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Edge #304 - The Legend of Zelda: Breath of the Wild special

edge also gave 10/10 to skyward sword so eh



i'm sure botw will be good but an edge 10/10 don't mean much anymore


Haven't they been around for like 24 years and only handed out like 19 10/10?

When it comes down to it review scores are just opinions. You may feel Skyward Sword wasn't a 10/10 but I'm willing to bet that it was a 10/10 for many. The same way one of your 10/10 may be lower for some one else.


I just find it funny how some Gaf users uses the same info to suit their respective arguement.

10/10 from site = man that site scores are worthless! That score means nothing!

7/10 from same site = Hahahaha! I knew it! Bargain been! Flop! And whatever else is said. DOA? Whatvever.



Not saying you're one of these users.
 

Caelus

Member
Well Gamexplain did say some things about MM in relation to BotW (not storywise).

Yeah, the previews we've heard so far suggest that NPC interaction is more in-depth, with individual schedules and multiple sidequests.

The EDGE review states how it ties into the greater narrative and the consequences for the game's world.

It only confirms a minimum amount of dungeons by the way, not the total amount.
 
The early morning version of this thread was much better when we were all happy that so many great games were releasing.

How on earth are people so mad / divisive over a 10? BACK IN MY DAY (gets out grandpa glasses), a game reviewing this high on say, NES, or SNES would be like a swan song in a desert with few easily found oasis' (due to lack of information).

Edit: also swan song is not the phrase I wanted to use there. I meant like an oasis in a desert. Early morning brain is on. Whatevs
 
How on earth are people so mad / divisive over a 10? BACK IN MY DAY (gets out grandpa glasses), a game reviewing this high on say, NES, or SNES would be like a swan song in a desert with few easily found oasis' (due to lack of information).

To be fair, that was before games like Metal Gear Solid 4 and GTA 4 which both were showered in perfect scores by critics but then seemingly got the backlash of the century later.
 
The praise stems from the premise of being the realization of the wii promise, and i agree with the reviewer, skyward sword aimed to be the ultimate wii game, and it managed to do that, even if at the expanse of aspects that people love about it.

What should be noted though is that breath of the wild praise comes from all types of people, including those that didn't care for latest efforts of the zelda series, gamespot for example who wasn't hot on SS, is gushing HARD about botw. Granted, not every zelda fan will love breath of the wild, but it's THE game since ocarina that has a shot at being almost universally loved.

I sometimes think I'm the only one in the position of earnestly loving every 3D Zelda since OoT, even if some of them (maybe all of them) lack something that I admired about its siblings. But the 'cycle' and the infighting are unavoidable consequences of a series that has a few well-defined reference points for what is idealized in the community history (specifically, LttP and OoT) alongside an impulse to do something a little different and new in every game.

A 10 for Skyward Sword holds up in its own way when you realize that six years later, it's still the only game inextricably designed around motion controls—i.e. you can't really have a standard-control SS because that undermines concepts fundamental to every corner of the game—that stands tall as a full and complete adventure. To this day, it has no competition in its category. And even if games like Arms and the superior sensitivity of the Joy-Con herald a Super Nintendo era for motion controls, I don't see Nintendo gambling on an SS-like project themselves with any of their core properties, except for the HD/Joy-Con remaster we all expect. (A potential SS HD could very well be a more robust Joy-Con showcase than any other game in the same way that Wind Waker HD was arguably the finest outing for the Wii U GamePad.)

In any case, it does seem like BotW has the potential to be a unifying series landmark, because no matter what kind of baggage players are bringing in with them, regardless of their ideal vision of what Zelda ought to be, it looks as though BotW will do something for them. The pre-release hype would have us believe that it's the spiritual sequel to every game in some small way. Even Majora's Mask. Maybe even Zelda II, though I haven't heard anybody say so just yet. I'm here for Wind Waker 2, myself.

Nevertheless, I think people are right to exercise caution. Trust in the enthusiast media is as low as it has ever been, much of it owing to the chasm between the playing habits of dedicated fans (of any series) and reviewers who are jacks of all trades and masters of none, and are perhaps structurally incapable of speaking to advanced or late-game issues that may arise. Sometimes this leads to scores that overshoot, other times to scores that undershoot. But it's useful to remind ourselves that past the 20-hour horizon where reviewers playing in a rush are already forming their impressions into quips and decimal points, regardless of how much lies ahead of them, anything can happen. We don't know, for instance, if the wonder of BotW is trivialized by fast travel (the way the Skells of Xenoblade X or flying mounts of WoW shrank their respective worlds) or if its itemization system flattens the late-game progression into a plateau. We don't know if there will be something relatively tame but controversial anyway like TWW's Triforce hunt. We just don't know.
 

KHlover

Banned
To be fair, that was before games like Metal Gear Solid 4 and GTA 4 which both were showered in perfect scores by critics but then seemingly got the backlash of the century later.

Same MGS4 that won GAF GOTY twice?

Internet "backlash" is pretty worthless. Too much hyperbole for the sake of discussion. Always take it with a grain of salt.
 

Makai

Member
A 10 for Skyward Sword holds up in its own way when you realize that six years later, it's still the only game inextricably designed around motion controls—i.e. you can't really have a standard-control SS because that undermines concepts fundamental to every corner of the game—that nevertheless feels like a full and complete adventure.
Skyward Sword's sword control could easily be mapped to the right analog stick. It didn't even seem analog when I played it - swings locked to an octagonal gate.
 
I sometimes think I'm the only one in the position of earnestly loving every 3D Zelda since OoT, even if some of them (maybe all of them) lack something that I admired about its siblings. But the 'cycle' and the infighting are unavoidable consequences of a series that has a few well-defined reference points for what is idealized in the community history (specifically, LttP and OoT) alongside an impulse to do something a little different and new in every game.

A 10 for Skyward Sword holds up in its own way when you realize that six years later, it's still the only game inextricably designed around motion controls—i.e. you can't really have a standard-control SS because that undermines concepts fundamental to every corner of the game—that stands tall as a full and complete adventure. To this day, it has no competition in its category. And even if games like Arms and the superior sensitivity of the Joy-Con herald a Super Nintendo era for motion controls, I don't see Nintendo gambling on an SS-like project themselves with any of their core properties, except for the HD/Joy-Con remaster we all expect. (A potential SS HD could very well be a more robust Joy-Con showcase than any other game in the same way that Wind Waker HD was arguably the finest outing for the Wii U GamePad.)

In any case, it does seem like BotW has the potential to be a unifying series landmark, because no matter what kind of baggage players are bringing in with them, regardless of their ideal vision of what Zelda ought to be, it looks as though BotW will do something for them. The pre-release hype would have us believe that it's the spiritual sequel to every game in some small way. Even Majora's Mask. Maybe even Zelda II, though I haven't heard anybody say so just yet. I'm here for Wind Waker 2, myself.

Nevertheless, I think people are right to exercise caution. Trust in the enthusiast media is as low as it has ever been, much of it owing to the chasm between the playing habits of dedicated fans (of any series) and reviewers who are jacks of all trades and masters of none, and are perhaps structurally incapable of speaking to advanced or late-game issues that may arise. Sometimes this leads to scores that overshoot, other times to scores that undershoot. But it's useful to remind ourselves that past the 20-hour horizon where reviewers playing in a rush are already forming their impressions into quips and decimal points, regardless of how much lies ahead of them, anything can happen. We don't know, for instance, if the wonder of BotW is trivialized by fast travel (the way the Skells of Xenoblade X or flying mounts of WoW shrank their respective worlds) or if its itemization system flattens the late-game progression into a plateau. We don't know if there will be something relatively tame but controversial anyway like TWW's Triforce hunt. We just don't know.
You're not the only one my friend I also love every single 3D maybe not all for the same reason but I love them regardless
 

Peterc

Member
Well deserved. You don't have to be the best to be a good game. Don't worry horizon would still be a good game. It got a 9, maybe even a 10 if botw wouldn't been there.
 
The early morning version of this thread was much better when we were all happy that so many great games were releasing.

How on earth are people so mad / divisive over a 10? BACK IN MY DAY (gets out grandpa glasses), a game reviewing this high on say, NES, or SNES would be like a swan song in a desert with few easily found oasis' (due to lack of information).

Edit: also swan song is not the phrase I wanted to use there. I meant like an oasis in a desert. Early morning brain is on. Whatevs

Yeah, I don't get it, then again, I don't get "system wars" either as I enjoy all the systems for their exclusives and treat multi-platform games as which ever system offers the most benefits like monetary deal/visuals/performance on PC, friends/controller on Xbox, and VR/3D/visuals/performance on PS. That said, Nintendo will always be my nostalgic go-to for the classic franchises.

Ultimately, the more good/great scored games the better.
 

Davey Cakes

Member
Absolutely no surprises on the Zelda score. There was no way the game would be less than a 10/10. Nintendo's put too much work into it.

That said, on my own personal scale, Skyward Sword was probably a 9/10 even though I loved it, so I disagreed with Edge there. We'll see how it is this time around.
 

phanphare

Banned
Skyward Sword's sword control could easily be mapped to the right analog stick. It didn't even seem analog when I played it - swings locked to an octagonal gate.

nah, feel like you'd get handedly worked by some of those enemies. wiimotion+ was crucial to that game and it'd be unplayable otherwise.
 

Hupsel

Member
Awesome scored. Zelda, Horizon, Torment... I want to play Sniper Elite also, Ive heard good things about it.

Anyone know what they said about Torment btw?
 
I'm interested in what next months EDGE cover feature is about - not on phone so can't provide picture. The tease picture is like a silhouette of a tall multi-story shack like structure, set rising above some fir or monkey puzzle type trees, with a tall slim chimney on top and a weather vane with a fish on it. Any ideas?
 

benny_a

extra source of jiggaflops
nah, feel like you'd get handedly worked by some of those enemies. wiimotion+ was crucial to that game and it'd be unplayable otherwise.
It's still an octagonal gate and the game can easily be played outside of drawing a circle with a dual analog controller.
 
I'm really considering trying to buy a Switch at launch but really didn't like the IR signal information that came out..but these scores and praise for Zelda...with Mario coming later this year.
T1f66RK.png

fucking ouch, glad i didn't fork out the cash during the S redesign hype.
 

Quonny

Member
...

A well established magazine doesn't throw away their good standing and reputation with their audience for short-term sales.
Am I not getting my point across? I have absolute faith that they're not going up to their reviewers and saying "rate this a 10 or else".

But it's like when you see "first reviews" on IGN. These should be viewed with extra scrutiny. That's not saying that they're being deceptive, or misleading, but when a review outlet is given preferential treatment from the publisher you should always take their review with an extra grain of salt. Even if that's how it always is with EDGE because of their format. I'm just bringing up a point, not dismissing their review, opinions, or score.
 

e_i

Member
Torment got an 8. Nice. Three great games in a week is heaven (Torment, Zero Dawn and Zelda). And Nier coming out the following week as well.
 

sphinx

the piano man
A 10 for Skyward Sword holds up in its own way when you realize that six years later, it's still the only game inextricably designed around motion controls—i.e. you can't really have a standard-control SS because that undermines concepts fundamental to every corner of the game—that stands tall as a full and complete adventure. To this day, it has no competition in its category.

you clearly never played Red Steel 2.

it was embarrasing that Ubisoft, of all devs, provided the ultimate proof of concept for the Wiimotion +.

Ubi showed nintendo how combat with WM+ is done... let that sink in
 

balgajo

Member
Good God the conclusion of EDGEs review:

" The result, for all the longevity of its series and the familiarity of the open world genre, is a game that evokes feelings we haven't felt for 20 years. Not since Ocarina of Time have we set foot in a world that feels so mind-bogglingly vast and unerringly magical, that proves so relentlessly intriguing. Plenty of games promise to let us go anywhere and do anything. Few, if any, ever deliver so irresistibly. 19 years on Ocarina is still held up as the high water mark of gamings best loved and greatest series. Now it may have to settle for second place".

tumblr_n9qgtdlSIg1ryuzqeo1_500.gif
 

phanphare

Banned
It'd be easier with an analog stick because it would actually respond to my input every time.

eh, no I don't believe that would be true at all. I'm remembering playing W101 using the right analog to draw shapes and yeah there's no way it'd be more accurate than the wiimotion+
 
Skyward Sword's sword control could easily be mapped to the right analog stick. It didn't even seem analog when I played it - swings locked to an octagonal gate.

They were, but it's far more intuitive to swing that way then use the analog that way. You'd have to move the analog to the correct direction and quickly move it to the opposite side. Workable, but not ideal. I'm not sure you would mimic stabbing other than a button press. And I can't remember if twisting is necessary anywhere.

There is the net in the game. It maps directly to your movements and you don't have to swing it to catch bugs, you can be really gentle with it. It's one of my favorite things to do in SS. And I use a twist motion very oftem. Would not be nearly as satisfying with analog.

With that said, I fully expect a HD remaster with a traditional control option.

Edit: I realized that by mapping to Analog would also mean no camera control or a would need a toggle. Now SS doesn't have camera control outside of the target action (or first person perspective), but I think a benefit of dual analog would be camera control. In fact I hope any potential remaster would feature them.
 

balgajo

Member
you clearly never played Red Steel 2.

it was embarrasing that Ubisoft, of all devs, provided the ultimate proof of concept for the Wiimotion +.

Ubi showed nintendo how combat with WM+ is done... let that sink in

Really? That sword mini game on Wii sports resort was better than Red Steel 2 imo.
Skyward Sword is definetly the best motion controls game I played.(Even though diving using motion controls is shit)
 
you clearly never played Red Steel 2.

it was embarrasing that Ubisoft, of all devs, provided the ultimate proof of concept for the Wiimotion +.

Ubi showed nintendo how combat with WM+ is done... let that sink in

Ubisoft always showed Nintendo how to use the gamepad with Zombi U too. For all we shit on them they're pretty on point sometimes
 
Skyward Sword's sword control could easily be mapped to the right analog stick. It didn't even seem analog when I played it - swings locked to an octagonal gate.

Not to turn this into even more of an SS thread than it already is, but there's a lot more to the game than the sword, from the tightrope walking to the bug-catching to the minor challenges like the pumpkin walk or the bamboo-slashing (though we could all do without that goddamned harp). You could map a lot of this to sticks like you can map just about anything to a keyboard and mouse, but that's sort of like playing TP's Rollgoal on the GameCube, where it's just painfully obvious the mini-game was only included in the first place to support a different interface.
 
People are so mad that this is getting a 10 but has frame rate issues. Like, really mad.

Funny because edge also gave Bloodborne a 10 (rightfully so).

10/10=/=Perfect. I think of reviews as recommendations. For me a 10 means that it is getting the highest recommendation.

Regardless, I'm pumped!!
 

Makai

Member
They were, but it's far more intuitive to swing that way then use the analog that way. You'd have to move the analog to the correct direction and quickly move it to the opposite side. Workable, but not ideal. I'm not sure you would mimic stabbing other than a button press. And I can't remember if twisting is necessary anywhere.

There is the net in the game. It maps directly to your movements and you don't have to swing it to catch bugs, you can be really gentle with it. It's one of my favorite things to do in SS. And I use a twist motion very oftem. Would not be nearly as satisfying with analog.

With that said, I fully expect a HD remaster with a traditional control option.
Just push it in a direction to swing in that direction. Push in another direction to swing in another direction. Recenter if you want to swing in the same direction again. It's like flicking the C Stick in Smash Bros.

I don't remember the net well enough to comment.

eh, no I don't believe that would be true at all. I'm remembering playing W101 using the right analog to draw shapes and yeah there's no way it'd be more accurate than the wiimotion+
It was good in Okami
 
Just push it in a direction to swing in that direction. Push in another direction to swing in another direction. Recenter if you want to swing in the same direction again. It's like flicking the C Stick in Smash Bros.

I don't remember the net well enough to comment.

It was good in Okami

That wouldn't really work because a lot of the swordplay is tricking the enemy. If an Enemy sees your sword coming from the left it blocks. So you often have to move it to the opposite direction and attack from there.
 

Caelus

Member
That cover is weird. I don't think swimming is even a big part of the game, is it?

We don't know. The Zora are one of the main tribes and are involved in the story, and the previewers haven't gotten to the other areas of the game yet since it takes a while. With all the armors in the game, there might be a diving one.
 

Ridley327

Member
Just push it in a direction to swing in that direction. Push in another direction to swing in another direction. Recenter if you want to swing in the same direction again. It's like flicking the C Stick in Smash Bros.

I don't remember the net well enough to comment.

It was good in Okami

Okami straight up pauses the game to let you draw, though.
 
I'm playing through Skyward Sword right now for the first time, barely know anything about it beyond it being divisive on GAF.

While I personally don't mind Fi, or the hand-holding, I can understand why some would. I do think it's annoying as FUCK that every time I get an item the game halts to tell me what it is and add it to my inventory. And while I'm not super great with the motion controls, I can tell that if someone was good with them they'd have an incredible time with the combat, whereas if someone wasn't good at them they'd fucking hate the whole core gameplay of the title.

So if the person reviewing SS for EDGE didn't care about Fi or the hand holding or the constant reminders about items, and was proficient with the combat, I could absolutely understand a 10/10 for Skyward Sword. Despite being on SD weak as shit hardware the game is beautiful, the characters are charming, to story is awesome, the locations - though limited - are fantastic and an interesting evolution of the formula by having the worlds themselves be designed similar to dungeons, the items are cool, there's the new item upgrade mechanic, there's a lot to like here and some very obvious seeds that grew into BotW. I'm just about to start the Soul Trial in the volcano world and I'm having a total blast even in spite of not being super great with the combat.

Plus, it's more telling that they're harsh on Zelda games despite "brand loyalty" that only 3 out of, what 17 Zelda games? have 10/10 scores from them. Even if they were only around to score from OoT onward, that's still two major console Zeldas and a half dozen handheld Zeldas that didn't get 10s, so the "brand loyalty" argument seems inherently flawed.
 
I'm interested in what next months EDGE cover feature is about - not on phone so can't provide picture. The tease picture is like a silhouette of a tall multi-story shack like structure, set rising above some fir or monkey puzzle type trees, with a tall slim chimney on top and a weather vane with a fish on it. Any ideas?
Structure looked a bit too elaborate to be Days Gone and too unique for something like Rust or Fortnite. Tough one.
 
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