kenji_sama
Member
This is a fantasy based on reality.
Reality is when you hold a button to make a whole "fantasy".
Reality is when you hold a button to make a whole "fantasy".
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Eurogamer: Tabata on Final Fantasy XV - "core-centric", "casual", "best FF ever"
- Thread starter Kagari
- Start date
Exentryk
Member
Pack it up. We begin our journey to KH3 tomorrow. You guys coming, M Night, Snoozer and Dark Castle?
After what they said last year and years before... of course people are going to be upset.
They were turn-based. You didn't just have to HOLD the button.
Nightengale
Member
No way it's an option at this point.
It's a different system now. I don't subscribe to "a to awesomeness" as a bad thing by default (my favourite Kiseki games are all a to awesome), but this pretty much cements the death of Versus 13.
Shadow Ranger
Member
Can't say this doesn't sound disappointing, because it sounds very disappointing, indeed.
I didn't find XIII's approach very fun (and was also one of the most boring parts of the game for me). XII's was fine in that I had complete control whenever I chose to over each character, and the Gambit system was just a great addition that required user input anyway.
In a way, if XV's system is awful at least Nomura has possible ammunition (maybe?) to blame Tabata on this easy-automatic... thing.
Ultimately the demo or earlier impressions will give us a better idea, but so far the more Tabata speaks the more it sounds just too casual.
I didn't find XIII's approach very fun (and was also one of the most boring parts of the game for me). XII's was fine in that I had complete control whenever I chose to over each character, and the Gambit system was just a great addition that required user input anyway.
In a way, if XV's system is awful at least Nomura has possible ammunition (maybe?) to blame Tabata on this easy-automatic... thing.
Ultimately the demo or earlier impressions will give us a better idea, but so far the more Tabata speaks the more it sounds just too casual.
Scrooge McDuck
Member
That is not the case in this game, either.
Alex_Mexico
Member
I don't like the sound of it. The real meaning maybe was lost in translation? Anyway I'm holding off my potential loosing of my shit until we know more.
I mean they surely can't be making an epic 60 hour RPG where all you do is hold down X and dodge, right?
I mean they surely can't be making an epic 60 hour RPG where all you do is hold down X and dodge, right?
When you put it like that, it really does seem awfully simple.
Here is what they showed at e3 2013....now which part of this did people have issue with?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LBilT83Uq4A
This still looks like Versus13...people would have freaked out then if they thought something was up
I'm personally awaiting the announcement that the game is 20-35 hours long.
Have you ever played a musou? Because this
It's exactly the opposite, button mashing is the essence of musou
I believe one of the interviews this week saying 40.
DaSorcerer7
Member
I'll say it again, this should've just stayed being a spin-off.
MaschinenZimmer
Banned
Cool, I like ARPGs.
Scrooge McDuck
Member
To be fair, they've made more than ten RPGs where all we do is press X. We couldn't even dodge.
Nightengale
Member
My hypothesis was that the above was mostly target render and was pretty much Nomura's last chance at delivering the combat system he wanted to achieve, and the game would be kept in silence until Nomura either succeeds at it,or fails and Tabata's alternative took over.
They're pretty much working towards rebranding the identity of XV right now and completely disassociate from KH style combat.
manueldelalas
Time Traveler
What did you think when they said it was an "A"RPG?
http://youtu.be/f1Kd9aXBLa0
Holding/Tapping R will bring up a target reticle on enemies.
Holding L brings up a sub-menu that allows you to access reserve members, switch between any of the characters in play or access Special Orders.
Circle is the basic attack button. Most characters have an attack for each circle and left analog stick combination, "O + nothing", "O + forward" and "O + backward". Some even have attacks for "O + left/right".
Triangle and Square are for special abilites like Ace's Laser Cannon (These consume the ability gauge) and offensive spells like Fire RF (These consume MP of course). Each character can be equipped with 2 special abilities, 2 offensive spells or one of each. Some special abilities have multiple combinations when used with the left analog stick.
There is no Jump button but Cross is for dodging and casting support spells like Cure. Pressing/Holding X while the left analog stick is tilted in a certain direction will cause that character to dodge in that direction. Standing still for a moment and holding X will cause the character to charge the support spell. Once the spell begins to charge, you can run around while the spell is charging. When it is charged up, releasing the X button will cast the support spell.
Let's take Ace for example.
O+nothing: Ace sends forwards in a vortex of cards, then swirls cards around him then sends them out forwards again.
O+forward: Ace skips forwards 3 times while swirling cards around him. Then, hurls them forwards.
O+backwards: Ace charges up the attack up to LV5. Depending on the charge level number, the same number of cards will be fired at the enemy one after the other. The enemy may be stun locked while they are being hit by the cards.
Ace does the full attack animation if you hold the following button combinations but you can always perform dodge cancels or magic cancels in between certain actions.
This is what a single attack button, single dodge button and no jump button can do.
Holding/Tapping R will bring up a target reticle on enemies.
Holding L brings up a sub-menu that allows you to access reserve members, switch between any of the characters in play or access Special Orders.
Circle is the basic attack button. Most characters have an attack for each circle and left analog stick combination, "O + nothing", "O + forward" and "O + backward". Some even have attacks for "O + left/right".
Triangle and Square are for special abilites like Ace's Laser Cannon (These consume the ability gauge) and offensive spells like Fire RF (These consume MP of course). Each character can be equipped with 2 special abilities, 2 offensive spells or one of each. Some special abilities have multiple combinations when used with the left analog stick.
There is no Jump button but Cross is for dodging and casting support spells like Cure. Pressing/Holding X while the left analog stick is tilted in a certain direction will cause that character to dodge in that direction. Standing still for a moment and holding X will cause the character to charge the support spell. Once the spell begins to charge, you can run around while the spell is charging. When it is charged up, releasing the X button will cast the support spell.
Let's take Ace for example.
O+nothing: Ace sends forwards in a vortex of cards, then swirls cards around him then sends them out forwards again.
O+forward: Ace skips forwards 3 times while swirling cards around him. Then, hurls them forwards.
O+backwards: Ace charges up the attack up to LV5. Depending on the charge level number, the same number of cards will be fired at the enemy one after the other. The enemy may be stun locked while they are being hit by the cards.
Ace does the full attack animation if you hold the following button combinations but you can always perform dodge cancels or magic cancels in between certain actions.
This is what a single attack button, single dodge button and no jump button can do.
Sakura
Member
Well the thing that makes me worry personally is him saying
"it's possible to set it up so you have different enemies and different choices of attacks you can enter in, but I want to simplify that."
What does that mean? There won't be different enemies? There won't be different choices of attacks?
If pressing a button for coolness, means a system similar to how Resonance of Fate plays, then cool, but the way he is describing it sounds pretty boring.
And when you consider FF games thus far haven't been particularly complex as it is gameplay wise, yet he is talking about making it even more casual, I dunno to me that sounds pretty clear on the direction of gameplay.
That Dude John
Member
I think the worst part is that we have to wait til March at the earliest to really make sense of what he just said. I like to think that what he's describing means that XV will have a nice flow between offensive and defensive actions(like the Arkham games) and there will be tactical reasons for going back and forth that won't leave combat feeling brain-dead.
Hopefully.
Hopefully.
Sounds like as if you just press one button and it chooses the right attack itself.
Fire enemy -> ice attack.
And so on.
Other than the change in UI (I don't think the UI in this video is even real, some of it doesn't match up at all) what exactly has changed from this trailer to the gameplay they're showing now? Pretty much nothing. All the animations, models, effects, and environments have been improved, but nothing has changed. Do you know how the footage they showed in this video was being played? It could have been mostly identical, except they didn't describe it at the time. Think about that.
Ah, really? Do you happen to remember which interview that may have been? Google hasn't been helpful so far.
Actually I thought something was fishy right when they showed that trailer. The battle system looked simply too good to be true. I didn't think video games were advanced enough yet to make all the things they showed actually playable.
Like in this area for example, if you have more than one enemy and they're spread apart a little, you press your awesome button and Noctis rams his sword into the ground and spins around it hitting stuff with his feet. And when you're walking on the side of a building and hold down X Noctis will charge an enemy and knock him off it or something like that.
I just didn't think you could make it work properly because there were too many variables in the combat but if everything was scripted and built with that 'press/hold X for awesome' already in mind it starts making a lot more sense.
Alex_Mexico
Member
Thats an unfair comparison. Those games are turn based and involve a lot of strategy where you navigate seas of menus and, yes, all you do is choose with the Dpad and X but you have to manage you're whole party.
FFXV battles ain't turn based, won't even feature any menus a-la KH and you're holding one button down mostly removing also any kind of strategy that could involve timing hits or linking combos.
Tabata just shot himself in the foot. These declarations are so asinine (casuals aren't even reading you right now!) that I'm convinced some of it must've been lost in translation!
Dark_castle
Junior Member
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=804363
It's totally that FF: Crystal Chronicle guy, Kenichiro Yuji and Tabata himself.
The Silver
Member
FROM MY POINT OF VIEW IT'S THE GAMERS WHO ARE EVIL
True, but they certainly kept that incredibly quiet if its been the case for the past years. They were being disingenuous as hell by showing that sort of combat with out indicating that it was going to control drastically different than what had been described thus far.
Dr. Black Jack
Member
Every Final Fantasy game I played back in the day only required one non-directional button to press during battle. Just sayin'.
Speedwagon
Michelangelo painted the Sistine Chapel. Yabuki turned off voice chat in Mario Kart races. True artists of their time.
Ι do not understand SE's mindset in regards to games development and gamers in general.
What is their logic, why do they desperately feel the need to change their -once adored- concept of how to make games?
Why do they crave so much to change everything people loved about JRPGs and Final Fantasy?
Havent they heard people's complaints towards FFXIII oversimplifying a lot of mechanics and aspects?
Havent they noticed their fans disappointment in the last generation?
What is this "I want FF to appeal to a broader audience"???
Who are they talking about? Our grandparents? Because certainly I think only my grandparents are going to be the ones that need 1 win button to play FF.
Everyone else I know will absolutely hate an action rpg with 1 button...
Does Tabata think that gamers suck so bad that there is need for 1 button? How did we play older FFs and how do we play other highly complex games?
Does Tabata think that we are idiots?
So many questions....
What is their logic, why do they desperately feel the need to change their -once adored- concept of how to make games?
Why do they crave so much to change everything people loved about JRPGs and Final Fantasy?
Havent they heard people's complaints towards FFXIII oversimplifying a lot of mechanics and aspects?
Havent they noticed their fans disappointment in the last generation?
What is this "I want FF to appeal to a broader audience"???
Who are they talking about? Our grandparents? Because certainly I think only my grandparents are going to be the ones that need 1 win button to play FF.
Everyone else I know will absolutely hate an action rpg with 1 button...
Does Tabata think that gamers suck so bad that there is need for 1 button? How did we play older FFs and how do we play other highly complex games?
Does Tabata think that we are idiots?
So many questions....
Dark_castle
Junior Member
What happens tomorrow?
Based on the other interviews he has given this week, I think he's mostly referring to Noctis' role as a "weapon summoner". From the beginning, Noctis has been presented as this super cool Advent Children style character who has a huge array of weapons he can summon at any time to fight his enemies, and he can teleport and so on.
So I think he's basically saying while it's possible to design a game where every single weapon had it's own moveset and things were really technical, he didn't want to go in that direction (or Nomura tried to go in that direction and failed to make it work!). Instead there will be a single attack button, and you equip weapons on a limited deck, and the game picks what to use based on the context (where you're facing, what enemy you're fighting, the range, etc) to create fast flowing action which looks impressive and also works.
This is just my guess, but I get the feeling from his comments that they're making a game where your decisions going into a battle are equally if not more important than how you actually control the character in the battle. FFXII could be a good example. Depending on how you set up your party AI, what weapons are in your deck, what abilities and magic you have equipped, etc, it could make encounters much easier or much harder, rather than the player's ability to manually dodge every attack or execute complex combo strings.
MilkyOctave
Member
It's funny to think that past couple of years we had tiny bits of information regarding FFXV, and now it feels like we're getting news everyday. Only that with each news tend to create more negativity surrounding the game's design. I believe that the end product will still be good, gotta have faith. Sounds like they're thinking ahead if they're to release it on DiveIn, to make it easier for casuals to play.
Lucent
Member
I'm not all that worried about it if it's similar to this.