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[EazyB]

On that note, I'm quite in the vehicle for community rating and testing that will funnel community maps into Matchmaking. I'm hoping that's touched on tonight, and not just the functionality of Forge.

There's no way Bungie could expect decent community content integration without offloading some of the burden to the community. I've said it before, but the way they plan to integrate the content is almost as important as the tools that they give the community. With the possibility of integration into MM creators have more incentive to create quality maps.

Slightly related, but FC2 did a really smart thing by having two author notes on a map as opposed to H3's single author tag. With FC2, if you started a fresh map, you'd be recognized as the map's "Original Author" and there was also a line for simply "Author." If someone were to download/steal your map, you'd still be recognized as the original author while their name would fall under "Author." While whatever you make within Halo is free to be used and edited by anything, this gives a little more reassurance to the creator that their work will be recognized.

What's going to be so much easier, and more fan friendly, is searching and tagging created variants from Forge. Similar to how they're doing screenshots and saved films. Instead of going online, trying to download, and going back, it's going to be a quick step process.

That's another important thing about community maps. FC2 had a system where you could search by rating, popularity, author, and maybe even more options. On top of that they allowed the creator to snap a photo in the editor to use as a preview pic (hey doesn't Halo have a screenshot dealy?). All of these made finding quality maps much more simple.

 

[Schmitty]

This. Construct is okay, but I'd rather they try and make a new vertical map rather than port Construct, which has some issues.

I think that is what Swordbase was in the beta. Vertical maps always just are a race to the top which is why I hate them.

 

[feel]

Why do you guys worry so much about old favorite maps returning? Reach's jetpacking makes the fine tuned lines of sight and walk/jump paths irrelevant. Might as well make every map a huge room with some boxes, cause they'll all play the same. /still bitter about jetpacks in matchmaking (disclaimer: didn't really put much thought into this post, do not take seriously)

 

[The Librarian]

I can definitely see Valhalla being in the canyon somewhere.

But you are right. I am not excited about the Blood Gulch remake. It was awesome in Halo CE, but that's Halo CE and not Reach. It was tailored for Halo CE, and it worked amazingly with its simpler gameplay. I know a lot of people are fans of Coagulation in Halo 2, but I thought it was awful compared to playing on Blood Gulch. My main reasons for that was most likely due to the different physics and rules that Halo CE had: i.e. the grenade physics, invincible vehicles, etc. For whatever reason that made the map much more fun for me.

Anyways, my main point is that a map can play much more differently in a different game. Yes these are all Halo games, but I don't need to tell you that they are in fact different games with, although slightly, different rules and gameplay factors. That's why I think it makes the most sense for Bungie to stop making all these remakes of previous maps, and to just focus on making new maps that will work in their current game. And we all know that it is almost impossible for them to make everyone happy with their remakes. People always find something to bitch about.

You have some good points.

Valhalla isn't everything. I can't wait regardless. Nearly four hours to go!

Oh, and from the supposed "beta leaks," Forge_island is my most anticipated.

 

[Domino Theory]

Please no.

Agreed.

I still can't believe how many gems stemmed from Halo 2 in terms of maps:

Ivory Tower
Headlong
Lockout
Midship
Sanctuary
Colossus
Ascension
Waterworks
Terminal
Relic
Zanzibar
Turf
Burial Mounds

So. fucking. GOOD.

 

[Blueblur1]

Well my Legendary purchase is in question, found out that my work is cutting my position Aug 6. :|

Hopefully I'll be back up and running by Reach!

Wow, that's terrible. Start sprucing up your resume a.s.a.p.

 

[big ander]

I think that is what Swordbase was in the beta. Vertical maps always just are a race to the top which is why I hate them.

Good point.
Make another vertical map please. A good one this time.

Why do you guys worry so much about old favorite maps returning? Reach's jetpacking makes the fine tuned lines of sight and walk/jump paths irrelevant. Might as well make every map a huge room with some boxes, cause they'll all play the same. /still bitter about jetpacks in matchmaking

 

[Hydranockz]

That's another important thing about community maps. FC2 had a system where you could search by rating, popularity, author, and maybe even more options. On top of that they allowed the creator to snap a photo in the editor to use as a preview pic (hey doesn't Halo have a screenshot dealy?). All of these made finding quality maps much more simple.

Anyone who disregarded cohesion when naming their map really didn't stand much of a chance when it came to being popular imo.

"What does the map Sasquatch v54 look like?"

*looks at preview shot of Sandbox*

FFFFFFFFFFFFUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU

 

[Sai-kun]

This. Construct is okay, but I'd rather they try and make a new vertical map rather than port Construct, which has some issues.

Man I love construct so much

 

[Princess Carl]

Agreed.

I still can't believe how many gems stemmed from Halo 2 in terms of maps:

Ivory Tower
Headlong
Lockout
Midship
Sanctuary
Ascension
Waterworks
Terminal
Relic
Zanzibar
Turf

So. fucking. GOOD.

Its quite amazing really. Love me some Halo 2 maps.

 

[Shake Appeal]

I'd forgotten Letters's irrational hate of jetpacks.

 

[Schmitty]

Agreed.

I still can't believe how many gems stemmed from Halo 2 in terms of maps:

Ivory Tower
Headlong
Lockout
Midship
Sanctuary
Ascension
Waterworks
Terminal
Relic
Zanzibar
Turf

So. fucking. GOOD.

You could almost list every map from that game. Terminal and Burial Mounds were awesome. There was also Beaver Creek, Coagulation, and Colossus. The only really bad maps were Gemini, Backwash, and Warlock

 

[Striker]

Agreed.

I still can't believe how many gems stemmed from Halo 2 in terms of maps:

Ivory Tower
Headlong
Lockout
Midship
Sanctuary
Ascension
Waterworks
Terminal
Relic
Zanzibar
Turf

So. fucking. GOOD.

Beaver Creek
Colossus
Burial Mounds

Goddamnit.

 

[Gareth Bale]

Just to clarify, when I said 'possibly' Construct I was thinking more of a reimagining than a remake. Obviously from a map control perspective it has a lot of problems.

 

[Sai-kun]

Is anyone in the IRC chat?

 

[Domino Theory]

Beaver Creek
Colossus
Burial Mounds

Goddamnit.

Crap, forgot those maps, but Beaver Creek is just a re-make of CE's Battle Creek so I didn't list it.

 

[JMizzlin]

Hype reaching critical capacities.. But now it's time for work for the next 6 hours =/ fuuu

 

[Striker]

Crap, forgot those maps, but Beaver Creek is just a re-make of CE's Battle Creek so I didn't list it.

It wasn't you missing them in your list, but how it went from 20-some good to fantastic maps to three or four decent ones. Ugh.

Beaver Creek poops on the ladders from Battle Creek.

 

[kittens]

Man, I have such different taste in multiplayer maps than most of HaloGAF. My all time favorites are probably Hang'em High, Lockout, Valhalla, Construct, and Narrows. Midship is the one that baffles me the most -- I find it boring and impossible to get any kills in, but GAF loves it.

Oh, and Burial Mounds. I thought it was unanimously hated? I thought it played like crap. I remember cursing how often it popped up in matchmaking back in the early days of H2.

 

[EazyB]

Why do you guys worry so much about old favorite maps returning? Reach's jetpacking makes the fine tuned lines of sight and walk/jump paths irrelevant. Might as well make every map a huge room with some boxes, cause they'll all play the same. /still bitter about jetpacks in matchmaking

Yeah, it'll be interesting to see if every map they create accommodates jetpack use. Many of the Halo series's best maps just simply won't work with jetpacks. In that way it really seems like it could limit what Bungie could do with their maps as opposed to opening up new opportunities (because not everyone will have them).

I'm not a big fan of the jetpacks in MP.

 

[Domino Theory]

Hype reaching critical capacities.. But now it's time for work for the next 6 hours =/ fuuu

Hehe, I'm in a similar boat since I have Tennis class at my College in 30 minutes. I'm just going to ask the coach if I can leave earlier.

"hey coach can i leave at 5:30pm today?"

"why?"

"well, sketch aka mancannon hasn't been dream crushing ever since urk promised 2 megatons so i need to see the new forge and other megatons and maybe check out noble 7"

"...."

 

[Pennybags]

Yeah, it'll be interesting to see if every map they create accommodates jetpack use. Many of the Halo series's best maps just simply won't work with jetpacks. In that way it really seems like it could limit what Bungie could do with their maps as opposed to opening up new opportunities (because not everyone will have them).

I'm not a big fan of the jetpacks in MP.

Can loadouts be tweaked for specific maps in a playlist? I could see that being done for smaller maps/remakes.

 

[GhaleonEB]

Slightly related, but FC2 did a really smart thing by having two author notes on a map as opposed to H3's single author tag. With FC2, if you started a fresh map, you'd be recognized as the map's "Original Author" and there was also a line for simply "Author." If someone were to download/steal your map, you'd still be recognized as the original author while their name would fall under "Author." While whatever you make within Halo is free to be used and edited by anything, this gives a little more reassurance to the creator that their work will be recognized.

I think the pieces are there with Reach, we'll see how they're used. The File Browser in the Beta allowed searching for content by tags and map, but including the community rating (something that was added to Halo 3) and authors seems like a natural. And Halo 3's file sets worked as a way to link screenshots to map variants. I can see those building blocks being tweaked into what you're describing. I'd be surprised if they're not, actually.

 

[Domino Theory]

Can loadouts be tailored for specific maps in a playlist? I could see that being done for smaller maps/remakes.

Yeah, Armor Lock isn't available during KoTH and SWAT/Slayer Pro have Sprint-only. They can definitely tailor the Loadouts to the maps/gametypes.

 

[FilthyLies]

Can loadouts be tailored for specific maps in a playlist? I could see that being done for smaller maps/remakes.

Yeah if they tailor them for gametypes (no armor lock in KOTH), it's not a big jump to assume they'll also tailor them for maps if necessary.

 

[BakedPigeon]

Give me Damnation or give me death.

 

[Domino Theory]

Yeah if they tailor them for gametypes (no armor lock in KOTH), it's not a big jump to assume they'll also tailor them for maps if necessary.

BEET U.

 

[Tashi]

Eazy I want Ber Ber Creek 2.0 as soon as Reach comes out.

Spoiler

I'll break it for you

 

[FilthyLies]

BEET U.

FFFFFFFFFFFFFF-

I wonder if there will be an option to have AAs be on-map pickups in the final game. We know that AAs in campaign work much like equipment from Halo 3- you can pick them up and swap them out, you're not locked into one specific AA for a mission. Could be an interesting twist to have standard Halo gameplay with the AAs taking the place of say an on-map powerup like an overshield.

Could at least give custom games some more flexibility for sure. Seems unlikely though, as Bungie's been pushing loadouts pretty hard since the reveal.

 

[Future PhaZe]

Agreed.

I still can't believe how many gems stemmed from Halo 2 in terms of maps:

So. fucking. GOOD.

Pretty much why H2 gets a pass for its meh campaign...absolutely amazing multiplayer at its peak.

Reach would be lucky to come close but I'm holding onto hope.

 

[Darkflight]

Lucky no sleeps left people :lol Can't wait to dive into this in 7 hours before I have to get ready for work.

 

[kittens]

Yeah, jetpacks in MP are a definite concern of mine. I can't wait to use them to find skulls and shit in campaign, though.

 

[Pennybags]

FFFFFFFFFFFFFF-

I wonder if there will be an option to have AAs be on-map pickups in the final game. We know that AAs in campaign work much like equipment from Halo 3- you can pick them up and swap them out, you're not locked into one specific AA for a mission. Could be an interesting twist to have standard Halo gameplay with the AAs taking the place of say an on-map powerup like an overshield.

Could at least give custom games some more flexibility for sure. Seems unlikely though, as Bungie's been pushing loadouts pretty hard since the reveal.

Match begins. Everyone races to the Armor Lock. :lol

 

[Princess Carl]

Match begins. Everyone races to the Armor Lock. :lol

 

[Domino Theory]

Yeah, jetpacks in MP are a definite concern of mine. I can't wait to use them to find skulls and shit in campaign, though.

I'm not sure skull hunting will be in anymore considering all the skulls from Halo 3 are being ported over and now you have the ability to make your own skulls.

I hope I'm wrong, though, because I LOVE skull hunting.

 

[GhaleonEB]

I'm not sure skull hunting will be in anymore considering all the skulls from Halo 3 are being ported over and now you have the ability to make your own skulls.

I hope I'm wrong, though, because I LOVE skull hunting.

Skulls are now a top-level feature as they were in ODST, along side difficulty. I suspect we'll have other stuff to hunt down, though.

 

[Major Williams]

Yeah, jetpacks in MP are a definite concern of mine. I can't wait to use them to find skulls and shit in campaign, though.

Ooooooh didn't even think about that! That will definitely be a hoot! 2.5 more hours!

 

[Brolic Gaoler]

Skulls are not a top-level feature as they were in ODST, along side difficulty. I suspect we'll have other stuff to hunt down, though.

A quake type interactive gallery of all the bungie folks would be pretty badass.

Anyone remember that easteregg? You walked down a hall full or semi animated photos of the folks at id ending with Carmack.

 

[EazyB]

Good God, I want to see Forge.

I think the pieces are there with Reach, we'll see how they're used. The File Browser in the Beta allowed searching for content by tags and map, but including the community rating (something that was added to Halo 3) and authors seems like a natural. And Halo 3's file sets worked as a way to link screenshots to map variants. I can see those building blocks being tweaked into what you're describing. I'd be surprised if they're not, actually.

I hadn't thought about filesets in Reach's browser. Selecting a highly rated map and being brought to a page with multiple screens and even gameplay videos would be really awesome.

Eazy I want Ber Ber Creek 2.0 as soon as Reach comes out.

Spoiler

I'll break it for you

Think you can jump over this?

I'll definitely hit up a remake or two shortly after Reach comes out. I find it's a great way to learn the tools, it's easy enough to use the functionality you know about as a constraint for what an original map can be, but using a recreation as a constraint really forces you to stretch the limits of the tools.

 

[Brolic Gaoler]

Here's the easteregg I was talking about.

Seeing something like that only with the bungie team would be pretty cool.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e7iMRGaBCEQ

 

[Shake Appeal]

All right, I'm going to sleep. Not sure what to hit first thing in the morning. Bnet, I guess, for a ViDoc (fingers crossed).

 

[Blueblur1]

I just watched the Square Enix video. Those figures look great. Much cooler than the McFarlane crap.

 

[Not a Jellyfish]

I justr watched the Square Enix video. Those figures look great. Much cooler than the McFarlane crap.

Yeah I know, they actually look pretty awesome. Will actually be picking them up when they release.

 

[Brolic Gaoler]

Yeah I know, they actually look pretty awesome. Will actually be picking them up when they release.

ditto

 

[Doodis]

ditto

thirdo

 

[Hydranockz]

Ah sure what is another 3 hours *will stay up*

Tour of new office as a megaton?

New building is amazing

 

[S1kkZ]

Ah sure what is another 3 hours *will stay up*

doesnt it start in 2 hours?

 

[Palette Swap]

Skulls are now a top-level feature as they were in ODST, along side difficulty. I suspect we'll have other stuff to hunt down, though.

Armor unlocks perhaps?
That big achievement picture didn't seem to feature any kind of collectibles except for these? (and collectibles = achievements has pretty much become a staple of this gen)

Stupid question: for some reason, I remember reading somewhere before ODST was released that its hub was a testbed for Reach.
I might have misunderstood the quote at the time and it only served as a way to experiment with bigger levels but my understanding back then was that Reach would feature a hub too?

 

[GhaleonEB]

doesnt it start in 2 hours?

Yeah, but the goods (screens, video, embargoed coverage) won't hit the web until an hour later.

I might have misunderstood the quote at the time and it only served as a way to experiment with bigger levels but my understanding back then was that Reach would feature a hub too?

I don't recall that exact exchange, but I do remember folks from Bungie saying some ideas for ODST would carry over into Reach. Offhand, Firefight, the lack of dual-wielding and a less studly player (slower, lower jump, health pack system) come to mind as examples that did. At the time I was thinking the hub world was one of them, but now I'm not sure it's practical given Reach's scale.

As for stuff to search for, I think it was Lars at the ODST PAX panel who mentioned he wanted to put in tons of developer commentary skulls into ODST, but they ran out of time. My memory of the panel is he kind of made a sly allusion to 'well maybe next time', something to that effect. So I've been hoping for something like that in Reach since then.

 

[Pennybags]

Yeah, but the goods (screens, video, embargoed coverage) won't hit the web until an hour later.

But live text blogging is so exciting! It's always better to read about something before you see it!