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Eurogamer: Tabata on Final Fantasy XV - "core-centric", "casual", "best FF ever"

Thats an unfair comparison. Those games are turn based and involve a lot of strategy where you navigate seas of menus and, yes, all you do is choose with the Dpad and X but you have to manage you're whole party.

FFXV battles ain't turn based, won't even feature any menus a-la KH and you're holding one button down mostly removing also any kind of strategy that could involve timing hits or linking combos.

Tabata just shot himself in the foot. These declarations are so asinine (casuals aren't even reading you right now!) that I'm convinced some of it must've been lost in translation!

Saying that this game is only "hold X and dodge" is just as unfair. The very article describes briefly how enemies could counter your attacks. How character positioning is important. How we could bait enemies. How we need to break their stance. Does any of those previous games have these? I feel like the game going through many people's head here is a simplified, bastardized version of FFXV, akin to saying "in Final Fantasy IX the characters just stand in one place, we press X and they attack the enemies automatically".


Kindly read above.
 

Myths

Member
Lol at all the people who were hyping the second coming practically and are now discontent. Serves you right..

Anything can change between now and its release.
 

Soriku

Junior Member
The worst part is the wording

Here is something incredible we can do with combat on new consoles


But we're not going to do that

Instead we are going to do the opposite of that

This is just strange. With stronger hardware you'd think they'd make the gameplay be more involved or something. Instead, it's regressing. wut.
 
DnRMGUo.gif
 

Perfo

Thirteen flew over the cuckoo's nest
All main FFs are one-button action so I don't see the difference. It's party management, strategy, stats, approach to battle and the rest that makes the difference in an RPG. This is not Devil May Cry, nor Street Fighter meets FF. I don't know why someone expected differently.
 

Ceravic

Member
Going to bed now. Hopefully I wake up to some kind of Tabata interview that puts out some of the flames instead of fanning them.
 
This is just my guess, but I get the feeling from his comments that they're making a game where your decisions going into a battle are equally if not more important than how you actually control the character in the battle. FFXII could be a good example. Depending on how you set up your party AI, what weapons are in your deck, what abilities and magic you have equipped, etc, it could make encounters much easier or much harder, rather than the player's ability to manually dodge every attack or execute complex combo strings.

Sure it's a guess, but it sounds more tolerable than the way Tabata described it.
 
Contextual could be cool, but it doesn't sound like it will be. The only hope is that this is a result of terrible square enix PR guidance and that the game lives up to tabata's track record of somewhat challenging games.
 
Seeing that E3 video, I think if it's highly stylized and very flashy with strategy involved, it can cover up a lot of the one-button system.

It will look really cool at least.
 

Soriku

Junior Member
All main FFs are one-button action so I don't see the difference. It's party management, strategy, stats, approach to battle and the rest that makes the difference in an RPG. This is not Devil May Cry, nor Street Fighter meets FF. I don't know why someone expected differently.

This was supposed to be KH meets FF.
 
This is a message to the mainstream gaming public expecting Squaresoft and the Final Fantasy franchise to offer any sort of innovation moving forward:

It's NOT going to happen. They're going to cater to the gamer that offers their dollar soon than their time. It's sad, but true.The sooner you can come to terms with this company selling the fuck out, the sooner you can accept that there are better RPG's out there these days...
 
Saying that this game is only "hold X and dodge" is just as unfair. The very article describe briefly how enemies could counter your attacks. how character positioning is important. How we could bait enemies. How we need to break their stance. Does any of those previous games have these? I feel like the game going through many people's head here is a simplified, bastardized version of FFXV, akin to saying "in FInal Fantasy IX the characters just stand in one place, we press X and they attack the enemies automatically".



Kindly read above.

This is why I'm holding my opinion until we hear more and they show us more. This information being casually thrown in an interview is weird. He needs to talk less and show more. It's all very confusing.
 

Perfo

Thirteen flew over the cuckoo's nest
Because the game is probably designed to play this way. The comparison with the car is different. When you're letting the car drive on its own, you're not playing that part of the game. The choice is that you don't have to do it, because it's an optional part of the game. Here it's pretty clear that he is designing a game where the challenge is not in how good the player is at action, but how the player approaches the encounters.

You're not stating the obvious when you guess that there is a choice. You are simply projecting your desire onto what he did not say. If there is an option for more complex action based combat, why wouldn't he say so since he has been so honest and open about everything else. He's talking about the sort of game he wants to make, and he says there will be depth, but that the depth is not in the controls and input. I think it's best people start accepting that instead of being disappointed AGAIN when it comes out and it's exactly what he described.

Instead people should look at the positive things he has said about the combat and encounter design. It might be press A for Awesome, but that doesn't mean fighting enemies has to be brain-dead or uninteresting. It's just the difference in how you approach it.

As usual duckroll keeps real and nails it. Best neogaf user from ever.
 

Nestunt

Member
I dont want to overreact, but everything I've been hearing about this Final Fantasy (only one character, no women, no strategy or turns) makes me very worried that "Final Fantasy" is only a placeholder to call for fans' (like me) money
 

Soriku

Junior Member
This is a message to the mainstream gaming public expecting Squaresoft and the Final Fantasy franchise to offer any sort of innovation moving forward:

It's NOT going to happen. They're going to cater to the gamer that offers their dollar soon than their time. It's sad, but true.The sooner you can come to terms with this company selling the fuck out, the sooner you can accept that there are better RPG's out there these days...

Does SE really think a pure action RPG wouldn't appeal to many people?
 
All main FFs are one-button action so I don't see the difference. It's party management, strategy, stats, approach to battle and the rest that makes the difference in an RPG. This is not Devil May Cry, nor Street Fighter meets FF. I don't know why someone expected differently.

Probably because we were told differently for many years?
 

jman2050

Member
All main FFs are one-button action so I don't see the difference. It's party management, strategy, stats, approach to battle and the rest that makes the difference in an RPG. This is not Devil May Cry, nor Street Fighter meets FF. I don't know why someone expected differently.

Seems like they want to have their cake and eat it too.

If they want a simple control interface that's easy to understand and doesn't require pressing a bunch of buttons and remembering a bunch of complicated progressions then just make the damn game turn-based.
 

Perfo

Thirteen flew over the cuckoo's nest
This was supposed to be KH meets FF.

Now it's a main FF and not a spin-off, can't afford to become a bland action rpg with X, X, X, X. Needs to be a bit more tactical, and that's what they're (hopefully) aiming too. If you like I think we're getting an evolution of those battle systems similar to XII, partially auto-battle but with alot of things to "prepare" ahead of the battle/execution itself. Sounds like FF to me.
 

Soriku

Junior Member
Now it's a main FF and not a spin-off, can't afford to become a bland action rpg with X, X, X, X. Needs to be a bit more tactical, and that's what they're (hopefully) aiming too. If you like I think we're getting an evolution of those battle systems similar to XII, partially auto-battle but with alot of things to "prepare" ahead of the battle/execution itself. Sounds like FF to me.

It doesn't have to be X X X X. Look at Tales for example.

Even KH isn't X X X X lately.
 

duckroll

Member
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=804363

It's totally that FF: Crystal Chronicle guy, Kenichiro Yuji and Tabata himself.

Kenichiro Yuji is the battle director of Type-0, so I guess that makes sense, yeah. This patent is definitely for XV. I checked the credits for Type-0, and Nakazawa was credited with "Lead Game Designer". At one point, Famitsu even listed Nakazawa as co-director on Type-0, so maybe he does more than just battle system direction these days.
 

Empty

Member
with the holding down buttons, there's lots you can do to make battles interesting within that context. to be honest i might prefer it like that, i think in a more pure action rpg i might just get frustrated that it's not on the same level as a platinum games action game. by de-emphasizing the pure action elements they can make something that strikes a different note and it more enjoyable.

i don't really put much stock in these "casual" comments anyway. nearly everyone wants to make a game that appeals to as many people as possible, doubly so in a series like final fantasy that's always spread a wide net. even from software say that want to widen the appeal of their latest releases, yet it still meets their core values. i think final fantasy has had engaging battle mechanics, even in some of the crummier releases, for a long time so i'll give them the benefit of the doubt for now.
 
Now it's a main FF and not a spin-off, can't afford to become a bland action rpg with X, X, X, X. Needs to be a bit more tactical, and that's what they're (hopefully) aiming too. If you like I think we're getting an evolution of those battle systems similar to XII, partially auto-battle but with alot of things to "prepare" ahead of the battle/execution itself. Sounds like FF to me.

instead of x,x,x,x,x, now it's just x!

don't get mad, you set me up
 

Dark_castle

Junior Member
Based on the other interviews he has given this week, I think he's mostly referring to Noctis' role as a "weapon summoner". From the beginning, Noctis has been presented as this super cool Advent Children style character who has a huge array of weapons he can summon at any time to fight his enemies, and he can teleport and so on.

So I think he's basically saying while it's possible to design a game where every single weapon had it's own moveset and things were really technical, he didn't want to go in that direction (or Nomura tried to go in that direction and failed to make it work!). Instead there will be a single attack button, and you equip weapons on a limited deck, and the game picks what to use based on the context (where you're facing, what enemy you're fighting, the range, etc) to create fast flowing action which looks impressive and also works.

This is just my guess, but I get the feeling from his comments that they're making a game where your decisions going into a battle are equally if not more important than how you actually control the character in the battle. FFXII could be a good example. Depending on how you set up your party AI, what weapons are in your deck, what abilities and magic you have equipped, etc, it could make encounters much easier or much harder, rather than the player's ability to manually dodge every attack or execute complex combo strings.

This would be mostly fine if they just let us press the button manually for each weapon summons rather than holding it for automatic combo. The same way in FFXII you could select commands manually from menu even though you have the actions set in Gambit.
 
I'm not going to over-reaction because a lot of games I play basically have me pressing one button to attack anyway.

I'll make my judgment call when the demo is released.
 

jman2050

Member
The more I think about it the more I feel like the best way to achieve something resembling these goals is to just copy the Kingdom Hearts combat system and be done with it. Which is what they were going to do in the first place before everything else happened.

So I don't even know what the hell.
 
Everything sounded awesome about the game and now this... But then again, his previous games and KH were basically one button action.
 

Ateron

Member
They had one job: make a KH game set in a dark inspired FF universe, with the ability to switch party members on the fly. Easy money, fitting evolution for the series, most people would be happy. How can they fuck things up this badly?

They really are out of touch with their fanbase. Will wait for the demo to give it a fair shake, but it's disheartening to read this first thing in the morning. How can it go from KH to an automated game? Games like Devil May Cry and Bayonetta have that flair but they make you master the mechanics in order to shine, they make you earn it. How awful would it be if everthing just happened at the touch of a single button? It's like playing MvC simple mode, to each his own but..
 

TTG

Member
This is great, what could he have said that would be more disheartening? "No one likes videogames, just give me your money and we can all disperse."
 

hohoXD123

Member
Wtf. Please tell me there is a way to make the combat more manual for the people who don't want this casual crap. Hype for this game definitely took a hit though.
 

Perfo

Thirteen flew over the cuckoo's nest
Wtf. Please tell me there is a way to make the combat more manual for the people who don't want this casual crap.

Auto-battles didn't make FFXII less tactical or easier than any other FFs. Same for FFXIII.
 

Carbonox

Member
"I'm getting too old to play with diverse controls so fuck all of y'all here's a one button system just to please myself"

lol

I think the game looks class and the gameplay/combat looks fun from a visual standpoint but yeah this news of a simple system is quite disheartening. I'm hoping that post further up of the various methods you can apply yet still using one face button (was that post regarding Type 0?) will apply as that eases the tension a bit I think.
 

Haunted

Member
Didn't Bayonetta have this as well?

I generally have no problem with a one button mode as long as the originally promised depth is still in there (Tabata specifically mentions it is - is he lying?)

That said, the danger that this kind of thinking will replace the depth in future iterations is absolutely there.
 
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