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Destiny 2: "Guided Games" only works with normal difficulty for Raids (and Nightfall)
- Thread starter ZeoVGM
- Start date
Interficium
Banned
I'm here for these kind of meltdowns.
for real
Literally in what I posted.
I did all of them and yes I did it via the external LFG. It was the same type of people I had to deal with the in-game matchmaking in other MMO's like FF14. Regardless if the LFG is internal or external, it won't stop people from being bad so it doesn't excuse Bungie from not including the same function in-game.
Flying Toaster
Member
Honestly does not surprise me at all. I will still be there day one because I like the abuse. But Destiny 2 seems half baked.
Edit: By half baked I mean in the sense that a lot of ideas are coming in after the fact. With Destiny GAF and other sources it is not hard to find raid groups or nightfall parties.
Edit: By half baked I mean in the sense that a lot of ideas are coming in after the fact. With Destiny GAF and other sources it is not hard to find raid groups or nightfall parties.
Bungie can't force someone to use voice. Secondly, we don't know the intricacies of GG. I am sure booting won't be that simple. Bungie wants to protect the group and the solo player from trolling.
We don't know how they're balancing it.
psynergylover
Member
even if it did, you would just exit the activity then choose the harder difficulty.
Ryouji Gunblade
Member
Are they saying it could be changed post launch? I want those heroic Nightfalls with random people ready to go. Shouldn't be bad since current Nightfalls are a joke to beat with 2 people anyway.
Except Bungie specifically stated that more than half the community never touched a raid so obviously a sizable amount of people won't find a way. I mean it's great that they provided the function for the normal Raid and Nightfall easy mode but why stop there? It's just the same half-measure that Bungie is known for.
Good point. They should also remove any cryptarchs and have people go to third-party websites to decode their engrams. Wouldn't want the game to hold anyone's hand.
So basically, Bungie knows best and we should never question it. Of course.
So why doesn't Nightfall have the option despite the absolute fact that you don't need communication?
Why didn't Prison of Elders (non-Skolas) and Challenge of the Elders have matchmaking? Why no optional matchmaking for the weekly story or normal missions?
(All of this while the strikes that were specific to quests, and harder than Nightfalls at times, had matchmaking in Destiny 1.)
There is absolutely zero logic or reasoning to Bungie's choices here. And the argument of "communication" falls apart when it can't be applied to other activities in the game.
They found a great middle ground here. It's not blind matchmaking but it's an in-game way to jump in and do a Raid or a Nightfall. Yet they refuse to go all the way for nonsense reasons.
From Bungie's perspective, the decision was probably made from a "player experience" point of view.
Imagine a casual player wanting to jump into a Heroic raid. They probably think "hey I'm alright at this, I got matched with a decent group in the normal raid, I got carried a little, I can do this Heroic version", then matched against a group that wants to finish the Heroic Raid ASAP.
That less experienced player would obviously die a few times, the party would need to wipe, and it would be completely opposite of what the group was looking for. Imagine what this would eventually lead to.... imagine the language and verbal punishment that player would receive.
Even in Destiny 1 LFG, I have seen countless people say "I'm experienced, I've done Heroic many times, easy, send me an Invite" and then just expect to be carried. When that person dies numerous times, and the party realizes he just expects to get carried, the verbal abuse is insane.
I completely agree.
xiaxdragon
Banned
Anthem feels EXACTLY like the destiny 1 reveal.....which means I'll wait for reviews.....before I even get anywhere near hyped
Lol, when did I say Bungie knows best and why are you talking about Destiny 1?
17 Seconds
Banned
oh my gooooooood will the stupid destiny matchmaking "controversy" ever end? lfg sites are not hard to use, people.
and once again, the vast majority of people complaining are people who have no idea what a destiny raid entails.
and once again, the vast majority of people complaining are people who have no idea what a destiny raid entails.
... Because they're doing the same stuff here? I'm giving examples of activities in Destiny 1 that could have had BLIND matchmaking yet didn't, meaning the argument of "you need communication" falls apart.
The same thing applies here: no matchmaking for Nightfalls and from what we know, no matchmaking for missions.
NullPointer
Member
And aren't psychic like you I guess.
FingerBang
Member
That's why the internet exists. I like being part of it.
Is LFG hard to put in the game? And Destiny raids don't entail that much, lol.
Mass Appeal
Member
Ugh I knew Guided games was too good to be true.
I understand why some people think this is how it should be but that's not how it should be. I love DGAF and Discord but Bungie really shouldn't be afraid to give it's fans more options.
If anything why not just have heroic guided games unlock once the individual completes the regular raid and NF once ? I understand they want people to learn mechanics but I feel completing a activity once is more then enough.
I understand why some people think this is how it should be but that's not how it should be. I love DGAF and Discord but Bungie really shouldn't be afraid to give it's fans more options.
If anything why not just have heroic guided games unlock once the individual completes the regular raid and NF once ? I understand they want people to learn mechanics but I feel completing a activity once is more then enough.
scooblehdoo
Member
Reading comments against matchmaking for heroic is just weird... As if everyone in matchmaking is complete brain dead and doesn't have the slightest idea what they are doing. Having choices is good! If your random team sucks, so be it, you have the choice to leave and find another group. Just like lfg groups, sometimes you join a great team where everything goes smooth, sometimes you won't.
But yeah bungie, make it more difficult for people to play your game by forcing them to use those elitist lfg shit where you need to hand in a resume before being allowed to join.
But yeah bungie, make it more difficult for people to play your game by forcing them to use those elitist lfg shit where you need to hand in a resume before being allowed to join.
KINGofCRA5H
Member
Welp.
17 Seconds
Banned
huh? we know what a destiny raid is.
Not the correct choice...the only choice
Anyone who has played hard mode raids knows this...
Yep only once or twice gone with an lfg group for a hard raid...early in the cycle for a new raid it is always a mistake
Anyone who has played hard mode raids knows this...
Yep only once or twice gone with an lfg group for a hard raid...early in the cycle for a new raid it is always a mistake
I don't have a problem with restricting the highest tier of raid content to pre-made groups. I also tend to think that the people running that content are going to be so discriminating that it opens up the door for a lot of gear snobbery that Bungie always disliked.
So many people complained that they needed match-making because all they wanted to do was just see the raid, to experience the raid. Well now you can find people to raid with, but apparently that's not enough? Now you have to see both normal and heroic raids?
So many people complained that they needed match-making because all they wanted to do was just see the raid, to experience the raid. Well now you can find people to raid with, but apparently that's not enough? Now you have to see both normal and heroic raids?
NullPointer
Member
And you know the vast majority complaining?
Salty Rice
Member
Not the issue. Players shouldn't have to use them. In-game LFG should exist for heroic difficulty.
almostjuliuscaesar
Member
oh bungie lol
the vast majority seem to be people saying "oh I guess I wont play the raids again". People that have completed Heroic raids would know including matchmaking would be the wrong choice.
17 Seconds
Banned
they require all 6 people to have microphones and know very detailed and specific mechanics and sequences. destiny raids aren't about shooting, they're about carrying out choreography while dealing with enemies trying to mess it up. your average player is not going to spend time researching how it's all done beforehand, and teaching even one unprepared person is a very painstaking experience.
even the lfg sites are very hit or miss. an easy in-game lfg that allows people to just hop into a raid on a whim would. not. work.
Hero_of_the_Day
Member
LOL. Fucking Bungie. Never gave a fuck about doing the raids on heroic, so doesn't effect me. But, still just goofy.
I have. You're wrong.
This isn't blind matchmaking. Having Guided Games, which is a form of LFG and not straight blind matchmaking. It would work fine. And if you don't want to use it, don't.
Mass Appeal
Member
I don't think it's the wrong choice at all and this is from someone who has over a thousand hours in Destiny and has completed every single raid with challenge modes. I am all for Bungie giving more options to everyone. I don't understand those of you saying it would be a bad experience...it wouldn't be mandatory and if you still wanted to use DGAF, Discord or the LFG sites, more power to you.
It's beyond stupid not having MM for Nightfalls. I have done many Nightfalls through 100.io or Reddit fireteams and most of the time, no one says shit.
Why are you against having all the options of getting a team together in game? That seems to be the argument.
17 Seconds
Banned
i know what a destiny raid is, and i've seen this argument a million times.
Nydius
Member
Whether they're difficult to use or not is irrelevant, the point is we shouldn't need to use them at all. LFG tools should be completely in game.
I can only speak for myself but I'm sick to death of the reliance of third party apps/sites for Destiny game management. I mean FFS, I have an entire folder on my iPhone dedicated to third party apps for Destiny. Ishtar Collective so I can have a better inventory management system and gear manager. Crossroads and Destiny LFG for group finding. Destiny Public Events for public event timers. With exception to the public events timer, there's no reason these things should be standard features in game.
E:
Holy shit. Maybe it's because I spent a decade as a core raider in WoW but this entire description of Destiny raids made me laugh and roll my eyes. The "mechanics" in most of the raids, even heroic raids, are nothing short of a fucking joke. The only time they present any real challenge is - wait for it - when you're doing challenge modes. Researching it all beforehand... lol. Destiny mechanics are as straight forward as you can get.
If you think the mechanics for Crota or Aksis is anywhere close to Kael'thas, Arthas, or, shit, even OG Nefarian... just LOL. I'd love to see people who think the mechanics on heroic Destiny raids take on OG AQ40 Twin Emperors or Deathwing.
Double Donut
Member
The raids are one thing, but I don't see many people here acknowledging the fact this this applies to the heroic nightfall strike as well. Are you fucking joking with me?
Why does Bungie act like the nightfall is some super hardcore activity that requires teamwork? It's just a strike that's maybe 2% harder than other strikes. Most PUGs nowadays run them mic-less because there's literally no need for communication. It's just a strike.
Granted, we don't know if the nightfall is getting some insane changes or something in D2, but I doubt they'll be much harder than what we have now.
Why does Bungie act like the nightfall is some super hardcore activity that requires teamwork? It's just a strike that's maybe 2% harder than other strikes. Most PUGs nowadays run them mic-less because there's literally no need for communication. It's just a strike.
Granted, we don't know if the nightfall is getting some insane changes or something in D2, but I doubt they'll be much harder than what we have now.
Yes it would.
And hell, there are ways to make it more specific:
- Must be a specific LL.
- Game must detect a mic.
- Group can vote on booting a member
- They can even make it so that you have to beat the difficulty once, from start to finish, with a pre-made Fireteam before unlocking the Guided Games option.
There are really easy solutions to this. It's been 3 years and Bungie still has no clue.
Balmung421
Member
Would chat channels on PC fix this? Wonder if they will have LFG chat channels
Aside from that being an overstatement of the difficulty of raids in Destiny (Templar challenge: stand in the back and shoot!), how would putting LFG in game not work? Take the same options available on LFG sites, and put them in the game, e.g. a public post saying what you're looking for, how many players you have, your equipment, noob friendly/hostile, etc. What reason in the world could there be for not putting that in the game? How is having it on a website any better?
ElBoxyBrown
Banned
I can't say I'm dissappointed since I was never gonna use "guided games" anyway. No matter how you slice it matchmaking was never gonna solve the issue of finding people for raids or Nightfalls. Even if I used it I would go back to using LFG to find people that are determined to spend more than an hour to complete a raid or Nightfall without quitting. People don't play around when say that Destiny is a social game.
I like how people are always saying "other mmo's do it."
I remember when WoW first released heroic dungeons. Bliz had to nerf the shit out of them because of the backlash do to pick up groups not being able to complete them.
I truly believe they aren't allowing heroic MM because it will mostly be a disgusting experience for most random groups. I think the backlash they are receiving now is far less than what it would be if they had MM for heroic modes.
I remember when WoW first released heroic dungeons. Bliz had to nerf the shit out of them because of the backlash do to pick up groups not being able to complete them.
I truly believe they aren't allowing heroic MM because it will mostly be a disgusting experience for most random groups. I think the backlash they are receiving now is far less than what it would be if they had MM for heroic modes.
Because I think it will cause more damage than benefit. People will get frustrated, annoyed and eventually angry, which will result in negative experience for the casual Destiny player.
Removing an in game feature that encourages a negative experience for the average player is the best option.
Guys, this isn't about blind matchmaking.
It's about one or two people being matched with a pre-made group of 5 or 6 people.
Please stop defending Bungie's choice as if it were blind matchmaking. It's completely different.