will be practically unused due to its poor performance. It's like with Pascal-based cards, where many many people just didn't saw a single justification in buying Turing cards, where the rasterization performance didn't gain any performance, while RT was unusable for at least first year of those cards lifespan, it's still useful IMHO in only just a few games that did get DLSS2.0
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DonJuanSchlong
Banned
Exactly. It doesn't make sense to save a few bucks to get an inferior card. I want all the bells and whistles, plus being able to still be viable years to come.
llien
do you have any relationship to AMD by any chance? I've never seen so much insecurity being projected at a company they hate. If I don't like a company, I simply won't support it, it's a simple as that. You on the other hand, go out of the way to cry about it every chance you get. What gives?
NoviDon
Member
Its extremely impressive how big of a leap they've made. I remember reading people saying that the flagship rdna 2 cards wouldn't even be on par with a 2080 ti (LOL). But they are trading blows with the 30 series at 4k and absolutely stomping at lower resolutions. Also AMD will have a really good first generation raytracing solution besting the 2080 ti based on leaked benchmarks, and their answer to dlss is on the way with super resolution...
Ascend
Member
Fixed.
That's the rumor as of now. Generally AMD releases a major driver update every December, and supposedly it will be included in this upcoming release.
It's quite funny. The same people talking about being future proof completely ignore the fact that in the near future AMD will have its own scaling solution.
The obvious one sided view is disgusting.
DonJuanSchlong
Banned
What graphical features or options does AMD have over Nvidia? Pretty sure they don't have anything on DLSS or raytracing, hence why they didn't show either. But go ahead and blindly order the card before benchmarks show it's inferiority in raytracing, it's a smart thing to do.
Ascend
Member
You still don't dare answer whether you bought an AMD card when they supported DX12 and nVidia only supported DX11. All of us already know why. You didn't, because back then the features didn't matter, but now suddenly they do, just because it's nVidia. Your mask is off, you just don't wan't to admit it because you lack cojones.
Obviously if current ray tracing implementations cater to nVidia, why would AMD show those? They will inevitably lose. It would be like them trying to compare nVidia Hairworks vs their own graphics card. Obviously they are not stupidly going to paint themselves in the worst light possible. Each CU is an RT core, so there is some optimizing to do there, between rasterization and RT. But obviously you love to pretend that because you can't see the sun at night, the sun doesn't exist.
As for the whole DLSS thing... This is what is known regarding the XSX , which uses RDNA2;
At the very beginning of development of the Xbox Series X | S, we knew we were setting the foundation for the next decade of gaming innovation and performance across console, PC and cloud. To deliver on this vision we wanted to leverage the full capabilities of RDNA 2 in hardware from day one. Through close collaboration and partnership between Xbox and AMD, not only have we delivered on this promise, we have gone even further introducing additional next-generation innovation such as hardware accelerated Machine Learning capabilities for better NPC intelligence, more lifelike animation, and improved visual quality via techniques such as ML powered super resolution.
You have zero ground to stand on. You talk about the future for nVidia but completely ignore AMD's near future solutions, which obviously already exist but simply have not been revealed. You're here for only one thing; to downplay AMD as much as possible. I hope to God nVidia is paying you, because otherwise it's just pathetic.
Epic Sax CEO
Banned
The way Microsoft talked at HotChips they added silicon of their own making for the ML acceleration.
AMD, at least for now, will do Image Upscale using the native 4bit and 8bit capabilities of the CUs, without additional hardware.
It's all just a question of software anyway.
AMD, at least for now, will do Image Upscale using the native 4bit and 8bit capabilities of the CUs, without additional hardware.
It's all just a question of software anyway.
Pagusas
Elden Member
So the CU's will be handling RT, Upscaling, shading and all other graphical duties... That'll directly effect baseline performance and is exactly why nvidia (and it seems like MS) added additional hardware to handle those task. I think thats the problem with AMD's approach, those CU's cant be used for all 3 things at once, and having everything on is going to take a hit.
DonJuanSchlong
Banned
Sad part is you lack common sense and intelligence, because I was rocking AMD at that time. As matter a fact, I've had more AMD gpu's than I've owned from Nvidia! Who would have guessed?! Stop running from the fact that AMD just cannot compete with Nvidia in raytracing and DLSS, which is what several people have been saying. What I, or others choose to spend our money on, is none of your concern. Once you finally understand that, you can possibly lower your sodium levels.
Also we're talking about here and now, not sometime in the past. There wasn't gpus that could do realtime raytracing nor DLSS back in dx11 days. I'm pretty sure you knew that, but then again, maybe you didn't?
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Ascend
Member
It's a two way street. Having dedicated units means having idle die space for anything that does not use it. Having all in one units means the different tasks can 'fight' each other when all of them are enabled.
But there is a reason we went from having separate vertex and pixel shaders to unified shaders. In the long term, I think a unified compute unit is more versatile, although harder to optimize.
REALLY?? Why did it take you like 4 times before you answered that question? And tell me, which card was that? Or are you going to google now to find out which cards were the ones that did have DX12 while nVidia didn't?
Running? We have no ray tracing benchmarks. There is no basis to say that nVidia's RT is better. So don't pretend you're being rational. To be fair, I do expect AMD to do worse here, but by how much and whether it really matters is another story. Also... Competing =/= winning. The 5700XT was a viable competitor to the RTX 2070(S) (in spite of your dissatisfaction, I'm sure), despite it not winning. YOu don't always have to win to be competitive. Look at 1st gen and 2nd gen Ryzen. Technically they weren't really winning against Intel, and yet they competed well enough that many people bought Ryzen.
As for DLSS, I'll simply quote what I already said;
It ultimately is. It is the fault of people spending blindly, that the RTX 3090 is $1500, and that the 6900XT is $999.
If you claim to be objective and consistent, your past choices should be in line with your current claims. If they're not, you're full of
.And just like that, we're back to dismissing AMD's technological advantages at any given point in time...
Allnamestakenlol
Member
That's not true at all. The British also like to mate with their friends.
DonJuanSchlong
Banned
To end your entire silly argument, I have a tendency to flip flop between whatever gives me the best performance. I had Intel, and went AMD on processor. You don't hear me talk negatively about about ryzen, because they have done great in that area. Used to have AMD gpus like the 7970, 280x, 390, and 390x, then went full on Nvidia ever since then with 1080, 1080 ti, now the 2080 ti, and eventually the 3090. AMD doesn't offer an upgrade to me right now for the things that matter. If they did, guess what, I would be buying one. Unlike you, I don't need to bend over for one single company, and shill for them. Right now, and for some time, Nvidia just has the better performance. Nothing is wrong with that, and it's good that AMD is doing much better than their last couple of generations of GPU releases.It's a two way street. Having dedicated units means having idle die space for anything that does not use it. Having all in one units means the different tasks can 'fight' each other when all of them are enabled.
But there is a reason we went from having separate vertex and pixel shaders to unified shaders. In the long term, I think a unified compute unit is more versatile, although harder to optimize.
REALLY?? Why did it take you like 4 times before you answered that question? And tell me, which card was that? Or are you going to google now to find out which cards were the ones that did have DX12 while nVidia didn't?
Running? We have no ray tracing benchmarks. There is no basis to say that nVidia's RT is better. So don't pretend you're being rational. To be fair, I do expect AMD to do worse here, but by how much and whether it really matters is another story. Also... Competing =/= winning. The 5700XT was a viable competitor to the RTX 2070(S) (in spite of your dissatisfaction, I'm sure), despite it not winning. YOu don't always have to win to be competitive. Look at 1st gen and 2nd gen Ryzen. Technically they weren't really winning against Intel, and yet they competed well enough that many people bought Ryzen.
As for DLSS, I'll simply quote what I already said;
It ultimately is. It is the fault of people spending blindly, that the RTX 3090 is $1500, and that the 6900XT is $999.
If you claim to be objective and consistent, your past choices should be in line with your current claims. If they're not, you're full of
And just like that, we're back to dismissing AMD's technological advantages at any given point in time...
GymWolf
Member
They were not using mate as "meeting", don't try to use logic with me and stay away from my indignation please.
Ascend
Member
7970 -> 280X Extremely stupid 'upgrade' (it's actually a downgrade)
290 -> 390x Stupid 'upgrade'
1080 -> 1080 Ti Stupid 'upgrade'
1080 Ti -> 2080 Ti Extremely Stupid 'upgrade'
2080 Ti -> 3090 Ok upgrade
Yeah. I still think you're full of it. I'm starting to wonder if you ever even owned a graphics card. Oh well.
For some time, yes. Right now, no.
DonJuanSchlong
Banned
Do you know why I went from the 7970 to 280x? Because it died and I bought my buddies 280x for the mean time. But you already knew that right? Why are you so salty over what people do with their money? Its really stupid to judge what others do with their money. You might think it's stupid for you to do because you cannot afford it or other reasons, but who am I to judge your decisions? I think it's stupid to go AMD right now after owning and experiencing what raytracing and DLSS can offer. But you do you boo boo.
Should we just open up a GoFundMe for
Ascend
, so he can afford nice things in life, since he hates what other ppl do with their money. That's called pocket watching. Its a no-no where I'm from. It wreaks of insecurity. Get a grip.
GymWolf
Member
I mean, you can sell your previous hardware to soft the blow.
I always switched gpu when the performance were not enough, it's kinda what make pc special compared to fixed hardware on console.
DonJuanSchlong
Banned
I always hand down my gpu's to my buddies for huge discounted prices. I don't like selling stuff online or to strangers. My friends know that I take great care of my stuff and they get a good deal. It would end up just sitting in my room on a shelf otherwise. I have so many 18" subwoofers and various other drivers and amplifiers that I just never got around to getting rid of because of that.
GymWolf
Member
Same, my cousin and my only friend who play (pirate) on pc are the only people who get my hardware, i'm far too lazy to waste time with strangers.
Thanks to them i can upgrade every 2 years or so without crying blood tears...
They are already fighting to get my 2070super and my 8600k next
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Mister Wolf
Gold Member
Is it going to be another sharpening filter?
Ascend
Member
Ah. So it's not always the best of the best, which was basically already confirmed considering your GPU history, but, whatever.
I want people to be conscious consumers, not blind trend followers. There are smart ways to use money, and dumb ways to use money. And when the dumb ways is done by enough people, it influences the market as a whole. So I have every right to judge.
And, in reality, it's not stupid to judge what others do with their money; everybody does. If someone won the lottery and then went to gamble away all of it, it's perfectly fine to judge the action as a stupid action, wouldn't you say? The same applies to getting an RTX 3090. And also the 6900XT for that matter, although the latter is less stupid than the former in multiple ways.
That's fair enough I guess. FYI I can afford any of these cards, but I choose not to spend so much money on graphics cards.
I am actually worried about your stupid decisions affecting my own future pocket. But I guess that isn't as simple to understand as getting the latest dopamine rush with the newest shiniest non-essential product.
And I have no problem with that. But with the examples above, there were multiple side-grades. I personally upgrade every 4-5 years, which is likely longer than most people here.
Yeah this unfortunately doesn't stack up to what NVIDIA delivers.
DonJuanSchlong
Banned
Do you also get mad at people who buy high end cars, audio equipment, phones, etc? They aren't needed, but people love them. I just don't like when people have dumb opinions on what others do with their money. Who cares if someone updates their computer whenever they feel like it? It doesn't hurt you who only upgrades every 5 years, so why are you so angry that I'm choosing Nvidia over AMD again this time? I'm not sure what the infatuation you have with me on what I decide to do in my life and my money.
Its like you are constantly trying to prove me wrong, and utterly fail every single time. Even going so far to try and dissect everything I say to try and use against me, but fall flat on your face, every single time. Let it go already. Maybe I'll pair my AMD processor with an AMD GPU in the future if they can finally offer competition on the things that matter going into the next gen.
Also, you should probably put me on ignore, since it can't be that healthy to be that salty in life.
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AquaticSquirrel
Member
DonJuanSchlong
Ascend
can we all just chill please?You guys have been at each other's throats across a few threads now but especially escalating in this thread.
While this thread itself is not particularly worthwhile (we all know why it was created afterall), I think it is wise to chill out a bit.
I'll save you both some time:
DonJuanSchlong
prefers Nvidia, has his reasons and will buy 3000 series,
Ascend
prefers AMD, has his reasons and will buy a 6000 series card. Now let's get back to what this thread is really about: Judging
BluRayHiDef
's taste in films, Batman V Superman? Why you gotta do that to yourself bro?
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PhoenixTank
Member
GymWolf
Member
i guess that if you buy the top tier gpu of a series you don't need to upgrade every 2 years like me that i buy usually the 70 series from nvidia, but even with that in mind, i play on pc to have almost no compromises, if a gpu it's just not enough to do 1080p high\ultra details before, 1440p60 high\ultra details now and 4k60 high details in the future, then there is no reason for me to not buy a new gpu, especially when i can soft the blow by selling my current hardware.
I'm not gonna police how people spend their money if gaming is their major hobby and they don't starve their children to buy these things.
(not talking specifically about you dude)
to return on topic, these discussion are the worst for me that i still have to decide between amd and nvidia at the moment
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llien
Member
Nothing can "stack up" when one lives in a bubble, where TAA derivative upscaling gives results "on par or better than" 4k.
Ascend
Member
My advice; Don't let anyone influence your decisions. Inform yourself as much as possible and make your decision based on that. And be careful of marketing, both direct and indirect.to return on topic, these discussion are the worst for me that i still have to decide between amd and nvidia at the moment