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[Almighty]

Well looks like after all the successful Kickstaters by old school developers over the past year, Lori and Corey Cole decided to try their luck. Here it is Hero-U: Rouge to Redemption

Some info from the kickstater

Hero-U: Rogue to Redemption is a classic 2D RPG by award-winning game designers Corey and Lori Cole (Quest for Glory, Castle of Dr. Brain, and more). In our genre-bending style, Hero-U combines classic RPG skills and combat with the rich character relationships of Persona, and the story and puzzles of Quest for Glory in a single challenging game experience.

A classic role-playing game with exploration, combat, and skills
Tactical combat that is much more than "hack and slash"
A rich story that changes based on the way you play
Characters with unique personalities and their own agendas
Adventure-style puzzles that are an integral part of the story

For those wondering here is a blog post explaining why they are going with a much heavier RPG focus this time instead of the adventure game style they are so well known for.

As well as some links
New York Post Interview
Brawsome is Awesome
So what is Hero-U?
Mashable Entertainment Article
Rock, Paper, Shotgun Interview
RPG Codex Interview
Girl Gamer Interview

Update 14 Talks about new interviews, why your pledges matter, and new rewards. An excerpt

Corey: We're not sure if you realize how much power you have. When we left Sierra, the game industry became mired in an endless succession of first-person shooters. Adventure games died overnight because publishers didn't want to spend millions of dollars on games that would only sell a couple hundred thousand copies.

Gaming as we knew it died, except for a few decent MMOs. But now there are signs of life, and you're in charge.

By backing projects you care about, games that have quality and good design, you can help make smaller games possible. Big publishers have so much overhead, they're only interested in mass-market games that don't require any brains to play. They've abandoned the adventure gamer, and are providing only a watered-down husk of role-playing games.

Update 13 Gives some more detail about the RPG part of the game.

On the surface, Hero-U plays much like a typical adventure game. Shawn wanders around a fantasy environment, talks to people, and solves problems. But there is a big difference between Hero-U and most adventure games, and that's progression.

In most adventures, your character is about the same at the end of the game as at the beginning. Your character is also usually a pretty ordinary person who can only solve problems because of things he picks up during the game.

Shawn has some rather unusual skills and abilities, they change according to how you play, and they make a real difference. These skills give you choices in how to solve problems. If there's a locked door, you can find the key or a crowbar, but more likely you'll improve your lockpicking skill until you can open the door.

Shawn also "grows" in the sense of a character in a "coming of age" story. This is a feature that should be in more games, but frequently seems to be missing. As Shawn learns more about Hero-U and the mysteries of the catacombs, he is also learning about himself. You will help define his personality.

Update 12 Project Video redone and talking about what makes Hero-U different. An excerpt

We also have a dynamic mix of game play between the University, taking classes, studying in the library, making friends with other students... then going down into the catacombs, exploring, fighting monsters, and solving the mysteries of why Shawn got sent to Hero-U and what's going on in the outside world. Our plan is to have a strong balance between the story, character interactions, and role-playing elements of the game.

We're trying to create a game for which walk-throughs will be inadequate. Each player can make choices about how to interact with other students and teachers, where to spend their time, and on what they want to focus. All of these choices will have effects on relationships and the story, so the game may seem different to every player. That's a much different idea from watching a film or playing a tightly-scripted adventure game.

Update 11 Looks like they are promising Linux support.

Linux Support

We have had a lot of requests for a Linux version, but the team had concerns that spending time on making Linux builds, testing them, and getting them out to the Linux Beta testers might affect the development schedule. A few nights ago, I came up with a solution.

I have decided to personally commit to bringing Hero-U to Linux. Originally we planned this as part of our first stretch goal, but I came up with a new plan. After Hero-U: Rogue to Redemption is complete and on the way to our Windows and Mac users, I will personally port the game to Linux and - with the help of some of our passionate Linux friends - make sure the game is rock solid.

See, there's a little part of my history that 5 or 6 of you might not have heard yet. Before I was a game designer, I was a system programmer. My first job at Sierra was to translate the SCI game engine to the Atari ST and port the first four SCI games to the ST. I'll just put on my software engineer hat for this task.

Why am I doing it this way? It is so that none of the Kickstarter proceeds will be used for the port. I will be doing it on my own time after the game is complete, so that we can guarantee that the Windows/Mac versions of Hero-U: Rogue to Redemption are absolutely the best we can make them.

Welcome, Linux friends!

Update 10 This update is announcing more add-ons.

Digital add-ons available at any tier

Important Note on digital keys to our previous games: We are actually buying these keys from the respective sites. Since Kickstarter and Amazon payments take a percentage of our proceeds, and the purpose of selling these add-ons is to raise money for Hero-U development, all of these keys are more expensive than if you buy them directly. If this concerns you , please buy the previous-game keys directly from Steam, gog.com, or another site. We are offering them here solely as a convenience.

$15: Steam game key to Jolly Rover (PC or Mac)
$15: Steam game key to MacGuffin's Curse (PC or Mac)
$20: gog.com game key to Quest for Glory 1-5 package (PC only)
$18: An additional Hero-U: Rogue to Redemption game key for a friend
$18: Pre-order the second planned Hero-U game featuring a female Wizard main character
$100: In-game Head(stone) of the Class. See Update #9 or main project page for details
$200: In-game School Spirit. See Update #9 or main project page for details

Physical Add-Ons ONLY for Physical Tier Backers

Physical add-ons will be shipped separately from your copy of the game (exception - additional physical game boxes will likely be shipped in one package). When you select physical add-ons, please also add the following shipping charges to your pledge:

1-4 items: $15 US, $20 Canada/Mexico, $30 other countries
Each additional 4 items: Add $10 US/Canada/Mexico, or add $20 other countries

Physical add-on choices:

$30: Hero-U logo t-shirt
$35: Embroidered Hero-U baseball cap
$50: Extra standard boxed copy of Hero-U: Rogue to Redemption
$50: (Extra) copy of the physical yearbook.
$100: (Extra) copy of the Kickstarter-only premium boxed game plus Graduate-level inserts (game DVD, manual, music CD, varsity letter, and Hero-U backer's button)

Update 9 This update is in their own words "TAHR and Lori followed up on the discussion of adventure vs. role-playing games we started in Update #8, and we thought many of you would be interesting in the conversation." So might be best to read the whole thing. I don't want to risk quoting things out of context.



Update 8 They talk a little about "adventure game puzzles" and what they like and what they don't. As well as some stuff about Meeps. Some excerpts

We've said that there will be "adventure game puzzles" in Hero-U: Rogue to Redemption. It's true – There will be. But they might look a little different from adventure game puzzles you've known.

There were certain "rules" to successful adventure game play – Take everything that isn't nailed down. Find a crowbar and use it to take the things that are nailed down. If there's a guardian, kill it, bribe it, or distract it. There isn't a lot of moral subtext to most of those games. Use your intuition to guess the designer's mind – "Ah, violets are blue and so is the sky, so you have to make someone believe a mirror is really a window by pasting on 500 violet petals."

We like to break those fundamental rules. In fact, we think you have to break them to make a great game. Worthwhile games are about innovation and surprises, not about copying formulas that might have worked for someone else in the past... or even for ourselves.

We're not going to require you to navigate a complex maze using your mouse, because those suck. They also don't work well in our interface. We won't make you map out the catacombs on paper, but you might find yourself taking a few notes, such as how to avoid the traps.

There are plenty of things to click on in Hero-U, but everything interesting fills a tile, and we intend to make the important things fairly obvious. Sorry, we don't like "hunt the pixels" puzzle either.

Update 7 New add ons and a little more game info as well. Some excerpts

Torchinomotorino asked about equipment and cross-class skills:

Corey responded: We will have many more equipment options in Hero-U than in Quest for Glory. As Sierra adventures, those games were severely limited in inventory space and options. Rogues at Hero-U rely heavily on their tools and possessions. We'll also get Shawn some stylish changes of armor and clothing.

Lori added: The Rogue can set magical traps and snares, learn to make healing salves and blinding powders, and even itching powders to add to his repertoire of thief skills. He's never going to be a great fighter, but he'll find ways of defeating his foes that no warrior would dream of using!

Shadowfax11 and DeviantBoi asked why we are using a different graphics approach than in the Quest for Glory games, pointing out that SpaceVenture has promised a Sierra-like engine on a $500K budget.

Lori responded: At our $400K goal, we will have $260K after expenses and backer rewards with which to make the game. Quest for Glory IV cost almost $1 million to make back in 1993 when most of the developers earned $15/hour. Costs are higher now.

We've done the math. We know exactly what it took to make Shannara, MacGuffin's Curse, and Jolly Rover, which was a traditional adventure game. Our budget is not enough to make an Adventure RPG as complex as Hero-U will be using the Sierra approach to art and animation. It is enough to make a great game with tiled graphics.

There is another reason we are goingwith the MacGuffin's Curse approach. We know that we can create a game with the same emotional involvement, character development, and story-telling as any Quest for Glory with this engine. In addition, we can create a combat system that is more "Puzzle-solving" than "click, click, click."

You want to sneak past a monster? No problem - if your sneak skill is high enough. But maybe you'd like to set a trap for the monster and then lure it into the trap. Or perhaps you'd like to push a few barrels so that you can keep the monster from getting to you while you investigate it's lair. We couldn't really pull this sort of game style off with the Adventure Engine.

So our decision to go with the MacGuffin's Curse style is as much because we want to add a different sort of game play to the story as it is financial.

Corey added: What we're doing with Hero-U is boiling the game down to its essence - story, characters, and puzzles - then putting in as much art and music as we can to support those. By using the top-down view, we don't need as much animation or backgrounds, and the programming is simpler. That's allowing us to put a million dollars of gameplay in a $260K game.

Update 6 Changing a tier and they are doing an Ask me Anything on Reddit 6pm EDT today(Oct 31). They are promising that they will be talking more about the story, combat, art, etc in future updates.


Update 5

Story Paths and Relationships in Hero-U
There are a lot of "black and white" games out there. They give the players two paths – good or evil, etc. That's an improvement over making the player sit through a linear, non-branching story.

But we can do better. Yes/No, Either/Or, Binary pathing is so last century! It's also not the way life works.

Quest for Glory broke the mold of D&D-style games by eliminating experience levels. Instead, players gradually improved each of their skills through practice. In Hero-U, we are doing the same thing for character relationships. All of your actions during the game will affect how others see you, and how they react in turn.

No two players are likely to see the exact same story in Hero-U. Each player will forge their own relationships, and choose where to spend their time. The subtle connection between these decisions will affect many aspects of game play.

This won't as simple as "You're a Thief" or "You're a Rogue Hero." The game – like real life – will be much more complex and layered. Shades of grey mean something in Hero-U: Rogue to Redemption.
Let's say for instance you've been friendly to one of the other students. Maybe that student saw you in the hallway after curfew, but she'll keep quiet about it. Or maybe she'll mention a useful book in the library. If things work out, maybe you can develop a romantic relationship.

Of course, the opposite is true too. Maybe someone else is jealous of that budding relationship, and decides to make you look bad. There are a lot of ways for a Rogue to find revenge. Maybe one of your teachers will stand up for you, or maybe everyone will hang you out to dry. Everything you do in the game will affect someone's attitude towards you, positively, negatively, or sideways. That would be the case when a plot element hinges on your actions, and a character decides you might be useful to them... or not.

The people who write walkthroughs for games are going to have a hard time with Hero-U: Rogue to Redemption. The players, on the other hand, may find themselves playing the game over and over, trying to see what changes when they take a different attitude. The developers will need to develop some automated tests to check out all the options.

Update 4

Pretty short so I will just post the whole thing.

We're doing very well so far - Thank you everyone for your support! We're rapidly approaching the 1/3 mark towards Hero-U's goal. We're now in the "accumulation period" where we slowly build up towards the goal. We hope all of you are sharing the project with your friends, but being gentle about it.

Ten of us (the most that could fit) got together for a Google+ hangout last night, and had a fun time asking and answering questions about Hero-U, Quest for Glory, and so on. It was an experiment, so we decided not to record it.

I will add some new rewards this weekend as part of our extended Halloween celebration. Remember, you can use "Manage my pledge" to adjust your reward level and pledge amount at any time. If you joined us early, keep checking back - You won't miss out on new rewards! I will also make sure I mention any reward additions in an Update.

We're going to have another party today at 2 pm Pacific Time on Saturday. That will be 5 pm on the East Coast, 9 pm UTC, etc. Google "Current time in California" and you can find out when to show up. We plan to broadcast this one and record it on YouTube.

Speaking of YouTube, we got Andrew Goulding of Brawsome to record some of his thoughts on the project. hanks Andrew! We hope the video will help everyone understand why everyone on this team is so excited to be working together. Talk about your "mutual admiration societies." Seriously, we have a great team and everyone on it knows how to make fun games. This is going to be amazing!

Since I've yet to successfully at a video to an update (someone PM me about that please!), here's a link to Andrew's talk:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YETNRY71UMc

Update 3

Looks like they are reassuring people that while it will have more RPG elements then QfG they still plan to have adventure. An excerpt

Where's the Adventure?

One concern that we've seen raised on many adventure game forums is that Hero-U: Rogue to Redemption will be too much of a role-playing game and not enough of an adventure game.

The short answer is, "Adventure gamers – You are going to LOVE Hero-U!"

When we created the Quest for Glory series, people raised exactly the same questions. Many people – even at Sierra – said that adventure gamers hate CRPG's, and CRPG players had no interest in playing adventure games. With Quest for Glory, we proved that we could make a game that was fun for everyone who likes tales of heroic deeds and high fantasy. Our first hybrid game was named Adventure Game of the Year by Computer Gaming World... and that might have seemed a bit strange for a game that many considered to be a CRPG.

I think we could have done the same with a science fiction game, a Western, a historical romance, or a modern-era drama. You see, we don't think there is a conflict between adventure and role-playing gaming. We think that both genres belong together, and that a game that contains elements of both is more fun than a game that only does one thing. We proved it once, and with Hero-U, we plan to prove it again.

Add enough character development, and a bit of combat, to an adventure game, and you have a CRPG. Add enough story and puzzles to a CRPG, and you have an adventure game. Why settle for just one?

Update 2

The new update is mostly trying to explain why they are going with this style. A few excerpts from the update.

Would it make more sense to make a game “much like” Quest for Glory? Hard to say. In any case, between the original Hero’s Quest and Quest for Glory 5, development budgets ballooned from $250K up to over $2.5M. Even if it was “only” $1.5M, that’s too much to ask on Kickstarter.

You can’t step into the same stretch of river twice. The Quest for Glory games were a unique combination of Lori’s and my background with the tools we had available at Sierra. If we had been working for a company with different tools, we would have made an entirely different game.

What Lori and I will promise is that we are putting the same work and dedication into Hero-U as we put into each of our other games. We still have the same “gamers sensibility” that we applied as a yardstick each time. Hopefully we’ll be funny. Hopefully the dialogue will work as well as it did in Quest for Glory. Is it possible we’ll get this one wrong? Sure it’s possible - but I don’t think it’s the way to bet.

Of course, you can always “wait and see”. But then the game might not happen at all. It’s pretty much up to you, the players, to determine the fate of Hero-U. If you want higher production values, support at a higher level and get more of your friends to support the project. For now, we’ve designed a minimalist style that can be implemented within a reasonable budget. It’s more important to make sure that we can complete the game than to promise a level of polish that we won’t be able to fund.

Update 1

and a for those worried about the art they address it in the update

Concept vs. Final Art

Most of you understand that games are developed using "placeholder art", but I am adding this since we've seen some complaints about the "test dungeon" art in the video. In previous games, we sometimes represented a character with a grey box or a red "X". The "game images" you see in this Kickstarter project are all placeholders. Some of them are really beautiful placeholders, but they may or may not be representative of final game art.

In particular, the 2D top-down image included in the video is a concept piece. That is the point of view you will have in the game, but the actual image is a placeholder. The actual Hero-U game will give you the freedom of movement and tactical actions that the top down view allows, but it will be carefully crafted to look Really Nice in the game. As it is, our prototype is way nicer than boxes and X's.

We will also have closeups of characters for dialogue and combat, and beautiful background screens for key scenes. The number of background screens we can afford will be partially dependent on the budget we raise from this Kickstarter project.

From the sound of it it looks like they are aiming to create a game that is something very different from the Quest for Glory series. With that said I do like what they are aiming for and do to my love of QfG I am planning on backing this one.

 

[MrBud360]

RPG with puzzles. Finally!!!!!!Again!!!!!

 

[VGChampion]

Never heard of it before. Interest is a little piqued though.

 

[Count of Monte Sawed-Off]

In for $75.

 

[godofcookery]

aaand its up! at 20K currently.

 

[Almighty]

Sweet at 24k already. Seems to be going along at a pretty decent rate so far. Hopefully it picks up a little as word that it is live spreads. I will be adding my money to it later today. Trying to decided $20 or $35 myself.

 

[MrBud360]

RPG + Puzzles = Winner.

Don't know why people didn't copy Quest for Glory mechanics before. Well, the wait its over.....

 

[MrBud360]

One of the best game covers ever

 

[dude]

Hmm... I love Quest For Glory, but this looks very very different. Not necessarily bad, just.. Different. Also, I put down waaaay too much money into Project Eternity...

Will probably back later this month though, I'm a sucker for Kickstarters.

 

[adixon]

art looks baaad. That said, these two made what are probably still the best games ever made so... I'm in.



*edit* Okay actually, only the (hopefully far from final) dungeon crawling art looked bad. Whatever those hand-drawn adventure game backgrounds were which kept popping up, those looked pretty great.

 

[MrBud360]

Hmm... I love Quest For Glory, but this looks very very different. Not necessarily bad, just.. Different. Also, I put down waaaay too much money into Project Eternity...

Will probably back later this month though, I'm a sucker for Kickstarters.

Better back now then later. Kickstater projects needs a great start to be succeeded!!!

 

[Almighty]

One of the best game covers ever

Ha. I can't believe I never noticed this before, but that guy is so boned on that cover. Sword all bent and half his shield bitten off.

Hmm... I love Quest For Glory, but this looks very very different. Not necessarily bad, just.. Different. Also, I put down waaaay too much money into Project Eternity...

Will probably back later this month though, I'm a sucker for Kickstarters.

Yeah I know that feel. You just reminded me that I spent more on Project Eternity then I was planning to. So I am thinking I might have to wait a a week or two before I back this one.

Edit,

Though MrBud360 makes a good point. Might as well do it today while I remember since I won't be charged til the end anyway.

 

[epmode]

Man, that combat(?) screenshot looks... Well, it's a screenshot alright.

Considering that there have been almost 0 Quest for Glory clones since the series died, I'm not sure why they're not going for the same structure. Maybe I just need to see more.

 

[adixon]

Can't believe this is happening after all these years... Probably best to pledge now so they get a big first day push, and then lower/remove your pledge later if you have second thoughts (since kickstarter doesn't charge until the end of the funding period, it doesn't make a difference aside from helping the project).

 

[godofcookery]

62K within a day. Seems like they are off to a pretty good start.

 

[Eusis]

Eh, decided what the heck and pitched in at $20. I may well back out, but I want to help give this a chance to reach full funding and maybe really go from there.

 

[Instro]

Looks really ugly, disappointing.

 

[Instro]

DP

 

[Nirolak]

Sorry, used the wrong mod tool.

Split the threads back apart.

 

[godofcookery]

Didn't realize we had another thread for this. Dunno if I'm going to pitch in yet, the game looks pretty ugly.

are you speaking of the art in the trailer?

The overhead view you can see for a few seconds in the video represents the perspective, but *not* the look of the final art.

 

[epmode]

Thank god.

I still want this to be more adventure than RPG though.

 

[godofcookery]

Thank god.

I still want this to be more adventure than RPG though.

1000x yes. I am growing more afraid that QfGV was a lite version of what we might get here.

 

[HP_Wuvcraft]

This is the best Kickstarter campaign I have ever seen.

Everything is very clearly defined. I especially like the cost breakdown.

Dear Christ, the cost breakdown. YES.

art looks baaad.

Get out.

GET OUT OF MY HOOOOOOOOOOOUUUSE!

 

[Instro]

are you speaking of the art in the trailer?

Yeah I was, ignore me then. Didn't have the chance to give it a full look earlier. I was wondering why there was such a discrepancy between that shot and then the background art pieces that were shown.

 

[HP_Wuvcraft]

They just did an update and addressed the art.

http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1878147873/hero-u-rogue-to-redemption/posts/332460?ref=activity

 

[Alexios]

Really hate this name, it's like Zoo shovelware for Wii U.

Should be good, though graphics look like a flash RPG. Good to know it's placeholder.

A pure adventure with the concept art as the backgrounds would have been rad though.

 

[DiscoJer]

If you read their blog, they give some explanation of why it's more RPG and less adventure than QFG

http://www.hero-u.net/leaders/to-rp-or-not-to-rp/

Basically: Budget (cheaper to make than a full blown adventure game), ease of getting hints on the internet today somewhat invalidates puzzles, they think an RPG would sell better, and they just really, really like RPGs

Surprisingly, the NY Post interview (already mentioned) is really good.

 

[Alexios]

That's weird to hear since there are more successfully done indie adventures than RPGs (which need variety of enemies, combat systems, loads of larger locations than just one screen backgrounds, etc etc)... I guess if they want full professional voice acting and animated cut scenes... But it's not like those can't get added to RPGs inflating costs, it's a choice regardless of genre.

Seems to me a thread merge is needed, there was no reason to do another and discussion is split...

 

[DiscoJer]

Well, I get the impression that's going to play a lot like Persona- you have some school scenes and then dungeon crawling, so it's likely going to be cheaper to make than ones where you are wandering all over the world.

 

[Eusis]

Basically: Budget (cheaper to make than a full blown adventure game), ease of getting hints on the internet today somewhat invalidates puzzles, they think an RPG would sell better, and they just really, really like RPGs

Admittedly going for actual HINTS rather than SOLUTIONS largely retains the intent while helping to grease the wheels and make a game more enjoyable for someone who doesn't want to get stuck on stuff. But I guess most people just hit GameFaqs rather than UHS, and there's still the fact that maybe they'd rather just make a straight forward RPG or RPG with some adventure elements rather than an adventure with RPG elements.

 

[Almighty]

Wohoo 70k so far. It is off to a pretty good start. I am thinking it they will probably reach their goal at least if nothing else.

Also added new update and RPS interview to the OP.

 

[mclem]

COREY: Gloriana’s actually our own roleplaying world, that we’ve used for decades in our D&D games. Hmm. Not sure if we’re supposed to use the word ‘decades’ and say we’ve been around for that long…

RPS: Eh, it’s Kickstarter. I think it’s expected at this point.

LORI: Right! It’s old-school!

COREY: Old school RPG! [...]

Self-aware. I like that.

 

[v1oz]

Does the "U" have anything to do with Wii U?

 

[nonadventurer]

I'm really really excited about this one. And personally I'm glad they aren't doing a carbon copy of Quest for Glory, but rather going for something different - and something they look to be really excited about! With their writing style and approach to puzzles, I'm sure at least the adventure game part is going to be great.

As an aside, the links in the OP lack the pretty interesting interview Corey Cole did with Rpgcodex yesterday.

Does the "U" have anything to do with Wii U?

No, I don't think so. In fact I'm pretty sure it doesn't.

 

[Eusis]

Given it's a school theme I imagine it means "University".

 

[Gloam]

Pitched in, and why wouldn't I? Art looks nice, that little dungeon overview they gave was pretty cool looking as well, hope this goes better than the Shaker Kickstarter.

 

[Almighty]

As an aside, the links in the OP lack the pretty interesting interview Corey Cole did with Rpgcodex yesterday.

Thanks. Added to OP.

 

[DiscoJer]

Pitched in, and why wouldn't I? Art looks nice, that little dungeon overview they gave was pretty cool looking as well, hope this goes better than the Shaker Kickstarter.

Well, it's got a more modest goal. Shaker did about 100k in the first day, then sort of fizzled. It probably would have reached 500k if they hadn't given up about a week into it.

This should do about that. Other than Double Fine, most adventure game KSes with a pedigree seem to do about 500-700k

 

[Eusis]

Well, it's got a more modest goal. Shaker did about 100k in the first day, then sort of fizzled. It probably would have reached 500k if they hadn't given up about a week into it.

This should do about that. Other than Double Fine, most adventure game KSes with a pedigree seem to do about 500-700k

And admittedly Double Fine has one of the finest pedigrees, with the added bonus of having been actively developing well liked games, including the humor and style that people cherished about LucasArts graphic adventures.

But yeah, I guess this is moving slower than Shaker, but without the shadow of Project Eternity and possibly just being more appealing maybe it will reach its goal afterall. Not too confident about stretching though, short of some bizarre surge within the next few days that leaves only stretch goals to hit.

 

[Almighty]

I am thinking hitting the goal is at least what this will do myself. Like DiscoJer said I am thinking somewhere around $400k to $700k is where this will end up. The only thing that might hurt this is them saying that they want to make a different game then QfG. The series they are arguably most known for.

A lot of the other kickstarters from what i can tell seemed to use the "Did you like our old games? Well give us money and we will make a new one just like them." way of generating hype and getting support. I am a little surprised the Coles decided to not follow that path and instead say that it will have take some lessons from QfG, but is going to be a very different game. That might work in their favor or work against them time will tell.

 

[mclem]

I am thinking hitting the goal is at least what this will do myself. Like DiscoJer said I am thinking somewhere around $400k to $700k is where this will end up. The only thing that might hurt this is them saying that they want to make a different game then QfG. The series they are arguably most known for.

A lot of the other kickstarters from what i can tell seemed to use the "Did you like our old games? Well give us money and we will make a new one just like them." way of generating hype and getting support. I am a little surprised the Coles decided to not follow that path and instead say that it will have take some lessons from QfG, but will mostly be a very different game. That might work in their favor or work against them time will tell.

I think it'll work against them, but I also think it's a good thing that a 'classic' designer isn't trading on nostalgia; there's room for both types of Kickstarter in the world, but we've seen far more 'just like old games' ones than 'let me make something new' ones, and it's good to see this redress the balance a little.

 

[Alexios]

^ it's still an old school RPG though, just not an old school point & click adventure that they're known for... Which I love btw, point & click adventures are far more alive in the indie scene than RPGs where we had Spiderweb and the occasional hit or miss like Eschalon before Kickstarter projects started. I'm not even sure they should be called old school though, I don't see why they shouldn't be considered modern, as if having a party and being turn based makes them outdated, but yeah...

 

[Almighty]

I think it'll work against them, but I also think it's a good thing that a 'classic' designer isn't trading on nostalgia; there's room for both types of Kickstarter in the world, but we've seen far more 'just like old games' ones than 'let me make something new' ones, and it's good to see this redress the balance a little.

I agree and either way chances are I would of backed their project. I guess I am just hoping it doesn't hurt them bad enough for them to not reach their goal.

 

[Eusis]

^ it's still an old school RPG though, just not an old school point & click adventure that they're known for... Which I love btw, point & click adventures are far more alive in the indie scene than RPGs where we had Spiderweb and the occasional hit or miss like Eschalon before Kickstarter projects started. I'm not even sure they should be called old school though, I don't see why they shouldn't be considered modern, as if having a party and being turn based makes them outdated, but yeah...

I can't even fathom party based gameplay actually being 'outdated', maybe out of fashion at worst. Especially in today's multiplayer/co-op focused era, when that setup not only is more friendly to multiplayer even for turn-based games but has actively been done for decades via multiple controller support in SNES FFs and Baldur's Gate having online play, or even more recently DQIX being designed WITH multiplayer in mind.

I think considering turn based to be outdated though has to do with greatly increasing tech SEEMING to make it irrelevant, even though 1. games are all about playing under certain sets of rules, 2. some games just handle it poorly and make things drag out, exuberating that 'dated' feel (JRPGs have been pretty guilty with that at times), and 3. maybe some of these people just don't care for turn based combat. I couldn't go and say sports games are passe just because CoD sells huge numbers and I rarely enjoy sports games, even though maybe if I find the right one and get into it I'd be glued.

 

[Almighty]

3. maybe some of these people just don't care for turn based combat.

I think that is the biggest reason turn-based fell out of favour personally.

Based on the two most common complaints I hear "Why is my guy standing around waiting for the other guy to hit him. It so unrealistic." and "Why did it say I missed? My guy clearly hit him/or he was right next to him how could he miss." A lot of people just don't seem to be able to wrap their head around the idea that turn-based combat and dice roll combat, those two seem to go hand in hand, are abstractions of actual combat to make the gameplay more tactical, slower paced, etc. Not to be taken literally like the characters are really standing around taking turns hitting each other.


The recent XCOM game is a perfect example of that problem. As it is a recent turn based game and I still see those complaints or at least complaints in the same vain being made for that game.

 

[Eusis]

I think that is the biggest reason turn-based fell out of favour personally.

Based on the two most common complaints I hear "Why is my guy standing around waiting for the other guy to hit him. It so unrealistic." and "Why did it say I missed? My guy clearly hit him/or he was right next to him how could he miss." A lot of people just don't seem to be able to wrap their head around the idea that turn-based combat and dice roll combat, those two seem to go hand in hand, are abstractions of actual combat to make the gameplay more tactical, slower paced, etc. Not to be taken literally like the characters are really standing around taking turns hitting each other.


The recent XCOM game is a perfect example of that problem. As it is a recent turn based game and I still see those complaints or at least complaints in the same vain being made for that game.

I think that's a bit of a mix of 1 (more advanced technology) and 3, they may've rolled with it at lower graphical levels but as it gets closer to either looking like real life or at least a CGI cartoon it's harder to swallow that level of abstraction, so either you can't reconcile that and decide you can't stand it now, or you only tolerated it before as a "limit of technology" but see no reason to do it now, even though there are distinct strengths especially for games like Xcom.

Does worry me though that people might get vocal enough to effect even many JRPGs, it already sounds like they'd rather just make Final Fantasy into a straight up action RPG and seem very close to doing just that with Lightning Returns. Bad enough we were extraordinarily lucky to get Xcom with most everything else being an indie/digital-exclusive title when it comes to NA/Europe.

 

[Alexios]

I wouldn't put much stock in such complaints, the games are not for everyone but surely anyone can wrap their head around the concept if they take 30 seconds to try and comprehend it. I mean, like chess. Not everyone plays but everyone gets it surely.

 

[Almighty]

I think that's a bit of a mix of 1 (more advanced technology) and 3, they may've rolled with it at lower graphical levels but as it gets closer to either looking like real life or at least a CGI cartoon it's harder to swallow that level of abstraction, so either you can't reconcile that and decide you can't stand it now, or you only tolerated it before as a "limit of technology" but see no reason to do it now, even though there are distinct strengths especially for games like Xcom.

Does worry me though that people might get vocal enough to effect even many JRPGs, it already sounds like they'd rather just make Final Fantasy into a straight up action RPG and seem very close to doing just that with Lightning Returns. Bad enough we were extraordinarily lucky to get Xcom with most everything else being an indie/digital-exclusive title when it comes to NA/Europe.

You make a good point. Thankfully there is kickstarter which is doing it best to try and revive turn-based game play. Hopefully it will work to counteract the influence from the past decade or so of dominant mindset being that turn-based game play is outdated, a relic of the time of weaker hardware.

I wouldn't put much stock in such complaints, the games are not for everyone but surely anyone can wrap their head around the concept if they take 30 seconds to try and comprehend it. I mean, like chess. Not everyone plays but everyone gets it surely.

I guess maybe the problem is that a lot of people out there don't take the time to think about it.

 

[Almighty]

Well seems to have really slowed to a crawl today. Only $84k raised so far. Though with this being the first smaller kickstarter I paid any attention to I am not sure if this is normal or if I should be worried. The only other kickstarters I watched this close were Wasteland 2 and Project Eternity and they were not exactly an average kickstater to use to judge this one by.

 

[Instro]

Well seems to have really slowed to a crawl today. Only $84k raised so far. Though with this being the first smaller kickstarter I paid any attention to I am not sure if this is normal or if I should be worried. The only other kickstarters I watched this close were Wasteland 2 and Project Eternity and they were not exactly an average kickstater to use to judge this one by.

The Jane Jensen barely did like 30k in its first 24 hours iirc, and still made over 400k in the end, so this should fine I think. It certainly won't blow past its goal by a lot, but I can't see it not getting there.