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[Thunder Monkey]

I'm curious.

I really don't like that freaking Upad. Stealing focus away from the best control scheme consoles have introduced yet in the Wiimote to fall back on an archaic design.

I look at the Wii and think why didn't Bioware port the PC version of KotOR and alter the mouse only controls and UI suiting it for the Wii? Why did it's strongest gaming addition (IR sensor) continually get sidestepped for its weakest(motion)?

Is it just because of the hardware? Because it wasn't designed to be PC like? Or is it a case of Nintendo leading and devs following into an abyss of shallow titles and missed opportunities?

It seems crazy, and might well be, but I look at the Upad and think "Why?" Asymmetric gameplay? What if it's more entertaining for someone using a Wiimote? That odd one out has to play the less enjoyable form of the game.

Honestly the entire controller concept just seems to me like "Well... what other idea do we have?" And that doesn't inspire much confidence.

Though honestly given developer attitudes about new control schemes it may help. I'd just rather they be dragged kicking and screaming into the future than the industry become stagnant on a singular path.

 

[Loofy]

I remember reading the IGN articles talking about how miyamoto was flying over from japan and forced some major gameplay changes in Eternal Darkness(apparently the game played terribly in public demos). After Too Human, its apparent ED was only decent because of Nintendo and that SK cant really do anything by themselves.

 

[AlexBasch]

I'm not sure I want one either, but I'd wager it's for different reasons than most GAFers.

I'm just not interested in Nintendo games, and mostly will get it once it reaches ridiculous low prices.

But I'm guessing that tablet-controller will keep the thing expensive.

 

[Thunder Monkey]

I'm just not interested in Nintendo games, and mostly will get it once it reaches ridiculous low prices.

But I'm guessing that tablet-controller will keep the thing expensive.

I definitely have different motivations than you.

And most likely my dislike of the Upad will evaporate the second I see Mario, Metroid, or Zelda on the thing. ED wouldn't sell me on it, a game that I enjoyed, but have never received a sequel to, and yet a new Mario or Zelda likely will.

So when I say not sold, that's kind of thin reasoning. I just don't like the Upad, but games can still motivate me.

 

[Mifune]

I remember reading the IGN articles talking about how miyamoto was flying over from japan and forced some major gameplay changes in Eternal Darkness(apparently the game played terribly in the playable demos). After Too Human, its apparent ED was only decent because of Nintendo and that SK cant really do anything by themselves.

One thing Nintendo helped with was giving the game a tutorial. And that's something Too Human desperately needed.

I don't really remember reading about any drastic gameplay changes. More just streamlining and refining the gameplay. Again, TH could have used some of that.

 

[Father_Brain]

I enjoyed ED on GC, but it sold, what, 500-600K worldwide? How would allocating an HD budget to a sequel make any sense for Nintendo?

 

[TUROK]

For a forum that has a distinct reputation of directly pissing off Denis Dyack, this thread sure is insult-free. Eternal Darkness for the Wii-U would make me buy the console in a heartbeat.

 

[Thunder Monkey]

For a forum that has a distinct reputation of directly pissing off Denis Dyack, this thread sure is insult-free. Eternal Darkness for the Wii-U would make me buy the console in a heartbeat.

I can't fault someone for being a loudmouthed jackass.

I've been accused of it more than a few times.

 

[CubeHands]

For a forum that has a distinct reputation of directly pissing off Denis Dyack, this thread sure is insult-free. Eternal Darkness for the Wii-U would make me buy the console in a heartbeat.

Because ED is every gamers dirty little secret.

 

[MutFox]

Eternal Darkness had some of the coolest sounds...
I loved casting in that game.

 

[Bluth54]

I would love to see another Eternal Darkness, but I have doubts that the modern Silicon Knights would be able to do the IP any justice.

 

[zerotol]

I'll help you out there: games don't age.

Well, they certainly do. Some games age better than others. RE4 has aged well. It's still playable today. Vice City has not.

 

[Dascu]

I want to believe.

 

[Chemo]

Given their track record, I can't really imagine anyone giving too much of a shit about this. Silicon Knights is a bad developer, and even if Eternal Darkness was acceptable to some (though admittedly not me), I cannot realistically see this studio producing a game that delivers on all of the hopes and dreams of the fans of the first.

 

[Night_Trekker]

Well, they certainly do. Some games age better than others. RE4 has aged well. It's still playable today. Vice City has not.

No they don't. People age. They actually change as they get older. Games don't age. Your expectations change and your memories betray you.

Being reasonable with expectations means anyone can enjoy older games for what they are instead of dismissing them for what they aren't. But a lot of gamers aren't that mature.

 

[JasonUresti]

No they don't. People age. They actually change as they get older. Games don't age. Your expectations change and your memories betray you.

Being reasonable with expectations means anyone can enjoy older games for what they are instead of dismissing them for what they aren't. But a lot of gamers aren't that mature.

It's an expression, friendo. It happens in all forms of media/entertainment, some games, albums, books, etc., are "of their time". Fundamentally they aren't as strong, and the things that seemed so novel and interesting during their day wither a bit under Father Time's merciless march forward.

For games, it could be something simple, like missing features that became commonplace due to their universal worth (early RTSs lacking click and drag to select, early FPS that allowed and required you to aim up and down not supporting the mouse).

 

[Night_Trekker]

It's an expression, friendo.

The meaning of the expression clearly isn't obvious to many of the people who say it over and over on NeoGAF, bub. People who actually say older games are "unplayable" when they raved about them years prior. It's fucking absurd.

Again, if you (the general "you") love games (or movies or books or...), you can keep your expectations in check and enjoy older titles for what they are. If what you really love is dazzling spectacle and are only capable of enjoying games when they overlap with dazzling spectacle, please play something new so you don't subject everyone else to the sound of your entitled bitching.

 

[WhyMe6]

I enjoyed ED on GC, but it sold, what, 500-600K worldwide? How would allocating an HD budget to a sequel make any sense for Nintendo?

I'm not sure if any studies or analyses have been done on this, particularly because there are so many variables that determine the success of a new IP, but I'd be interested to see that, if this were in development and if it had been so for much longer than we expected (X-Men Destiny has all the hallmarks of being a side project), whether or not being a launch title would help its chances of success.

Launch titles stand out far more to all consumers over a quiet release or a release in the middle of a busy period. There's usually a very limited selection pool, a range of ports/yearly updates, and some core titles that stand out. Coupled with some promotion from Nintendo, the fact that it is a "Nintendo" game and it could definitely find success, especially with some Eternal Darkness eShop promo (free download code included for an upres version of the original?).

I'd also be interested to see a continua demonstrating the game's sales adjacent to the GCN's overall userbase. An equivalent attach rate % could be then created and used to compare against current gen consoles. Was 600k on the GCN a success? Tentatively, the game sold to 2.76% of the GCN's userbase at the end of its lifetime, which is equivalent to selling 1.8m copies on the PS360, 2.62m copies on the Wii. Therefore, you could say that it was quite a success considering overall GCN sales. If the numbers were calculated upon ED's launch, that % would be much greater. Of course, there are a range of reasons that this is a terrible argument, but I wouldn't call the game a failure at all.

 

[Lord Ghirahim]

Eternal Darkness 2 would be the one thing to get me to buy a non-JP Wii U this year.

 

[zerotol]

No they don't. People age. They actually change as they get older. Games don't age. Your expectations change and your memories betray you.

Being reasonable with expectations means anyone can enjoy older games for what they are instead of dismissing them for what they aren't. But a lot of gamers aren't that mature.

Games don't age? Balls. There are games that have stood the test of time for good reason. Others haven't, again, for good reason. Some games don't age well.

 

[MDX]

Conclusion

They're working on Eternal Darkness 2 for the WiiU, aren't they?

Its this because the game will also make use of this:

Wii Vitality Sensor: Nintendo’s newest groundbreaking product, the Wii Vitality Sensor, expands the appeal of video games. It will initially sense the user’s pulse and a number of other signals being transmitted by their bodies, and will then provide information to the users about the body’s inner world.

Which had to do with this:

As explained above, the sanity of the player's character will be affected by decisions made, enemies faced, as well as any other suitable occurrence that may relate to sanity. As the character loses sanity, the environment will change in a way that hinders the character's and player's progress through the game. The instant invention provides an added challenge and enables multiple possible scenarios, so that playing of the game may be different each time the game is played. It is noted that the invention is particularly suited for implementation in action/adventure/RPG games, but that it may be used in any suitable video game or the like.

originally filed way back in the year 2000, and was intended to cover a feature of the GameCube game Eternal Darkness, which was released in 2002.

 

[StoppedInTracks]

Metal Gear Solid: Quad Snakes?

 

[Krev]

I enjoyed ED on GC, but it sold, what, 500-600K worldwide? How would allocating an HD budget to a sequel make any sense for Nintendo?

It's been so long since the first game that another instalment would effectively be a franchise relaunch. I'm sure it would be 'Eternal Darkness: Scary Subtitle', not 'Eternal Darkness 2', and it would have a storyline that's comprehensible to newcomers.
Perhaps Nintendo see it as a franchise with potential and are interested in taking another shot at it. It has a world and concepts that are unique in today's gaming landscape. Being tied to a cult-classic would help the new game attract hype and coverage from the gaming press that a new IP wouldn't see. Nintendo would be hoping that this winds up selling it to many who never touched the original.

No they don't. People age. They actually change as they get older. Games don't age. Your expectations change and your memories betray you.

Being reasonable with expectations means anyone can enjoy older games for what they are instead of dismissing them for what they aren't. But a lot of gamers aren't that mature.

Agreed.

I really don't like that freaking Upad. Stealing focus away from the best control scheme consoles have introduced yet in the Wiimote to fall back on an archaic design.

I look at the Wii and think why didn't Bioware port the PC version of KotOR and alter the mouse only controls and UI suiting it for the Wii? Why did it's strongest gaming addition (IR sensor) continually get sidestepped for its weakest(motion)?

Is it just because of the hardware? Because it wasn't designed to be PC like? Or is it a case of Nintendo leading and devs following into an abyss of shallow titles and missed opportunities?

It seems crazy, and might well be, but I look at the Upad and think "Why?" Asymmetric gameplay? What if it's more entertaining for someone using a Wiimote? That odd one out has to play the less enjoyable form of the game.

Honestly the entire controller concept just seems to me like "Well... what other idea do we have?" And that doesn't inspire much confidence.

Though honestly given developer attitudes about new control schemes it may help. I'd just rather they be dragged kicking and screaming into the future than the industry become stagnant on a singular path.

I hear you. The underuse of the pointer was criminal. It was nice to play Pikmin and Anno on the thing, but there should have been a ton of strategy games for the system. We got Telltale ports and Zack & Wiki, but it was criminal that Nintendo didn't make a point and click adventure game for Wii. It could have been huge.
And of course, the IR sensor should have been the future of first-person games on consoles. It leaves twin-stick control under a thick layer of dust. But we got Metroid Prime 3, Red Steel, Goldeneye, CoD downports and uh, The Conduit, and it looks like the system could fade away forever. I don't see Sony pushing it on PS4 now that motion controllers are no longer a craze.

It's just very sad. So much missed potential.

I can't help but feel the same way about Nintendo going with the tablet concept. Back when everyone was going nuts speculating about what the mysterious Revolution controller feature could possibly be, one of the most common guesses was 'touchscreen'. It's the obvious, which does lead me to believe that the 'what other ideas do we have?' scenario may be very close to the truth. Rather than being the cornerstone of a bold vision for gaming Nintendo want to run with, it seems like it was put into the controller simply to satisfy the expectation that they must include some kind of 'revolutionary' gimmick in all their forthcoming consoles. That's not to say that it doesn't have some great qualities, but it seems more like they decided to run with the most workable idea that they had (and struggle to think up compelling game designs for it), not like it's something truly visionary and necessary, like the Wii mote was.

Perhaps Nintendo feel it makes sense to introduce a controller like this now because of the influence of competition coming from Apple, but they will always come up short if consumers are going to directly compare their products. Should Nintendo really be trying to position themselves closer to an industry so thoroughly dominated by a behemoth like Apple? I think differentiation is key, and that's what I'm hoping to see from them at E3.

 

[Sadist]

Please be Eternal Darkness II

 

[Shiggy]

What we know:

- SK is working on an IP fans are requesting
- SK focusses on the next generation already
- Concerning next gen hardware, they only have Wii U kits right now
- SK wants to work on blockbusters, but most publishers are not willing to fund further SK-money-eating projects
- Nintendo still has a major stake in SK and they still own the ED trademark

Yeah, it is Eternal Darkness for Wii U.

 

[Danielsan]

Unless it looks shockingly good I'm not touching any silicon Knights/Dyack games.

 

[Gianni Merryman]

What we know:

- SK is working on an IP fans are requesting
- SK focusses on the next generation already
- Concerning next gen hardware, they only have Wii U kits right now
- SK wants to work on blockbusters, but most publishers are not willing to fund further SK-money-eating projects
- Nintendo still has a major stake in SK and they still own the ED trademark

Yeah, it is Eternal Darkness for Wii U.

Yes, summing all things up it makes pretty much sense, if we know as a fact they're working on a WiiU's game, that they haven't confirmed explicitally so it's still just a speculation for now.

 

[Shiggy]

Yes, summing all things up it makes pretty much sense, if we know as a fact they're working on a WiiU's game, that they haven't confirmed explicitally so it's still just a speculation for now.

We know that they've ported their technology to Wii U last year, and we also know that they are presenting a title this year. As the other next generation platfrorms are said to be unveiled in 2013 or later, we can assume that this is a Wii U title.

 

[seady]

I want Eternal Darkness 2, but I know Dennis will end up raping my memories of the awesome original.

 

[bunbun777]

I am already getting scared- ED: SR was the only game I couldn't stomach. Too freaky with the sounds and glitches and tentacles.... had to bail I admit it.

 

[Opus Angelorum]

It would certainly help Nintendo appeal to the mature market if the Wii U did have a dark title like ED near launch.

 

[RoyalFool]

How are they affording to develop a next-gen title? when so many developers who've actually sold some games in the last few years are having to cancel them. Are they getting some kind of tax-relief or win the Epic lawsuit?

 

[Anasui Kishibe]

I really don't like that freaking Upad. Stealing focus away from the best control scheme consoles have introduced yet in the Wiimote to fall back on an archaic design.

I look at the Wii and think why didn't Bioware port the PC version of KotOR and alter the mouse only controls and UI suiting it for the Wii? Why did it's strongest gaming addition (IR sensor) continually get sidestepped for its weakest(motion)?

Is it just because of the hardware? Because it wasn't designed to be PC like? Or is it a case of Nintendo leading and devs following into an abyss of shallow titles and missed opportunities?

It seems crazy, and might well be, but I look at the Upad and think "Why?" Asymmetric gameplay? What if it's more entertaining for someone using a Wiimote? That odd one out has to play the less enjoyable form of the game.

Honestly the entire controller concept just seems to me like "Well... what other idea do we have?" And that doesn't inspire much confidence.

Though honestly given developer attitudes about new control schemes it may help. I'd just rather they be dragged kicking and screaming into the future than the industry become stagnant on a singular path.

Monkey, come on. I bet you ten Nintendo develops new controllers with already a lot of gameplay enhancements in mind. How it will get used by other devs is a mystery but at least Nintendo first parties will make good use of it

 

[Krev]

We know that they've ported their technology to Wii U last year, and we also know that they are presenting a title this year. As the other next generation platfrorms are said to be unveiled in 2013 or later, we can assume that this is a Wii U title.

...what

How are they affording to develop a next-gen title? when so many developers who've actually sold some games in the last few years are having to cancel them. Are they getting some kind of tax-relief or win the Epic lawsuit?

Nintendo funding.
It's the only answer.

Epic lawsuit goes to trail next month.

 

[Kifimbo]

I enjoyed ED on GC, but it sold, what, 500-600K worldwide? How would allocating an HD budget to a sequel make any sense for Nintendo?

Silicon Knights is heavily subsidised, so the financial risk for Nintendo is probably low. Otherwise, I agree, it doesn't make sense.

 

[Thunder Monkey]

Monkey, come on. I bet you ten Nintendo develops new controllers with already a lot of gameplay enhancements in mind. How it will get used by other devs is a mystery but at least Nintendo first parties will make good use of it

I see the Upad at least as represented so far as more of a gimmick than the Wiimote ever was. The Wiimote had some fairly drastic controller improvements, some flaws in the design that hindered it, but mouse-like control in a videogame controller is a hell of a deal.

E3 may change that, but I definitely don't feel any inspiration in it. It seems like a flimsy deal they made with developers. "Okay you guys can have your twin sticks and buttons, but we get other control schemes to toy around with."

I can only hope a Wiimote is packed in. If it is, we might see some cool Wiimote applications from competent devs.

 

[1-D_FTW]

4.) Vague hype so that everyone thinks SK is working on their favorite title. With the issues they're having with the government, it wouldn't be bad PR for people to think they've really got their stuff together and are about to release a real crowd-pleaser. By not being specific, every group of fans can think it's their #1 game that's about to hit.

 

[Woo-Fu]

It has to be ED. It'd probably be a cold day in Hell before SK got the rights to create another LoK game. Considering they seem to end up suing every company they work with except Nintendo I doubt Eidos would pick them to bring back LoK.

 

[fabricated backlash]

I keep my expectations in Check. And that's coming from someone who genuinely enjoyed Too Human.


But Eternal Darkness, despite it's many many flaws, was one of, if not "the" best story driven horror adventure games I've ever played. It's amazingly focused, well written, some of the voice actor performances are outright ridiculously good and the audio directing in the game was sublime.

But, and that's a huge But(t)

a sequel would need to have vastly improved gameplay and controls, as well as more engaging combat. I don't even care much about graphics, as even the original couldn't hide it's N64 roots, but if a potential sequel couldn't deliver on the gameplay front, that would be a fucking shame. Even ED felt outdated when it came to controls. It was painfully obvious that the game started as an N64 game the second you got control over Pius.

And even then, they would need to get a story, an antagonist, and a main character that's as well written, delivered and executed as in the original. And honestly, I doubt that Pius can be trumped.

 

[tim.mbp]

What we know:

- SK is working on an IP fans are requesting
- SK focusses on the next generation already
- Concerning next gen hardware, they only have Wii U kits right now
- SK wants to work on blockbusters, but most publishers are not willing to fund further SK-money-eating projects
- Nintendo still has a major stake in SK and they still own the ED trademark

Yeah, it is Eternal Darkness for Wii U.

HD port of Eternal Darkness?

 

[Cousteau]

A Linsanity effect is a must.

 

[Hot Coldman]

I can't fault someone for being a loudmouthed jackass.

I've been accused of it more than a few times.

Yes, but you're good at it.

 

[Shiggy]

...what

Nintendo funding.
It's the only answer.

Epic lawsuit goes to trail next month.

A resume revealed that they ported their technology last year. I cannot find a quote for the 2012 reveal part though, so I might have remembered that part wrongly.

 

[Spieler Eins]

I just really...REALLY hope this isn't nintendo's "one more thing" at the end of their conference. As much as I'd love a sequel to ED, that'd kinda suck tbh.

No way. If it exists, I wouldn't be surprised if the trailer is only shown somewhere hidden on the Nintendo page like Monado, lol.
But now I just can't stop imagining Reggie on the conference going through some WiiU games in detail as usual, my hype meter already overwhelming my soul after getting introduced to HD Pikmin and others, then a new trailer starts with some narrator ,,Deep into that darkness peering...''.
Something would be all over my face.

Honestly, I just hope for them to be a bit more subtle. Blood dripping from the walls, statues following you, the smaller things in the first that made it believable.

I wasn't a fan of most of the effects because they weren't convincing. The system muting, or your body falling apart, gravity shifting. They all took me out of the experience because they stalled the action. White flash! and your movements matter again.

It was just really sloppy. I'd want them to tone down the explicit ones, and focus more on the subtle. Shadows occasionally stalking you, an unintelligible voice talks to you through the controller, sometimes the clocks have eyes. Small touches. The game was never scary to me, this kind of thinking could make it so.

There was some unnecessary stuff, that would also repeat too often, but I still also liked some of those, like TV turning off or seemingly deleting all your save files by accident.

I'd be more interested in this game because of its artstyle and environments (plus changing over eras) anyway. The goddamn church...

 

[The Boat]

What we know:

- Nintendo still has a major stake in SK

Huh? They do?

 

[Krev]

A resume revealed that they ported their technology last year. I cannot find a quote for the 2012 reveal part though, so I might have remembered that part wrongly.

Very interesting.

 

[EatChildren]

A resume revealed that they ported their technology last year. I cannot find a quote for the 2012 reveal part though, so I might have remembered that part wrongly.

Jeff Giffen. To quote his resume:

Platforms/Software:
Nintendo
Wii, Wii U
Revolution SDK, Project Café, Freescale Codewarrior for Wii 1.5

....


Wii Technology Development
Wii U SDK knowledge
Implemented dynamic shadowing on the GP, with scaling detail and a fixed memory footprint. Supported full scene and per-dynamic shadowing, with up to 4x post pass shadow output.
Constructed a TEV based depth of field post process. Featured 4x Gaussian blur, and near / far twin focus fields.
Optimized the EFB copy-out system and the post process memory to be shared between the shadowing and depth of field techniques. This was also ground work for distortion effect support.
Developed threaded static geometry command buffer construction via GD.
Upgraded renderer to support tiling for HD output. Integrated Revolution screenshot tool, and upgraded it to accept the HD output.
Installed custom interrupt handlers, with on screen call stack print and screenshot.
Built in character fade support via a depth shell prepass render.
Implemented 3D Combat Text pop-ups.
Installed custom Thread Local Storage support
Added 16:9 and progressive video output, as well as PAL support.
Installed Home Button Menu, Banner, Icon, Strap Screen, controller disconnection messages, and other varying TCR requirements.

 

[Gianni Merryman]

HD port of Eternal Darkness?

It doesn't make sense to me.

As has been already pointed out, ED didn't sell spectacularly on Gamecube to start with - and back then Gamecube owners had hardly plenty of stuff to choose from - so a plain HD port would hardly justify the costs of the operation, besides it could end up being one of the biggest bombs in videogame history IMO, and both Nintendo and SK must be fully aware that times have changed since.

 

[Barry Burton]

Sign me up for a sequel. I really loved the first one.

 

[Despera]

Its this because the game will also make use of this:

Which had to do with this:

Yep. The vitality sensor sounds like the perfect fit for Eternal Darkness. Looking forward to this or a new LoK title.