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[krang]

Looks like Manor have now gone into administration.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/38530855

Damn.

 

[xrnzaaas]

Being last in F1 sucks more that in any other sport.

 

[Jezbollah]

Well done Bernie. Well done.

That's all three teams who came into F1 in 2010 gone within 6 years. Quite an achievement.

 

[DieH@rd]

Well done Bernie. Well done.

That's all three teams who came into F1 in 2010 gone within 6 years. Quite an achievement.

I'm honestly surprised this team managed to survive for so long. The only hope it now has is for Merc/McLaren/Ferrari to resurrect it as a 2nd team. Torro Roso style.

 

[Jezbollah]

I'm honestly surprised this team managed to survive for so long. The only hope it now has is for Merc/McLaren/Ferrari to resurrect it as a 2nd team. Torro Roso style.

Unfortunately as good as that will be, it wont fix the core issue - the skewed money distribution model that F1 has had in place for years.

 

[Spades]

Well done Bernie. Well done.

That's all three teams who came into F1 in 2010 gone within 6 years. Quite an achievement.

Well all three teams barely achieved anything in F1. Perhaps only teams with sufficient budget should contemplate entering the pinnacle of motorsport so that they can actually compete.

 

[DD]

Carlin leaves GP2 to focus on other series

 

[Aiii]

Well done Bernie. Well done.

That's all three teams who came into F1 in 2010 gone within 6 years. Quite an achievement.

And what a great contribution to the sport they had.

Hope Liberty moves forward on 3-car top-teams, third seat for rookie drivers.

 

[Zaru]

Well all three teams barely achieved anything in F1. Perhaps only teams with sufficient budget should contemplate entering the pinnacle of motorsport so that they can actually compete.

Even if all teams spent 400 million per year, some of them would still inevitably be backmarkers. And there's not enough prize money (at least officially) to cover everyone's costs.

I don't even know how pure "racing" teams (e.g. Force India) can keep existing if they're not attached to some manufacturer or technology company that makes money back with the advertisement effect. It's all just burned money.

 

[krang]

Carlin leaves GP2 to focus on other series

That's quite the shock. Moreso than the Manor news.

 

[Jezbollah]

And what a great contribution to the sport they had.

Hope Liberty moves forward on 3-car top-teams, third seat for rookie drivers.

To be fair, they hardly had the chance to be competitive. I went to Lotus (then Caterham)'s HQ in Hingham to do a bit of work, and their facilities there were tiny. The fact they managed a few seasons in F1 was a tremendous achievement. Sometimes contributions aren't measured in what is achieved on track.

Three car teams have to be the way to go now, or straight up factory satellite teams with year old chassis/engines is the only way to survive in F1. The old way of being a privateer is quickly dying out. It'll be Sauber next.

 

[Spades]

Sometimes contributions aren't measured in what is achieved on track.

But ultimately they should be. It's a sport.

 

[Jezbollah]

But ultimately they should be. It's a sport.

It becomes less of a sport when there are fewer competitors.

 

[DD]

It gets bizarre to know that Manor was the only team that had to pay for transport expenses.

 

[Aiii]

Manor is a participant, never a competitor.

 

[Jezbollah]

Manor is a participant, never a competitor.

I guess ten car grids are the future then.

 

[Aiii]

Do not put the other teams on Manor's level, that is your problem right there.

At best you can make a case for Sauber. Every other team is 100% guaranteed to be able to score points in any given season and I could even make an argument for any one of them to even have an off-chance shot at a podium finish.

I could never make the same argument for any incarnation of Manor, and I do not see why the sport should be any better off with them on the grid. I am deeply sorry for anyone working for them, but they are running an F1 team on a GP2 budget (the blame for this one falls on Bernie for pretending this could ever be a reality) and that simply means you are just there to ride at the back with no chance of ever not being there.

 

[Zaru]

Having 10 teams isn't anything unusual and I won't particularly miss Manor on the grid if they disappear. Sucks for anyone involved of course but when has a team ever survived at the back without getting bought or something?

Though 9 teams... that would really be a sign of dark times under the current system.

 

[Adam Scott Aukerman]

If they're not saved, that's two less seats for young drivers on the grid for at least the next two seasons. Many of you really seem to overlook the contribution Manor have made to the sport just by being there. What they've achieved on their budget is nothing to be sniffed at, and their inability to compete for regular points has nothing to do with their ability as a team.

And with Manor gone, the chances of Sauber folding next year have just increased.

Hoo-fucking-ray.

 

[Jezbollah]

I would get used to 9 teams. I doubt Sauber will exist for a few seasons more given their current struggles. Unless you have a billionaire with experience in racing and manufacturing (Gene Haas) its unlikely any new teams get into F1 now unless they're a big manufacturer.

As regards to privateer racing teams that spent years at the back, Mercedes dominate F1 now, and their existence can be traced back to Tyrrell. Same for Red Bull and Stewart GP. Force India were of course Jordan, and you have Williams and McLaren, who have never been acquired - they did the better job than most but still had major struggles. Minardi were lucky not to disappear thanks to Red Bull, and Renault were once Toleman. Every team has been there. All once participants, all once making up the numbers.

I really hope the new owners of F1 look at the Concorde agreement and get a blowtorch to it. I'd much rather have a grid of 12 teams that are more competitive from front to back than have Ferrari in it.

 

[Zaru]

If they're not saved, that's two less seats for young drivers on the grid for at least the next two seasons.

That sounds bad on paper but... none of their drivers are still in F1.
Exceptions being Bianchi who died, and the Mercedes juniors who are... well, Mercedes juniors. Someone much bigger is making sure they have seats.

 

[Tempy]

I want more teams on the grid, not less :|

Third cars is interesting and all, but would just raise every remaining team's budget even more.

No idea what the solution is, maybe Liberty has some ideas.

Also, any chance of Prema stepping up to F1?

 

[scorcher59]

I would get used to 9 teams. I doubt Sauber will exist for a few seasons more given their current struggles. Unless you have a billionaire with experience in racing and manufacturing (Gene Haas) its unlikely any new teams get into F1 now unless they're a big manufacturer.

I really hope the new owners of F1 look at the Concorde agreement and get a blowtorch to it. I'd much rather have a grid of 12 teams that are more competitive from front to back than have Ferrari in it.

This has to happen, sooner rather than later, someone has to call out the big teams on their threats to "secede"

 

[Adam Scott Aukerman]

That sounds bad on paper but... none of their drivers are still in F1.
Exceptions being Bianchi who died, and the Mercedes juniors who are... well, Mercedes juniors. Someone much bigger is making sure they have seats.

They're at Manor in the first place because there was nowhere else to put them.

And then there's all the engineering talent that their helping to foster. The sport is much poorer without them.

 

[DBT85]

I really hope the new owners of F1 look at the Concorde agreement and get a blowtorch to it. I'd much rather have a grid of 12 teams that are more competitive from front to back than have Ferrari in it.

We can only hope. Won't happen while Bernie is still kicking around though.

Ferrari won't go anywhere anyway.

 

[Satanic Saint]

We can only hope. Won't happen while Bernie is still kicking around though.

Ferrari won't go anywhere anyway.

Actually Bernie himself wants the distribution to be equal. He has numerous times paid the prize money in advance to the smaller teams. He helped Lotus with his own money when they couldn't even afford catering for their employees.

Blame the head honchos of the top teams. They are the greedy ones.

 

[Aiii]

And with Manor gone, the chances of Sauber folding next year have just increased.

No, the chances have decreased. Since they do not risk coming in at a position that gives them no prize money anymore.

 

[Adam Scott Aukerman]

No, the chances have decreased. Since they do not risk coming in at a position that gives them no prize money anymore.

And yet, the chances of them being firmly at the back of the grid have increased, lowering their value to sponsors. Sauber have been close to folding more than once in recent years whilst still receiving prize money.

 

[Aiii]

They will finish in the exact same places as last year, though.

 

[DieH@rd]

They will finish in the exact same places as last year, though.

Except, people will now say they finished dead last. Last year they at least could say they were not last.

 

[Zeknurn]

Vegas eRace qualifier is on soon and the race is at 3pm PT/00:00 CET.
https://www.twitch.tv/eleaguetv

Onboard available here:
http://www.fiaformulae.com/en/news/2017/january/track-layout-unveiled-for-visa-vegas-erace/

 

[DBT85]

Alonso speaking his mind

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/127665/alonso-f1-peaked-in-the-2000s

Formula 1 reached its peak in the 2000s and the Ayrton Senna/Alain Prost era would be considered boring now, reckons Fernando Alonso.

The 2005/06 F1 world champion believes the 1980s championship battles are viewed over-generously with hindsight.

A stern critic of recent F1, Alonso reckons many of the 2014-16 regulations' problems also compromised what many consider as the championship's halcyon period.

"Formula 1 at that time, it was very boring," he said of the Senna/Prost era.

"If you see a race now from '85, '88 or '92, you will sleep through the race because it was two McLarens, the fourth guy was lapped and there was 25 seconds between each car.

"There were 10 cars DNF because the reliability was so-so.

"Television figures, spectators are going down [now], like it was in these boring years in the '80s where Senna, Prost and these people were saving fuel, saving tyres and things like that, so it's exactly the same boring as it was at that time."



By contrast, he rates the manufacturer boom of the 2000s as F1's high point.

"I think Formula 1 grew up a lot," Alonso said of that period.

"A lot of manufacturers came into Formula 1 in the 2000s - BMW, Toyota, and there were many people coming.

"Television figures and the spectators were at the maximum.

"We opened Formula 1 to new countries - we raced in Korea, we raced in India, we raced in Singapore, two races in Spain - and that was the maximum.

"And we didn't understand that situation, probably. The costs were very high, technology was very high, some manufacturers pulled out."

Alonso also believes it is common for drivers to be reassessed more favourably after they retire.

"When you stop racing you transform into an idol, when you are racing you are criticised," he said.

"When you stop racing you are fantastic, it happened with Felipe [Massa], with [Mark] Webber.

"The people of the '80s - they're great champions, they are idols. And now in this generation [Lewis] Hamilton, [Sebastian] Vettel, they will be idols for the kids in go-karts now."



He added that his frustration with recent F1 regulations was that the performance available from the technology could not be fully exploited.

"The resources, the budgets of these teams, the technology we are using allows these cars to be fantastic machines and probably beyond any physics that the human being respects," said Alonso.

"Now we don't have that feeling. We have a car that is way too slow with no grip.

"So we are sitting in a single-seater but with the feeling of a GT."

But Alonso remains optimistic that the increased performance of the 2017 designs - which are intended to lap four-to-five seconds faster due to improved aerodynamics - will make F1 more to his taste.

"I think this will make that excitement of driving and this joy of driving, because we'll feel the grip and we can push in the corners," he said.

 

[Tubie]

Alonso speaking his mind

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/127665/alonso-f1-peaked-in-the-2000s

god damn, non stop dropping (truth) bombs

 

[Aiii]

He's almost correct. The DNF's added a nice level of unpredictability that is sorely missed. Looking back at the late 90s, you were on the edge of your seat during the entire race because even if a guy had a solid lead over the person behind, something could happen at any time.

I also quite enjoyed knowing the teams went to the limit with technology, making engine go far beyond just to catch up to a faster team. I enjoyed that more than the whole "lets save engine because of penalties boohoo" we have now.

Other then that, he's just stating what everyone else is thinking.

 

[Jezbollah]

The sad thing is that F1 used to be the absolute pinnacle of how fast you could make a car within the regulations given. Then people wanted the racing to be close and started thinking they could change regulations and enforce a mandate to make tyres that inhibit performance. The result is that it's made the racing worse.

 

[Zeknurn]

@FIAformulaE
The Superpole results are in for the Visa #VegaseRace

Spoiler

1. @bono_huis
2. @FRosenqvist
3. @AUusiJaakkola
4. @grahamcarroll33
5. David Greco

The coverage is about to start.
https://www.twitch.tv/eleaguetv

 

[Tempy]

Twitch chat is annoying at the moment with all the CSGO players coming in after being notified their favorited CSGO channel is broadcasting.

 

[Zeknurn]

Twitch chat is annoying at the moment with all the CSGO players coming in after being notified their favorited CSGO channel is broadcasting.

Ah, that explains it. But hey, Twitch chat gonna Twitch chat.

 

[JDB]

Twitch chat is annoying at the moment with all the CSGO players coming in after being notified their favorited CSGO channel is broadcasting.

I'm sure the Twitch chat would be high quality otherwise.

 

[JDB]

This framerate, though.

 

[Zeknurn]

This is the best thing ever.

 

[JDB]

Everyone divebombing each other. Truly an authentic online race experience.

 

[Zeknurn]

I wonder which FE drivers will take out the sim racers in the first corner.

 

[Tempy]

There's not a whole lot of interest it seems for the eRace (7k-9k viewers). I guess it doesn't help that rFactor2 looks quite janky. I'm sure the racing physics is the best out there, but when cars collide against barriers or each other, it looks rather comical.

 

[Tempy]

More technical difficulties...

 

[Zeknurn]

In case anyone missed it

https://clips.twitch.tv/eleaguetv/InquisitiveEelMau5

 

[Tempy]

That was actually not bad. Helps it was commentated by Jack Nicholls and Dario Franchitti.

EDIT: This moment was amusing - https://grabyo.com/g/v/iowjbPrw2Zx

 

[Zeknurn]

It was pretty fun, and like you said, they need to move to a more modern game with functional crash physics. rFactor 2 works for the other eRaces but for serious esports it doesn't cut it.

I wonder if they will make an official Formula E game.

 

[Tempy]

LOL - http://www.gpupdate.net/en/autosport-news/348368/gamer-bono-huis-wins-formula-e-erace/

"However, it transpired that a software glitch meant Pahkala's Fanboost was illegally enabled for an additional five laps."

No wonder he was setting those blazing laps.

 

[Zaru]

I wonder if they will make an official Formula E game.

I wouldn't be too optimistic for a full game in the near future.
The series takes place entirely in cities, which means digitally recreating a LOT of high quality assets. It's not like some F1 tracks where you plant a few trees/grandstands and that's pretty much it.

However, wasn't there this whole VR experience thing going on for Formula E? Their recreation is kinda low fidelity but maybe they'll get there. Those same assets could probably be used for both.
Thing is, a decent official game would probably have a higher budget than a Formula E team....