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[BokehKing]

When they booed Bernie I knew the "revolution" had veered off course.

Well the thing is he sold them on a dream and have gave up on it and they didn't.

"Donate, we are taking the fight to the convention"
Like people BELIEVED that, still do.


Edit: at the same time, he definitely has Ron Paul fans in his circle. I use to be for Paul back in the day.

 

[SneakersSO]

This post makes no sense. If Trump wins, it is because he has more voters. But that is not my problem, because I didn't vote.

You see how that becomes a problem if enough people think that way?

Except, I will be voting for a person whom I feel could either win (long shot, but as long as its greater than 0%, its still a shot) and is a far better fit for whom I find would be ideal for the position. Will they lose to either of the two parties? Almost assuredly.

I won't be voting for Trump, so I won't be enabling that nonsense. But I won't be voting for HRC. There have been a myriad of problems that have been occurring & that people have ignored throughout this campaign. Heck, the overwhelming majority of Americans don't even vote, and somehow its on ME cause the beliefs I hold dear about politics in this country won't allow me to vote for HRC?


I'm not in a large group of dem/lib voters. We are currently being whipped up by fear-mongering in such a way that you'd think voter turnout for dems this election should be the highest it has EVER been. Hillary should by all accounts win this by a landslide.

Actually it will be. Because people like you, people who think like you, have made a decision that a Trump Presidency is a more favorable outcome than a vote for Clinton.

You are perfectly welcome to vote however you like, but don't try to rationalize it for anything but what it is. You support a Trump Presidency over a Clinton Presidency.

Absolutely not, but its nice you've come up with a way to rationalize your finger-pointing as being justified in face of people who find your candidate disagreeable. Any candidate, EVEN HILLARY, would be better in the office than Trump. But I cannot in good conscious support Hillary.

Translation: Fuck you minorities, I got mine.

Considering I am a minority, this post is just ridiculous. If anything, considering my race & socio-economic background, I am a slamdunk guaranteed voter for dems/HRC in November, and am among the people who theoretically stand to benefit the most from her winning.

 

[SneakersSO]

.

 

[SneakersSO]

.

 

[Pendas]

You know you have a bad Candidate when the only reason supporters can give to vote for her is "We can't let the other guy win."

Considering I am a minority, this post is just ridiculous. If anything, considering my race & socio-economic background, I am a slamdunk guaranteed voter for dems/HRC in November, and am among the people who theoretically stand to benefit the most from her winning.

Not on these forums. Yesterday I was a Stupid, White Supremacist, Non-American for even entertaining the idea a Trump Election could bring about more change than Hillary.

 

[ClosingADoor]

Except, I will be voting for a person whom I feel could either win (long shot, but as long as its greater than 0%, its still a shot) and is a far better fit for whom I find would be ideal for the position. Will they lose to either of the two parties? Almost assuredly.

I won't be voting for Trump, so I won't be enabling that nonsense. But I won't be voting for HRC. There have been a myriad of problems that have been occurring & that people have ignored throughout this campaign. Heck, the overwhelming majority of Americans don't even vote, and somehow its on ME cause the beliefs I hold dear about politics in this country won't allow me to vote for HRC?

I'm not in a large group of dem/lib voters. We are currently being whipped up by fear-mongering in such a way that you'd think voter turnout for dems this election should be the highest it has EVER been. Hillary should by all accounts win this by a landslide.

This discussion is not about Americans who don't vote. That is a separate problem. The discussion is how you - and people thinking like you - are not voting because of - to me - misguided reasons.

And no, in America other candidates at this moment have absolutely no chance to win. That chance is not greater then 0%. It will be Clinton or Trump. That is the choice you have at the moment. You might not like it, but that is the way it is.

Your beliefs are all fine. But when you actively refuse to vote for Clinton, you are making a Trump presidency more likely to happen. Yet you chose to sit at the sidelines and pretend that your vote doesn't matter.

You know you have a bad Candidate when the only reason supporters can give to vote for her is "We can't let the other guy win."

If people don't agree with all policies of candidate A, pointing at candidate B and saying he has even worse plans is a very valid argument.

 

[EdibleKnife]

I'm not in a large group of dem/lib voters. We are currently being whipped up by fear-mongering in such a way that you'd think voter turnout for dems this election should be the highest it has EVER been. Hillary should by all accounts win this by a landslide.

This time last year, people saw Trump's nomination as a joke. There's no such thing as a certainty in this election.

 

[Beer Monkey]

What started with the best of intentions has turned into a destructive monster beyond anyone's control. Poor Bernie.

He could have put on the brakes for the last few months. He waited until the last minute. He bears responsibility. I can't pity him, his ego is too big.

 

[DrForester]

Absolutely not, but its nice you've come up with a way to rationalize your finger-pointing as being justified in face of people who find your candidate disagreeable. Any candidate, EVEN HILLARY, would be better in the office than Trump. But I cannot in good conscious support Hillary.

You realize how contradictory these statements are, right? Again, you can vote however you want, but don't try to rationalize it away by pretending it's not what it is. If you can't vote for Hillary out of conscious, then that's because your conscious is telling you that a Trump Presidency is a better alternative to a vote for Clinton.

 

[Paskil]

You know you have a bad Candidate when the only reason supporters can give to vote for her is "We can't let the other guy win."

Yes, except this is demonstrably not true. In fact, I could easily give you more policy reasons as to why I supported Hillary over Bernie (or Trump, for that matter). It helps that she actually has had many different defined policies rather than just to "break up the banks" and "blah blah 1%."

 

[GoldenEye 007]

You know you have a bad Candidate when the only reason supporters can give to vote for her is "We can't let the other guy win."

Not sure I follow given Clinton aligns pretty closely with Sanders. People claiming that clearly are choosing not to look at her platform.

 

[USC-fan]

I honestly dont know what is worse at this point. 8 years of hillary or 4 years of trump.

 

[SneakersSO]

This discussion is not about Americans who don't vote. That is a separate problem. The discussion is how you - and people thinking like you - are not voting because of - to me - misguided reasons.

And no, in America other candidates at this moment have absolutely no chance to win. That chance is not greater then 0%. It will be Clinton or Trump. That is the choice you have at the moment. You might not like it, but that is the way it is.

Your beliefs are all fine. But when you actively refuse to vote for Clinton, you are making a Trump presidency more likely to happen. Yet you chose to sit at the sidelines and pretend that your vote doesn't matter.

1. Given the color of my state and its multi-election history over the last 50 years, my vote DOESN'T matter.

2. Theres multiple candidates whom I not only agree with that I think would make better Presidents than either of the two party nominees, but I fully feel that a vote for Clinton just enables the set of problems that our nation faces in regards to politics that has allowed us to reach this specific shitty point in the first place. Sure, one of these two people is almost guaranteed to win, but thats not even close to being a good or acceptable thing. So, i'll vote for someone else, someone whom I feel is better abled and whom voting for them will still allow me to sleep at night.

 

[commedieu]

I honestly dont know what is worse at this point. 8 years of hillary or 4 years of trump.

Are you a visible minority?

 

[Curufinwe]

I honestly dont know what is worse at this point. 8 years of hillary or 4 years of trump.

The fascist, racist one is worse.

 

[Pendas]

Yes, except this is demonstrably not true. In fact, I could easily give you more policy reasons as to why I supported Hillary over Bernie (or Trump, for that matter). It helps that she actually has had many different defined policies rather than just to "break up the banks" and "blah blah 1%."

Oh yeah? What are those policies?

 

[Snowman Prophet of Doom]

This time last year, people saw Trump's nomination as a joke. There's no such thing as a certainty in this election.

They weren't looking at the polls. The polls showed Trump ahead from the very beginning, just as the polls now show Hillary as having a MASSIVE advantage that Trump is going to have to do a hell of a lot to chip away at.

 

[The Llama]

Apparently a bunch of people are camped out in the middle of Broad Street and convinced the police to bring them a ladder so they can tear down a Mississippi flag that's hanging up lol.

 

[EdibleKnife]

1. Given the color of my state and its multi-election history over the last 50 years, my vote DOESN'T matter.

2. Theres multiple candidates whom I not only agree with that I think would make better Presidents than either of the two party nominees, but I fully feel that a vote for Clinton just enables the set of problems that our nation faces in regards to politics that has allowed us to reach this specific shitty point in the first place. Sure, one of these two people is almost guaranteed to win, but thats not even close to being a good or acceptable thing. So, i'll vote for someone else, someone whom I feel is better abled and whom voting for them will still allow me to sleep at night.

Why did you get invested and participate at all in this election if you actually believe this?

 

[Kinsei]

Considering I am a minority, this post is just ridiculous. If anything, considering my race & socio-economic background, I am a slamdunk guaranteed voter for dems/HRC in November, and am among the people who theoretically stand to benefit the most from her winning.

Then you don;t care too much. In addition to all of the racist shit Trump as spewed forth Trump will severly fuck the supreme court for decades. His VP wants rape and torture of gay children to be federally funded.

Go ahead and say how you can't vote for Hillary in good conscious. It's fucking bullshit.

 

[ClosingADoor]

1. Given the color of my state and its multi-election history over the last 50 years, my vote DOESN'T matter.

2. Theres multiple candidates whom I not only agree with that I think would make better Presidents than either of the two party nominees, but I fully feel that a vote for Clinton just enables the set of problems that our nation faces in regards to politics that has allowed us to reach this specific shitty point in the first place. Sure, one of these two people is almost guaranteed to win, but thats not even close to being a good or acceptable thing. So, i'll vote for someone else, someone whom I feel is better abled and whom voting for them will still allow me to sleep at night.

I hope you sleep well at night if enough people do the same as you and a Trump presidency actually happens.

I just think it is far better to pick the better candidate that actually has a chance of winning, and then in the next cycle try again to make the candidate you fully support win the primaries.

I honestly dont know what is worse at this point. 8 years of hillary or 4 years of trump.

If you don't know that, maybe you have missed pretty much every headline about Trump over the past months.

 

[Wafflecakes]

I honestly dont know what is worse at this point. 8 years of hillary or 4 years of trump.

Joke post? God I hope so.

As a gay person living in a state where it is still legal to fire someone for being gay, fuck you. The next President will likely appoint 2-3 SCOTUS justices in their first term alone. This could set the US back decades on gay rights, among other issues.

 

[Melkezadek]

You know you have a bad Candidate when the only reason supporters can give to vote for her is "We can't let the other guy win."

Probably because no matter how much policy or facts one brings up, it's always met with "Well I can't trust her" or "There is nothing she can do to make me vote for her."

How do you reason with that?

I would have loved to hear a moderator in a debate ask Bernie "Did you vote on the war in Iraq? " and him going "No, I couldn't do it because of my conscious."

Would be laughed out of existence. Ironically, that was the excuse for many of the non voters in the UK. What good it did them.

 

[Ambient80]

I honestly dont know what is worse at this point. 8 years of hillary or 4 years of trump.

"I honestly don't know what is worse at this point. Getting a piece of dust in my eye or getting pepper sprayed in the eye."

 

[Knuckle Sandwich]

Joke post? God I hope so.

As a gay person living in a state where it is still legal to fire someone for being gay, fuck you. The next President will likely appoint 2-3 SCOTUS justices in their first term alone. This could set the US back decades on gay rights, among other issues.

None of that matters because emails.

 

[Clefargle]

I honestly dont know what is worse at this point. 8 years of hillary or 4 years of trump.

Ugh, can't believe I see this trotted out so often. Such weak sauce "both parties are teh saem" nonsense. Considering Clinton is to the left of Obama, eight years of Clinton will at the worse move liberal agendas forward slightly. At worst, trump will wreck the economy and enact barbaric policy. If you can't see the difference then I have to assume you're being obtuse.

 

[Jonm1010]

Oh yeah? What are those policies?

Questions like this say more about your own ignorance on the topic then anything you think you are gaining by challenging someone to do the HW you probably should have done before dismissing a candidate and defending that dismissal.

 

[psrock]

You know you have a bad Candidate when the only reason supporters can give to vote for her is "We can't let the other guy win."




But what does that say about the candidate that lost to her, badly that is.

 

[SneakersSO]

You realize how contradictory these statements are, right? Again, you can vote however you want, but don't try to rationalize it away by pretending it's not what it is. If you can't vote for Hillary out of conscious, then that's because your conscious is telling you that a Trump Presidency is a better alternative to a vote for Clinton.

If thats how you gotta rationalize people like me (minority, life-long liberal/dem voters from poor socio-economic backgrounds) deciding not to vote for HRC in November, that we are somehow okay with Trump versus not okay with this entire system, which has consistently & continuously fucked me & my kind for forever, then so be it.

The only thing I do agree with the right with AT ALL is that voices like mine, minority/poor voters who are only ever given a shit about when it comes time to elect a democrat, have been taken advantage of. And now that i'm sick and tired of that, I somehow need to get in line or be branded a nazi/bigot/whatever.

If thats how you want to treat people who you claim your candidate & their policies should be helping, then so be it.

 

[Cagey]

Short of something so horrendous like Hillary Clinton literally owning slaves in 2016, her as the vehicle to Not Elect Trump is the better option than Trump. Every time.

 

[AxelFoley]

You know you have a bad Candidate when the only reason supporters can give to vote for her is "We can't let the other guy win."



Not on these forums. Yesterday I was a Stupid, White Supremacist, Non-American for even entertaining the idea a Trump Election could bring about more change than Hillary.

Yes, a Trump win would bring more change than Hillary, and none of it good. I don't see how any rational, thinking person could entertain any thoughts of that asshole in office.

 

[Jonm1010]

If thats how you gotta rationalize people like me (minority, life-long liberal/dem voters from poor socio-economic backgrounds) deciding not to vote for HRC in November, that we are somehow okay with Trump versus not okay with this entire system, which has consistently & continuously fucked me & my kind for forever, then so be it.

The only thing I do agree with the right with AT ALL is that voices like mine, minority/poor voters who are only ever given a shit about when it comes time to elect a democrat, have been taken advantage of. And now that i'm sick and tired of that, I somehow need to get in line or be branded a nazi/bigot/whatever.

If thats how you want to treat people who you claim your candidate & their policies should be helping, then so be it.

How does a potential Trump presidency make your battle easier?

Hell, how does a protest vote achieve that? Walk me step by step through your logic here because I am struggling.

 

[xxracerxx]

Not on these forums. Yesterday I was a Stupid, White Supremacist, Non-American for even entertaining the idea a Trump Election could bring about more change than Hillary.

You think Trump will change the country for the better?

 

[AxelFoley]

This time last year, people saw Trump's nomination as a joke. There's no such thing as a certainty in this election.

Trump needs 60% of the white vote (which he'll probably get) and a good chunk of the minority vote (which he won't get) to win.

As usual, it seems people of color and white folks with common sense will have to save this country from itself.

 

[Pendas]

You think Trump will change the country for the better?

For the Better? Fuck no. But I see more radical changes than if Hillary becomes President. Worse Changes? Probably, only time will tell.

 

[SneakersSO]

How does a potential.Trump presidency make your battle easier?

Hell, how does a protest vote achieve that? Walk me step by step of your logic.

Did I say it did? I made my vote for someone whom I thought could do such a thing in this election long ago. Am I voting for Trump? Absolutely not. But i've seen this song & dance long enough that Clinton will get in office and do fuck all for me & my people. Oh, she'll come out & shill for us, say whatever she wants to get us to vote for her, make us believe she is fully on our side; dems have been doing that for decades now. It's NEVER resulted in positive change for us.

But go ahead and tell me how things are going to be better for poor, minority voters with Hillary in charge. Tell me how she'll be able to fulfill the myriad of promises she's made thus far, that other democratic leaders have also made and not fulfilled, and how she'll be the one to finally cross the threshold & help those who have been asking for it the most.

 

[commedieu]

If thats how you gotta rationalize people like me (minority, life-long liberal/dem voters from poor socio-economic backgrounds) deciding not to vote for HRC in November, that we are somehow okay with Trump versus not okay with this entire system, which has consistently & continuously fucked me & my kind for forever, then so be it.

The only thing I do agree with the right with AT ALL is that voices like mine, minority/poor voters who are only ever given a shit about when it comes time to elect a democrat, have been taken advantage of. And now that i'm sick and tired of that, I somehow need to get in line or be branded a nazi/bigot/whatever.

If thats how you want to treat people who you claim your candidate & their policies should be helping, then so be it.

All of this falls apart because your laying down for a fascist to win. So you're branded due to having a choice, but choosing the one more likely to get a fascist in office.


The dnc is fucked. Lol. Trumps going to win, and I'll see you at the minority Roundup wondering why you're there.

This is about the superior court as well..not just the presidency. Things for minorities is much better under Democrats than republicans. Kiss all those lgbt rights away with republicans running the nation, or any police reform, or gun control.

 

[ShockingAlberto]

You know you have a bad Candidate when the only reason supporters can give to vote for her is "We can't let the other guy win."

I mean, that is a pressing reason.

I think Clinton will be a good president. I don't particularly like how hawkish she can, but I don't think interventionalism is a blight against humanity, either. Sometimes the U.S. should step in. There should be long term plans, there should be learned testimony, but I think being an isolationist country in the face of death and depravity isn't always the most moral answer.

I like how anti-gun Clinton can be. I want victims to have unlimited rights to sue gun owners. I want gun stores to be forced to do more due diligence and follow ups than student loan providers have to do. I think we should be reacting to every shooting like it absolutely needs to be the last one ever, not just "Oh man, really, again?" I don't want anyone, anyone, reacting to a tragedy with legislation that favors gun manufacturers. As far as I can tell, Clinton would not.

Clinton will appoint liberal judges, but more importantly, I think she will nominate diverse judges. Women, people of color, people who are going to look at constitutionality from a lens of disadvantaged communities rather than big business. Of the entire legacy Obama is going to leave, I think his efforts to diversify the court (up until calling the GOP's bluff this year) are going to be the most long-lasting.

Obama had no interest in politicking, which is ultimately what slowed a lot of his agenda down. As a Senator, Clinton drank McCain under the table to get him to back off on her agendas, she argued senators to a standstill, she wouldn't let anyone remove provisions she required from bills as long as she was still a senator (which is why some bills had provisions removed after she left). I think she will be more aggressive with her agenda than Obama has been. Obama wanted to lead, Clinton has an agenda, most of which I line up with.

I think she'll get the public option into ACA. I think she'll drastically lower student loan interest rates. I think she'll get to 75% of a lot of what I want and hopefully pass the baton to someone who can get the rest done. I expect she'll make me incredibly mad. I bet she'll intervene where it's not morally necessary. I bet she won't do enough for important, oppressed communities. I bet I will have a lot of the frustrations I had with Obama with Clinton.

I bet Sanders would infuriate me, too. Or Warren. Or Biden. I don't think any leader, Democratic or otherwise, is going to do 100% of what I want them to do or the way I think they should do it. But my support for them is not out of fear for the otherwise - not entirely, anyway. It's that I expect to get infuriated with a leader of 325 million people and I will support them in the triumphs I agree with and scream at the ones I don't.

Maybe that's not a good argument for you to vote Clinton, but it's mine.

 

[Aaronrules380]

Did I say it did? I made my vote for someone whom I thought could do such a thing in this election long ago. Am I voting for Trump? Absolutely not. But i've seen this song & dance long enough that Clinton will get in office and do fuck all for me & my people. Oh, she'll come out & shill for us, say whatever she wants to get us to vote for her, make us believe she is fully on our side; dems have been doing that for decades now. It's NEVER resulted in positive change for us.

But go ahead and tell me how things are going to be better for poor, minority voters with Hillary in charge. Tell me how she'll be able to fulfill the myriad of promises she's made thus far, that other democratic leaders have also made and not fulfilled, and how she'll be the one to finally cross the threshold & help those who have been asking for it the most.

Change is a slow, difficult process. It's not always going to be readily obvious. But you know what will definitely not result in positive change: BACKING THE RACIST WHO IS ENDORSED BY THE KKK

 

[USC-fan]

Ugh, can't believe I see this trotted out so often. Such weak sauce "both parties are teh saem" nonsense. Considering Clinton is to the left of Obama, eight years of Clinton will at the worse move liberal agendas forward slightly. At worst, trump will wreck the economy and enact barbaric policy. If you can't see the difference then I have to assume you're being obtuse.

i don't think they are the same at all. But the fact remains trump will be one term while clinton will likely be 2 terms.

Also if trump could bring some change to fund raising would be a huge win for me. They have to get the big money out!!! The email leak just proves that more.

Also people are right she seems very hawkish. I don't want us in any more wars. I sick and tired of being the police for the world.

Don't care for either one. Both are my last choices.

 

[Captain Tuttle]

That being said, if Trump wins, Bernie or Bust kids better not cry about what he does to this country.

Oh they'll cry. People who voted for Nader cried about Bush

 

[Aaronrules380]

i don't think they are the same at all. But the fact remains trump will be one term while clinton will likely be 2 terms.

Also if trump could bring some change to fund raising would be a huge win for me. They have to get the big money out!!! The email leak just proves that more.

Also people are right she seems very hawkish. I don't want us in any more wars. I sick and tired of being the police for the world.

Don't care for either one. Both are my last choices.

And his supreme court picks will be 20-30 years. Glad you're ok with that

 

[xxracerxx]

Every time I read someone calling Clinton hawkish, I just read it as calling her a bitch.

 

[commedieu]

Change is a slow, difficult process. It's not always going to be readily obvious. But you know what will definitely not result in positive change: BACKING THE RACIST WHO IS ENDORSED BY THE KKK

That's the weirdest part.

I hate hilary but I don't mind a racist fascist? As that means things will be better off with conservatives having no opposition?

This is why I've been saying it. But the party is about to have a hard divide.

 

[elrechazado]

Every time I read someone calling Clinton hawkish, I just read it as calling her a bitch.

That's some serious projection.

 

[xxracerxx]

That's some serious projection.

Never said it wasn't. It is just how I read it sadly.

 

[ShockingAlberto]

Every time I read someone calling Clinton hawkish, I just read it as calling her a bitch.

She is definitely an interventionalist.

I don't think she would have invaded Iraq (hindsight vote notwithstanding), but I do think she would have made the same decisions she made as SoS as president.

 

[sangreal]

Every time I read someone calling Clinton hawkish, I just read it as calling her a bitch.

But she is Hawkish. What's the last military action she didn't support ?

I like Hillary but if the shoe fits...

 

[commedieu]

But she is Hawkish. What's the last military action she didn't support ?

I like Hillary but if the shoe fits...

Not that I care for her. But I don't remember McCain bing called hawkish so often...it's like her middle name at this point.

 

[Melkezadek]

Every time I read someone calling Clinton hawkish, I just read it as calling her a bitch.

What's even more ridiculous is that Trump has stated we'll have boots on the ground in Syria.

People are so caught up in a world of what ifs they're ignoring everything that's actually being said.