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[Prince Vultan]

Here, right now, Microsoft has an edge. The £80 price disparity between the two consoles will be a decision maker for many, but for others, Microsoft's exclusives are more convincing than anything Sony has shown on PS4 to date. Killzone is no Halo; Driveclub doesn't look like measuring up to Forza; and Dead Rising 3 now looks like a smarter bet for open world mayhem than Second Son.

Even a second-tier title like Ryse makes a stronger case for its host hadware's graphical capabilities, at least, than anything set for PS4's launch day, while no next generation multiplayer game can match Respawn's work on Titanfall - an exclusive secured with Microsoft's financial backing, and a game utterly reliant on the company's cloud to synchronise its AI and provide dedicated servers as and when needed. Microsoft's own studios and its willingness to open its chequebook has ensured that Xbox One has 12 months' worth of exclusives that stand against the best ever seen in a launch year

Jesus... this really is as bad as some of the posts we were getting from Microsoft fans in the "Winning the games message" thread yesterday. Those game comparisons are dumb as hell.

Please tell me this was a contributor piece or something like that. I can't believe Edge would put up something like this as part of an "official" article... especially given their post E3/post 180gate coverage of these two consoles.

 

[Klocker]

Jesus... this really is as bad as some of the posts we were getting from Microsoft fans in the "Winning the games message" thread yesterday. Those game comparisons are dumb as hell.

Please tell me this was a contributor piece or something like that. I can't believe Edge would put up something like this as part of an "official" article... especially given their post E3/post 180gate coverage of these two consoles.

Yea right because only your opinion is correct one.

Other people have opinions too and some of us like all the games better on Xbox and that has nothing to do with fluff and all to do with having good taste

 

[Nightengale]

Yea right because only your opinion is correct one.

Other people have opinions too and some of us like all the games better on Xbox and that has nothing to do with fluff and all to do with having good taste

Its fine to have a different opinion, and some comments towards Xbox fans are inappropriate, but please don't be a jerk.

Different taste. Your use of good taste is equally as bad as his 'correct' opinion.

 

[Brera]

This brute force and elegant design is marketing bullshit.

Both consoles are pretty identical with each having minor tweaks.

A worse gpu and ram is a worse whatever way you look at it and esram sounds like a massive headache rather than "elegant"

From everything we've read and heard, PS4 has the brute force AND the more elegant design.

 

[Prince Vultan]

Yea right because only your opinion is correct one.

Other people have opinions too and some of us like all the games better on Xbox and that has nothing to do with fluff and all to do with having good taste

I never said my opinion was the only "correct" one. I just voiced my dismay at an Edge piece seemingly sounding like some low tier forum post when I know they're better than that.

Although it is very funny that you'll attack me for a perceived lack of respect for opposing opinions while simultaneously implying that anyone with an opposing opinion to your own has "bad taste"

 

[Gemüsepizza]

Yea right because only your opinion is correct one.

Other people have opinions too and some of us like all the games better on Xbox and that has nothing to do with fluff and all to do with having good taste

Then they should mark this as "opinion" and not try to state this as a fact / without explanation.

For example:

"Killzone is no Halo" - What does this even mean?

"Driveclub doesn't look like measuring up to Forza" - In what way? Graphically? The gameplay?

"and Dead Rising 3 now looks like a smarter bet for open world mayhem than Second Son." - Again, no explanation why. Graphically SS is a lot more impressive to me than DR3. They also have different approaches.

"Even a second-tier title like Ryse makes a stronger case for its host hadware's graphical capabilities, at least, than anything set for PS4's launch day" - So 900p Ryse looks much better than 1080p Killzone? Are they serious?

"no next generation multiplayer game can match Respawn's work on Titanfall" - How can they know this?

 

[nickthebiggeek]

Yea right because only your opinion is correct one.

Other people have opinions too and some of us like all the games better on Xbox and that has nothing to do with fluff and all to do with having good taste

Step off that high horse there.

 

[Vorg]

I still believe it can be treated as such - PS4's 'brute force' (I know it sounds ridiculous to PC GAF...) will let you do everything with good/enough performance, while Xbox' approach is more elegant/balanced for very specific tasks (e.g. latency-dependent GPGPU, certain types of h/w-aided sound processing, tiled rendering) because it can use less raw power to produce the same result - that undoubtedly can be labelled 'elegant'.

Obviously, the question is how easy are those Xbox' customizations to use for the devs, how 'fixed' they are in their function and how right was MS about future game development paradigms. If answers are negative to all of those, the 'elegance' of Xbox might well turn against it, in particular for 3rd party titles.

I'd really love Sony to come out and reveal all their customizations, because apart from increased ACEs, Garlic/Onion/+ busses, 'volatile' flag and 2nd SoC for background processing we don't know a lot...

Not that I agree with any of this but why was this guy banned?

 

[BruiserBear]

Underpowered hardware is now elegant?

What the fook have we come to? lol

lmao

I asked this question the other day. Can you imagine someone going into a PC thread and arguing a 7770 was more elegant than a 7850? They would be laughed at, but yet here we are having that discussion in console threads.

 

[Riky]

Yeah even I agree with that. Even if they played both that sounds all around kind of suspect. Anybody else get edge to see if this is true?

It's true. Subscriber so get my copy early.

The article does go on to talk about the online side with updates and approval process and says Microsoft still haven't confirmed this area meaning less free to play games etc. There is also a Q&A with Phil Harrison and Ken Lobb.

 

[TechnicPuppet]

Then they should mark this as "opinion" and not try to state this as a fact / without explanation.

For example:

"Killzone is no Halo" - What does this even mean?

"Driveclub doesn't look like measuring up to Forza" - In what way? Graphically? The Gameplay?

"and Dead Rising 3 now looks like a smarter bet for open world mayhem than Second Son." - Again, no explanation why. Graphically SS is a lot more impressive to me than DD3. They also have different approaches.

"Even a second-tier title like Ryse makes a stronger case for its host hadware's graphical capabilities, at least, than anything set for PS4's launch day" - So 900p Ryse looks much better than 1080p Killzone? Are they serious?

"no next generation multiplayer game can match Respawn's work on Titanfall" - How can they know this?

Just their opinion, the same way as it was their opinion when they said PS4 was the only choice before they saw the actual games.

 

[Metalmurphy]

Yea right because only your opinion is correct one.

Other people have opinions too and some of us like all the games better on Xbox and that has nothing to do with fluff and all to do with having good taste

That's just awesome haha.

 

[Gemüsepizza]

Just their opinion, the same way as it was their opinion when they said PS4 was the only choice before they saw the actual games.

But they explained why this was their opinion back then. They don't do this now. That's the problem I have with this article.

 

[Vorg]

Yea right because only your opinion is correct one.

Other people have opinions too and some of us like all the games better on Xbox and that has nothing to do with fluff and all to do with having good taste

The irony...

 

[Prince Vultan]

But they explained why this was their opinion back then. They don't do this now. That's the problem I have with this article.

Plus, they made those statements about the PS4 being the more appealling choice both AFTER E3 and AFTER MS' 180thon started. They were well aware of the games scene on both machines then and the only thing that's changed since then is that MS announced another Fable game and Sony announced a whole lot of new titles at GC.

It just doesn't make sense why they've suddenly changed stance... and started writing about these things in the manner they seemingly now are.

 

[Klocker]

Its fine to have a different opinion, and some comments towards Xbox fans are inappropriate, but please don't be a jerk.

Different taste. Your use of good taste is equally as bad as his 'correct' opinion.

well of course it is. I'm pissed at the constant berating of people and calling them fluffers because they say they like the Xbox one and games.

its relentless and ridiculous

 

[alterego]

back on topic: I feel like there should be a thread on exact developer quotes regarding these consoles with links, but unfortunately I do not have the time to make this and it would probably be destroyed by the console war anyway.

Developer Comments Timeline:

http://ps4versusxbone.wordpress.com/2013/09/24/developer-comments-timeline/

 

[Nightengale]

well of course it is. I'm pissed at the constant berating of people and calling them fluffers because they say they like the Xbox one and games.

its relentless and ridiculous

I don't want to demean those people who are jerks, but if you act the same way, you're no better.

I just find it easier to not actively partake in conversations that make me roll my eyes over, rather than popping a vein and riling myself up for no reason just to dispute some people's opinion.

It is ridiculous and relentless, but I don't think it's a good thing for anyone to act like an ass over it. It only breeds more hostility.

 

[boredandlazy]

Killzone is no Halo? No wonder it's one of my most anticipated games.

 

[Kazuma Kiryu]

Yea right because only your opinion is correct one.

Other people have opinions too and some of us like all the games better on Xbox and that has nothing to do with fluff and all to do with having good taste

I am SHOCKED that you would like ALL games better on Xbox. I mean, that's a clear sign of having good taste. (obvious sarcasm)
Jesus christ, you're worse than the people you're pointing out.

 

[SMZC]

well of course it is. I'm pissed at the constant berating of people and calling them fluffers because they say they like the Xbox one and games.

its relentless and ridiculous

Well, to be fair, these consoles haven't even been released yet. It's too soon for anyone to say which of them will have their favorite games, especially when taking into consideration that launch lineups are almost never anything special.

That goes for the PS4 too, suffice to say. I mean, many people bought a PS3 expecting to play The Last Guardian at some point. We all know how that turned out.

 

[onanie]

I know Bkillian is an ex-Microsoft guy who worked on the Xbox One's design, and is pretty invested in it (99% of his posts are about the XO and it's design), but just something to add some sauce to the thread...

Adding cores never scales linearly. For their statement to be true on a GFLOPS basis (which it probably isn't), a scaling efficiency of 95.6% per core added would provide 12CUs at 853MHz with the same horsepower as 14CUs at 800. At that (bogus) scaling factor, 18 CUs at 800MHz would only be 7.4% faster than 12CUs at 853MHz.

The real scaling factor is guaranteed to be higher than that, but it will still be <1, and the scaling factor probably goes down with increasing cores, since the bottlenecks become even more important. You're going to have a lot more contention for a 256 bit memory bus at 12 cores than at 2. What this means is that in real terms, PS4 does not have, and never had, a 50% GPU advantage. What the actual advantage is, we may never know.

http://beyond3d.com/showpost.php?p=1787463&postcount=6534

Thoughts?

His numbers work if you subtract from each subsequent CU the same percentage of the clock rate. This does exaggerate the drop in performance per extra CU (and you can even end up with negative FLOPs with too many CUs).

I think it would be more accurate if each subsequent CU is a set percentage of the previous CU, as "scaling efficiency" would imply.

Please tell me if I am wrong (or have too much time).

 

[TechnicPuppet]

But they explained why this was their opinion back then. They don't do this now. That's the problem I have with this article.

They just like the Xbox One games better. Not exactly shocking is it.

 

[phosphor112]

Not to be nitpicky but wouldn't it make more sense to label the y-axis "CU Count" and have the scale go by tens?

I.E. 10 20 30 etc.

Of course this is coming from someone too lazy to make a graph in the first place

The comic avoids is the cu count. It's just in ALU's. That's why the y axis is performance.

 

[Jack_AG]

Maybe they have played both of them and prefer Dead Rising.

I find this acceptable but if comparisons are made it should be as close to apples/apples as you can get.

 

[Glorified G]

Page 12, it's and Edge article "Power Of The Crowd"

The front cover has a quote

"XBOX ONE: FROM CRISIS TO CONTENDER"

At least this will wake some people up and make them realize edge doesn't some kind of bias towards Sony, but more bias towards provocative/sensationalism and getting as much readers as possible

 

[dragonelite]

At least this will wake some people up and make them realize edge doesn't some kind of bias towards Sony, but more bias towards provocative/sensationalism and getting as much readers as possible

Dem fools with their bias to money trucks...

 

[onanie]

They just like the Xbox One games better. Not exactly shocking is it.

More likely a different author to the earlier ones. I know, shocking.

But with drive-by commentary like "Dead Rising 3 now looks like a smarter bet for open world mayhem than Second Son" without a good explanation, it's hard to say that this piece is to be taken seriously.

 

[artist]

At least this will wake some people up and make them realize edge doesn't some kind of bias towards Sony, but more bias towards provocative/sensationalism and getting as much readers as possible

Is that the same article as this one?

http://neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=671877

Not to be nitpicky but wouldn't it make more sense to label the y-axis "CU Count" and have the scale go by tens?

I.E. 10 20 30 etc.

Of course this is coming from someone too lazy to make a graph in the first place

It would still look the same, except with new labels for the x-axis.

 

[onQ123]

Posted yet?

http://www.vgleaks.com/playstation-4-audio-processor-acp/

Mark Cerny confirmed in an interview that PlayStation 4 uses hardware expressly dedicated to audio tasks. Which are the capabilities of this hardware? What is Sony telling to the developers about it?

Here we have some material from Sony’s presentations where you can learn more about audio custom hardware in PS4. This dedicated hardware will manage basic tasks, for game or system, relying on the CPU or GPU for advanced tasks.

Another important point is that this audio block is not programmable by developers directly, they could only access it via OS.

 

[nib95]

Microsoft finally reversed in with their truckload of money. Edge mission success. No but really, I have no idea, sensationalist? Different writer? Weird opinions? Something else?

 

[Raydeen]

Then they should mark this as "opinion" and not try to state this as a fact / without explanation.

For example:

"Killzone is no Halo" - What does this even mean?

The best Killlzone has never been as good as the worst Halo.

That's just a plain, hard, no contention fact that even the most dye in the wool PS fan would agree with. And seeing the dazzling PS4 demo sequence, with dazzling identical game play to the previous ones, I really don't think that's going to change....unless 343 industries drops the ball and turns the Halo series into a Kinect Candy Crush game, I don't think the next war between the two franchises will play out any different.

 

[onanie]

Just got the latest edition of Edge, they seem to be coming around to X1.



There is also a couple of lines about memory difference but one quote is from Ken Lobb so I expect he would say that since he works there. The other is from Anton Yudintsev of Gaijin Entertainment,

PS4's DDR5 is basically 50 per cent more powerful than DDR3. But the memory write is bigger on Xbox One. So it depends on what you're doing. PS4 is more powerful, but you can't just write to memory, you need to read sometimes

Presume this is something to do with the Esram double bandwith claim?

GDDR5 basically has literally 159% more bandwidth than DDR3, doesn't it? The downplaying is strong with this one.

 

[shinra-bansho]

Posted yet?

http://www.vgleaks.com/playstation-4-audio-processor-acp/

Not that I'm aware. Doesn't say a whole lot, but essentially confirms that the audio hardware is mainly for compression/decompression for both game, as well as for system functions, and that game audio tasks will probably primarily be done on the CPU?

I don't really foresee a situation where developers are going to prioritize audio over other parts of games if they have limited resources.

 

[amstradcpc]

Posted yet?

http://www.vgleaks.com/playstation-4-audio-processor-acp/

As suppossed it makes no sound processing at all. This will be half a core or more dedicated to sound processing while XB1 audio block needs no CPU at all.

 

[nib95]

The best Killlzone has never been as good as the worst Halo.

That's just a plain, hard, no contention fact that even the most dye in the wool PS fan would agree with. And seeing the dazzling PS4 demo sequence, with dazzling identical game play to the previous ones, I really don't think that's going to change....unless 343 industries drops the ball and turns the Halo series into a Kinect Candy Crush game, I don't think the next war between the two franchises will play out any different.

Utter tripe. Killzone 2 says hi. Hell, even Metacritic agree's.

http://www.metacritic.com/game/playstation-3/killzone-2

http://www.metacritic.com/game/xbox-360/halo-4

http://www.metacritic.com/game/xbox-360/halo-reach

http://www.metacritic.com/game/xbox-360/halo-3-odst

Also, Shadow Fall is a big departure from past Killzone's. In-fact, it's now arguably more open world than Halo is (judging by Halo 4). Open ended massive environments, no set order of objectives, lots of tactical leeway and options, the OWL and all the tactical and gameplay mechanics that come with it etc.

 

[mjswooosh]

The best Killlzone has never been as good as the worst Halo.

That's just a plain, hard, no contention fact that even the most dye in the wool PS fan would agree with. And seeing the dazzling PS4 demo sequence, with dazzling identical game play to the previous ones, I really don't think that's going to change....unless 343 industries drops the ball and turns the Halo series into a Kinect Candy Crush game, I don't think the next war between the two franchises will play out any different.

*Sigh* stop trolling...

 

[frizby]

Did the processing of sound suddenly become some kind of monster power draw?

I don't see how that's possible when lots of current gen games sound amazing.

 

[EmptySpace]

As suppossed it makes no sound processing at all. This will be half a core or more dedicated to sound processing while XB1 audio block needs no CPU at all.

save the fact that the xbone will also do skype, movie, and tv while players are playing the game, so that audio block is not dedicated to gaming.

people are really forgetting all the multi-tasking that xbone will do.

 

[travisbickle]

The best Killlzone has never been as good as the worst Halo.

That's just a plain, hard, no contention fact that even the most dye in the wool PS fan would agree with. And seeing the dazzling PS4 demo sequence, with dazzling identical game play to the previous ones, I really don't think that's going to change....unless 343 industries drops the ball and turns the Halo series into a Kinect Candy Crush game, I don't think the next war between the two franchises will play out any different.

And Forza's no Gran Turismo, as in the worst GT is better than the best Forza.

It's gamefaqs mentality, and why I said it was surprising for Edge magazine.

 

[mrklaw]

it's a shame that slide doesn't talk about audio mixing. I'd assume if it is doing decompression of 200+ mp3s it could also handle mixing them into at least a stereo or HDMI LPCM output (5.1 encoding probably wouldn't be covered)

 

[artist]

Posted yet?

http://www.vgleaks.com/playstation-4-audio-processor-acp/

Thanks, made a new thread and credited you - http://neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=685901

 

[mjswooosh]

I suppose it's like a Nissan GT-R vs a Bugatti Veyron.

The Bugatti would smoke anything on a straight road, but the GT-R may be more nippy and useful in certain scenarios (racing around a tight corner city).

Joke post? If only cars and GPU/CPU architectures had anything remotely in common so that analogy didn't sound batshit insane. You're on a roll!

 

[nib95]

I didn't realise Raydeen made that other silly post as well. Damn I fell for him twice. He must be trolling surely?

 

[TechnicPuppet]

More likely a different author to the earlier ones. I know, shocking.

But with drive-by commentary like "Dead Rising 3 now looks like a smarter bet for open world mayhem than Second Son" without a good explanation, it's hard to say that this piece is to be taken seriously.

I know what game i'll likely prefer. As for taking it seriously, I never took their piece about how the PS4 is the only choice seriously and I don't take this seriously.

It seems this is just what Edge does.

 

[beast786]

I suppose it's like a Nissan GT-R vs a Bugatti Veyron.

The Bugatti would smoke anything on a straight road, but the GT-R may be more nippy and useful in certain scenarios (racing around a tight corner city).

But that's not a fair comparison. A better one is that the Xbox One is a Ford Mustang GT whilst the PS4 is the Nissan GT-R Black Edition. In other words, the PS4 has more performance and is better balanced (more customisations, creative bandwidth management, faster bandwidth, more forward thinking GPGPU features, secondary custom chip etc), and has less weight (Kinect, snap etc) to worry about.

So the main thing to learn from above is GTR is always the right choice <3

I like it.

 

[Snake29]

PS3 had the best audio in games (and movies), and there was also support for 7.1 PCM.

PS4 will be even better with sound with those new DSP's.

 

[ReplacementPelican]

The best Killlzone has never been as good as the worst Halo.

That's just a plain, hard, no contention fact that even the most dye in the wool PS fan would agree with. And seeing the dazzling PS4 demo sequence, with dazzling identical game play to the previous ones, I really don't think that's going to change....unless 343 industries drops the ball and turns the Halo series into a Kinect Candy Crush game, I don't think the next war between the two franchises will play out any different.

As posted above, the critics say 'hi'.

However, I take contention to the 'identical gameplay' comment mainly because I got bored of Halo for exactly that reason.

 

[velociraptor]

Utter tripe. Killzone 2 says hi. Hell, even Metacritic agree's.

http://www.metacritic.com/game/playstation-3/killzone-2

http://www.metacritic.com/game/xbox-360/halo-4

http://www.metacritic.com/game/xbox-360/halo-reach

http://www.metacritic.com/game/xbox-360/halo-3-odst

Also, Shadow Fall is a big departure from past Killzone's. In-fact, it's now arguably more open world than Halo is (judging by Halo 4). Open ended massive environments, no set order of objectives, lots of tactical leeway and options, the OWL and all the tactical and gameplay mechanics that come with it etc.

In before 'Halo is more popular than Killzone'.

 

[nib95]

So the main thing to learn from above is GTR is always the right choice <3

I like it.

Definitely. If I had the money, I'd pick a GT-R over a Ferrari, Porsche or whatever every time. Others just seem like a bit of a flamboyant waste of money, especially when a GT-R more often than not can take them around a track.