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[LukasTaves]

30fps though.

60fps won't increase the framebuffer size. It would increase bandwidth usage, but that esram is very good at, and with foward+ that's even less of an issue.

It's fine on PS4, so again, hardware problem.

Weren't people talking before launch of the systems saying the Xbox One wasn't going to be able to handle deferred rendering properly because of the eSRAM? So it's hardly something new.

Yeah, 32mb might not be able to hold a fat 1080p buffer at once, but the hardware wasn't designed to be used like that, so the software needs to adapt.

Or not. Performance is a bit of egg/chicken kind of problem. I'd say that it's indisputable that for the current scenario, xbone's design is clearly far from ideal, even if in some theoretical scenarios the esram could be a huge win.

Only resolution is important. Maybe phrase grass in terms of grassolution and I'm in.


I've seen you post several times about using the move engines for that thing, but which game has made those improvements you speak of and where can I see their post-mortems? (Or just technical slides)

Streaming the framebuffer into esram? I think no game has done that yet. More recent xbone SDKs have a residency flag you can mark any content to be tied to a memory pool, but that's still statically allocated AFAIK.

But, Ms guidelines for performance on xbone (and it's alluded as far back as the leaked docs) visualizes this scenario, streaming data into esram utilizing just small buffers for each stream is how Ms designed the console for maximum performance.

But, that doesn't mean situation will necessarily improve, last gen not even Ms themselves developed engines that handled tiling on edram by using the "ideal scenario", and many developers have spoken now that Ms' tools were really lacking.

The only slide I have at hand is tthis one

But let's be honest, most devs tried to adjust their engines to use the PS3, it just took a lot longer as the Cell was something you had to get used to and required a lot of work to get it running in a decent way.

I think Cell was only a problem in the start of generation, later days it became the lifeguard of the design... I think in the later days the problem was they couldn't rely more on cell as for some tasks that would mean increased delay.

 

[Windom Earle]

Knowing this is a Fox Engine thread, is it safe to assume it's full of "lazy devs"?

 

[omonimo]

Knowing this is a Fox Engine thread, is it safe to assume it's full of "lazy devs"?

More lazy hardware.

 

[Chobel]

Knowing this is a Fox Engine thread, is it safe to assume it's full of "lazy devs"?

Change that to "garbage devs" and your assumption is true.

 

[ypo]

lol therer sure are alot of qualifiers in the article.

 

[Journey]

All on the fox engine? Surely we have to give Xbox hardware some share of the blame. However big or small that share may be.

It's all to blame...


Because it sucks at running the Fox Engine... better?

Jk

 

[LiquidNarwhal]

I'm playing the Xbox One version of PES 2015 from about 2 weeks, i used to play FIFA from 2008 till 2 weeks ago, but than i tried the new PES and i saw it was way and way better than FIFA 15, that's the real soccer, gameplay is awesome not even comparable with that garbage EA made...But unfortunately i'm noticed the 720p resolution on One, and it was a bit annoying, but after a while i got used to it and i like better even the graphics and animation of this game than FIFA 15. However komani must stop this and start pushing Xbox One hardware too, instead of duing all tha job on PS4 and just a simple port on Xbone, is not possible that Xbox One can't handle that graphics at 1080p and 60fps, while it can in similar games such as FIFA 15 or the other sports games around, it was a bit understandable in MG Ground Zeroes due the dimension of that game, but even there the gap between 720p vs 1080p seemed too much, 900p and 1080p would be more realistic if they worked as they're supposed to do on Xbox One, unfortunately this seems to me a problem of a pretty traditional japanese company which doesn't like at all foreign console, especially now that that foreign console is not even the market leader console anymore.

The logic behind this post might be one of the most racist things I've ever read.

 

[Elandyll]

Just realized that DF had indeed posted their comparison for PES 2015...

Even more of a gut punch (for the XB1) than expected in some ways, as the textures are also (slightly) better on PS4 and the framerate is a perfect 60fps on both versions, but I also realized ... We know that both PES and MGS: TPP are using the Fox engine, but won't Silent Hills use it as well?

 

[Lettuce]

Is this game using the that Fox dye engine or whatever its called?

 

[omonimo]

Just realized that DF had indeed posted their comparison for PES 2015...

Even more of a gut punch (for the XB1) than expected in some ways, as the textures are also (slightly) better on PS4 and the framerate is a perfect 60fps on both versions, but I also realized ... We know that both PES and MGS: TPP are using the Fox engine, but won't Silent Hills use it as well?

Won't? Everything from konami it's fox engine, why SHs won't?

 

[Coulomb_Barrier]

This engine seems to really highlight the processing gap between the two platforms. GZ had an even bigger gap.

 

[Duxxy3]

This engine seems to really highlight the pricessing gap between the two platforms. GZ had an even bigger gap.

So far it's the only engine that has this many problems with the xbox one architecture.

 

[Piggus]

Microsoft is just as much at fault than Konami. They could have designed a better system that plays better with games that use that kind of rendering approach.

So true. Deferred rendering was the new standard and the new way forward long before this generation even started. Designing a system that struggles with deferred rending without heavy optimization/workarounds was just plain stupid on Microsoft's part. Forward rendering presents too many limitations compared to deferred rendering.

 

[c0de]

So true. Deferred rendering was the new standard and the new way forward long before this generation even started. Designing a system that struggles with deferred rending without heavy optimization/workarounds was just plain stupid on Microsoft's part. Forward rendering presents too many limitations compared to deferred rendering.

Did you read the whole thread?

 

[AstroNut325]

Before the start of this gen I could have sworn that all the major game engines used deferred renders.

 

[WaffleTaco]

Not surprised at all. MGS 5 is definitely going to be 720p. I just hope they give the option for a higher resolution for less frames per second.

 

[UpUpDownDown]

So far it's the only engine that has this many problems with the xbox one architecture.

Or it might make less concessions for the xbo hardware and use all the ps4 strengths.

Delwithit.gif

...and this is the only engine with problems?? Really?

 

[kitch9]

So far it's the only engine that has this many problems with the xbox one architecture.

Yes, its the only engine that has to make concessions for the Xbox hardware.

The only one.

Yeah, 32mb might not be able to hold a fat 1080p buffer at once, but the hardware wasn't designed to be used like that, so the software needs to adapt.

The designers of the Xbox hardware would not have wanted to use this solution and it is a band aid solution at best. To say its not designed to be used a specific way implies that they saw this as an ideal solution from the start which they didn't.