II_JumPeR_I
Member
You hopefully know that MS pays this Devs and Publishers to have their games in the service???
It isnt hurting anyone...
It isnt hurting anyone...
Because UK chart is only retail and that doesn't included PC (digital) sales.The article cited has nothing to do with "hurting day one sales." What I find is weird with:
"Perhaps unsurprisingly because of Game Pass, The Outer Worlds sales are 78% on PS4 and 22% on Xbox One. "
Why are they lumping GP with XOne? Gamepass is also on PC which is where I'm playing the game.
Let me guess...LOL, whining about something being too pro consumer for the sake of the corporations bottom line. Game consumers can be the worst.
LOL, whining about something being too pro consumer for the sake of the corporations bottom line. Game consumers can be the worst.
That I clicked reply at that moment doesn't mean I hadn't seen the page earlier than that. Duh. But again I said "or I misread" and didn't insist or accuse you of doing anything like that in later posts. So I don't know why you're frustrated enough to go back to that point a day later. How does a back water dwelling poor guy like me leave such a lasting impression to you, lol. I guess not-broke people like you have a lot of free time on their hands. Enough to take screenshots when you can just say "the timestamps, man", lol ? In the very post you screenshot I said kFC isn't even popular or have much of a presence here now you want to put me down for eating KFC, lmao. I mean, first you put down back water countries that aren't the USA apparently, now you want to say anyone who goes to KFC is equally back water? That'd put plenty fellow Americans of yours in the same, er, bucket (ha!) so you basically just said the USA is back water by your own "logic"? Dang. But lol @ trying to put me or anyone else down for being "broke"or "poor" anyway. Keep digging.Yeah better cuts like KFC chicken.
You've pretty much revealed you're broke, there's no going back now.
Oh, and you know edits are timestamped and publicly visible right? No one's buying the "you must have edited your post, I don't know why I else I would mention KFC" excuse - you mentioned KFC because you are poor and that is where you go when you want wings.
LOL, whining about something being too pro consumer for the sake of the corporations bottom line. Game consumers can be the worst.
Let me guess...
Do you prefer to have a year of amazing gaming deals and after that collapse of the gaming industry over to have a grow and health gaming industry with more games for the next decade?
I will always choose the health industry for the future instead my "pro-consumer" deal for a year before collapse.
No.Gamepass isn't going to make the industry collapse. Way to miss the point though, consumers should care about getting the best deal and not about how much money the corporations make. Things are quite unbalanced. Consider this, if people were getting a great deal on new Toyota's, they wouldn't be saying 'it's too consumer friendly, how will Toyota make enough money'. It's absurd the way some game consumers act.
How do we know no one gets hurt? I am not saying we know people are getting hurt to be clear. But do we know for a fact that no devs have bonuses tied to sales numbers that may get watered down due to subscriptions but not sales?You hopefully know that MS pays this Devs and Publishers to have their games in the service???
It isnt hurting anyone...
It is hard to make a conclusion yet but it looks that games being at launch on Gamepass hurts too potential revenue... perhaps Gamepass should try to be like Netflix and release games only after some months of release.
In any case let's try to make some maths with what we have:
The Other World guessed sales in UK: ~10-20k (using the UK ranking and estimating with previous weeks ranking).
Xbox The Other World UK sales: ~3k (I used about 15k sales for that)
Xbox games in UK usually do 30-40% of the sales... it is lower than PS4 version but it is way better than 22%.
Xbox The Other World missed UK sales: ~2k
Xbox The Other World missed Revenue: $120k
Let's say these missed sales are playing the game on Gamepass at average of $5 per month (I know it is $10 but there is so many $1 deal that is even hard to defense the $5).
Xbox The Other World generated Gamepass Revenue per month: $10k
So these 2k players that used the Gamepass to play The Other World needs to stay in the service paying $5 per month during 12 months (one year) to math the launch sales of the game without Gamepass.
That is one game.
If you have another launch games on Gamepass you will need in the same terms (low sales games) 2 years of Gamepass subscription to pay off... if you have the 3rd game launch in Gamepass in the year... and the number will only increase... you will never recover the missed revenue.
If we start to look in big seller games... well it will be a monstrous number of missed revenue.
At that point I don't believe Gamepass will ever pay the revenue lost but not having the game on Gamepass.
Launching game with Gamepass is a non go imo.
It is business suicide.
You do it only to cater more users to experience the service with one game sporadic but never for all first party games and never for 3rd party games.
So how they will recover the revenue sales at launch with Gamepass for this game in UK? Explain how that Gamepass "magic" works please.Did you really just lump the entirety of the industry into one games sales and try to say an entire service is business suicide because of your math which doesnt even account for how the sales of games actually works...
Right...
I'm gonna puke from how dizzy this thread makes me.
That's essentially what leasing a car is. From what I can tell, the leasing program is pretty common and helps car companies stay afloat. RMR is huge in the Automotive world.No.
Gamepass will colapse... I just used gaming industry as metaphor lol
I'm waiting Toyota renting cars at $100 per month... it will go bankrupt.
You mean leasing?I'm waiting Toyota renting cars at $100 per month... it will go bankrupt.
Do you have ideia how much per month cost that leasing car? C'mon.That's essentially what leasing a car is. From what I can tell, the leasing program is pretty common and helps car companies stay afloat. RMR is huge in the Automotive world.
$100 per month?You mean leasing?
So how they will recover the revenue sales at launch with Gamepass for this game in UK? Explain how that Gamepass "magic" works please.
I knew you have nothing to say.You want me to explain how your math which has absolutely no real facts is somehow indicative to how a service will be profitable?
A service like gamepass does not and will not even be sustainable if you base everything on one title.
Which is exactly why it's not only offered with one title.
Do you have ideia how much per month cost that leasing car? C'mon.
I knew you have nothing to say.
More titles = more revenue lost that will never be recovered.
If you can't understand why Gamepass won't work having games launching in simultaneous with retail/digital then I can't do nothing.
Do you have ideia how much per month cost that leasing car? C'mon.
$100 per month?
I suppose the thinking is they offer these ridiculous cheap Gamepass deals, put regular new games on it, get people entrenched in the Gamepass system and so used to getting new games easily and cheaply thet when they put Gamepass upto $10 or $15 a month, many people will be so invested in the system that many carry on with it at the higher price.
Do you meant $350 per month? Of course.I lease 2 cars a Ford Edge for $350 and a Ford Fusion Hybrid for $350, each in a 36 month lease. But these cars are worth $20,000-$30,000 a piece. A game is worth $60, Gamepass is indeed sustainable for developers as Microsoft pays the developer based on the statistics of each games installs, hours played and so on.
We can use revenue... what developer will receive is a way lower fraction of that.(Facepalm)
More titles does not equal more revenue lost. You can't boil everything down to your IMAGINARY NUMBERS.
Considering we don't have any numbers to what and or how these deals are structured, or how much a developer makes by adding their game to the service, your numbers mean fuck all.
Of course.Do you meant $350 per month? Of course.
Try to lease these cars at $100 there and see if they can hold the deal.Of course.
We can use revenue... what developer will receive is a way lower fraction of that.
And yes.
A $60 retail game will generate absurd more revenue than the same gamer just playing it on Gamepass.
It is not even contestable that.
You people are crazy.
We can use revenue... what developer will receive is a way lower fraction of that.
And yes.
A $60 retail game will generate absurd more revenue than the same gamer just playing it on Gamepass with a sub at $10 per month.
It is not even contestable that.
You people are crazy.
Like I said... the best case scenario you need to subscribe for 12 months in Gamepass to recover the revenue of a single retail game... if you get another games in that period then you need 24 months and you can go on.
That's not what they're doing, not even close. What you pay is based on what you put down as well as your credit. You must have never owned a car.. Not only that, but no one here has enough information to even fathom an educated guess. All I know is, I don't give two shits about how it's done, but for $15 a month I can play a shit-ton of games. If companies like Microsoft, Sony, Google, Netflix, Hulu, HBO, Showtime, etc can provide me solid content at a solid price per month, I'm fucking in. RMR wins every time.Try to lease these cars at $100 there and see if they can hold the deal.
That is what Gamepass is doing.
And before you say the car costs more you need to remember that the Gamepass monthly cost give you more than one car.
You don't need to know because it is less than what the subs is... it is a small fraction of the sub.Then tell me the revenue that any developer made on gamepass. Go for it. You can't because it doesn't exist.
Not only is the $60 claim false considering not even close to $60 goes to a developer when they sell a game, but you also have no data to support how many people have converted a game from rent to buy with gamepass.
We "people" aren't crazy. We can simply look past the most basic details that you seem to be stuck on an unwilling to move from for whatever reason.
You don't need to know because it is less than what the subs is... it is a small fraction of the sub.
It is impossible to be more than that.
You believe MS is giving money to devs lol
So you really believe MS pays for devs more than what they get with the subs? OMG if they do that to all devs that have games on Gamepass lolYou have to be trolling at this point.
You don't need to know because it is less than what the subs is... it is a small fraction of the sub.
It is impossible to be more than that.
You believe MS is giving money to devs lol
So you really believe MS pays for devs more than what they get with the subs? OMG if they do that to all devs that have games on Gamepass lol
This makes sense.At the moment thats EXACTLY what they are doing. They are building a service that requires content and they are getting that content by cutting deals for games. And they arent going to do that for all devs because they are going to hand pick the content they want and get the deals they want.
So my first post said it is unsustainable.At the moment thats EXACTLY what they are doing. They are building a service that requires content and they are getting that content by cutting deals for games. And they arent going to do that for all devs because they are going to hand pick the content they want and get the deals they want.
So you really believe MS pays for devs more than what they get with the subs? OMG if they do that to all devs that have games on Gamepass lol
Indeed a trillion dollars company making charity.
You have a example (that is what the thread is based).Its a case to case scenario. It depends on the production scope and scale of a project. If you wanna ship a AAA title on gamepass I highly doubt that you can even recoup the lost costs from Digital sales and retail sailes. If you are Not AAA there is a chance you either recope those costs or in some cases even break even. Everything is possible.
So my first post said it is unsustainable.
Read it please.
Right now Game Pass is hurting software sales on Xbox but if Microsoft is successful in creating the Netflix of gaming it could benefit games in the post physical media era when people are not willing to pay $60 for a download.
It is unsustainable and I explained in the first post.I read your first post but its simply wrong. As the service evolves so do the subscribers. THats the whole point. At some point the amount of subscribers will cover the price of the operating costs and then everything past that is revenue.
Now im not saying the price of gamepass will not go up. It most certainly will in time as the value of the product is seen, but to say its unsustainable is simply untrue. There is a very clear path to profits.
It is unsustainable and I explained in the first post.
I even go more depth saying they will probably needs to move away from releasing on Gamepass simultaneous to Retail/Digital launch and now you give a another example they will need to ask more for Gamepass.
Netflix make their own movies and release them on day one on Netflix? What’s your pointIt is hard to make a conclusion yet but it looks that games being at launch on Gamepass hurts too potential revenue... perhaps Gamepass should try to be like Netflix and release games only after some months of release.
In any case let's try to make some maths with what we have:
The Other World guessed sales in UK: ~10-20k (using the UK ranking and estimating with previous weeks ranking).
Xbox The Other World UK sales: ~3k (I used about 15k sales for that)
Xbox games in UK usually do 30-40% of the sales... it is lower than PS4 version but it is way better than 22%.
Xbox The Other World missed UK sales: ~2k
Xbox The Other World missed Revenue: $120k
Let's say these missed sales are playing the game on Gamepass at average of $5 per month (I know it is $10 but there is so many $1 deal that is even hard to defense the $5).
Xbox The Other World generated Gamepass Revenue per month: $10k
So these 2k players that used the Gamepass to play The Other World needs to stay in the service paying $5 per month during 12 months (one year) to math the launch sales of the game without Gamepass.
That is one game.
If you have another launch games on Gamepass you will need in the same terms (low sales games) 2 years of Gamepass subscription to pay off... if you have the 3rd game launch in Gamepass in the year... and the number will only increase... you will never recover the missed revenue.
If we start to look in big seller games... well it will be a monstrous number of missed revenue.
At that point I don't believe Gamepass will ever pay the revenue lost but not having the game on Gamepass.
Launching game with Gamepass is a non go imo.
It is business suicide.
You do it only to cater more users to experience the service with one game sporadic but never for all first party games and never for 3rd party games.
You have a example (that is what the thread is based).
Even for small titles with low sales you can't recover the revenue lost... a drop in 20% of launch sales is abysmal for either small or big AAA title.
I understand MS is doing a test to see how it works but it is unsustainable... they will probably stop to release games on Gamepass simultaneos with Retail/Digital launch.
But let's play that game.
How many games do you believe MS can give always from retail sales per year on Gamepass?
It is unsustainable and I explained in the first post.
I even go more depth saying they will probably needs to move away from releasing on Gamepass simultaneous to Retail/Digital launch and now you give a another example they will need to ask more for Gamepass.
Gamepass actually has not much difference from how PS Plus of Games for Gold works... the main differences that makes these last two works is that the price is way higher and the games are not simultaneous released with retail/digital... everybody that will buy the game at launch will buy it and after they can put it on Plus or Games for Gold to make it more accessible or create hype for sequels.
Now what Gamepass do is to steal sales from retail/digital launch without getting the revenue back.
That won't work.
The premisse of the thread is true.