Since GCN, they've had a constant streak of using second screens in handheld and console market. I've said this in another thread, but Nintendo's best move would have been to release a Wii 2 with more advanced motion controls, same graphics as Wii U, and by avoiding an expensive tablet controller, you could charge $250 for the console.
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NPD January 2013 Sales Results [Up7: Wii U 57K (CNET), Vita ~35K, PS3 201K]
- Thread starter Nirolak
- Start date
Isn't that the truth? Iwata has been a disaster.
Davey Cakes
Member
I think they will sell better than the Wii U's starting numbers.
That said, I think people put too much into these systems "stealing the Wii U's thunder." If anything they'll be in their own market while Nintendo creates a bubble for the Wii U.
I'm thinking that a price cut, plus other incentives, plus a marketing turnaround and more in-demand software could make the Wii U quite appealing even among the hype of the other consoles.
In any case, it's not cut and dry. I do think Nintendo will improve the Wii U situation and I do think Orbis/Durango will be plenty successful. But that's all speculation.
Seeing how much people have been overreacting and flipping out over recent Orbis/Durango news (no used games, subscription service, no backward compatibility, always online, etc.), I could predict that these consoles will sell badly but just because GAF responds one way doesn't mean the entire market necessarily will. It'll be interesting to see how things play out.
Nintendo could certainly code a HD Wii emulator that runs significantly better than Dolphin. But you're right, getting things to run smooth on Wii U level hardware might be difficult still.
That's the thing though, Nintendo specifically made some hardware choices inside the Wii U for easier backwards compatibility. I think it would've been a better idea for them to go with a different architecture - possibly same as the PS4/next Xbox is using, and went the full emulation route. The CPU is what's hurting them - I think the GPU is capable enough to render Wii games in 720p.
Yamauchi still runs the show, his presence is felt even when he is not CEO. LoL
Does that necessarily mean that they will go the way of the dodo? I'm not sure. I think there could be some core audience who still doesn't mind them. The issue is that much of that type of audience is one Nintendo hasn't had as their focus in well over a decade. I don't think everyone feels the need to have an all-in-one phone gizamadooder for everything. Some do, sure, and that happens to be the casual audience Nintendo has attempted to cater to for the last few years. I don't see them vanishing, but never ever hitting the level of DS. At best, maybe between PSP and GBA levels of success. And that's not too bad, as long as the investment isn't a costly one for companies. It surely is an interesting thing to wonder about, though. Will they create a hybrid to compete with a shrinking console and portable market?
I'm sorry to break the trend of bad WiiU news, but if this is true... Holy fucking shit that's bad.
Yeah that target is getting revised down again. Great job with the reboot, guys.
Steve Youngblood
Member
If it is the 3DS all over again, that doesn't bode well for Iwata. If they have to follow the same "major pricedrop/free ambassador games/rush completion of big titles" playbook of the 3DS, I don't think that reflects very well on him.
It's funny that people keep bringing up the 3DS. Let's see, do I remember the 3DS launch? When Iwata had to cut his salary and cancel his bonus and promised the shareholders that he wouldn't screw up the next hardware launch? That 3DS launch?
This is pretty rough news for Nintendo...but I still think Iwata will keep his job. The 3DS is still kicking ass and with the killer launch line-up for it this year, this should be its best year yet.
NSMBU should be selling Wii U's left and right, but its not. And if that won't, Mario Kart isn't likely to turn many heads either. Nintendo absolutely needs to alter their marketing strategy, it needs to be aggressive, and really push that its a new fucking console.
It seems so simple...
NSMBU should be selling Wii U's left and right, but its not. And if that won't, Mario Kart isn't likely to turn many heads either. Nintendo absolutely needs to alter their marketing strategy, it needs to be aggressive, and really push that its a new fucking console.
It seems so simple...
MikeE21286
Member
Yep. As long as he's there Nintendo will stay out of the mobile/tablet ghetto.
walking fiend
Member
IF Wii was a bit modern, IF they had expanded drastically employing those who can work with new technology, then maybe it was better to come up with a more powerful hardware.
It is true that their 1st party teams couldn't catch up to be ready at launch, but at least they will be ready for the second year. But what do you think were chances of Nintendo getting 3rd party support even if its hardware was more powerful? Was that risk worth putting their 1st party teams even in more trouble?
I think they actually shouldn't have bothered even this much with 3rd parties, and should have pushed their games to clear up the slate. Who is gonna pay $350 to play a version of AC3 with maps on the Gamepad when he can get a 360 for ~$200?
That is what I expected to read; you really think there's any chance that he is let gone after how well 3DS is performing?
Yeah, they overestimated Mario; even in Japan Mario didn't do much for them, neither NSMB nor MK; however, it didn't mean that it wasn't possible to sell multimillioners on 3DS like t hey did on DS, they just needed the right game, with turned out to be Animal Crossing.
They need the right game and marketing for Wii U too.
What do you mean by this? Does he have a majority stake in Nintendo? Is he a major influence in the decisions made by Iwata?
3DS is not kicking ass. Unless you live in Japan. It has missed every single sales target Nintendo has set. Japan does not make up for the sales in Europe and America.
They could probably even go as low as $199 without the Gamepad. But yes, if I were in charge of Nintendo that would have been my strategy for sure.
Clear
CliffyB's Cock Holster
I actually think Vita's in a better position than Wii-U. Yeah, sales are low but at least there aren't two more powerful and better-supported by third-party competitors launching within the next 12 months!
The sad truth about Vita is that its not going to be replaced by something better. Which is why I've been so irritated by some of the triumphalism about its failure... if/when it gets discontinued who else is going to try and make a better handheld gaming device?
But, Nintendo fans shouldn't feel too down.
Wii-U might not be selling well... but objectively it WONT be discontinued, at least not until Nintendo have thrown all their biggest franchises at it. Which given their production rate will take several years (the length of an old console gen) to do.
Don't believe the hysteria. How many years were pundits like this Kevin Dent jackass prating about how dead PS3 was, only to have it basically tied with 360 globally as the generation ends. NPD's are not necessarily representative of a platforms fortunes world-wide, in fact they can actually be quite the contrary.
The sad truth about Vita is that its not going to be replaced by something better. Which is why I've been so irritated by some of the triumphalism about its failure... if/when it gets discontinued who else is going to try and make a better handheld gaming device?
But, Nintendo fans shouldn't feel too down.
Wii-U might not be selling well... but objectively it WONT be discontinued, at least not until Nintendo have thrown all their biggest franchises at it. Which given their production rate will take several years (the length of an old console gen) to do.
Don't believe the hysteria. How many years were pundits like this Kevin Dent jackass prating about how dead PS3 was, only to have it basically tied with 360 globally as the generation ends. NPD's are not necessarily representative of a platforms fortunes world-wide, in fact they can actually be quite the contrary.
jeremy1456
Junior Member
You're forgetting the part about how Nintendo had big guns coming and everyone discounted them saying that it would never come back, how it was doomed against the Vita, etc.
We all know how that turned out. I just feel bad they discontinued the system after a few months of sales figures. What a shame, it had a lot of potential.
Exactly. People aren't realizing it but the shit with 3DS' launch was probably strike two for him.
Nothing1016
Member
Soo if we take the Japanese sales and NA sales, then the Wii U sold around 110,000+ this January when you combine their largest markets. That is pathetic. Nintendo is gonna need at least a $75 price cut to their deluxe model by E3 at the latest. They are gonna have to drop HUGE bombs as well. Hopefully the relatively successful 3DS, even though it doesn't meet projections, will keep Nintendo profitable over the long run.
Nintendo is gonna have to pull an Xbox and make the Wii U a 4 year console. They can't afford to keep it alive for 7.
Nintendo is gonna have to pull an Xbox and make the Wii U a 4 year console. They can't afford to keep it alive for 7.
Pachterballs
Banned
vitas 35k vs wiiU's 55 ain't bad.
shinra-bansho
Member
These are not just "weak" sales.
If the sales were that low, Capcom is just as likely to just kill the entire franchise.
megabytecr
Member
Not doomed yet. Will wait for next christmas.
In any case Panic Nintendo (price drop, gamesss)
Uber Panic nintendo (they can drop the gamepad), throw a wii remote and wii u pro controller. Boom! $199
There are lots of things still they can do until uber Panic Nintendo, so not yet panicking although I have to confess I am worried.
Waiting for my Black Ops 2 copy, looking forward to playing in the shitter.
In any case Panic Nintendo (price drop, gamesss)
Uber Panic nintendo (they can drop the gamepad), throw a wii remote and wii u pro controller. Boom! $199
There are lots of things still they can do until uber Panic Nintendo, so not yet panicking although I have to confess I am worried.
Waiting for my Black Ops 2 copy, looking forward to playing in the shitter.
timetokill
Banned
Iwata isn't going anywhere anytime soon.
The last thing investors want in a period of volatility and unpredictability is to introduce even MORE unpredictability in there. The 3DS is doing quite well after a shaky start, and they will give Iwata time to try and pull the same trick twice with Wii U.
The last thing investors want in a period of volatility and unpredictability is to introduce even MORE unpredictability in there. The 3DS is doing quite well after a shaky start, and they will give Iwata time to try and pull the same trick twice with Wii U.
Far from it, outside of Japan the 3DS has been struggling. That said, things should get better for it.
i remember a thread on neogaf from about 10 years ago wondering if nintendo was creatively bankrupt. i didn't agree with it at the time, and i still don't think they were. but they are now.
there was a spark in the creation of the wii and the ds. touch handhelds hadn't ever really been done before- not for gaming, and not on such a grand scale. they threw in some other things too, but ran on the touch screen as the main selling point. and it worked. it worked because it sparked the imagination of people within nintendo. people who thought, why not a pet simulator? why not a collection of small brain exercises? these were demonstrations that were easy to understand, and probably weren't meant to become the 20m+ selling franchises they grew into. but the ideas came from a good place. they came from experimentation and imagination.
the same happened with the wii. yeah, motion control gaming had existed before this console, but no one ever gave it a serious shot on a grand scale. again, there was a spark of excitement and imagination. one rectangular device could mean so many different things: a sword, a bat, a tennis racket, a flashlight, a steering wheel, etc. it's a simple and appealing idea. to improve matters, it was seen as different from video games in the past. similar to how brain age was 'good for you', wii sports was also seen as good for you in that it got you up and moving around in your leisure time.
with the 3ds, they didn't have a good idea or a spark. they had messed around with 3d gaming a long time, but they never had the software to back it up. to this day, i'm left wondering why it was necessary, and the only answer i can come up with is that they were trying to bank on the 3d boom going on at the time. even during panic mode, they made no effort to showcase games that were not only obviously better with 3d, but were essentially impossible to replicate without it. their answer to its poor sales was to do what they did during the gamecube: lower the price, rush out some games, and rely on the tried and true above all else. to this day, there still isn't a breakout hit like nintendogs or brain age, and that rests entirely on the shoulders of the software manufacturers.
and finally there's the wii u. i think there's more you can do to promote the wii u than you could have with the 3ds. it's the same position though- nintendo took something that was popular, and slapped it on one of their systems hoping they could gain popularity through some sort of osmosis. again, no thought to actual software, or any spark of imagination. that's the deep, underlying problem with the console. nintendo doesn't really know what they have. this is outlined by their upcoming lineup and plan to save it through software like mario kart, mario, smash bros, and the same zelda game that failed to make the gamecube relevant. nowhere is there something groundbreaking or terribly unique.
i give them a year. that's a year to make this not an utter disaster, and bring it closer to the 3ds's level of failure. sony did it with ps3, and nintendo did it with the ds. the problem is parents won't buy a console for their kids to play mario. they'll buy a handheld for that. so nintendo will need to start appealing very strongly to everyone like they did the wii, and they'll have to do so when there's actually something worth advertising.
it's strange- the e3 2011 demo was actually a bunch of pretty easily-communicated ideas. and they botched that messaging in every market. show people switching from the game to their tablet so someone else can watch tv. that's one commercial. show someone using tvii with netflix, hulu, etc. that's another commercial. show a family playing games together. that's another commercial. the wii u launch commercials were like a weird mix of the kinect and gamecube launch commercials. loud and weird and stupid.
we're already seeing new bundles coming up. zombi u in the us, and monster hunter 3 in europe. those won't do anything at all, but we're starting to see nintendo get aggressive with the machine. for the short-term, we'll probably see even more bundles crop up. i think it's too late, and there will need to be a gigantic shift somewhere for people to take note, or some outstanding piece of software that no one saw coming and everyone has to have (wii fit u won't be that thing).
there was a spark in the creation of the wii and the ds. touch handhelds hadn't ever really been done before- not for gaming, and not on such a grand scale. they threw in some other things too, but ran on the touch screen as the main selling point. and it worked. it worked because it sparked the imagination of people within nintendo. people who thought, why not a pet simulator? why not a collection of small brain exercises? these were demonstrations that were easy to understand, and probably weren't meant to become the 20m+ selling franchises they grew into. but the ideas came from a good place. they came from experimentation and imagination.
the same happened with the wii. yeah, motion control gaming had existed before this console, but no one ever gave it a serious shot on a grand scale. again, there was a spark of excitement and imagination. one rectangular device could mean so many different things: a sword, a bat, a tennis racket, a flashlight, a steering wheel, etc. it's a simple and appealing idea. to improve matters, it was seen as different from video games in the past. similar to how brain age was 'good for you', wii sports was also seen as good for you in that it got you up and moving around in your leisure time.
with the 3ds, they didn't have a good idea or a spark. they had messed around with 3d gaming a long time, but they never had the software to back it up. to this day, i'm left wondering why it was necessary, and the only answer i can come up with is that they were trying to bank on the 3d boom going on at the time. even during panic mode, they made no effort to showcase games that were not only obviously better with 3d, but were essentially impossible to replicate without it. their answer to its poor sales was to do what they did during the gamecube: lower the price, rush out some games, and rely on the tried and true above all else. to this day, there still isn't a breakout hit like nintendogs or brain age, and that rests entirely on the shoulders of the software manufacturers.
and finally there's the wii u. i think there's more you can do to promote the wii u than you could have with the 3ds. it's the same position though- nintendo took something that was popular, and slapped it on one of their systems hoping they could gain popularity through some sort of osmosis. again, no thought to actual software, or any spark of imagination. that's the deep, underlying problem with the console. nintendo doesn't really know what they have. this is outlined by their upcoming lineup and plan to save it through software like mario kart, mario, smash bros, and the same zelda game that failed to make the gamecube relevant. nowhere is there something groundbreaking or terribly unique.
i give them a year. that's a year to make this not an utter disaster, and bring it closer to the 3ds's level of failure. sony did it with ps3, and nintendo did it with the ds. the problem is parents won't buy a console for their kids to play mario. they'll buy a handheld for that. so nintendo will need to start appealing very strongly to everyone like they did the wii, and they'll have to do so when there's actually something worth advertising.
it's strange- the e3 2011 demo was actually a bunch of pretty easily-communicated ideas. and they botched that messaging in every market. show people switching from the game to their tablet so someone else can watch tv. that's one commercial. show someone using tvii with netflix, hulu, etc. that's another commercial. show a family playing games together. that's another commercial. the wii u launch commercials were like a weird mix of the kinect and gamecube launch commercials. loud and weird and stupid.
we're already seeing new bundles coming up. zombi u in the us, and monster hunter 3 in europe. those won't do anything at all, but we're starting to see nintendo get aggressive with the machine. for the short-term, we'll probably see even more bundles crop up. i think it's too late, and there will need to be a gigantic shift somewhere for people to take note, or some outstanding piece of software that no one saw coming and everyone has to have (wii fit u won't be that thing).
Please stop, no spin is going to help. Vita is outright dead, and Wii U is dying at an alarming rate.
If 3DS was strike 3 then what was strike 1 and 2?
MikeE21286
Member
Just a question.
If you were a marketing director in charge of taking your marketing budget and re-investing into one of these consoles, which would you choose?
Please see this:
and this:
and this:
Also yeah, I am also seeing the sub-200k number on DmC. Given that they already revised down to a million shipped (I think?) that's...bad. Assuming if true at least.
InsaneZero
Member
Nintendo's best move would've been to expand their Western presence, revitalize their overseas affiliates and create constructive relationships with Western developers as Iwata has been doing in Japan, so that in return Iwata can actually not look like a complete idiot when he places his trust in them to fill in the Wii U schedule.
The biggest problem with Nintendo is that it's entirely based in Japan in a world that's completely connected everywhere. I doubt that this is simply an Iwata thing as it is a problem with Nintendo in general.
The biggest problem with Nintendo is that it's entirely based in Japan in a world that's completely connected everywhere. I doubt that this is simply an Iwata thing as it is a problem with Nintendo in general.
This is Capcom you're talking about. They'll probably shelve the series. We'll get DmC 2 if we're lucky.
StreetsAhead
Member
If it can't sell well in the US this year with Donkey Kong, 3 Mario franchise games in 3 genres, Animal Crossing, Fire Emblem and POKEMON, then nothing can be done.
H_Prestige
Banned
Either Nintendo gets new management and starts making competent consoles with modern features, or they get out of home consoles. No two ways about it.
I also find it amusing that Nintendo is now the one making loss leading consoles with bloated, unnecessary features while Sony and MS either sell for profit (ps3/360) or break even (vita). Pretty interesting role reversal.
I also find it amusing that Nintendo is now the one making loss leading consoles with bloated, unnecessary features while Sony and MS either sell for profit (ps3/360) or break even (vita). Pretty interesting role reversal.
Pachterballs
Banned
Duxxy3
Member
He's the largest stockholder still. Doubt it's a majority though.
Thank you for that truth.
Nintendo's IPs have already failed to boost a console before. Their IP's aren't as effective when they aren't facing a completely outmatched and dead on arrival system like the Vita. The 720 and PS4 aren't going to be a Vita and 3rd parties aren't going to magically start supporting the Wii U.
There is no bright future awaiting this thing.
Father_Brain
Banned
Couldn't agree more. I think Nintendo's apparent failure to even get Japanese third parties fully on board stems to a large extent from an inability to grasp just how intertwined Japanese console development and Western markets have become.
Vita can still be savedBring the bomb on the 20th Sony!
That's a PS4 event man. Gotta learn to accept that now.
If they're really smart at the start of the show they'll announce they're going to have a separate Vita only show in a week or two. But don't waste PS4's time on Vita stuff.
UberTag
Member
They better figure out why catering to the hardcore is a problem before they release the PS4 with no significant revenue streams outside of gaming or they're going to run into similar problems.
metalslimer
Member
I really wish people would stop pointing to the 3DS as the definitive reason Nintendo can turn everyhthing around with Wii U. The cycle has just repeated from last year's version of this with the PS3 and Vita. There are so many things that Nintendo could do with the 3DS that they can with the Wii U and many things the 3DS had going for it (lack of real competition for one) than the Wii U doesn't. If I anything the reason I want Iwata out of the CEO position is the fact that he couldn't see any of the problems with the Wii U launch and actually thought they weren't pulling any of the same 3DS launch mistakes. Even the 3DS in the market where handhelds are on the decline didn't sell this bad.
Edit: DmC is a fucking failure.
Edit: DmC is a fucking failure.