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[Deleted member 47027]

With the amount of destructable environments plus crazy graphics, yeah to account for everything to keep 60, they would have to significantly reduce those things to account for the rare 16 grenade screen.

Answer me this. Does Call of Duty multiplayer maintain 60 fps in every situation?

For sure, I'm just saying that they CAN still find the limits and work accordingly within them. It's a different story of a Game Genie scenario happens where someone breaks the game via a glitch and goes beyond the limits set.

As for your second question, no, of course not.

 

[IAmRandom31]

You can plan for it. It's just as controllable as single player, you just have to know the limits of what can be done.

Elaborate on " planning for it "

Would love to see a code structure that is designed to " plan for " moments of the entire screen filling up with explosions.

The only people playing games smoothly at +60fps on any game are the ones who are either

A.) dropping the graphic fidelity massively, overcompensating on FPS as to where drops never happen below 60fps

B.) Have a massive rig, which again achieves 100+fps and whatever is being thrown on screen does not overload the / GPU / Bandwidth / CPU

 

[Majanew]

As long as it's not distracting and there isn't screen tearing or dropped frames that is causing the game to stutter.

 

[BigDug13]

Answer me this people who are hating on this news.

What console multiplayer shooter maintained 60fps in all situations?

 

[Fantasmo]

So CoD basically.

 

[trephine]

Wont bother me at all, ill be too into the game to care. Where the hell did all these frame per second elitests come from out of nowhere.

 

[Deleted member 47027]

Elaborate on " planning for it "

Would love to see a code structure that is designed to " plan for " moments of the entire screen filling up with explosions.

It's not high concept here brah. You plan for the possibility of everything going off at one moment completely on screen. You find the maximum amount of shit that could happen at the same time. Trigger every effect at once. That's it. It's not high concept.

 

[teokrazia]

Via Eurogamer

Amazing streak of fox & grapes BS.

 

[SmokedMeat]

Watch the damn the presentation first.

He said that the only scenarios where framerate will drop is when crazy shit happens ( like 20+ grenades going off at the same time in a full lobby ).

Other than that, it's 60fps.

I'm fine with that, and wouldn't expect frame rate to remain stable in a situation like that anyways.

I thought GAF liked honesty?

 

[Oppo]

I admire the honesty and candor, and I buy the rationale.

 

[Skeff]

Whoa. Well, there's the devil, in the details. I'd rather have 30fps constant, than drops from 60fps.

It's super noticeable to me, unfortunately.

It seems the technical presentation wasn't super noticeable though, I take it you don't play any 60fps games then.

 

[nib95]

Also, this is the same as every 60fps console shooter to date. They have drops too. GG are just being exceedingly honest.

 

[OldAsUrSock]

"Running 60 has become this Holy Grail. Suddenly people think if you run 60 your game is better. Technically, that's not really true.

having a constant 60 is not actually better than having a 'lot of the time' 60. It sounds weird, but it's actually true.

Is this the same guy that was fighting against 60fps? If so they need to get rid of him.

 

[Mystery]

And I'm out. They've saved me some money. Having framerate drops is a complete turn off for me and I would rather a solid 30 than and unstable 60fps. Not interested Guerilla.

This is the stupidest shit I've ever heard, and I can't believe it's getting repeated over and over in this thread. Having a solid 60fps is ideal, but choosing a 30fps multiplayer shooter experience over a near-constant 60fps multiplayer shooter experience is ridiculous. If the framerate drops to 45 or 50 fps a few times during the match, what is the downside? It's not like you're playing multiplayer for some sort of cinematic experience. Maybe your response time will be slightly slowed during those few occurrences. If it was locked at 30, your response time would be slowed for the entire match.

 

[kaching]

The difference is no one tried excusing those

So all the "60fps or nothing" types absolutely refused to play them?

I don't recall GAF making much hay over games that claimed 60fps but didn't hit it 100% of the time. Seemed to excuse them easily enough and what Guerrilla seems to be saying here sounds like it's about on par with those past "offenses" so the degree of chastisement should be similar.

oh so it'll be like on internet forums where if you're in a really small enclosed thread the IQ will bump up and it's beautiful and you'll wish everyone thought through their posts like that and then you see more people in a thread and it's back down to idiot levels

I loled.

 

[MDSLKTR]

60fps was a pipe dream but nooo still complaints now

 

[Orayn]

It's not high concept here brah. You plan for the possibility of everything going off at one moment completely on screen. You find the maximum amount of shit that could happen at the same time. Trigger every effect at once. That's it. It's not high concept.

There are way too many permutations of where players could be on a map and what they could use to test all of them.

 

[dark10x]

Interesting that they're getting called out on this while Wonderful 101 got off with a framerate not unlike Bayonetta ps3. :-/

 

[Skeff]

Is this the same guy that was fighting against 60fps? If so they need to get rid of him.

I would assume your talking about the artist who was working on driveclub, so I'd guess no.

 

[Deleted member 47027]

There are way too many permutations of where players could be on a map and what they could use to test all of them.

Shouldn't be. You trigger everything to see the max, from every spot with every angle. No matter how unrealistic the scenario, it's doable. "Trigger 25 grenade explosions even though the max that could possibly happen is 24" etc.

 

[Nafai1123]

So like every other 60fps shooter.

 

[maplelord93]

a lot of the time

...................

 

[WeAreStarStuff]

I wish they had went with locked 30fps from the start, and just pushed even more visuals.

 

[driver116]

You know what you need to do Sony - overclock CPU+GPU 10%.

 

[mephixto]

A drop from 60 to 45 is very noticeable and annoying, I hope this drops will be minimal and not too frequent.

 

[Skeff]

Shouldn't be. You trigger everything to see the max, from every spot with every angle. No matter how unrealistic the scenario, it's doable. "Trigger 25 grenade explosions even though the max that could possibly happen is 24" etc.

The problem of course with this is if it hit 60 fps whilst doing all of this the game would look like shit or have no explosions/destruction.

 

[nib95]

This is the stupidest shit I've ever heard, and I can't believe it's getting repeated over and over in this thread. Having a solid 60fps is ideal, but choosing a 30fps multiplayer shooter experience over a near-constant 60fps multiplayer shooter experience is ridiculous. If the framerate drops to 45 or 50 fps a few times during the match, what is the downside? It's not like you're playing multiplayer for some sort of cinematic experience. Maybe your response time will be slightly slowed during those few occurrences. If it was locked at 30, your response time would be slowed for the entire match.

Another thing is, during explosions etc is when you least notice drops as well. Almost actually suits what's going on screen. Having then downgrade the visuals for that very rare drop would have been an utter waste.

 

[BeeDog]

Well, on one hand it's not like there was ever a chance it would run at a constant 60 fps with this kind of visual fidelity, but on the other hand, jesus christ they couldn't have phrased this worse even if they tried.

Anyway, I've been so damaged this past generation that a variable 60 fps will probably be better than locked 30 fps.

 

[Cave Johnson]

I hate the way this presenter details the game. He sound like a hybrid between a Crytek & COD PR. Lots of tech tech tech tech talk and then side-steps concerning actual significant gameplay improvements. For instance, one of the audience posed a really good question asking why have that airship segment that is scripted and not be able control it in this incredibly detailed world - the answer..

toilet paper....

DETAILED TOILET PAPER

Then this dude goes on a tangent detailing how it will take until 2018 before that kind of mechanic is implemented with DTP involved. Goes to show where their priorities lie and is no wonder why the game is shaping up to the the most generic, carbon-copy FPS design for next-gen attaching the better graphics, 1080p and 60fps "most-of-the-time" tagline for the masses.

And then there's season passes as well..

So basically, all the inherent limitations of the sub-standard FPS design going to fruition with KZ: SF as it's launch "next-gen" title. I'm sorry, I've played 1080p/60fps LOCKED FPS this gen and it hasn't so much changed my perception other than being visually and responsively tolerable than it's console counterparts.

 

[BlackClouds]

Dude should've just lied/exaggerated about the framerate. Do not ever kow-tow to the douchebag set, it's not worth it.

 

[Lord Error]

It's a very good decision to make SP visually richer at 30FPS and scale down multiplayer visuals for 60. No one cares about super fact reaction times in SP really.

Interesting that they're getting called out on this while Wonderful 101 got off with a framerate not unlike Bayonetta ps3. :-/

The price of honesty. It really depends how often and how much it drops frames. If it's 60 most of the time, like say CoD games, than I don't see people complaining.

Dude should've just lied/exaggerated about the framerate. Do not ever kow-tow to the douchebag set, it's not worth it.

Pretty much. Unless it's 60FPS like how GoW3 was 60FPS, in which case I can understanding not wanting to oversell it.

 

[VanWinkle]

I wish they had went with locked 30fps from the start, and just pushed even more visuals.

But the visuals at 60fps already look better than any other console shooter out there.

 

[Bl4ckSunsh1n3]

This is the stupidest shit I've ever heard, and I can't believe it's getting repeated over and over in this thread. Having a solid 60fps is ideal, but choosing a 30fps multiplayer shooter experience over a near-constant 60fps multiplayer shooter experience is ridiculous. If the framerate drops to 45 or 50 fps a few times during the match, what is the downside? It's not like you're playing multiplayer for some sort of cinematic experience. Maybe your response time will be slightly slowed during those few occurrences. If it was locked at 30, your response time would be slowed for the entire match.

Whoa, whoa, whoa. Quit talking sensible.

From what I get out of it he's talking mostly about edge case scenarios for the frame rate drops. If that is the case then nearly every player input will occur at rate of 60FPS.

 

[Breakfast at Noon]

at least there open about it and not hiding.

this may sound strange but why always 30 or 60 why not, you know 45? why does it have to be that specific set?

 

[Lagspike_exe]

They should have cut the resolution to 1600x900 to boost FPS.

 

[ComputerMKII]

They should have 'made graphical concessions'. As Respawn Entertainment said, framerate is king.

 

[Deleted member 47027]

The problem of course with this is if it hit 60 fps whilst doing all of this the game would look like shit or have no explosions/destruction.

Well you optimize around what you see. Say 25 grenades makes the system shit itself and drop into the 15s. Alright, which part of that is responsible for killing it so much? Do you rework how the smoke comes out? Maybe there's too much work happening with the destruction minimum that comes from a grenade drop next to a certain type of material? You optimize and try to get it to where it looks best with the least performance decrease. Sometimes you just hit hard limits, and that's what it sounds like here. They're hitting a hard limit in extreme scenarios that people may not come across. But you cut what you can, where you can, and try to make it work without noticeably losing visual fidelity.

 

[VanWinkle]

at least there open about it and not hiding.

this may sound strange but why always 30 or 60 why not, you know 45? why does it have to be that specific set?

Refresh rates of television sets. With anything that's not 30 or 60, there will be some frames that are single frames and some that are doubled, which creates a jarring experience.

 

[Q8D3vil]

Suddenly people think if you run 60 your game is better.

60 fps does make games better.
120p make them better too.

 

[Orayn]

Shouldn't be. You trigger everything to see the max, from every spot with every angle. No matter how unrealistic the scenario, it's doable. "Trigger 25 grenade explosions even though the max that could possibly happen is 24" etc.

Trigger 25 grenade explosions where? At every possible configuration of where you could put 25 grenades on the map? With every possible camera position and camera angle for each of 24 players?

Well you optimize around what you see. Say 25 grenades makes the system shit itself and drop into the 15s. Alright, which part of that is responsible for killing it so much? Do you rework how the smoke comes out? Maybe there's too much work happening with the destruction minimum that comes from a grenade drop next to a certain type of material? You optimize and try to get it to where it looks best with the least performance decrease. Sometimes you just hit hard limits, and that's what it sounds like here. They're hitting a hard limit in extreme scenarios that people may not come across. But you cut what you can, where you can, and try to make it work without noticeably losing visual fidelity.

This is more realistic. You optimize things in broad strokes, not through exhaustively testing every game scenario that could cause the framerate to drop. That's just not possible in a game with 24 human players each acting independently.

 

[jett]

I don't mind an unlocked framerate at all as long as it's running close to 60fps most of the time. Nobody complained about the recently released "60fps" Metal Gear Rising and that shit drops frames on a constant basis. Or the COD games for that matter, on either console. Sometimes I think some developers are too honest.

 

[dark10x]

at least there open about it and not hiding.

this may sound strange but why always 30 or 60 why not, you know 45? why does it have to be that specific set?

It needs to be a multiple of the refresh rate for an even display of frames. Anything else results in judder.

I don't mind an unlocked framerate at all as long as it's running close to 60fps most of the time. Nobody complained about the recently released "60fps" Metal Gear Rising and that shit drops frames on a constant basis.

Wonderful 101 is much MUCH worse as well. Platinum is losing their framerate edge.

 

[DirtyLarry]

Crysis 1 @ 1080p on my PC runs 60fps "a lot of the time" and it's pretty damn awesome.

This x10.
Same with BF3. Most of the times I am able to get that constant 60 FPS, but there are sometimes it drops due to all the action on screen. It hardly ruins anything.

 

[def sim]

"So, having a constant 60 is not actually better than having a 'lot of the time' 60. It sounds weird, but it's actually true."

I'm sure the game will be fine. This is just an incredibly stupid thing to say.

 

[driver116]

at least there open about it and not hiding.

this may sound strange but why always 30 or 60 why not, you know 45? why does it have to be that specific set?

It must divide into 60

 

[BloodMoney]

A drop from 60 to 45 is very noticeable and annoying, I hope this drops will be minimal and not too frequent.

Yes... and it happens even on uber end gaming rigs during various "high load" scenarios.

 

[Deleted member 47027]

Trigger 25 grenade explosions where? At every possible configuration of where you could put 25 grenades on the map? With every possible camera position and camera angle for each of 24 players?

You don't have to overthink it - put it in one spot with the most possible destructable terrain with the most effects on and see how it performs. You don't have to go through every possible angle when you can throw them all at one spot at once. Plenty of devs will make places that are used to just stress the whole system with every effect they could possibly use in multi at once, to simplify the process. I'm just saying it's not that crazy to find these things.

 

[Nightengale]

I hate the way this presenter details the game. He sound like a hybrid between a Crytek & COD PR. Lots of tech tech tech tech talk and then side-steps concerning actual significant gameplay improvements. For instance, one of the audience posed a really good question asking why have that airship segment that is scripted and not be able control it in this incredibly detailed world - the answer..

Then this dude goes on a tangent detailing how it will take until 2018 before that kind of mechanic is implemented with DTP involved. Goes to show where their priorities lie and is no wonder why the game is shaping up to the the most generic, carbon-copy FPS design for next-gen attaching the better graphics, 1080p and 60fps "most-of-the-time" tagline for the masses.

Were we watching the same presentation?

The question about 'explore the city' thing was practically asking for a first-person GTA of Vekta City, where the audience was interested at why the game doesn't allow for a full-scale exploration of a fully rendered city.

The explanation was poor, but it was pretty obvious he meant that if they rendered the entire world complete with explorability and open-world, the game would need another 4 years of development time.

 

[nOoblet16]

It's like so many people haven't heard of the term perceptual 60FPS. Almost all 60FPS console tittles do this, they are just being honest about it. There are very very few games that run at locked 60FPS with no drops most being sports games or Forza. Hell even on a high end PC I'll experience dips once in a while in many games.

 

[Naminator]

Dat feel of locked 60FPS?