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[SniperHunter]

wow this CEO makes an interesting point. Square Soft was ballsy before they merged with Enix, after the merger they lost the balls and started playing it safe...

now Enix just whores DQ and Square is stuck milking FF13. The merger was a failure for sure

 

[TacticalFox88]

Pretty much every game that had this logo was good. Pretty much every game that had the new logo was bad or unremarkable.

Considering this is the best mainline FF game....yeah no.

 

[Toth]

People think Versus is the worst thing that SE is doing right now. I think it's investing all your resources on FFXIV.

I don't know about that. buzz for 14 is pretty strong at the moment. It may turn out to be a very profitable decision.

 

[BocoDragon]

Considering this is the best mainline FF game....yeah no.

That's probably the anomaly of the Square Enix era.

Although it started development before the merger and in fact, the Square Enix host didn't take to the Matsuno organ and rejected it!

 

[TreasureHunterG]

Completely agree. Specially if he's talking about the old SquareSoft who completely lost it's identity after the merger. It wasn't a merger, was a assimilation by Enix.

 

[Glass Rebel]

That's probably the anomaly of the Square Enix era.

Although it started development before the merger and in fact, the Square Enix host didn't take to the Matsuno organ and rejected it!

wada injected cancer into his eye

get it right man

 

[Beth Cyra]

That's probably the anomaly of the Square Enix era.

Although it started development before the merger and in fact, the Square Enix host didn't take to the Matsuno organ and rejected it!

Are we sure this was Wada?

Given how early the switch was pulled for Vaan, could it have been someone else? Also was it the President or just someone/producer that came down on Matsuno? Have we ever got concrete info on this?

 

[H_Prestige]

Considering this is the best mainline FF game....yeah no.

The exception makes the rule.

 

[vocab]

It took almost two gens to realize that?

Japan lagging behind everything as usual.

 

[lunchwithyuzo]

NieR was made by Cavia(published by SE) which is now defunct and the main guy who directed Drakengard and NieR faded within SE or retired.

It was produced by an Enix guy. A lot of SE games have been in fact, way more than just DQ and the tri-Ace stuff.

 

[cosmicblizzard]

Considering this is the best mainline FF game....yeah no.

While I consider XII the worst one, it's essentially a Squaresoft game. If anything, the merger only crippled it. Of course, that's merely an assumption, as I have no idea just what lead to Matsuno's decline. I doubt the merger helped though.

 

[Chuck Norris]

Wasn't there no other way for Square? Maybe they shouldn't have bankrupted themselves.

Correct me if I'm wrong but I believe Sony was an interested buyer

Hard to say what that would have meant though. Would Sakaguchi have stuck around for example?

Probably would have left Sony in a much better place in Japan though

 

[Zekes!]

http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20070513192351/finalfantasy/images/7/7f/XII_NAfront.jpg

Considering this is the best mainline FF game....yeah no.

you're a good guy

 

[H_Prestige]

While I consider XII the worst one, it's essentially a Squaresoft game. If anything, the merger only crippled it. Of course, that's merely an assumption, as I have no idea just what lead to Matsuno's decline. I doubt the merger helped though.

Yup. FFXIII is the first FF conceived under the square enix regime.

 

[Trojita]

Considering this is the best mainline FF game....yeah no.

Yeah no. No game with Vaan as the main character is the best of anything.

 

[Aeana]

That's probably the anomaly of the Square Enix era.

Although it started development before the merger and in fact, the Square Enix host didn't take to the Matsuno organ and rejected it!

Am I misunderstanding? You are claiming that FF12 is the only decent game with the Square Enix logo? Is there some other constraint like "of the internally developed games" or something else?

 

[cosmicblizzard]

Yup. FFXIII is the first FF conceived under the square enix regime.

It also probably would have gotten out A LOT earlier. Assumptions again, but I don't think it's too outlandish.

It really is funny how a single movie can ruin everything.

 

[Risette]

Without Enix, would the Fantasy have been Final? Weren't they in danger?

Not sure what the heck people are talking about saying the merger was a no-choice situation for Square, or that Suzuki ran the company into the ground. Neither are remotely true. In fact, the merger was supposed to happen even earlier than it did, but it was the fiscal impact of the Final Fantasy film that made Enix hold off til 2003.

The continued success of the EA and Square ventures in the US and Japan (I'm going back to the PSone here) and the capital infusion from Sony was more than enough to get Square back on track after the film (look it up if you don't believe me, they were back in the black by FY2002).

Suzuki is completely right, the merger was an asinine idea headed up and orchestrated by completely incompetent idiots, notably Tweedle Dee and Tweedle Dum at Enix, Fukushima and Honda, and of course, Wada.

Enix desperately wanted to piggy back Square for US penetration, Wada was an absolute idiot who despised Sakaguchi and was terrified of the backlash from the film, and together they instituted horrendous development reforms and linear focused brand reliances that were so laughably short sighted it amazes me these men have jobs.

Nothing else is more responsible for the state of this company than that damn merger.

.

 

[Izick]

couldnt agree more

.

 

[FlutterPuffs]

Yeah no. No game with Vaan as the main character is the best of anything.

He wasn't the main character. So it's the best RPG on the PS2.

 

[Gentleman Jack]

He wasn't the main character. So it's the best RPG on the PS2.

It's like you're ringing the dinner bell of every Nocturne fan on the board...

 

[Beth Cyra]

It's like you're ringing the dinner bell of every Nocturne fan on the board...

Not like SMT3 or Persona 4 fans really need to be provoked to scream about how great they are.

 

[lunchwithyuzo]

That is why he began making moves to join with Enix, who was at the time a less productive version of what Atlus is today. Instead of having a healthy stable of in-house teams along with some smartly chosen subs like Atlus they had almost no in house development staff and relied entirely on subs. Both are heavily tied to the success of their cornerstone JRPG franchise, Dragon Quest and MegaTen/Persona respectively. Atlus has done what Enix has failed at for decades on two counts by making MegaTen/Persona a successful brand globally and by splitting MegaTen into a multi-pronged IP with titles like Nocturne under the MegaTen name directly, the Persona franchise, and other spin offs that have had solid market success (Digital Devil Saga) and strong legs on re-releases (Devil Summoner, Devil Survivor). The notion behind this being that by consolidating the two major players in the then very popular JRPG genre they would have all the muscle needed to gobble up market share and other smaller publishers.

Uh, Enix wasn't really anything like Atlus, that's an awful comparison. They were a pure publisher and additionally had a pretty successful print publishing business (which was part of the reason Square wanted to merge). I'd also argue Enix had a far more diverse lineup than Atlus, there was so much more to them than just DQ back in the day (Door Door, Portopia, Jesus, Just Breed, Itadaki Street, Actraiser, Soulblazer, EVO, Seventh Saga, Brain Lord, Wonder Project J, Violinist of Hamlin, Mystic Ark, Star Ocean, Mischief Makers, Bust-A-Groove, Valkyrie Profile, Robot Alchemic Drive, Grandia, etc, etc).

DQ hasn't been milked nearly as hard as Megaten either, and it's actually managed much higher western sales (including two million sellers under it's belt, something no Megaten has managed worldwide afaik). You're really way off here.

 

[ohlawd]

Yeah no. No game with Vaan as the main character is the best of anything.

Step yo' game up. Balthier's the leading man.

 

[markot]

Square is rubbish >.< they seem to spend their time making engines now...

Thier games are shit. Enix and Eidos are the only parts of the company that work.

Also, DQX is a hit, FF14 was a massive turd pile of shit after being hyped by the company as a wow killer.

 

[JaseC]

Considering this is the best mainline FF game....yeah no.

He did say "pretty much", so posting a single counter-example is just proving his point.

 

[UberTag]

Despite the fact that The Spirits Within was an unquestioned financial disaster, I still consider it to be a better movie than Advent Children.

 

[Esura]

Despite the fact that The Spirits Within was an unquestioned financial disaster, I still consider it to be a better movie than Advent Children.

I remember being highly pissed off when I was younger that there was no FF character in the movie or any sword fights. Advent Children is what I wanted SW to be lol.

 

[Aeana]

Pretty much every game that had this logo was good. Pretty much every game that had the new logo was bad or unremarkable.

He did say "pretty much", so posting a single counter-example is just proving his point.

So you guys are claiming that nobody likes FF10-2, Crystal Chronicles, DQ8, KH2, KH Chain of Memories, Radiata Stories, Rocket Slime, Romancing SaGa: Minstrel Song, Grandia 3, Front Mission 5, Valkyrie Profile 2, Crisis Core, Dragon Quest Swords, The Last Remnant, The World Ends with You, DQ9, 4 Warriors of Light, Nier, and so on? Huh.

 

[JaseC]

So you guys are claiming that nobody likes FF10-2, Crystal Chronicles, DQ8, KH2, KH Chain of Memories, Radiata Stories, Rocket Slime, Romancing SaGa: Minstrel Song, Grandia 3, Front Mission 5, Valkyrie Profile 2, Crisis Core, Dragon Quest Swords, The Last Remnant, The World Ends with You, DQ9, 4 Warriors of Light, Nier, and so on? Huh.

What? I haven't claimed anything. Poking a little lighthearted fun at somebody using a single game to debate the opinion that "pretty much every Squeenix game is bad or unremarkable" is not the same as championing it.

 

[Esura]

So you guys are claiming that nobody likes FF10-2, Crystal Chronicles, DQ8, KH2, KH Chain of Memories, Radiata Stories, Rocket Slime, Romancing SaGa: Minstrel Song, Grandia 3, Front Mission 5, Valkyrie Profile 2, Crisis Core, Dragon Quest Swords, The Last Remnant, The World Ends with You, DQ9, 4 Warriors of Light, Nier, and so on? Huh.

All the bolded I played and really enjoyed. Many of the non bolded I haven't played. I need to play more games....

 

[Glass Rebel]

Man, The Last Remnant PC is so good.

Also Aeana reminded me that my copy of 4 Warriors of Light still hasn't arrived. I've been waiting for weeks ffs.

 

[BocoDragon]

Am I misunderstanding? You are claiming that FF12 is the only decent game with the Square Enix logo? Is there some other constraint like "of the internally developed games" or something else?

I said it was an anomaly for the Square Enix era. Everything else is predictable for the company: another KH, another DQ, another Nomura game with a shounen vibe.

XII was the only release of the merged company's history that suggested to me a different direction ... If people groan at Square Enix's predictable nature, and they do often, they probably aren't talking about XII.

 

[scytheavatar]

The merger has been a complete failure. For Enix. Their future would have been a lot brighter ATM if they didn't have the FF deadweights pulling them down.

 

[Zekes!]

I like 4 Heroes of Light more than most of the mainline FF series

 

[idlethreats]

So you guys are claiming that nobody likes FF10-2, Crystal Chronicles, DQ8, KH2, KH Chain of Memories, Radiata Stories, Rocket Slime, Romancing SaGa: Minstrel Song, Grandia 3, Front Mission 5, Valkyrie Profile 2, Crisis Core, Dragon Quest Swords, The Last Remnant, The World Ends with You, DQ9, 4 Warriors of Light, Nier, and so on? Huh.

Threads about SQEX always bring out the most reasonable of opinions.

 

[LiquidMetal14]

Company has been so down from the Japanese end and they are damn lucky they have some good western talent to hold them up.

 

[Trojita]

He wasn't the main character. So it's the best RPG on the PS2.

Step yo' game up. Balthier's the leading man.

Tell that to Square-Enix and reality.

 

[Bladenic]

So you guys are claiming that nobody likes FF10-2, Crystal Chronicles, DQ8, KH2, KH Chain of Memories, Radiata Stories, Rocket Slime, Romancing SaGa: Minstrel Song, Grandia 3, Front Mission 5, Valkyrie Profile 2, Crisis Core, Dragon Quest Swords, The Last Remnant, The World Ends with You, DQ9, 4 Warriors of Light, Nier, and so on? Huh.

I laughed at the omission of FFXIII and its highly regarded sequel.

 

[DJIzana]

Tell that to Square-Enix and reality.

I think even Square Enix realized this later on... when they added him as a character in PSP version of Final Fantasy Tactics.

 

[MagiusNecros]

Basch was supposed to be the main character, and old concepts placed Vaan and Ashe as two potential successors to the Rabanastre throne, but that was scrapped.

 

[Blood Diamonds]

It's been a long time, but I agree.

 

[Aeana]

I laughed at the omission of FFXIII and its highly regarded sequel.

I guess that makes the whole list invalid, huh.

 

[TunaLover]

Maybe a total failure for Enix.

Was to post this.

 

[Beth Cyra]

I think even Square Enix realized this later on... when they added him as a character in PSP version of Final Fantasy Tactics.

Square has always and will always view Vaan as the lead character.

It's the reason that he is in Dissiida, the cover art for XII's 25Th Re Art, as well as first character Amano ever did for XII.

Not towards you, but the Vaan not being lead is old and boring now. Yes he wasn't early on, however the sheer length of time he was and the fact we never even saw the game before he was the lead makes the arguements dumb.

Just because he isn't the story center doesn't mean he isn't the MC of the game.

 

[Levyne]

How many of those are internally developed? (Curious, not trying to be coy)

 

[MagiusNecros]

XII:RW has more focus on Vaan.

 

[Beth Cyra]

XII:RW has more focus on Vaan.

Did some pretty cool stuff with his character to.

Storyline is certainly of a different style, but Vaan getting the Goddess Blade and even before that pimp slapping Balthier was awesome.

On top of all this Vaan in TA2 is flat out amazing.

 

[RSLAEV]

Step yo' game up. Balthier's the leading man.

He wasn't the main character. So it's the best RPG on the PS2.

This is a fan interpretation. This is not reality. Vaan is the main character. He is the turd in the punchbowl that has kept many people from finishing the game.

 

[Aeana]

How many of those are internally developed? (Curious, not trying to be coy)

About 7, doing a cursory glance. SE doesn't really do very many 100% internally developed games anymore, regardless. Even FF13-2 had outside help.