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At the box office: The Avengers vs The Dark Knight Rises
- Thread starter shinobi602
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SonicMegaDrive
Member
Yeah, the reviews aren't really 'mixed'. They're pretty overwhelmingly positive. Close to 9/10ths of the reviews are good.
ViewtifulJC
Banned
It wasn't gonna beat Avengers anyway, but like one of the many, many shitty things to come out of this tragedy is that now we'll never know. That's always that feeling of doubt, that what-if that scared off enough people.
XiaNaphryz
LATIN, MATRIPEDICABUS, DO YOU SPEAK IT
Assuming Deadline is correct in that this weekend will be +37% over last year, its definitely fair to think it had an effect:
It could mean people are choosing not to watch TDKR despite the higher YOY attendance numbers.
DH1 midnight gross was 39% of its opening day gross
DH2 midnight gross was 47% of its opening day gross
Eclipse midnight gross was 44% of its opening day gross
BD1 midnight gross was 42% of its opening day gross
TDK midnight gross was 26% of its opening day gross
If the $75M OD is accurate, that would put TDKR midnight gross at 40% of its opening day gross. That is on the same level as Potter and Twilight (notorious for being front loaded). Somewhere in the 32%-35% would a fair increase from the TDK but more than that leads me to believe there was a unusual decrease in demand after midnight.
TheDrowningMan
Member
Yep. Same reason 9/11 impacted flying; fear of falling victim to a similar attack. Now, the fall of the World Trade Center affected air ticket sales for several years, whereas this is unlikely to have such lasting power. It will, however, cost The Dark Knight Rises and several other films tens of millions of dollars.
Measuring impact of a freakish event like Aurora on movie box office will be nigh impossible.
But you can measure the impact of 3D ticket prices, and a 30-40% markup is enormous, especially when the exhibitors did everything they could to push 3D on opening weekend for Avengers.
At my local theater, where they had Avengers on 4 or 5 screens first weekend, only one of them was 2D. So for about 16 out of 20 showings every day, every single customer was automatically paying a few dollars more than every single customer who is paying to see TDKR this weekend.
So while TDKR was always going to have a great box office, it had NO chance of catching the Avengers record without 3D and with a significantly longer run time.
And as far as worldwide, forget that too. Batman is much more of an American phenomenon. Foreign box office only made up somewhere like less than half of TDK worldwide b.o., compared against movies like Avengers or Harry Potter or LOTR where foreign is like two-thirds or three-quarters.
But you can measure the impact of 3D ticket prices, and a 30-40% markup is enormous, especially when the exhibitors did everything they could to push 3D on opening weekend for Avengers.
At my local theater, where they had Avengers on 4 or 5 screens first weekend, only one of them was 2D. So for about 16 out of 20 showings every day, every single customer was automatically paying a few dollars more than every single customer who is paying to see TDKR this weekend.
So while TDKR was always going to have a great box office, it had NO chance of catching the Avengers record without 3D and with a significantly longer run time.
And as far as worldwide, forget that too. Batman is much more of an American phenomenon. Foreign box office only made up somewhere like less than half of TDK worldwide b.o., compared against movies like Avengers or Harry Potter or LOTR where foreign is like two-thirds or three-quarters.
XiaNaphryz
LATIN, MATRIPEDICABUS, DO YOU SPEAK IT
Yeah, this was covered earlier. Around 52% of Avengers went to 3D showings on its domestic OW, so that would be around a 15-20% markup overall.
Of course it had some effect but How much is another matter. As soon as the midnight number was released we knew it wasn't going to surpass avengers for opening weekend and the midnight numbers weren't "tainted".
Actually surprised it wasn't higher than the 52%, based on my completely anecdotal and small sample data set.
I'm always fascinated by the lack of foreign appeal for Batman. The list of movies that top TDK internationally is pretty astounding in some spots. I guess the character is just seen as too dark in the international market?
RBelong2Us
Member
After tracking had the film at 180-200 and midnight numbers hit 30m it seems safe to say that the tragedy had an impact on opening day but i do think all that does is make the film less frontloaded.
It could sell more tickets and still not top TA OW gross.
Colonel Nasty
Member
Im kind of suprised it wont take the OW number after the sheer amount of people at my midnight screen. I dont think the long run numbers will be TDK levels because of word of mouth. Of the people in my group only the "real" Batman fans enjoyed it. The rest either didnt like it or said "not as good as TDK."
It would have to sell a massive amounts of tickets to take the OW record. I predicted that it would (trying to start a box office discussion in the |OT|) but it was always going to be difficult. I believe the time where a 2D only film captures the OW record is over. The Avengers sequel will probably set a new standard and Avatar 2 will blow away whatever is set.
Thunder Monkey
Banned
HAhaha!
Dude that is freaking hilarious!
...
I just bought the series DVD two weeks ago.
Guys... thinking it had little if any impact is different than thinking it had no impact.
I'm sure it effected ticket sales in the immediate area. I doubt it did nation wide.
Regardless though. How is a $180 million OW bad?
Pretty sure they have CONFIRMED no numbers until Monday.
Good Job Bob
Member
Schweinehund
Member
I enjoyed DKR more but the pacing wasn't as good as avengers, the later half of the movie is where it picks up.
For me, I think TDK > DKR >>>> Begins = Avengers
The humor and quality of writing surpassed avengers by a ton. The whedon one liners got obnoxious about halfway through the movie.
For me, I think TDK > DKR >>>> Begins = Avengers
The humor and quality of writing surpassed avengers by a ton. The whedon one liners got obnoxious about halfway through the movie.
The Technomancer
card-carrying scientician
What? One of my problems with TDK and DKR is that none of them have any sense of humor at all. You're lucky if you get one three line exchange in which someone says something funny, and I don't really like movies that are just two hours of grimdark serious gritty action.
Also when you say writing do you mean dialogue or plot?
I also concour. During the Avengers, the audience erupted in laughter throughout the film, while in DKR there was hardly any reaction at all.
Thunder Monkey
Banned
Well I know I don't have an ulterior motive as I like the Nolan series and Avengers.
And ignorant? Nah. Equivocating a single shooting to the largest attack this country has seen on our shores in over 60 years definitely seems much more ignorant. Shootings occur every day. And I doubt that a shooting is going to seriously hamper American consumerism.
No matter how much the media plays it up.
I have faith in the American people to ignore what could, in a statistically insignificant way, kill them to feed their wants.
*chortle*
Good grief.
Back to ye' basement.
Thank you. THIS. People still want to see this film..., just perhaps not right away owing to the general feeling among some movie goers after the horrific shooting.
Thunder Monkey
Banned
Schweinehund
Member
Both
Marked DKR Spoilers, if you don't want them in the thread please say so and I'll edit.
Almost all the exchanges between Selena and Bruce are charming. There isn't that much humor when he's the bat but bruce is extremely well played. Gordon and Blake also had some good exchanges. Throughout the series Alfred and Bruce have had excellent dialogue.
I thought the plot was good as well. Bane breaking batman's back and spirit was genius. Batman having to climb out of the pit to escape his depression and regain his spirit that originally drove him was clever. The whole talia/bane/raj backstory was very well written and made the film feel like the second part of batman begins. The icing on the cake was alfred's florence scene, that shows batman has moved on to a new life. Blake's transformation into Robin also felt natural and not forced.
My only complaint about the story is why did bane or talia feel the need to stick around when the bomb was going to go off? It seems like they were almost psychotic, Raj intended to destroy Gotham, not to be destroyed with it.
I thought the plot was good as well. Bane breaking batman's back and spirit was genius. Batman having to climb out of the pit to escape his depression and regain his spirit that originally drove him was clever. The whole talia/bane/raj backstory was very well written and made the film feel like the second part of batman begins. The icing on the cake was alfred's florence scene, that shows batman has moved on to a new life. Blake's transformation into Robin also felt natural and not forced.
My only complaint about the story is why did bane or talia feel the need to stick around when the bomb was going to go off? It seems like they were almost psychotic, Raj intended to destroy Gotham, not to be destroyed with it.
Starsunder
Member
Thanks you. I thought I was the only one scratching my head.
Thunder Monkey
Banned
I couldn't stop myself from laughing every time BaleBats opened his mouth in TDK.
People that are not blind fanboys. I've had a few friends say it sucked and half the movie is mumbling.
Messofanego
Banned
What? Me and the rest of the people in our screening laughed at all the comebacks and jokes, there was quite a bit of humor in the first half especially between Selina and Bruce.
"
So that's how that feels like
ZeroGravity
Member
I generally don't get too invested in these box office wars, but I am genuinely happy that it seems like Avengers will come out on top between these two movies. I've never liked Nolan's interpretation of Batman and TDKR was no exception. Following TDK, there were so many people claiming that it "advanced" or "legitimized" comic book movies and somehow pushed them forward into a greater public and cinematic acceptance...
...and then The Avengers comes along, perfectly walks the line between being seriousness and cheesiness, embraces its source material and doesn't shy away from what it is, and was one of the most entertaining and fun experiences I've ever had with a movie, and then goes on to become the most successful comic book movie of all-time, a position it will likely retain for some time. It really showed that you don't need to reinvent the wheel and try to ground these fantastical stories into some kind of dark and gritty realism to make them appeal to people.
...and then The Avengers comes along, perfectly walks the line between being seriousness and cheesiness, embraces its source material and doesn't shy away from what it is, and was one of the most entertaining and fun experiences I've ever had with a movie, and then goes on to become the most successful comic book movie of all-time, a position it will likely retain for some time. It really showed that you don't need to reinvent the wheel and try to ground these fantastical stories into some kind of dark and gritty realism to make them appeal to people.
Ninja Scooter
Member
More people will go to see TDKR than went to see Avengers OW, so I'm not so sure how much it "won" because the tickets were a few dollars more. It doesn't really say anything one way or the other.
Escape Goat
Member
You make it sound like it was a comedy. haha. The funniest thing was the police dude's hat being blown off and his stunned look that Nolan felt he needed to capture for a full 5 seconds.
Thunder Monkey
Banned
I can completely understand wanting to know the numbers. I enjoyed watching numbers and units come in on videogames. Numbers can be a lot of fun. I just don't get the motives of those using them against one another.
But hell loyalty was never my thing. I was a Genesis, SNES, and PC owner. I read Marvel, DC, Image, Mirage, and Archie. And enjoyed it all because of different reasons. I've never had a football team, but players and coaches with certain styles I watched.
So that might be part of it. I don't see it as TDKR vs Avengers. I see the potential for two comic book movies to make well over a billion dollars worldwide in the same year. And more than likely both are the best of their types we've seen yet. (haven't seen TDKR yet)
TDKR will need to be in the 180-185M range to safely be ahead of Avengers in tickets. About half of the Avengers showing were in 3D, and the average premium on 3D tickets is about 30%. My estimate for Avengers minus 3D premium would be 170-175M. If TDKR opens in that range, then both movies sold more or less the same number of tickets. IMAX complicates things a little bit, but I would suspect that TDKR will beat Avengers in opening weekend IMAX Box Office anyhow.
I'm personally much more aggravated by films that are clearly hokey and puerile but which take themselves seriously than I am by hokey, puerile movies that unabashedly admit their status.
Thunder Monkey
Banned
Always loved your style man.
Count Dookkake
Member
Right, let's make more movies like Batman and Robin.
I had no idea dark and gritty realism sold movies.
QuiteWhittle
Member
A film based on Grant Morrison's Batman and Robin would be pretty sweet, tbh.
We almost did not go see the movie on opening day because of the tragedy. Not because we were scared of copy cat killers, but because it just felt a little dirty and the whole event was such a downer that I did not want it to ruin my first experience of the film. We ended up going, but I can see how a lot of people could have been turned off.
XiaNaphryz
LATIN, MATRIPEDICABUS, DO YOU SPEAK IT
They release tickets sold info as well right? This should be easy to track when the final numbers are out.
Good Job Bob
Member
I'm fine with any tone the director wants to set the movie in, so long as it's consistent and executed well -- both Avengers and the previous Nolan Batman films (haven't seen TDKR yet) have succeeded in this.
I just wish that Avengers had more, or any at all, emotional resonance. Taking the lighthearted approach doesn't preclude emotional resonance, the first two Sam Raimi SM films had plenty of emotion while still being lighthearted and fun.
I just wish that Avengers had more, or any at all, emotional resonance. Taking the lighthearted approach doesn't preclude emotional resonance, the first two Sam Raimi SM films had plenty of emotion while still being lighthearted and fun.
IMO Begins to Rises to DKR . DKR was the weakest of the three.
Yoda
Member
The shooting defiantly will impact OW sales. Over-protective mom's will not let their kids see the movie so soon after the mass murder, as it is a PG-13 movie... that means less ticket sales. I'd be surprised if this movie doesn't still outsell the avengers overall, despite it lacking the inflated 3-D ticket prices the avengers enjoyed.
Colonel Nasty
Member
I really hate the 3d argument. Yes, it definitely adds to the overall but if Batman comes in 180 and the Avengers was 207 isn't that extra 27 more than the 3d tax? Even assuming every Avengers ticket was 3d and every TDKR was 2d (not counting IMAX).
I hope this means you like Batman and Robin.
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