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Atlus' dungeon crawler "Baroque": what's the word?
- Thread starter RSLAEV
- Start date
Takeda Kenshi said:
Here is something I posted at GameFAQs:
I'm still not super sure about this one. At this point, if I'm being honest, it's no Shiren but still a lot better than Izuna.
Pros:
-Cool Environments: While the levels are almost all very randomly arranged mazey messes like in Shiren, they'll often include interactive features like Flaming Grills, Steam Vents, or Fireball Spewing Walls which NOT ONLY harm you but the baddies as well. You can actually try to work it so baddies get caught up in these "features".
-Unique Baddies: The baddies in this game don't just LOOK good (or farked up, actually) but most of them will have multiple attacks and or tricks up their sleeves. Like one of the first guys I had major difficulties with were the Katos. Katos are weird little armored turtles that love to stay all tucked in and roll around on their sides like living tires. When not bumping you all over the place by ramming you at full speed they'll sometimes peek out with their heads and spew poison gas at you! While all tucked in they're very well armored unless you manage to hit them on their softer sides or hitting the head when it pops out, they can be hard to knock down. I like how the game's baddies seem to have personalities with multiple maneuvers/attacks, not just Izuna's one trick wonders.
-Unique Items: While a lot of the game's items can be traced back to a million RPGs and Roguelikes before them, there are a number of really weird double edged ones. Take the "Coat of Exposure", weighing in at +9 DEF this is the best armor I've yet seen in the game but there is a catch, of course. The SECOND you start fighting anybody your character will take off his coat (I guess to expose himself to the baddies). I have to assume there is a way to make this item useful, perhaps by gluing it onto oneself via a Glue Brand, but I have yet to try this out.
-Quirky Storyline: Your character is a mute amnesic. While over the top at times, it is pretty original and definitely has you coming back for more as you recover little bits and pieces of your memory and try to figure out what the heck happened here and what was your connection to it all.
-Brutal Death Penalty: You know I love the level reset and lose all of your stuff on death, and it's in this game, at least somewhat mitigated by being able to store a handful of items back in your storehouse for future runs (and unlike Shiren, just because you clear the tower doesn't mean you can keep your stuff from that run).
-Brands: A cool new mechanic for this game is the brands. Your character can only have one brand at a time but they're like cool little passive skills/powers. Stuff like going through your VT at half the speed, auto IDing everything, or even the ability to have 20 seconds of Invincibility whenever you first enter a tower level.
-Cursebringer: This is the nasty sounding name for your BESTEST BUDDY in the tower! Toss items at this guy to get new ones. Toss him a rotten heart or food to get it "sanitized", toss him a normal heart or food to get it cooked (it will make the item super effective but with a big catch), or toss any two items to get something new (still trying to figure out if it is totally random or if there is a way to influence it at least the type of item spewed back at you).
Cons:
-Camera Controls: While I'm sure this is a problem that plagues all ACTION games, and I think at this point I finally have under control, it took a while to get a hang of things and I still am not getting why the game makers didn't think having the camera lock-on the baddies you use the "Lock-On" feature. If you hit the "Lock-On" button your character will direct all of his attacks at that opponent, so it is handy when in the midst of a hectic mob or a very mobile baddy, the game doesn't bother to have the camera lock onto the targeted baddy as well leading to some case where your character is fighting some baddy just off screen (so your character seems to know what is up even if you don't).
-Quirky Storyline: I knew going in I'd have to run through the tower multiple times, but at times it feels like you aren't making any progress. It isn't always clear if you've properly triggered events so that you are now fighting the new and improved tower (so that you know you must be doing something right) or if it will just be the same number of floors as it was on your last successful run (so you must have missed some key event or dialog on your last run through).
-Generous Save System: While I'm sure this would be a HUGE BOON for most, I dislike the game's save system since it renders the harsh death penalty mechanic moot. Basically the game allows you to save in between every level and continue on without ever auto-saving, even at death. What this means is that as soon as you die you pretty much have the option of simply re-loading your last save and continuing onwards.
I'd say at this point it is a worthy buy but doubt it will have Shiren's Cult Hit status.
Teasel said:
I might get Chocobo 3 IF I can convince myself it will make Shiren 3 more likely to come over this way (although Chunsoft may be completely out of the loop on this one), but there are no level resets, even with the big post story dungeons, and just sounds like they've really tried to make it light and fluffy.
Saitou said:Wait. Wait wait wait wait.
Wait.
Chocobo Wii will not reset level upon death? What the flying fuck!
I was looking forward to it too
This interview only scared me more. It sounds as if the game was developed by the marketing department:
http://www.cubed3.com/news/9702
Saitou said:
My favorite line:
I like the addition of the Job System, to be sure, but I think this explains why, as if the Chocobo games weren't already cutesy enough, they added in some "Space Baby" to ensure it's a sure fire hit with the pre-teen little Barbie fans. I don't mind a game having wide appeal but it sounds like they put the game in a focus testing lab to create something more marketable.
AlternativeUlster
Absolutely pathetic part deux
I actually liked Pokemon Mystery Dungeon a lot for the DS (funny enough, I still haven't even gotten around to getting either Diamond or Pearl) so I am new to this roguelike RPG experience. If you go by some Best Buys, I've seen some stores carry 10 copies. Should I get this or Oopona?
AlternativeUlster said:
Opoona sounds like a definite skip, while Baroque... seems like a bit of a toss up. I'm still yet to hear or see what makes this a particularly good rogue-like, and I suspect that it might be one of the few Atlus games that I'll be able to find for cheap (like my $12 copy of Yggdra Union).
As for Chocobo on Wii... who knows, it might be good. That style of rogue-like is known for having multiple dungeons with various rules, so one of the side dungeons might play like a more traditional type.
The UPS guy finally showed up with my copy about two hours ago. After reviewing the manual, eating some dinner, and watching some Seinfeld I delved in. Ended up playing for a bit over an hour.
Initial thoughts:
- The camera is complete garbage. Saved by using the + button to focus (actually quite convenient to use with a classic controller)...but not by much. It's still troublesome. It's such a shame, too...if they had a 3/4 overhead view or something (instead of over the shoulder) perhaps it could be avoided. Graphics be damned...because the game is fun.
- I only played for an hour, but it did have quite a bit of repetition. Some new enemies popped up here and there as I progressed but that was about it. Rooms in the tower are pretty samey. I'm hoping this will improve as I continue on.
- For those of you scared off by roguelikes, the save system in this is pretty forgiving. However, I say save for the big screwups "just in case" - but let yourself die. I died fairly early going and I ended up with some pretty cool items soon thereafter, so all was not lost.
+ The music is very cool. I enjoy it. I guess there was grousing earlier in the thread, but I did it. Matches the game perfectly.
+ It's fun. As I type this I'm already itching for more.
+ Very easy to just pop the game in and play. Call me a disgruntled gamer, but I am so sick of having to watch cinema after cinema. I just want to get in and relieve some stress. Plenty of that here.
+ Graphics are nice. Not great. PS2ish, definitely. Although it's great how your character is affected by item equippings and stuff. Makes it more fun to upgrade.
Anyway, all in all it is what I expected. Aside from the camera I think this game is pretty damn cool so far.
Initial thoughts:
- The camera is complete garbage. Saved by using the + button to focus (actually quite convenient to use with a classic controller)...but not by much. It's still troublesome. It's such a shame, too...if they had a 3/4 overhead view or something (instead of over the shoulder) perhaps it could be avoided. Graphics be damned...because the game is fun.
- I only played for an hour, but it did have quite a bit of repetition. Some new enemies popped up here and there as I progressed but that was about it. Rooms in the tower are pretty samey. I'm hoping this will improve as I continue on.
- For those of you scared off by roguelikes, the save system in this is pretty forgiving. However, I say save for the big screwups "just in case" - but let yourself die. I died fairly early going and I ended up with some pretty cool items soon thereafter, so all was not lost.
+ The music is very cool. I enjoy it. I guess there was grousing earlier in the thread, but I did it. Matches the game perfectly.
+ It's fun. As I type this I'm already itching for more.
+ Very easy to just pop the game in and play. Call me a disgruntled gamer, but I am so sick of having to watch cinema after cinema. I just want to get in and relieve some stress. Plenty of that here.
+ Graphics are nice. Not great. PS2ish, definitely. Although it's great how your character is affected by item equippings and stuff. Makes it more fun to upgrade.
Anyway, all in all it is what I expected. Aside from the camera I think this game is pretty damn cool so far.
nakedsushi
Member
Hm, I can't find this (or another copy of Shiren) at my local Best Buy. Are there any other retailers carrying it that's not EBGamestop? I'd rather not go there.
Also, how annoying is the constantly depleting HP/Vitality thing? Is it limiting? I hate playing games with some sort of time or movement limit. In Shiren, the hunger thing isn't TOO limited, so I don't mind.
Also, how annoying is the constantly depleting HP/Vitality thing? Is it limiting? I hate playing games with some sort of time or movement limit. In Shiren, the hunger thing isn't TOO limited, so I don't mind.
nakedsushi said:
It's on par with Shiren...if not a tad better. I found myself getting frustrated with Shiren quite a bit more than with Baroque. The thing is, your VT can be 0 and you won't die as long as you have HP (of course, that goes down eventually, too)...but in Shiren you have to have food or you die. And food is hard to come by. At least in Baroque you can hack your way to live since either HP-up or VT-up items are easy to come by.
If nothing else, you can camp out for a bit if you have low, low HP and high VT to let yourself heal up (I had to do this a couple of times). The funny thing is, the bad guys will find you. So don't go grab a sandwich. I almost died doing that. :lol
straydog1980
Banned
one of my favorite items is the "summon" torturer item. It summons all the items and enemies on that floor to the same floor you are in. It turns into a diablo style hack as fast as you can fest.... the only problem is it's a crap shoot. If one of the items that spawns into the room is an explosion trigger and one of your foes trips it say..... 3 or 4 times, you go down in a literal blaze of glory.
still fun though lol. fuck it! :lol
still fun though lol. fuck it! :lol
^
I'm with you. Exactly...F it! So much craziness sometimes in this game. It's hard to get pissed when the roguelike formula sometimes just totally fucks you so bad. Random drop into a new floor with 5 enemies right there. BOOM!
BTW - where are those Baroque Defense Force avatars? I'm in!
I'm with you. Exactly...F it! So much craziness sometimes in this game. It's hard to get pissed when the roguelike formula sometimes just totally fucks you so bad. Random drop into a new floor with 5 enemies right there. BOOM!
BTW - where are those Baroque Defense Force avatars? I'm in!
Played Pokemon Mystery Dungeon and loved it. I also have the second one down on a preorder.Proven said:
Barogue is just not my cup of tea. The 3rd person perspective is just horrible with the combat and everything else (choppy animation, horrible hit blocks with no sense of actually hitting the enemy). I guess the 2d perspective helped me to like PMD and it should stay that way.
SlasherJPC
Banned
JadedOne said:Ordered it off amazon with the $5.00 coupon from Atlus. It'll be my first rogue like game so I hope I like it enough to join the Baroque Defense Force
Its my first rogue like rpg and I'm enjoying the heck out of it. The first hour was sorta like hmmmm but after getting into the main overall vibe of the game.
I really dig the game. I don't see this game being availible for very long on the shelves.i wouldn't call opoona a definite skip,the game has some annoying parts (like when you have to do a bunch of battles just to proceed with the story) but there is also lot of good old school style and lots of crazy sidequest,the worst thing about opoona is that it's filled with brim with random battle (although there is an item that let you skip them so it helps easing the pain) and that sometimes it's not clear to understand what to do nextcpro said:
gametrailers review is pretty much spot on
straydog1980
Banned
BAROQUE DEFENSE FORCE, MOUNT UP!
After a couple hours of gametime, here's my quick impressions.
-Loooove the music (I haven't heard the Saturn version, but I still love this version's music)
-Haaaate the camera. Just seems wonky to me
-Never heard the word goddammit so many times in the span of like 10-15 minutes
-One time threw my Angelic Rifle at the start since I didn't know what I was doing
-Enemy / character designs freak me out sometimes
-Rolling enemies suck
-I'm a big fan of your character looking different when you equip different equipment, so kudos to Sting for putting that in.
-I saw the enemy that Lord Gek's avatar is and I'm like "HEY ITS LORD GEK.....KILL IT!"
-The story is still coming together, I've only met a handful of characters in the tower, never seen a collector though.
-Sometimes it feels like I get to a point where there isn't a warp anymore and the game wants me to die (which I could expect)
-Sometimes it turns into "OH GOD I HAVE TO RUN SO MANY ENEMIES SAW ME"
-The depleting VT/HP thing really doesn't bother me too much.
Overall, I'm really enjoying it.
-Loooove the music (I haven't heard the Saturn version, but I still love this version's music)
-Haaaate the camera. Just seems wonky to me
-Never heard the word goddammit so many times in the span of like 10-15 minutes
-One time threw my Angelic Rifle at the start since I didn't know what I was doing
-Enemy / character designs freak me out sometimes
-Rolling enemies suck
-I'm a big fan of your character looking different when you equip different equipment, so kudos to Sting for putting that in.
-I saw the enemy that Lord Gek's avatar is and I'm like "HEY ITS LORD GEK.....KILL IT!"
-The story is still coming together, I've only met a handful of characters in the tower, never seen a collector though.
-Sometimes it feels like I get to a point where there isn't a warp anymore and the game wants me to die (which I could expect)
-Sometimes it turns into "OH GOD I HAVE TO RUN SO MANY ENEMIES SAW ME"
-The depleting VT/HP thing really doesn't bother me too much.
Overall, I'm really enjoying it.
PedroLumpy
Member
Any comments on PS2 vs. Wii versions?
Takeda Kenshi
blew Staal
PedroLumpy said:
It seems the Wii version is superior due to the fact you can run it in 480p and Widescreen. Just make sure you have a Classic Controller (from what I've seen.)
PedroLumpy
Member
Takeda Kenshi said:
Thank you very much.
Volcynika said:
Aren't I a bastard?! I like how unlike in Shiren, my little pals here can just yank the coat right off your back if we so desire. I also give a chuckle when they manage to steal something I was just about to toss anyways, "Oh no, he stole my Seed-Rotten, please give it back..oh whatever will I do with that?!" :lol
straydog1980
Banned
LordGek said:
done i think. I can't see your avatar so I'm guessing at the creature.
tetrisgrammaton
Member
so is baroque a port or a remake, or some of both? i've read that its a remake, but the general consensus seems to be its a port.
Prime crotch
Banned
Remake and port. It was remade for PS2 originaly I think and then ported to Wii.
straydog1980
Banned
LordGek said:
lol I can see most of them, just couldn't see yours for some reason. I can see the new one though
I've put in some good time, died around 8 times, and thought I'd chime in with what I think so far.
-Music is awesome, I don't care if the original sounded better to some. It fits the game well.
-Collecting items looks to be a fun time. Items are recored in the database when you store them, so it's nice to know there's something like that to do.
-Difficulty really isn't that bad so far. I mean, I've gotten to the 17th floor, so its bound to get harder, but so far its been no problem.
-Storyline seems to be built on triggers, so it gives good incentive to save certain items, that and be on the lookout for ones you need.
-Storyline is also a bad thing sometimes. I can sort of tell what to do right now to progress, but certain characters still have me scratching my head. That and I'm not sure how to tell whats new from dieing repeatedly, but...
-you can save between floors and reload without penalty, whenever you want. Its not so punishing as other roguelikes.
-The game plays fine with the regular Wii controls. I'm playing it fine that way. The camera is a pain, but I'm used to it, and it won't stop me from enjoying it.
Overall, I'm enjoying it very much. I'm always down for evil and twisted games like this, and I'm certainly glad I gave Baroque a chance.
-Music is awesome, I don't care if the original sounded better to some. It fits the game well.
-Collecting items looks to be a fun time. Items are recored in the database when you store them, so it's nice to know there's something like that to do.
-Difficulty really isn't that bad so far. I mean, I've gotten to the 17th floor, so its bound to get harder, but so far its been no problem.
-Storyline seems to be built on triggers, so it gives good incentive to save certain items, that and be on the lookout for ones you need.
-Storyline is also a bad thing sometimes. I can sort of tell what to do right now to progress, but certain characters still have me scratching my head. That and I'm not sure how to tell whats new from dieing repeatedly, but...
-you can save between floors and reload without penalty, whenever you want. Its not so punishing as other roguelikes.
-The game plays fine with the regular Wii controls. I'm playing it fine that way. The camera is a pain, but I'm used to it, and it won't stop me from enjoying it.
Overall, I'm enjoying it very much. I'm always down for evil and twisted games like this, and I'm certainly glad I gave Baroque a chance.
Normally I would be enjoying this game and attempting to unlock everything, but I just don't have the time to beat the same thing over multiple times to advance the plot anymore. Instead of running around throwing items at people to collect audio clips, or plowing through the same dungeon a 5th time, I could be playing another game.
In short, I wouldn't recommend this to anyone who constantly finds themselves losing interest midway through a game due to time constraints (or time better spent on other games).
In short, I wouldn't recommend this to anyone who constantly finds themselves losing interest midway through a game due to time constraints (or time better spent on other games).
straydog1980
Banned
Kuran said:
lol what? this game is worth $40.
tetrisgrammaton
Member
can't wait for my copy to arrive. ordered it from amazon last nite. hope its on the near end of their shipping scale
Question about "finishing" the game
*Spoilers for those that haven't reached the bottom after the very first run*
*Spoilers for those that haven't reached the bottom after the very first run*
I reached the bottom, saw the Archangel impaled, went through the Conciousness Orb, shot the God or whatever, then my character spoke and said he wanted to restart the world. Now you don't have to spoil it for me (but I don't know if people actually 'beat' it) but is there a real end to the game?
2DMention said:
Very much so AND THAT is now what is finally convincing me this IS a great addition to the console Roguelikes, more than anything else, it's pretty darned original items.
Something that I just caught today is that this game is CHOCK-A-BLOCK FULL of various iterations of Shiren's "Jar of Change", one of my favorite items.
Take the game's line of "Glass Boxes". So far I've seen a "Glass S Box" (sword inside) and a "Glass W Box" (wings inside). Boxes in this game always have a chance of blowing up in your face (and no Shiren's nice leave you with 1 hp, these can often be fatal explosions if not healthy) so the question is do you really want to risk death to open up a box with a random sword inside? It could be great or it might be some cursed piece of shit...do you feel lucky?
crowphoenix
Banned
I hate myself for running out of money when this game came out. Hopefully, I'll get work soon and the game will still be findable then.
Volcynika said:
Ahh, but this can be dangerous as far as the story progression goes as I've now determined it's more about talking to all of the key NPCs than merely clearing the tower. If you just dive past some key NPCs in the tower (or don't take time out to talk to all of the townies when you get a chance) you may be doomed to repeat the same form of the tower (sure it is randomized each time, but as the story progresses it will get deeper and nastier).