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[Bigfoot]

I think it speaks to how we view female characters who aren't bastions of purity. Skylar is not perfect. She's not funny. She's not exactly the type of person you'd want to surround yourself with at a party. But look who she married, look at her goals... there's no reason not to root for her, and I can't for the life of me understand those who don't.

What if I just don't like Skylear because of her dumb ugly face? . Maybe I would like Skylar if she was played by a better actress even if the character remained unchanged.

 

[Blader]

How is she annoying? She's trying to stop her husband from being a meth-cooking murderer? Excuse me, sorry, I didn't realize what a bitch she could be.

These two things are not mutually inclusive, which is probably why you're so baffled by people who don't like Skyler. Just because she's trying to do the right thing doesn't make her automatically fun or lovable or interesting to watch.

I have something to tell you and I think you better sit down...

I'm not really following the team mentalities in these thread since I rarely post them, but I'd have to assume, if for no other reason, that no one can be pro-Walt after Mike's death.

 

[faceless007]

NPR story on local Albuquerque businesses capitalizing on the success of BB

 

[Bomber Bob]

and people ask Anna Gunn, “Why is your character such a bitch?”

 

[Wilbur]

i cant breathe

 

[digoutyoursoul]

i cant breathe

I genuinely nearly pissed myself

 

[BocoDragon]

What are the reasons to root for Walt's goals over Skyler's? Because he's the main character? Gilligan always has seemed to advocate for sympathizing with Skyler, and it's fairly clear through her fall into the pool and her speech on time being her ally that we should as well. I don't understand those who wish to see Skyler fail, and I think it has to do with our expectations of female characters.

I don't see why her being a woman has anything to do with it. She's the foil for the anti-hero protagonist. Of course some people are still going to be cheering for the main character, and detesting those who are in his way.

Yes, I think they have attempted a transition of Skyler into the sympathetic main figure, and Walt into the unsympathetic bad guy ... But just because some people were left behind in that switcheroo does not imply misogeny.

My girlfriend hated Doakes on the show Dexter, and he was just a cop trying to catch a serial killer. So should we suspect racism or misandry in her hate for this character? Not at all. That's what happens when they are the foil for a main character, even if that main character is a bad person and the foil is morally justifiable.

 

[Bigfoot]

Glad to see he spoke out on the issue. Agree 100% with him.
Can't wait for the skyler haters in this thread to rage hard.

That's an old quote and it has been discused many times. Vince has also changed his view after finding out a large number of Skylear haters are also women.

 

[PastorOfMuppets]

Man, seeing all these Los Pollos Hermanos ads on YouTube make me wish that it was a real franchise. That chicken looks so good.

 

[vpance]

If you think Jesse finding out about Brock isn't going to be a huge deal (if it happens that is)
you're going to be disappointed I think.

You say it's exploring territory most of us have come to expect but that's really not true at all, because there's still the execution of how those plot points will play out. You might not find it interesting, but remember there's still the question of how Jesse will find out, which could be exciting on its own.

I think it doesn't really make sense for him to find out. If he does, it's purely for wrapping up a supposed loose end. The only people that know are Saul, Hule and Walt himself, none of who have much reason to say shit. Either Walt spills it out when he finally breaks down and confesses all his sins (ugh) or Saul reveals it to Jesse to convince him Walt is a POS. Both choices don't sound very interesting to me.

I fully expect Jesse to find out about Brock - it happened too recently in the show for it to not come up again - but I do wonder how and if Gilligan will revisit Jane's death? That was a pretty pivotal moment in Walt's transformation, but there were zero witnesses to it so I can't imagine how it will come up unless Walt himself talks about it. It also happened four years ago and may be too long for a lot of viewers to even remember much less care.

Again, another thing that's not necessary to dwell upon but for the sake of fans complaining I guess it will be explained.

 

[Cornballer]

- Salon.com: How the desert made Walter White
- Forbes: Seven Leadership Tips from Breaking Bad's Vince Gilligan

 

[matthieuC]

Man, seeing all these Los Pollos Hermanos ads on YouTube make me wish that it was a real franchise. That chicken looks so good.

I read somewhere the restaraunt actually exists under a different name.

 

[inm8num2]

If there's one thing I can't stand about the fandom of this show, it's that with every major decision Walt makes the overwhelming response on the internet (not this forum, internet in general) seems to be, "Oh shit! He's Heisenberg now!"

*watches girl choke on vomit*
"Shit, he's Heisenberg now!"
*runs over dealers, shoots one in head*
"Holy shit, he's full Heisenberg now!"
*poisons kid*
"Whoa shit, he's fuckin' Heisenberg!"
*whistles after feigning remorse for Todd killing kid*
"Shit, man, no turning back from Heisenberg!"

Walt isn't a schizophrenic. He was an incredibly depressed, overqualified chemistry teacher with a long string of shitty luck. In the face of death he started down a different path and has been on it ever since. If anything, he's been 'Heisenberg' since the premiere, if not sooner.

Just something I had to get off my chest. When people say, "He's Heisenberg now!" it seems odd to me that people wouldn't consider things he did in the first 2-3 seasons as actions of a twisted man, however desperate or justified in survival terms he might have been.

 

[ivysaur12]

These two things are not mutually inclusive, which is probably why you're so baffled by people who don't like Skyler. Just because she's trying to do the right thing doesn't make her automatically fun or lovable or interesting to watch.



I'm not really following the team mentalities in these thread since I rarely post them, but I'd have to assume, if for no other reason, that no one can be pro-Walt after Mike's death.

How is the journey of a woman who discovers her husband is a meth cooking sociopath not interesting? She's not fun. She's not particularly warm. But if our sympathy is unable to over come these factors, then I really have to wonder what we expect from our female characters. And maybe women in general.

You don't need to find her particularly nice or charming to have an incredible sympathy for her situation. She's toyed with, manipulated by, and held prisoner by her husband. Unlike her husband, she's a generally good person prone to mistakes.

 

[UrbanRats]

As i said before, i'm sure some people root for Walt in the same way they root for Tony Montana or any other antihero.
Because they are those that usually propel the story forward, are in control and and provide the "fun stuff".
If Skyler "won" at the start of Season 3, there wouldn't even be a series, so i think that's simply a process in the back of the mind of some of the Skyler haters, that even use terms like "cock blocker" and such.
In an action movie, if one character were to propose a crazy shootout pproach, and the other a diplomatic resolvement, people wouldn't necessarily side with the most responsible one, but rather with the most entertaining.

--
Personally though i can't wait to see Walt crash and burn.
I think the moment where i lost all hope for him was the "I forgive you" scene.

 

[Courage]

If there's one thing I can't stand about the fandom of this show, it's that with every major decision Walt makes the overwhelming response on the internet (not this forum, internet in general) seems to be, "Oh shit! He's Heisenberg now!"

*watches girl choke on vomit*
"Shit, he's Heisenberg now!"
*runs over dealers, shoots one in head*
"Holy shit, he's full Heisenberg now!"
*poisons kid*
"Whoa shit, he's fuckin' Heisenberg!"
*whistles after feigning remorse for Todd killing kid*
"Shit, man, no turning back from Heisenberg!"

Walt isn't a schizophrenic. He was an incredibly depressed, overqualified chemistry teacher with a long string of shitty luck. In the face of death he started down a different path and has been on it ever since. If anything, he's been 'Heisenberg' since the premiere, if not sooner.

Just something I had to get off my chest. When people say, "He's Heisenberg now!" it seems odd to me that people wouldn't consider things he did in the first 2-3 seasons as actions of a twisted man, however desperate or justified in survival terms he might have been.

He was always "Heisenberg" his life just never met the conditions to show that side of him.

 

[Mr. Saturn]

I think it doesn't really make sense for him to find out. If he does, it's purely for wrapping up a supposed loose end. The only people that know are Saul, Hule and Walt himself, none of who have much reason to say shit. Either Walt spills it out when he finally breaks down and confesses all his sins (ugh) or Saul reveals it to Jesse to convince him Walt is a POS. Both choices don't sound very interesting to me.



Again, another thing that's not necessary to dwell upon but for the sake of fans complaining I guess it will be explained.

Just because you can't think of a third way, doesn't mean it won't happen right? The whole Walt confessing thing, that would be maybe okay depending on how its handled I guess, but why is it hard to see Saul telling Jesse the truth about Brock?

Are you really telling me you can't possibly envision a scenario where Saul tells Jesse the truth, in order to distance himself from Walt, especially now that Hank's gunning for him?

I seriously doubt that if either of these things are touched upon in the final season, that it will be because of fans complaining.

 

[Doctor Decimate]

i found Skyler to be infuriating as a character for a while.

though i think once she found out what Walt was doing she became tolerable and her actions and behavior were justified. but before that? hell no. as far as she knew, Walt was going through some shit because he had cancer.

 

[Batigol]

Only in this show can you be called a misogynist for not liking a female character.

Skylar is a terrible character because she only serves one function and that is to be a giant pain in the ass to Walt at all times, serving to thwart his every move (whether knowingly or unknowingly). It's such a played out, arbitrary character-type and almost always ends up just being irritating.

I couldn't care less whether or not she's a "good" person, because honestly... who cares

.

Old quote, but sums it up perfectly

Skyler S1-4 is insufferable

 

[inm8num2]

He was always "Heisenberg" his life just never met the conditions to show that side of him.

Exactly. Everything leading up to the events in the premiere essentially resulted in him having this deep-seated rage. All he needed was a catalyst to let it loose. That was the cancer and threat of death.

 

[Ataraxia]

Walt isn't a schizophrenic. He was an incredibly depressed, overqualified chemistry teacher with a long string of shitty luck. In the face of death he started down a different path and has been on it ever since. If anything, he's been 'Heisenberg' since the premiere, if not sooner.

The Gray Matter storyline pretty much confirms that Walter was always somewhat sociopathic. We're led to believe he created a brilliant company and was then bounced out by his two selfish partners - thus we felt bad for him, but it's clear after his last conversation with Gretchen that he left on his own terms likely because he didn't want to share the credit and because he has always had a problem with his ego. Heisenberg was always there, it just didn't become noticeable until he started producing meth.

 

[CharminUltra]

I don't understand why some people think you need to like the main character of a show.

I've always thought that it was more important for a main character to be interesting than likable.

That or, like I mentioned in my other post, the assumption that if you hate Skyler it automatically means you're rooting for Walt.

Skyler is a horrible, joyless and dull character played by an average actress. She is about as deep and nuanced as Deb Morgan. This would still be true even if she enabled Walt 100% of the time.

 

[Dai101]

Only in this show can you be called a misogynist for not liking a female character.

.

Old quote, but sums it up perfectly

Skyler S1-4 is insufferable

Can't wait to see her inside a plastic barrel.

 

[UrbanRats]

If there's one thing I can't stand about the fandom of this show, it's that with every major decision Walt makes the overwhelming response on the internet (not this forum, internet in general) seems to be, "Oh shit! He's Heisenberg now!"

*watches girl choke on vomit*
"Shit, he's Heisenberg now!"
*runs over dealers, shoots one in head*
"Holy shit, he's full Heisenberg now!"
*poisons kid*
"Whoa shit, he's fuckin' Heisenberg!"
*whistles after feigning remorse for Todd killing kid*
"Shit, man, no turning back from Heisenberg!"

Walt isn't a schizophrenic. He was an incredibly depressed, overqualified chemistry teacher with a long string of shitty luck. In the face of death he started down a different path and has been on it ever since. If anything, he's been 'Heisenberg' since the premiere, if not sooner.

Just something I had to get off my chest. When people say, "He's Heisenberg now!" it seems odd to me that people wouldn't consider things he did in the first 2-3 seasons as actions of a twisted man, however desperate or justified in survival terms he might have been.

I think it makes sense.

"Being Heisenberg" is not him changing personality, so it's true that the Heisenberg germ was in him all along, however letting that germ grow and take over is something he did in the course of the show and that's what people mean when they say "he's Heisenberg now".
Everyone can have morally conflicting thoughts, evil, egoistic, twisted thoughts; whether one acts out on those thoughts, whether you decide to suppress them or let them out, determine whether or not you're good/moral person or not.
So even though Walt may have been cultivating those thoughts, the fact that he decided not to act them out and to repress them, made him a different (better) person than the Walt that has no brakes and acts out every single depraved thing that goes through his mind, not giving a shit.

Besides, he's obviously and visibly shaken when Jane dies, but when Todd kills the kid, he doesn't even think about it.

 

[inm8num2]

The Gray Matter storyline pretty much confirms that Walter was always somewhat sociopathic. We're led to believe he created a brilliant company and was then bounced out by his two selfish partners - thus we felt bad for him, but it's clear after his last conversation with Gretchen that he left on his own terms likely because he didn't want to share the credit and because he has always had a problem with his ego. Heisenberg was always there, it just didn't become noticeable until he started producing meth.

Again on the same page. I just feel like people miss the point completely of Walt's arc when they think that putting on a hat makes him a different person. Rather, that aspect of who he is was always there. He was an angry, embittered man in the premiere who was ready to lose control.

 

[ivysaur12]

That or, like I mentioned in my other post, the assumption that if you hate Skyler it automatically means you're rooting for Walt.

Skyler is a horrible, joyless and dull character played by an average actress. She is about as deep and nuanced as Deb Morgan. This would still be true even if she enabled Walt 100% of the time.

A horrible character? As deep and nuanced as Deb? I'm so happy I'm not watching the same show as you.

 

[Frost_Ace]

That or, like I mentioned in my other post, the assumption that if you hate Skyler it automatically means you're rooting for Walt.

Skyler is a horrible, joyless and dull character played by an average actress. She is about as deep and nuanced as Deb Morgan. This would still be true even if she enabled Walt 100% of the time.

No.

 

[-Kees-]

I keep having this feeling that Skylar will be the one left standing after bringing Walt to whatever end he'll have, and then I have a vision of the internet imploding.

 

[Bacon]

Seems like every single time I go into a bb thread, regardless of what page I start at, the same exact skylar debate is always happening. I feel like I can recite the argument word for word at this point.

 

[SKINNER!]

Can't wait for this guys. J-just can't!

 

[UrbanRats]

The Gray Matter storyline pretty much confirms that Walter was always somewhat sociopathic. We're led to believe he created a brilliant company and was then bounced out by his two selfish partners - thus we felt bad for him, but it's clear after his last conversation with Gretchen that he left on his own terms likely because he didn't want to share the credit and because he has always had a problem with his ego. Heisenberg was always there, it just didn't become noticeable until he started producing meth.

Well he clearly isn't sociopathic, as he expresses genuine empathy all throughout the show.
The reason why he left Gray Matter as i remember it, was because he didn't want to stay with Gretchen due to her family being very rich.
Yeah, he had a severe inferiority complex, but hardly a one way ticket for the monster he became, like some of you make it sound.

 

[Amir0x]

Even Vince Gilligan couldn't stop the Skyler hate train.

big surprise Vince Gilligan knows what his characters are all about while some show watchers have no clue

 

[vpance]

Just because you can't think of a third way, doesn't mean it won't happen right? The whole Walt confessing thing, that would be maybe okay depending on how its handled I guess, but why is it hard to see Saul telling Jesse the truth about Brock?

Are you really telling me you can't possibly envision a scenario where Saul tells Jesse the truth, in order to distance himself from Walt, especially now that Hank's gunning for him?

I seriously doubt that if either of these things are touched upon in the final season, that it will be because of fans complaining.

It's just that that kind of reveal isn't interesting to me is all. Yet another Jesse gets mad at Walt, and then will they or won't they become friends again? It's all part of the Walt must get exposed and pay for his evil moral choices expectation. All I'm saying is that it would be more interesting to not see those things happen.

 

[EBCubs03]

Well he clearly isn't sociopathic, as he expresses genuine empathy all throughout the show.
The reason why he left Gray Matter as i remember it, was because he didn't want to stay with Gretchen due to her family being very rich.
Yeah, he had a severe inferiority complex, but hardly a one way ticket for the monster he became, like some of you make it sound.

None of that empathy seems genuine to me. I'm pretty sure that's how Cranston is acting it, too..

 

[ivysaur12]

Only in this show can you be called a misogynist for not liking a female character.

.

Old quote, but sums it up perfectly

Skyler S1-4 is insufferable

She's the most sympathetic character on the show and by far one of the most interesting to watch over 5 seasons. She in no way serves only as a roadblock or a foil for Walt. I don't even know how to respond to that because it's just not the case.

None of that empathy seems genuine to me. I'm pretty sure that's how Cranston is acting it, too..

Cranston has done a beautiful job with that.

 

[Nameless]

Why would anyone root for Walt over Skylar? Walt is, to make it as simple as possible, and evil human being seemingly incapable of empathy. Skylar is flawed, but genuinely a good person who cares deeply for her family and two children (much more than Walt does). I don't understand the hate or dislike, and at this point, every one should be rooting for Skylar to escape this situation. I don't really understand any of the other alternatives... she married a monster.

This over simplification of Walter White is getting tiresome. What you're describing is a robotic character on a boring show. Did you watch Crawl Space? Is that really just a mindless evil monster? You don't have to cheer for the guy but at least be honest.

Skyler has blood on her hands too, only people excuse it because she curled into a ball and cried about it. She continually takes liberties with her evil husband's evil drug money only to spew about sanctimony whenever the shit gets thick. Like Walt she had multiple chances to get out and chose to stay. She even spun her own web of lies along the way. Don't get me wrong, I feel fore her; she's justified in her depression over Beneke and being mortified that her husbsand is capable of blowing up drug lords in broad daylight. Yes, she should be afraid for her life and the lives of her children. These things being true don't make her morally immune. This show is rarely that black and white.

 

[BocoDragon]

The Gray Matter storyline pretty much confirms that Walter was always somewhat sociopathic. We're led to believe he created a brilliant company and was then bounced out by his two selfish partners - thus we felt bad for him, but it's clear after his last conversation with Gretchen that he left on his own terms likely because he didn't want to share the credit and because he has always had a problem with his ego. Heisenberg was always there, it just didn't become noticeable until he started producing meth.

I don't think I like the idea that Heisinberg/Bad Walt was pre-determined. And I think it's pretty clearly not that, if you just take a step back and look at the premise of the show.

This show is about a guy who hits rock bottom, and "breaks bad". He wasn't always bad. He made Heisinberg through his own decisions.

 

[ivysaur12]

Why would anyone root for Walt over Skylar? Walt is, to make it as simple as possible, and evil human being seemingly incapable of empathy. Skylar is flawed, but genuinely a good person who cares deeply for her family and two children (much more than Walt does). I don't understand the hate or dislike, and at this point, every one should be rooting for Skylar to escape this situation. I don't really understand any of the other alternatives... she married a monster./QUOTE]

This over simplification of Walter White is getting tiresome. What you're describing is a robotic character on a boring show. Did you watch Crawl Space? Is that really just a mindless evil monster? You don't have to cheer for the guy but at least be honest.

Skyler has blood on her hands too, only people excuse it because she curled into a ball and cried about it. She continually takes liberties with her evil husband's evil drug money only to spew about sanctimony whenever the shit gets thick. Like Walt she had multiple chances to get out and chose to stay. She even spun her own web of lies along the way. Don't get me wrong, she's justified in her depression over Beneke and being mortified that her husbsand is capable of blowing up drug lords in broad daylight. Yes, she should be afraid for her life and the lives of her children. These things being true don't make her morally immune. This show is rarely that black and white.

I literally qualified the point as not being simple as I was stating. I've also stated, multiple times, that Skyler is not a bastion of morality and has her own share of problems. That doesn't change the fact that I see her as a genuinely good person who has made their mistakes after being placed in incredibly difficult circumstances.

 

[Steelyuhas]

Train sequence is going down in AMC right now.

Fucking awesome.

 

[UrbanRats]

None of that empathy seems genuine to me. I'm pretty sure that's how Cranston is acting it, too..

No way.
Walt is no Hannibal Lecter, c'mon.

I think you're making the character more bidimensional than he is.
When he cries to Walter Jr., he clerly cares.
When he lets Jane dies, that clearly affects him.
When he goes to take Jesse back from that crack house, he's clearly moved.

What Walt does, is he lies to himself, he can hide things inside so well, that they're lost forever.
That's what he does with the plane crash, that's what he does with his constant mantra "i have to ____ for my family" and so on and so on.

even Gilligan said that he and his writers, refer to Walter's super power as the ability to lie (to others and himself).
He's the ultimate delusional, but he is no sociopath.

Only in the latest seasons (4 nd 5) i can see his detachment from reality becoming a real sense of emotional detachment (him whistling when the kid dies) but i still read that as him living, at that point, on a completely other planet.

 

[Amir0x]

Well he clearly isn't sociopathic, as he expresses genuine empathy all throughout the show.
The reason why he left Gray Matter as i remember it, was because he didn't want to stay with Gretchen due to her family being very rich.
Yeah, he had a severe inferiority complex, but hardly a one way ticket for the monster he became, like some of you make it sound.

He is a sociopath and the writers know it.

If you check the fake websites the crew made for the Breaking Bad series throughout the years, you can read some pretty interesting things they posted. Many of them provide clear insight into what the writers feel about characters. One such website led to a fake blog which conveniently had a post about various psychological illnesses.

The post's theme was "Remind you of anyone?", and the disorders listed are casually winking at the reader to reference characters from the show. For example, he goes over a substance abuse related psychological disorder, referencing Jesse. Then he goes over Kleptomania, referencing Marie. The final disorder? Antisocial Personality Disorder, a clear reference to Walt, with the winking clue about "breaking bad" at the end there. Antisocial Personality Disorder is often defined by a lack of conscience, by an inability to genuinely emotionally relate to others. For many of these people, love is a concept that is completely abstract. It means about as much as it takes to get something from another person.

He is a sociopath and the writers have made sure to write him that way. That's also probably why so many show watchers are fooled into thinking he has genuine emotions for his family - sociopaths, in order to function in society, often adapt by learning how to very effectively fake such emotions.

 

[Discotheque]

....nope I think it's pretty safe to say Walt is a black or white character at this point

People take that the wrong way and look at it as criticism. This is a comic book crime show. That's not a bad thing, I wasn't asking for another wire or some shit.

 

[faceless007]

Skylar is a terrible character because she only serves one function and that is to be a giant pain in the ass to Walt at all times, serving to thwart his every move (whether knowingly or unknowingly). It's such a played out, arbitrary character-type and almost always ends up just being irritating.

The reason she seems like a pain in the ass to Walt is because Walt is careless, reckless, irresponsible, dangerous, uncaring, and narcissistic when it comes to how his actions affect his family. Naturally, someone who actually is responsible, empathetic, and caring toward their family is not going to take kindly to someone putting them all in danger.

Arguments like this always conveniently forget Skylar concocting the gambling story and then buying the carwash, which were done for the sole purpose of letting Walt continue down his path while still providing a shred of protection for the family. Yes, Walt was annoyed by having to put up with those charades, because Walt is a selfish asshole who thinks he's invincible. But describing those actions as still "thwarting his every move" only makes sense if you think a cover story wasn't necessary at all, which is delusional.

If anything, Skylar has helped Walt do what he wants more than hurt him. Because he didn't give her any choice.

 

[Ciastek3214]

OH SHIT

BREAKING BAD

BAKING BREAD

OH SHIT

 

[Riggs]

Remember when Eggman got banned for calling Skyler a cunt?


Team Walt, even though I love Jesse. Also Skyler sucks, always bitching. Can't even give Walt proper bacon.

 

[ivysaur12]

....nope I think it's pretty safe to say Walt is a black or white character at this point

People take that the wrong way and look at it as criticism. This is a comic book crime show. That's not a bad thing, I wasn't asking for another wire or some shit.

It's more the blood on everyone else's hands that make it so morally compelling.

 

[Cornballer]

Train sequence is going down in AMC right now.

Fucking awesome.

Bill Burr is hilarious.

 

[Batigol]

She's the most sympathetic character on the show and by far one of the most interesting to watch over 5 seasons. She in no way serves only as a roadblock or a foil for Walt. I don't even know how to respond to that because it's just not the case.
.

Her only purpose is to foil Walt in some capacity.

There is nothing else to her character. She's not funny, interesting or fascinating. There is nothing to her character, except to be an annoyance.

Characters like Gus are Walt terrible people. Far worse than Skyler, but they're great characters, with layers of substance to them.

 

[Anustart]

All you damn #TeamSkyler people are nothing but misandrists.

 

[Glorious Ownage]

What's the best video out there that recaps the most important moments in the first five seasons? I've seen them all but would love a good refresher before tonight

Anyone?