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Fighting Games Weekly | June 15-21 | 16 is barely okay

Random Fighting Game Question:

Why do you guys think 3d fighters didn't take over the genre as much as other 3d game did other genres?

What other genres are you talking about?

Street Fighter 4 bringing 2D fighting games back was part of a greater trend of developers realizing that older style games with updated graphics could work in present day. It was mostly due to services like Virtual Console and Xbox Live Arcade, which allowed people to download old titles. And as a result older style games were given a face lift, like the New Super Mario Bros Series, or Pac Man Championship Edition.

As for 3D fighting games, interest in them from non-enthusiasts was already waning before SF4. I think fighting games that iterate a lot, but fail to reinvigorate interest from the general public, are doomed to meet the same fate. Soul Calibur had a huge chance of being like the current Mortal Kombat. But Namco fucked that up. It has nothing to do with 2D or 3D.

If you want me to come up with a reason why 2D fighters regained popularity...I think the style being derived from older technology actually helped. 2D fighting games like Street Fighter were forced to communicate more on screen with less available to them. More outlandish concepts were formed as well. 3D fighters in contrast, were about accentuating the newer technology, so they weren't about producing cartoon spectacle, but having a focus on melee combat and attempted realism. Street Fighter 4 came at a time where fighting games in general were waning, so there wasn't a large assertion from the public that 3D fighters were superior like before. With graphics for the 360/PS3 generation, they were able to produce a game that was captivating in a way Tekken and Virtua Fighter weren't. Of course the game about a karate dude that shoots plasma from his hands and has a roundhouse kick that turns him into a helicopter is going to capture more hearts than the game with the karate dude that mimics a chinese fighting style in real life.
 

ShinMaruku

Member
Random Fighting Game Question:

Why do you guys think 3d fighters didn't take over the genre as much as other 3d game did other genres?

3 Reasons really and they are all entwined.

1. 2d was the genesis and set the trend to be ripped off
2.2d was cheaper in the beginning which allows more people to get into making a game and understanding how the games are made.
3. 3d games have more differences between them than the normal 2d games have and they had less developers making them due to reasons 1 and 2. To complicate matters 2 of the big dogs are Namco and Sega, they are no Capcom with promoting their games.

Legacy is the most important thing.
 
Random Fighting Game Question:

Why do you guys think 3d fighters didn't take over the genre as much as other 3d game did other genres?
The 3D fighters have always had weird platform exclusivity issues. Tekken and VF had almost no Nintendo presence, Soulcalibur went from super popular multi-platform SC2 to a PS2 exclusive for a while and Dead or Alive was Xbox exclusive just about at the height of it's popularity. The 2D fighters have usually made their way onto several platforms at once (including arcades where the majority of 2D fighters usually started) and have far and away beaten 3D fighters to the punch in the fastest growing market left for dedicated gaming (PC).

Sometimes it's a simple matter of getting the game into the hands of as many people as possible. Isn't that how Tekken became big in the arcades? The game was everywhere at certain points in it's history.
 

Horseress

Member
FGW |
11427799_10153070279853883_5589354281792857683_n.jpg
 
Aren't Tekken and Soul Calibur really big franchises historically? I don't know how they compare to the main 2D games as a whole, but it's only in the last gen where they sort of became second-tier games.

Besides, it's really not fair to compare it to SF and MK, both of which are atleast somewhat riding the nostalgia coattails of extremely successful entries that are decades past. When you ask non-fighting game people about SF or MK their point of reference are usually the originals, not the newest entries.
 

ShinMaruku

Member
Tekken used to outsell SF quite easily the problem is it slid into niche status faster than sf did and sf is trying it's damnedest to get out of the niche status.
 

Sayad

Member
Random Fighting Game Question:

Why do you guys think 3d fighters didn't take over the genre as much as other 3d game did other genres?
But they did, until 2D fighters were able to keep up by using 3D graphic.


For the competitive scene, 3D fighters are generally more complex, which is why even the ones which were way more popular than 2D games at the time, didn't have as big of a competitive scene, in the US at least as there are some exceptions.
 

Kimosabae

Banned
You're personal opinion on the matter wasn't really what was important to me.

I used your post as an opportunity to make a point to others, regardless of what you said or feel:

Just because Chun wasn't used a lot doesn't mean A) she wont be used in the future when people actually learn to play SF5, or B) that she's not popular.

We have lots of concrete proof of Chun's popularity in the fanbase. It's not really debatable at this point.


"Concrete proof"? You mean like Internet polls? Lmao.

Look I don't disagree that Chun is still a popular character. But I find her lack of stream absence among the e3 crowd interesting and worth looking into. That's more "concrete proof" of her popularity than anything, it's just not particularly strong.
 

oneida

Cock Strain, Lifetime Warranty
Namco: How come these Capcom guys get so many casual players to get excited for this SFV?

Sega: Because their game is stupid easy and not super complex and arcade first like us HAHAHAHAHAHA. WE HAVE RESPECT AND HONOUR

Capcom & SONY: PRE-Orders are off the charts. :)

uitL7rH.jpg
 
I hate kara techniques. Why not just give the character that range on their special or throw

Input detection. You want a normal to start the frame the game detects a button, but few people press two buttons on the exact same frame. You probably want some leniency, which means a throw has to be able to cancel the startup of a button => Kara.

The other way to handle things would be the KOF way. KOF delays inputs a set number of frames to ensure proper things come out:
0f: CD moves
1f: specials, supers
4f: normal moves
(list not comprehensive, nor necessarily accurate)
 
I feel like I'm the only one in here who still likes SF4 after this week lol. I'm pretty excited about SEA Major and am looking forward to high level play again. The pros tournament in SFV just didn't do it for me. Nobody knows what they're doing yet. Birdie players and Justin got away with so much because nobody knows how to deal with the new characters/moves. Daigo basically handicapped himself by playing Ryu and had to fight off old habits while everybody was trying to play SFV since they chose a character they don't play in SF4.

I'm still really excited about SFV and i'm pumped to try the beta. But the game won't look that great to watch for me until all the top guys have at least one month with the game. I think SFV at EVO 2016 will be pretty amazing. For now, back to DP, FADC, Ultra hype :p
 

DRE Fei

Member
I feel like I'm the only one in here who still likes SF4 after this week lol. I'm pretty excited about SEA Major and am looking forward to high level play again. The pros tournament in SFV just didn't do it for me. Nobody knows what they're doing yet. Birdie players and Justin got away with so much because nobody knows how to deal with the new characters/moves. Daigo basically handicapped himself by playing Ryu and had to fight off old habits while everybody was trying to play SFV since they chose a character they don't play in SF4.

I'm still really excited about SFV and i'm pumped to try the beta. But the game won't look that great to watch for me until all the top guys have at least one month with the game. I think SFV at EVO 2016 will be pretty amazing. For now, back to DP, FADC, Ultra hype :p

I like DP FADC as a combo mechanic, but really dislike it as a defensive mechanic.
 

petghost

Banned
You think stuff like cr mk, fireball, v trigger cancel, cr mk, super could work?

Those types of cancels really open up combo systems. Damage is already super high so I'm not sure there is any need besides a more creative system.
 

DunpealD

Member
You think stuff like cr mk, fireball, v trigger cancel, cr mk, super could work?

Those types of cancels really open up combo systems.

Probably not right now. The first part pushes the opponent too far way for the second cr. mk to connect. V-trigger cancel straight to CA might work, since the V-Trigger itself has recovery.
 
You think stuff like cr mk, fireball, v trigger cancel, cr mk, super could work?

Those types of cancels really open up combo systems.

Not for Ryu, he can't V Trigger cancel from specials. They did that because they didn't want players doing random DP > V Trigger to make it safe like players do with FADC in SF4. Momochi did do F+HP, cr. HP, V Trigger, DP, Denjin Hadoken. So like FADC, V Trigger can be used to extend combos. I don't expect to see any long Tatsu or Axe kick loops though like the ones Sakura and Evil Ryu has.
 

QisTopTier

XisBannedTier
I'm telling you guys all Ryu needs is Donkey Kick, Ryu needs something to set up unblockable fireballs with or to help him juggle and build stun better
 
I feel like I'm the only one in here who still likes SF4 after this week lol. I'm pretty excited about SEA Major and am looking forward to high level play again. The pros tournament in SFV just didn't do it for me. Nobody knows what they're doing yet. Birdie players and Justin got away with so much because nobody knows how to deal with the new characters/moves. Daigo basically handicapped himself by playing Ryu and had to fight off old habits while everybody was trying to play SFV since they chose a character they don't play in SF4.

I'm still really excited about SFV and i'm pumped to try the beta. But the game won't look that great to watch for me until all the top guys have at least one month with the game. I think SFV at EVO 2016 will be pretty amazing. For now, back to DP, FADC, Ultra hype :p

Who is going to make the new thread for SEAM?

Pool1: Daigo, Reiketsu, Kim123
Pool2: Shiro, Kindevu, Chuan
Pool3: Gamerbee, Gonzales, Itazan
Pool4: Xiaohai, MOV, Dark Jiewa, Dogura
Pool5: Xian, KOK, Papatiwawa
Pool6: Humanbomb, Eita, Kokujin
Pool7: Momochi, Pugera
Pool8: Kazunoko, Cody,
Pool9: Infiltration, Kichijojiken, GTR, Marn, KSK, Matsuri
Pool10: Tonpy, Gachikun
Pool11: Tokido, Kawaguchi
Pool12: Nemo, RB, Misse
Pool13: Poongko, Gackt, Nyanshi
Pool14: Fuudo, Dakou, Harideshi (dictator),
Pool15: Mago
Pool16: Bonchan, Santarou, Big Bird, Sabohani

Xrd:
Pool1: Kazunoko, Jazz-izm, Dogura
Pool2: NOB, KOK
Pool3: Jiyuna, Pugera, Abegen
Pool4: Xie, Taka
 

shaowebb

Member
Too bad they couldn't put Chun-Li in Marvel.

I saw you were kidding but it reminds me of just how under utilized she was. Her pressure was legit and her lightning leg assist can setup stuff for the right team. I know her damage output was low but with the amount of hits she got and her terrific air dash pressure and crumple options you'd think someone would have experimented harder with maximizing a team setup for her to use seriously. Not like her combos were too rough or like DHC stuff wasn't a big thing for folks already.

Chun Li was under used in Marvel. She was fun and definitely usable out there. I used to enjoy the dirty stuff her and Rocket Raccoon got together with lightning legs and dig.
 
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